2009.04.25 01:00 - Programming/Filters in the conscious/unconscious

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Scathach Rhiadra. The comments are by Scathach Rhiadra.

      I sat alone for the first 15 minutes or so, then was joined by Bertrum.  We talked about the recent themed session with Bertrum and Maxine on Dreams.  We then discussed how the brain seems to be "programmed" through evolution and the relationship to the "filters" we use, which may prevent us from fully seeing reality. Is the "unconscious" experienced with the same filters in place, in our dreaming, or do we apply the filters to our dreams by interpretation and analysis, maybe losing the glimpses of insight in the process?

    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Bertrum
    Bertrum Quan: hi Scath
    Bertrum Quan: Quiet 1AM.
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes, as usual:)
    Bertrum Quan: For you it is morning...
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes, 9am
    Scathach Rhiadra: how are you this morning/night?
    Bertrum Quan: appropriately tired this time of night
    Scathach Rhiadra: :)
    Scathach Rhiadra: any topic you want to discuss...
    Bertrum Quan: Do you have a topic?
    Scathach Rhiadra: no, not this morning, still half asleep
    Scathach Rhiadra: are you continuing your dialog with Maxine tomorrow?
    Bertrum Quan: I'm not sure I can attend...
    Scathach Rhiadra: ah, it was very good last week:)
    Bertrum Quan: Yes, Maxine, asked the right questions. And the range of experiences added depth to the discussion.
    Scathach Rhiadra: mmm, yes we all seem to be facinated with our dreams
    Bertrum Quan: I'm even more fascinated by the mechanism dream than the content.
    Scathach Rhiadra: and so is Maxine I think
    Bertrum Quan: Having a conversation in SL makes me think of programming on a number of levels---and PaB is useful in examining the programming of reality.
    Scathach Rhiadra: how so...
    Bertrum Quan: Beyond the computer... the human computer that is the brain. And how we have been "wired" or "programmed" through our evolution,
    Bertrum Quan: And also how all of the creature we inhabit this world with have been programmed.
    Bertrum Quan: There's a very practical aspect to all of the programming... but in the case of human beings, it make keep us from fully seeing the nature of reality.
    Scathach Rhiadra nods
    Bertrum Quan: One also wonders about our fellow creatures. Do they have consciousness? And if so, are they actually able to see with is more clearly than us?
    Bertrum Quan: see with more clarity
    Bertrum Quan: We ascribe feelings and emotions sometimes to what we experience. Example a lovely bird song. But the bird likely sings because it is programmed to...
    Scathach Rhiadra: mmm, and the song probably means something entirely different to the bird
    Bertrum Quan: Or is entirely practical (and not thought out)
    Scathach Rhiadra nods
    Scathach Rhiadra: would that programming account for the filters we experience the world through?
    Bertrum Quan: That's what I believe. Yes..
    Scathach Rhiadra: and it is so difficult to drop the filters, even be aware they exist
    Bertrum Quan: Yes, and so much of the programming/leanring is reinforced.
    Bertrum Quan: Pab is an example of attempting the open a seam to what is beyond that stream
    Bertrum Quan: And for me the conscious existance is the where we have to unlearn... That's what the deamlife is so interesting as a mechanism. The subconsious yields clues (and I'm not thinking only of the content but more the mechanism).
    Bertrum Quan: *why the dreamlife
    Scathach Rhiadra: maybe our habitual tendencies are more definite in our conscious lefe, not so much in unconscious
    Scathach Rhiadra: life*
    Bertrum Quan: Yes. The restrained nature of waking is less constrained in dream---and drum breat of time (and the even the recognition of the beating of the heart as a meaure of time) takes on a different reality.
    Scathach Rhiadra nods
    Bertrum Quan: Intellect sometimes gets in the way as well in waking, but in dream the intellect may be freed....
    Bertrum Quan: Does that make sense?
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes:)
    Scathach Rhiadra: and we may recognise that in some inner way, hence the significance we sometimes give to insightful dreams that we remember.
    Scathach Rhiadra: thay can seem more significant than any waking thoughts
    Bertrum Quan: I know what you mean. I have had that experience.
    Bertrum Quan: But for me at least, I've cometo believe that applying content interpretation may very much limit seeing that reality and the importance of that dream experience.
    Bertrum Quan: I used to very much enjoy Freudian or Jungian filters for dreams!
    Scathach Rhiadra: ah I agree with you there! Interpretation is like applying the filters to the dream experience
    Bertrum Quan: We (our brains) do try to makes sense of things. Interpretation brings a organization and a logic to what is in this case a experience is free of that lind of logic.
    Bertrum Quan: an experience that is free of that kind of logic.
    Scathach Rhiadra: so hopefully being aware of the filters in our waking life and dropping them in our PaB practice will help in not putting them on our experiences of the unconscious
    Scathach Rhiadra: or loosen them up maybe
    Bertrum Quan: Yes. Loosen as you say or open up. Perhaps we can be able to pay more in both waking and in dream!
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes:)
    Bertrum Quan: Are you planning on attending the Sunday 1PM session?
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes, I usually do
    Bertrum Quan: If I 'm able to work around the demands of the day, I will try to attend.
    Scathach Rhiadra: well I must go now, youhave a good night, and maybe see you tomorrow, thank you for this discussion, it has been very enjoyable
    Bertrum Quan: 'Night Scath
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