2009.11.22 08:00 - detail and wider focus

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    During our weekly guardian meeting, the following 15 guardians were present: Adams Rubble, arabella Ella, doug Sosa, Eliza Madrigal, Eos Amaterasu, Lia Rikugun, Maxine Walden, Neela Blaisdale, Pema Pera, Qt Core, Riddle Sideways, SophiaSharon Larnia, Storm Nordwind, Wol Euler and Yakuzza Lethecus. The comments are by Lia Rikugun.


    Lia Rikugun: hello yakuzza
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi lia
    arabella Ella: Hiya
    Lia Rikugun: hello arabella and wol and pema
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi pema, wb everyone :)
    Pema Pera: Hi Everybody!
    Maxine Walden: hi, everyon
    Maxine Walden: everyone
    Lia Rikugun: hello hello
    Wol Euler: hello everyone
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi, everyone!
    arabella Ella: Hiya Pema all
    Adams Rubble: Hello everyone :)
    arabella Ella: Hiya Eos
    Eos Amaterasu: HI cats and kitties!
    Pema Pera: :)
    Pema Pera: we all stray in . . . .
    Maxine Walden: haha
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Hi Eos
    Wol Euler: hello storm
    Eos Amaterasu: Hi Eli :-)
    arabella Ella: Hiya Storm
    Eos Amaterasu: Storm drops in
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Eliza Madrigal waves
    arabella Ella: its lovely to watch people falling down like raindrops from the sky here :)
    arabella Ella: (reminds me of the tune ... its raining men ...)
    Wol Euler: :)
    Pema Pera: :-)
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Pema Pera is happy to see women raining as well . .
    arabella Ella: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: Hi SophiaSharon
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: did I lose the text?
    Pema Pera: we were just quietly enjoying our Sunday morning here, Sharon :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles

    our topic for today which Maxine suggested: the possible strain between the focus upon detail and the 'wider' focus

    Maxine Walden: did anyone want to pick up on the suggested topic for this meeting: the possible strain between the focus upon detail like administrative stuff we have been trying to face and the 'wider' focus we often need for the practices we do?
    Adams Rubble just finishing Pema's long email
    Adams Rubble: It may take some time to frame a response Pema
    Pema Pera: of course, let's forget about my email till later
    Pema Pera: I was just responding to what I read from Neela and Fefonz this morning
    Adams Rubble: There is a problem I think
    Pema Pera: I'd love to talk about the wider PaB practices, following Vendy's suggestion as well
    Pema Pera: yes, Adams?
    Adams Rubble: Let's take your suggestion for this morning Pema. It will take time to sort out my thoughts
    Pema Pera: well, Maxine's and Vendy's suggestion, more :-)
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Adams Rubble: yes, maxine's and Vendy's and Pema's
    Pema Pera: :)
    Pema Pera: Maxine, do you want to say a bit more about the "the 'wider' focus we often need for the practices we do"?
    Maxine Walden: sure, will try
    Maxine Walden: My own experience is that when I am trying to practice that my mind just 'feels' less focussed, sort of like letting me eyes go soft, as they say in yoga.
    Maxine Walden: And this softer focus seems to allow more access to a wider range of experience. Very different for me from the more 'sharp-eyed' focus I need when I have to think of details. Quite strikingly different in my experience
    Maxine Walden: The wider focus is inclusive, gathering in, as it were, while the sharper focus differentiates detail, notices differences perhaps
    Eliza Madrigal: hmm, yes Maxine..wonderfully put observation, thanks
    Maxine Walden: guess I had also been wondering about the possible strain between the two, which might be inevitable when we try to sort out the detail of admin 'stuff'
    Maxine Walden: while also keeping our openness, ever-exploring practice going
    Pema Pera: and one of the complications is that some of the admin stuff has been an attempt to find ways to allow the whole group to spend more time on the "wider focus"
    Maxine Walden: hmm, yes
    Pema Pera: when we noticed that the "wider focus" was threatened by too much disturbance . . . .
    Neela Blaisdale: Hello eevryone sorry to be late:)
    Pema Pera: while the group as a whole did not seem to find a good way to deal with that, for a while, leading to mounting frustration
    Wol Euler: hello neela
    Pema Pera: hi Neela!
    Storm Nordwind has not found such a strain, Maxine, and suspects these are normal parts of everyday life outside PaB too that people just get used to dealing with
    Wol Euler: walk closer, neela, we are in a diffent sim :)
    Eos Amaterasu: "soft eyes".... that rest, not "wandering eyes"
    Neela Blaisdale: weird..
    Eos Amaterasu: keeping eyes soft and "rest loose your mind, neither hold it nor permit it to wander" is itself a "practice"
    Eos Amaterasu: not anti-detail.... though there is a spectrum
    Eliza Madrigal: yes and a settling in/finding balance...
    Eos Amaterasu: maybe also taking responsibility for guarding that softness, personally - makes rigid guidelines less necessary
    Maxine Walden: agree, Eos
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Maxine Walden: 'guarding the softenss' suggests different 'textures' of experience co-residing

    softness in the group and rules

    Pema Pera: yes, Eos, and if our conversations of the last couple months can lead to that, they have accomplished their goal -- the fewer rules the better, as long as we do manage to keep that softness in the group, and don't sacrifice it in the name of openness to everybody, no matter how they behave . . . .
    Pema Pera: the suggested rules are really a second best . . .
    Maxine Walden: yes, some protections of the spaces, within the group as well as within each of us have seemed necessary to establish
    Storm Nordwind: It is a whole life skill, to be able to juggle such disparate textures. As with any skill, some people like structured rules and others much less so
    Adams Rubble: some people like rules and don't follow them; others hate rules and do follow them (nbot sugggetsing there are two types of people)
    Adams Rubble: not
    Maxine Walden: :), Adams
    Storm Nordwind: Yes, it's a multidimensional spectrum of learning and coping approaches
    Maxine Walden: yes, Storm
    Eliza Madrigal: Some things come across as rules perhaps, which are just ideas.. things to try to see if they fly on their own and free up some energy/movement
    Eliza Madrigal nods
    Maxine Walden: and for me when I am fatigued, etc, ideas may seem like rules
    Maxine Walden: It is my responsibility to keep myself rested enough to be able to respond to ideas as ideas, rather than rules, it seems to me
    Eos Amaterasu: :-)
    Adams Rubble: It is important to make sure the focus is on what is the goal. We as a group messed up on the recent two dsitractions but we have done better in the past
    Riddle Sideways: seems the difference is your attitude toward it/them/etc.
    Pema Pera: speaking for myself, I'm really delighted that in the last two months so many opinions have come forward, through our email exchanges. I feel we have gotten to know each other better, and we have reflected much more deeply on what PaB stands for. Rules or not is almost secondary; the increased involvement and engagement has been great!
    Adams Rubble: we need to make sure it is not all opn Pema
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ive learned a bit in the last few months, about distractions being learning experiences
    Storm Nordwind: Do we perhaps expect the PaB community to operate in different ways to the rest of society? We have extra tools, true. But we will surely have the whole spectrum of humanity with similar challenges.
    Eliza Madrigal: Riddle, yes... and the attitude we have with one another too... knowing and trusting intentions, and also putting enough trust in one another to say "Hey, not a good idea", which is goood to see happening
    Maxine Walden: agree, entirely, Storm
    Pema Pera: I found Vendy's response illustrative, as a new guardian: how she first was surprised and a bit ennoyed at all this discussion, and then very much appreciated it
    Wol Euler nods
    Eliza Madrigal nods
    Pema Pera nods to all that is said :)

    the openness of the PaB group, no hidden agenda

    Pema Pera: the most wonderful thing about this group is exactly what is happening now, that we can discuss the dynamics of the group in such an open way -- I have never seen any group doing this so harmoniously and honestly
    Storm Nordwind applauds the whole group
    Pema Pera: with so little in terms of hidden agendas, present in any other group I know . . . .
    Maxine Walden: that is interesting, Pema.
    Pema Pera: I think what scares some newcomers is that they try mightely hard to find out about our hidden agendas . . . . and get frustrated when they can't find them
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Maxine Walden: :)
    Pema Pera: is it a sect?
    Pema Pera: what do they want?
    Pema Pera: who is the leader?
    Pema Pera: what are his secret intentions?
    Pema Pera: exploring reality doesn't seem to be good enough as an answer to some . . .
    Storm Nordwind: There are fewer holes for their pigeons! ;)
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Eliza Madrigal nods and admits to having those same questions at first
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Riddle Sideways: :)
    Neela Blaisdale: too simple an idea for some:) and yet too rich and complex to ever have the "answer":)
    Pema Pera: hahaha, yes, Neela
    Eliza Madrigal: And then a breath of fresh air blows through...
    Riddle Sideways: is this not as it should be
    Storm Nordwind: Bear in mind that it is a compelling need in very many people to "belong". That is the criterion so often forward in the conscious or unconscious mind when they find a new group, as in "Is this something i want to belong to?"
    arabella Ella: both belonging and acceptance Storm
    Maxine Walden: And 'belonging' begins to make an 'in group' and an 'out group'
    Pema Pera: yes, and the danger is real: we all know about questionable sects luring unsuspected newcomers with friendly, sometimes overfriendly invitations
    Wol Euler grins. I think our chorus of "hello"s have chased a few away
    Pema Pera: hahaha
    arabella Ella: he he
    Storm Nordwind: Belonging is very often a more driven need arabella. Many people are happy to belong even if they are not accepted
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
    Neela Blaisdale: too much love., Wol?
    arabella Ella: yes
    Pema Pera: hey, wanna shortcut to enligthenment? We got it! Just sign this little paper here . . . .
    Storm Nordwind: How much Pema? :)
    Maxine Walden: hahaha
    Maxine Walden: !!!
    Pema Pera: just a bit of time, Storm
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Pema Pera: timeless time
    Storm Nordwind: Nooooo, I want to throw $$$$ at it instead!
    arabella Ella: zeroth time Pema?
    Pema Pera: hahaha
    Pema Pera: yes, Ara
    Riddle Sideways: does anybody remember signing the paper?
    Storm Nordwind: I have the tattoo - I'll put it on!
    Eliza Madrigal: shh, we're not supposed to talk about that
    Pema Pera: hehehe
    Neela Blaisdale: PaB tatoo? Yes!!!
    Neela Blaisdale: Amulet for enlightment.....
    SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
    Neela Blaisdale: we could sell them in RL for PaB costs, haha
    Wol Euler sees herself with a shaven head at the local airport
    Riddle Sideways: lol
    Storm Nordwind: ...genuine amulet guv... guaranteed to have been present at a PaB session guv, yours for just...
    Riddle Sideways: ya'll are way too good at this play stuff
    Pema Pera: we can create a PaB gang . . . .
    Pema Pera: making sure we are not tooooo nice to newcomers

    who will suggest the next topic for the meeting next week?

    Maxine Walden: Wondering if we can rotate the 'task' of suggesting a topic for this meeting. Just to bring it up while we have time
    Qt Core: from PaB to PHB in ten easy moves...
    Storm Nordwind: We can tell rival gangs to "BEat it!"
    Pema Pera: hehehe
    Riddle Sideways: would that be a rule, Maxine?
    Pema Pera: :)
    Maxine Walden: hah, Riddle!!
    Riddle Sideways: I am busy the weekend it is my turn to bring the topic
    SophiaSharon Larnia: topics change organically on their own, it seems, but good the have a delinated starting point
    Storm Nordwind wonders about the required initiation ceremony...
    Storm Nordwind chuckles at Riddle
    Maxine Walden: smiled at Riddle as well
    Eliza Madrigal: Agreed, Sharon...as Maxine noticed an organic topic and then framed it for us so nicely
    Pema Pera: initiation ceremony? drop! sit! be!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
    Pema Pera: labrador instead of laboratory
    Maxine Walden: lol, Pema
    Lia Rikugun: wuff
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Storm Nordwind: A retreat possibility?!!! In a remote eastern corner of Canada!
    Pema Pera: it is
    Wol Euler wonders whether the former refuelling stop at Gander is still a working airport.
    Wol Euler: well, then1
    Eos Amaterasu: geese do layovers here
    Eos Amaterasu doubts it, but doesn't kn ow
    Eos Amaterasu: No
    Connecting to in-world Voice Chat...
    Neela Blaisdale: Know thw poem Wild Geese by Mary Oliver?
    Maxine Walden: I nominate Storm for our next 'topic' suggester
    Riddle Sideways: second

    the next retreat in Malta

    Eos Amaterasu: On that topic, Malta retreat is coming up....
    arabella Ella: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: http://playasbeing.wik.is/PaB_Retreats/2010-01_Malta
    Storm Nordwind: Perhaps UK slang: "Let's have a gander (quick look) at this place over here... no perhaps we'll leave it to someone else..."
    Pema Pera: how many retreaters have signed up so far, Eos?
    Pema Pera: and Arabella?
    arabella Ella: Actually I am not sure
    Eos Amaterasu: 7, with 2 possible, but we need to re-email everyone
    arabella Ella: but i invite anyone who wishes to ask anything to IM me whether I am on line or off line of to email me if they wish
    Maxine Walden: Have to go, all. See you next week
    Storm Nordwind waves
    arabella Ella: bye Maxine
    Eos Amaterasu: bye all!
    Adams Rubble: bye Maxine
    Pema Pera: bye Maxine, and thank you!
    Wol Euler: bye maxine, take care
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye :))
    Neela Blaisdale gave you New Note.
    Riddle Sideways: bye Maxine
    Wol Euler: ty neela
    Adams Rubble: ty Neela
    Eos Amaterasu: Thanks Neela
    Lia Rikugun: ty neela
    Pema Pera: shall we add it to the chat log, Neela, the poem you gave us?

    the poem "Wild Geese" by Mary Oliver, Neela gave it to us written on a notecard

    Pema Pera: Wild Geese

    You do not have to be good.
    You do not have to walk on your knees
    for a hundred miles through the desert, repenting.
    You only have to let the soft animal of your body
    love what it loves.
    Tell me about despair, yours, and I will tell you mine.
    Meanwhile the world goes on.
    Meanwhile the sun and the clear pebbles of the rain
    are moving across the landscapes,
    over the prairies and the deep trees,
    the mountains and the rivers.
    Meanwhile the wild geese, high in the clean blue air,
    are heading home again.
    Whoever you are, no matter how lonely,
    the world offers itself to your imagination,
    calls to you like the wild geese, harsh and exciting--
    over and over announcing your place
    in the family of things.

    © Mary Oliver.


    Storm Nordwind will be on retreat elsewhere from January 3rd through the 31st, so will miss Malta
    arabella Ella: oh we will miss you too Storm :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thanks Neela :)
    Wol Euler: oh, pity.
    Eliza Madrigal: Lovely Neela, Thank you :)
    Pema Pera: bye everybody!
    Storm Nordwind agrees
    Wol Euler: bye pema, take care
    Lia Rikugun: bye bye everyone
    arabella Ella: bye Pema thanks
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye all, im off too :)) take care
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Everyone, thanks for a wonderful meeting today
    Neela Blaisdale: Bye Pema, be well
    Adams Rubble: bye Pema, everyone
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye everyone
    Neela Blaisdale: Bye Adams
    Wol Euler: bye everyone
    Neela Blaisdale: Bye Eliza
    Riddle Sideways: bye all
    Neela Blaisdale: bye all:)
    Storm Nordwind: Bye all
    Qt Core: bye all
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