2010.04.18 13:00 - Embracing the moment of now

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Maxine Walden. The comments are by Maxine Walden. This discussion seemed to creatively meander from empathy for Wol's not being able to get to the RL retreat in San Francisco because of the volcanic ash cloud to greater appreciation for frustration and disappointment being part of life and humbling to our 'controlling' selves, to appreciation of NOW as the only moment in time we have, to appreciation of each other in this NOW moment.  Upon re-reading the log, it seems that once several of us left at the end of the hour, the remaining group resumed an ongoing topic of their mutual interest. 

     

     

    Liza Deischer: hi Maxine
    Maxine Walden: hi. Liza
    Maxine Walden: how are you?
    Liza Deischer: I'm fine, thanks
    Liza Deischer: and you?
    Maxine Walden: oh, fine, thanks, just sitting here enjoying the space
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Maxine Walden: how are you enjoying PaB? That's an open question, I know...just wondering
    Liza Deischer: well, I didn't expect this question any more :-)
    Maxine Walden: ah, sorry.
    Liza Deischer: oh, no problem, that's not what I mean
    Liza Deischer: but I noticed that to Liza it means something different then to Darren
    Maxine Walden: ah, I see. Interesting...
    Maxine Walden: care to mention any of the differences? You may have elsewhere but I would be interested to hear
    Maxine Walden: hi, Wol
    Liza Deischer: well, Darren is more layed-back
    Wol Euler: hello liza, maxine
    Liza Deischer: he enjoys being here and is interested in people
    Liza Deischer: Liza is more critical
    Liza Deischer: hi Wol :-)
    Maxine Walden: I see. Wol, just wanting to mention how sorry I am that you could not get to SF
    Wol Euler: thank you, maxine, I appreciate that
    Maxine Walden: Listening, Liza, just wanting to also empathize with Wol's situation, not being able due to the ash cloud to get to the retreat in SF
    Liza Deischer: Oh, I understand, I'm very sorry for Wol too
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: I'm trying to take it calmly :)
    Liza Deischer: well, there is nothing practical you can do about it
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    Maxine Walden: calmly but perhaps with some disappointment as well, I imagine
    Wol Euler: oh yes, of course.
    Maxine Walden: Does it feel like the vulcan gods areout to frustrate a lot of people right now?
    Wol Euler: :)
    Liza Deischer: well, the strange thing is (and I'm not in Wol's poisition) but it makes you humble too
    Liza Deischer: one volcano and suddenly we can't move from one place to another
    Maxine Walden: ah, indeed! about the powers of nature?
    Maxine Walden: and who is really in charge on this planet?
    --BELL--
    Liza Deischer: but I think it is better to feel the disappointment then to feel angry
    Wol Euler nods
    Wol Euler: hello yaku
    Liza Deischer: it is somehow closer by
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey everyone
    Liza Deischer: Hey Yaku
    Maxine Walden: in my experience as well, Liza, even though the disappointment can feel deep and very painful
    Maxine Walden: hi Yaku
    Liza Deischer: yes
    Wol Euler: it would be completely pointless and somewhat silly to be angry about this
    Maxine Walden: we are empathizing with Wol's not being able to get to SF and the disappointment that would engender
    Liza Deischer: true, but some people react with anger
    Liza Deischer: not understanding the situation
    Maxine Walden: yes, and maybe anger gets the pain 'out' or 'away' in some way,
    Liza Deischer: feeling a lot of discomfort
    Liza Deischer: maybe because they lost control
    Liza Deischer: yes, but the pain is still there
    Wol Euler: yes but the "loss" is an illusion
    Liza Deischer: there is more comfort in pain
    Maxine Walden: say more, Wol?
    Liza Deischer: yes, but that is the issue with 'control'
    Wol Euler: well, it was never in their control really. Their "control" was predicated on the thing not actually existing :)
    Wol Euler: but as soon as it appeared, it proved that they didn't control it
    Maxine Walden: ah...
    Liza Deischer: exactly
    Maxine Walden: ah, that the event, SF in this case, was never a 'given' ?
    Liza Deischer: and pain is closer by
    Liza Deischer: it is not something you need to fight against
    Wol Euler: mmmm, I was actually thinking of "the other people", those who are reacting with anger - as many surely are
    Maxine Walden: ah, sorry, let me listen
    Liza Deischer: (so was I)
    Wol Euler: the "control" in this case is their expectation that their desires *must* always be capable of fulfilment
    Wol Euler: and that the world can never stand in their way
    Wol Euler: which is a pretty foolish position, really.
    Wol Euler: even leaving volcanoes out if it :)
    Liza Deischer: people in general can think they can make the world work
    Liza Deischer: like we are the ones that makes it go round
    Liza Deischer: it is foolish, I agree
    Wol Euler: the event in SF was "given", yes, but within the general context of life occasionally ignoring our desires
    Wol Euler: hello steve
    Maxine Walden: right
    Wol Euler: we make plans, we take actions, we anticipate outcomes, sure. All that.
    Wol Euler: But we also know that things might go wrong.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: let me rezz a moment perhaps
    Wol Euler: Almost everyone who dies in a car accident, for example, left the house that day thinking that they'd just drive to work as usual.
    Liza Deischer: yes
    Maxine Walden: hmm, yes...
    Wol Euler: I'm trying to find something Alain de Botton wrote about this, about anger and frustration arising from unrealistic expectation, in particular the expectation of total control
    Liza Deischer: there is this story of this monk that puts his only possesion his mug, upside down when he goes to sleep
    Liza Deischer: in order to remember himself that he doesn't know if he is going to stand up the next day
    Liza Deischer: control is a nasty thing
    Liza Deischer: but we seemed to have build our world on it
    Wol Euler nods
    stevenaia Michinaga: and usually pointless
    --BELL--
    Liza Deischer: control and expectations
    Liza Deischer: like we have rights according to our expectations
    Maxine Walden: Found myself in these past 90 sec feeling once again, how important it is to appreciate every moment, every NOW moment, as we do not have control,and NOW is all we really 'have'
    Wol Euler nods.
    Liza Deischer: yes
    stevenaia Michinaga: and what a simple place to be
    stevenaia Michinaga: here, now
    Maxine Walden: yes
    Liza Deischer: and it is nice to be here among friends
    Maxine Walden: indeed, Liza
    Liza Deischer: right now
    Wol Euler smiles
    Wol Euler: "this is here, it is now, I have tea and cake and friends. Life is grand."
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Maxine Walden: ah, beautiful, Wol
    Wol Euler: I guess the people who get angry at volcanoes are perhaps those for whom that isn't enough.
    Liza Deischer: I guess so
    Maxine Walden: hmm, yes
    Maxine Walden: maybe those who idealize the 'future' or 'what will be' or 'what MUST be'
    Liza Deischer: there is always a goal to be reached of which they think it wil make them more happy
    Liza Deischer: right Maxine
    Maxine Walden: yes, Liza
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    Maxine Walden: so easy to idealize the other-than-now
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi ara :)
    arabella Ella: Hiya
    Wol Euler: hello ara
    Maxine Walden: I am feeling very appreciative of our sharig this 'now', among such good friends
    Maxine Walden: hi, ara
    Liza Deischer: yes and running away from diappointments they don't want to acnolige
    Liza Deischer: hi Ara
    Wol Euler: damn, I can't find anything today, my copy of "gatsby" has also gone missing. I wanted to quote that last paragraph, ending "and so we beat on, boats against the current, ceaselessly into the past"
    Liza Deischer: acknowledge (?)
    Wol Euler: relative to being made happy by things in the future
    Wol Euler: "acknowledge", yes :)
    Liza Deischer: thanks :-)
    Maxine Walden: :), Liza
    Maxine Walden: nice reference, Wol, I had forgotten that ending of the Great Gatsby
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: it's one of my favourite books, I read it at least once a year.
    Wol Euler: found it online. "Gatsby believed in the green light, the orgastic future that year by year recedes before us. It eluded us then, but that's no matter -- tomorrow we will run faster, stretch out our arms farther. ... And one fine morning ---- So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past. "
    Maxine Walden: hmm, the ceaseless 'quest' so dismissive of the 'now' and expressing the tragedy of such
    Wol Euler nods.
    Liza Deischer: yes
    Maxine Walden: Wol, I am so sorry for your note getting to SF, but very grateful for our conversation here today, which in part embraces your situation
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Maxine Walden: for your not getting to SF
    Wol Euler: thank you, maxine.
    --BELL--
    Maxine Walden: thank you, Wol, for your openness which has allowed us this
    Liza Deischer: you have a great way of approaching these kind of things Maxine, so thank you too
    Wol Euler: agreed
    Liza Deischer: it turns out to be an embracing for all of us :-)
    Maxine Walden: ah, we are thanking each other appropriately it seems as we all have 'created' this lovely sharing experience.
    Wol Euler smiles.
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Liza Deischer: I start to sound like Darren heheh
    Wol Euler: heheheheheh
    Wol Euler: better be careful of that cross-over :)
    arabella Ella: :)
    Maxine Walden: Would that be OK, Liza, to begin to sound like Darren?
    Liza Deischer: well, I'm wondering about that
    Liza Deischer: I actually don't know
    Maxine Walden: hi, Mick
    Mickorod Renard: Hiya guys
    Yakuzza Lethecus: mick :)
    Liza Deischer: because I don't know yet what kind of effect it has on other 'parts' of me
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Yaku :)
    Wol Euler: I suppose that depends on what the majority "you" thinks he sounds like.
    Wol Euler: whether "you" think he is a good model to follow (or be lead by :)
    Liza Deischer: well I guess Darren is a big softy :-)
    Wol Euler: yes, but is that good or bad? :)
    Liza Deischer: and Liza thinkgs she is the 'strong' one
    Liza Deischer: it feels good
    Wol Euler: :)
    Liza Deischer: but I'm not going to take of my shoes!!
    Wol Euler: perhaps laying down that strength might feel like a moment of relief?
    Liza Deischer: hmmmm, I guess so
    Liza Deischer: it feels more like fluid
    Mickorod Renard: what is the topic?
    Wol Euler nods.
    Liza Deischer: eh.... good question :-)
    Wol Euler: hard to say, mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Wol Euler: that notecard is the last ten minutes or so, mick
    Mickorod Renard: thankyou,,,to you both
    Wol Euler grins.
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    arabella Ella: :)
    Mickorod Renard: thanks
    Maxine Walden: our wending conversation today, meandering through several topics...with openness and trust
    Wol Euler: and keeping our expectations on a leash
    Maxine Walden: :), yes, Wol
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Mickorod Renard: yes, I remember as a newcomer,,the expectations I had were outlandish
    Maxine Walden: so we could truly appreciate the now moment with one another
    Wol Euler nods.
    --BELL--
    Maxine Walden: I need to go. Am wondering whether this chatlog might be titled 'Embracing the moment' but will see when the whole chatlog is reviewed
    Wol Euler: :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: take care maxine
    Wol Euler: bye maxine, enjoy your sunday
    Liza Deischer: bye Maxine
    arabella Ella: bye Maxine
    Maxine Walden: very nice dicsussion, thanks so much everyone
    Maxine Walden: bye
    stevenaia Michinaga: time to go as well
    Wol Euler: bye steve, take care
    Liza Deischer: bye Steve
    arabella Ella: bye Steve
    Liza Deischer is smiling about Wol bringing back symmetrie
    arabella Ella: :)
    Wol Euler: :)
    arabella Ella: looks perfect Wol
    arabella Ella: Liza ... could you tell us more about your new project it sounds exciting
    Liza Deischer: the science project
    Mickorod Renard: yes it does
    arabella Ella: yes
    Liza Deischer: well, it was just fun to be part of it
    Liza Deischer: and enjoyed making the lab
    Liza Deischer: the idea is of a friend of mine
    Liza Deischer: and it is fun working together with people with different skills
    Mickorod Renard: have you any corroborated info to be presented?
    Liza Deischer: in a way I'm sad that it is finisched :-)
    Liza Deischer: what is corroborated?
    arabella Ella: it is an end and it could be seen as a beginning too Liza
    Liza Deischer: true
    Liza Deischer: the land is part of a Sim, with quite some technical people around
    Mickorod Renard: sorry,,i meant any insider knowledge being presented?
    arabella Ella: did you build too?
    Liza Deischer: yes, I made the lab
    Liza Deischer: and I made a big mess of it
    Liza Deischer: :-))))))
    arabella Ella: wow i am impressed :)
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Liza Deischer: that was one of the funparts
    Wol Euler: :))
    Mickorod Renard: learning from mistakes is often the best
    Liza Deischer: oh, no, this is an organized mess
    arabella Ella: i was gonna say ... who says there were mistakes? a mess may look cool ...
    Liza Deischer: it is an abandoned lab and something happened there
    Liza Deischer: yes, that is why I liked to build it
    Liza Deischer: experimenting with mess :-)
    Mickorod Renard: do we have to walk around and work out what,,a bit like the game cludo?
    arabella Ella: now you make me more curious
    Liza Deischer: well all things are different things
    Liza Deischer: no real story behind it
    Liza Deischer: there are some gadgets
    Liza Deischer: and it is just fun to try them
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Liza Deischer: and besiedes the gadgets there is some blood and there are some body's
    Mickorod Renard: wow,,sounds fun
    arabella Ella: oh ... vampire stuff?
    Liza Deischer: no, not vampire, think more alien
    Mickorod Renard: vampire aliens
    Liza Deischer: heheheh
    Wol Euler laughs.
    arabella Ella: well i was thinking romantic ... edward cullen
    Mickorod Renard: is he an alien?
    arabella Ella: :)
    Liza Deischer: I don't know Ara
    arabella Ella: depends on your point of view mick
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    --BELL--
    Liza Deischer: and I dressed up an alien avatar yesterday, the owner having no clue about anyghin that involves clothing
    Liza Deischer: it was real fun to do that :-)
    Mickorod Renard: where did you find your inspiration from Liza?
    Liza Deischer: actually, I don't know, I just start
    Mickorod Renard: have you been interested in area 51 before?
    Liza Deischer: no
    Liza Deischer: not at all
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Liza Deischer: it was a theme that suits the rest of the Sim well
    arabella Ella: what sort of an alien l|iza - ET style?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: good night everyone
    Liza Deischer: no not really ET
    Mickorod Renard: nite Yaku
    arabella Ella: nite Yaku
    Liza Deischer: bye Yaku
    arabella Ella: Wol symmetry
    Wol Euler: gah
    Wol Euler: you broke it.
    Liza Deischer: and different people working on it, you get different ways of looking at it
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    arabella Ella: did i?
    Wol Euler: mmhmm, it was correct before when you and mick were together
    Wol Euler: correct = symmetrical
    Wol Euler: there!
    Wol Euler: ty, liza
    Mickorod Renard: yeaaa
    arabella Ella: ok i thought Yaku broke it ...
    Wol Euler: oh, he may have done, I didn'T notice.
    Liza Deischer: correct = symmetrical
    arabella Ella: this is better thanks Liza
    Liza Deischer: I suppose we could spend several session on that
    Wol Euler: heheheh
    arabella Ella: :)
    Wol Euler: well, there's no need to impose my fetishes on the group to that extent
    Liza Deischer: I'm afraid it already happened :-)
    arabella Ella: your influence exhudes beyond language or chat Wol it is amazing
    Wol Euler: :)))))
    Liza Deischer: I for one cannot look at this circle anymore without looking for symmetrie
    arabella Ella: meeee toooo
    Wol Euler: :)
    Wol Euler: my work is done.
    Liza Deischer: hahahah
    Liza Deischer: a friend of mine came on line
    Liza Deischer: that's my cue
    Mickorod Renard: bye Liza
    Wol Euler: goodnight liza, take care
    Liza Deischer: cy :-)
    arabella Ella: nite Liza
    Wol Euler: I shall move on too, actually, time for my beauty sleep
    Wol Euler: goodnight ara, 'night mick
    Mickorod Renard: ok Wol,,nice to see you
    arabella Ella: nite Wol take care
    arabella Ella: and go easy on all that influence :)
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