2010.05.05 13:00 - Life Denting Self

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Fefonz Quan. The comments are by Fefonz Quan.

    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Wool :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: hello Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Arch
    Woolcinder Oxidor: you get to be the worm today
    Eliza Madrigal: The worm?
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Pema :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Big question Wool
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes we were the early birds
    Pema Pera: hi Arch, Eiza, Wool!
    Eliza Madrigal: hah
    Woolcinder Oxidor: hello Pema
    Archmage Atlantis: I am always the worm
    Archmage Atlantis: Waking up
    Woolcinder Oxidor: you dont believe in metamorphosis
    Archmage Atlantis: Hello Eliza, Pema
    Eliza Madrigal: :))
    Woolcinder Oxidor: was shakespeare right when he said that the good is oft interred with our bones
    Woolcinder Oxidor: and that the evil men do lives after them
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes , he wass
    Eliza Madrigal: Hm, maybe a better question would be was Shakespeare trying to be right? Or....
    Woolcinder Oxidor: and so that would imply that the sum total of evil in the world is increasing all the time
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes Wool, that is the math
    Pema Pera: thank you, Eliza!
    Eliza Madrigal: The autologger is so polite :) It says "Hello Eliza!"
    Pema Pera: (for grabbing the log)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen :)
    Pema Pera: hi Calvino and Zen!
    Eliza Madrigal: HI Cal :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: and is there another dimension to it...apart from the maths of it that i dont see
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Calvino Rabeni: Hello everyone
    Zen Arado: Hi Mick
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Mick :)
    Pema Pera: Wool, if I may ask, have you gotten a chance to play with our 9-seconds explorations?
    Woolcinder Oxidor: no Eliza shakespeare would have been doing a great disfavour to us all if he was trying to be right
    Pema Pera: hi Mick!
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Eliza Madrigal smiles
    Woolcinder Oxidor: no Pema i havent got the chance yet
    Pema Pera: do you know about our tradition?
    Woolcinder Oxidor: hello Calvino, Zen, Mick
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Wool
    Woolcinder Oxidor: very scantly i am afraid
    Archmage Atlantis: Pema...I was re-reading the website, and noted that the Guardian on duty would give a card of explanation to newcomers
    Archmage Atlantis: Would love to have that card
    Pema Pera: the basic idea is that we try to stop what we're doing a few times an hour, in RL as well as SL, to get a chance to look beyond our usual preoccupations
    Archmage Atlantis: And read it
    Eliza Madrigal: Yes, often Arch. Did you never receive a note? Sure... one moment Arch
    Eliza Madrigal: (Its more fun to talk about it one-on-one when there is opportunity though)
    Pema Pera: and when we are here, we can share our experience of what happens when we take those breaks
    Spider Paule: greetings to all :-)
    Pema Pera: we call it "9 seconds breaks" every 15 minutes, as a kind of pun -- it means a 1% time tax -- 9 seconds out of 900 seconds
    Pema Pera: hi Spider!
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Spider
    Spider Paule: namaste
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Spider :) Welcome
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes Wol told me about it
    Eliza Madrigal: (Spider that's a note about the group)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Fef :)
    Fefonz Quan: Hi everyone!
    Spider Paule: thank you
    Pema Pera: hi Fef!
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Fef
    Pema Pera: But here in SL we take somewhat longer breaks, 90 seconds instead
    Zen Arado: HI Fef
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes i was told...to recollect and revive
    Pema Pera: each of us constructs a picture of the world, and of ourselves, and calls that the reality we live in -- it's interesting to try to question that picture, trying to set it aside for a few seconds, frequently
    Pema Pera: just to see what happens
    Fefonz Quan: Spider, i wanted to ask if you are aware that we record those sessions logs and post them
    Eliza Madrigal: :) "Revive" seems a nice way of approach
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: and uncollect and recollect :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Very good point Fefonz
    Spider Paule: ah thats a good idea, chance to read it again
    Archmage Atlantis: The sessions become public record
    Fefonz Quan: so i guess it's ok with you that your comments will be included as well
    Spider Paule: yes it is ok :-)
    Fefonz Quan: (great:)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: we also exude ...what we hold within...so much so that it effects a birdling in a far flung forest
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, that is true Wool
    Archmage Atlantis: As does the bird
    Eliza Madrigal: Apologies, but I have to get going... was wonderful to see you all for this little while
    Pema Pera: bye Eliza!
    Mickorod Renard: bye Eliza
    Zen Arado: bye Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: :::waves::: Bye for now
    Archmage Atlantis: Bye poet
    Fefonz Quan: bye Eliz
    Spider Paule: what is todays topic?
    Pema Pera: I don't think we have a particular topic yet
    Pema Pera: but feel free to propose one :)
    Spider Paule: smiles ok
    Archmage Atlantis: I think it is that we are all connected
    Spider Paule: I sence that connection at this moment
    Pema Pera: Hi Liza!
    Mickorod Renard: Pema, maybe you could do a haiku poem on birdlings in the forrest?
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Liza
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Pema Pera: oh, Mick, I'm sure you'd do a better job :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey everyone
    Pema Pera: hi Yaku!
    Zen Arado: Hi Liza, Yaku
    Mickorod Renard: I saw some of yours during reading the logs,,,very nice
    Woolcinder Oxidor: i recall a mystic work on the place of the conference of the birds
    Fefonz Quan: hey Yaku!
    Fefonz Quan: hi Liza
    Liza Deischer: hi everyone
    Pema Pera: ty, Mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Yaku
    Spider Paule: hello Liza
    Pema Pera: Hi Fael!
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Fael
    Fael Illyar: Hi Everyone :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi fael
    Zen Arado: http://oldpoetry.com/opoem/show/2492...e-Of-The-Birds
    Archmage Atlantis: Hello fountain in the middle
    Zen Arado: Hi Fael
    Fefonz Quan: Hi agatha, Fael!
    Pema Pera: Hi Agatha!
    Agatha Macbeth: Hello everyone :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Ags
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes Zen exactly what i was thinking about ...thanks for the link
    Zen Arado: Hi Agatha
    Zen Arado: np :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: Attar was a perfumer...and thus his name which literally means perfumer in arabic
    Zen Arado: interseting poem
    Woolcinder Oxidor: while he was in his shop a beggar came to him asking for money
    Woolcinder Oxidor: and he said...you beg for money...how will you give your life to your Lord
    Woolcinder Oxidor: the beggaer said like this....he lied down ..placed his chalice on his chest and died
    Archmage Atlantis: He did find an answer
    Archmage Atlantis: It is not mine
    Zen Arado: "
    Zen Arado: "So long as we do not die to ourselves, and so long as we identify with someone or something, we shall never be free. The spiritual way is not for those wrapped up in exterior life.5"
    Pema Pera: how do you see that, Zen, dying to yourself?
    Zen Arado: same messages in so many spiritual paths
    Zen Arado: seeing through the attachments of ego
    Zen Arado: and dropping them
    Fefonz Quan liked the life.5 version :)
    Pema Pera: can you give an example?
    Zen Arado: thinking...
    Woolcinder Oxidor: it also has a link to Fitzgeralds translation ..its more comprehensive
    Zen Arado: dropping self aggrandizement
    Woolcinder Oxidor: http://oldpoetry.com/opoem/show/1322...ranslation-of-
    Pema Pera: how do you do that?
    Zen Arado: by noticing it first
    Zen Arado: noticing the ways I try to do that
    Zen Arado: sometimes seeing is enough
    Zen Arado: but old habits die hard for me
    Pema Pera: :)
    Liza Deischer: seeing is the start of a process
    Zen Arado: Jesus said to dent the self also
    Zen Arado: deny*
    Liza Deischer: deny?
    Pema Pera: was there something recently that you noticed, along those lines, Zen, as a concrete experience?
    Archmage Atlantis: Fighting old habits gives them powere
    Calvino Rabeni: I think normal life does fine at "denting" the self :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Such aa clche
    Pema Pera: /smiles at life denting self
    Zen Arado: I do it all the time Pema by talking too much
    Pema Pera: hahaha, no, this is an interesting topic, Zen
    Mickorod Renard: nice peom Wool
    Fefonz Quan: Don't try to dent the spoon - this is impossible :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes i spent a whole year writing it down :)
    Archmage Atlantis: If you talk from the "heart. Zen, there is no too much, or too little.
    Zen Arado: true Arch..but ...
    Archmage Atlantis: but.. tell us, it is important to truth
    Zen Arado: so much speeech designed to impress others
    Woolcinder Oxidor: is listening from the heart even better than talking from the heart
    Zen Arado: or to manipulate others...
    Fefonz Quan: Yes wool, the first one doesn't even need words sometimes
    Archmage Atlantis: Fael,does that not relate to our conversation about concent?
    Zen Arado: your mic is open Liza
    Liza Deischer: thanks
    Liza Deischer: (happens a lot with viewer 2.0)
    Fefonz Quan: (are you all using the new viewer?)
    Liza Deischer: (i neede to today, I crashed twice with emerald)
    Archmage Atlantis: No, I am old.....to slow to figure it out
    Fael Illyar: I see 2 people on viewer 2.0, 4 (+myself) on emerald. 4 unknown, most likely the old official linden viewer
    Pema Pera: bye everybody!
    Liza Deischer: bye Pema
    Fael Illyar: Have fun Pema :)
    Fael Illyar: Hi Wol :)
    Pema Pera: hi and bye Wol !
    Zen Arado: bye Pema
    Fefonz Quan: bye Pema!
    Wol Euler: bye pema
    Liza Deischer: hi Wol
    Fael Illyar: make 6 for emerald now
    Wol Euler: hello everyone else
    Wol Euler: sorry I'm late
    Zen Arado: Hi Wol
    Fefonz Quan: hi WOl!
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye Pem
    Agatha Macbeth waves to Wol
    Mickorod Renard: bye wol
    Zen Arado: I have been using it lately
    Mickorod Renard: bye Pema
    Zen Arado: takes some getting used to
    Archmage Atlantis: Give your pulished papher an award pejma\
    Liza Deischer: and voice is giving less complications with the new viewer, though the mic wants to be open all the time :-)
    Agatha Macbeth: Clunky
    Zen Arado: I don't like the camera controls
    Agatha Macbeth: Me either
    Liza Deischer: meneither
    Wol Euler: I haven't heard anyone who does
    Fefonz Quan: I asked cause it feels like i loose some of the mesages here, and i wonder if i should switch to a new viewer
    Zen Arado: keep having to switch
    Agatha Macbeth: Just about everything seems to be where you don't want it to be
    Liza Deischer: what kind of messages
    Liza Deischer: can't think of any
    Fefonz Quan: peoples responses Liza :)
    Liza Deischer: I would say that is not about the viewer
    Archmage Atlantis: I don't like being told to go west, then get pulled back to go right
    Agatha Macbeth: Go west young Arch :)
    Mickorod Renard: the subliminal ones Fef?
    Liza Deischer: and if west and right are the same thing :-)
    Fefonz Quan: are there any like that Mick ;-)
    Zen Arado: hmmm... west is left surely?
    Fefonz Quan: ?
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Liza Deischer: if you go to the north yes
    Zen Arado: is the convention?
    Liza Deischer: ?
    Wol Euler: on paper, yes
    Wol Euler: though that is fairly recent, until around 1600 east was usually up
    Zen Arado: well ...globes usually have North on top
    Liza Deischer: right and lieft isrelated ot my body
    Liza Deischer: east and west to the area
    Liza Deischer: *right and left are related to my body
    Zen Arado: thinks of weather maps
    Liza Deischer: think of my right hand ;-)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Mickorod Renard: do you still have east and west in space?
    Zen Arado: it is just a convention
    Zen Arado: a human device
    Liza Deischer: nice question, don't think so
    Wol Euler grins. Good question, Mick.
    Woolcinder Oxidor: east and west are related to the earths magnetic field
    Zen Arado: if we say it is it is
    Agatha Macbeth will consult HAL
    Wol Euler: I'd guess that they are inapplicable to you when you are out there
    Woolcinder Oxidor: but you do have a celestial north and south pole
    Mickorod Renard: grin
    Zen Arado: HAL will throw us out
    Agatha Macbeth: 'This is highly irregular dave'
    Mickorod Renard: spose u cud head for the north star and then carry on north after u pass it
    Fefonz Quan: you might apply them to solar system coordinates, or galaxial ones,
    Zen Arado: :)
    Archmage Atlantis: He learned it from the Mayand, Hal is a poseur
    Fefonz Quan: when the north aligns with the axis of rotation etc.
    Mickorod Renard: depends if the universe is curved
    Woolcinder Oxidor: even on earth the two poles do not coincide
    Woolcinder Oxidor: the magnetic north and the true north
    Liza Deischer is pondering about celestial north and south pole
    Zen Arado: yes but we could have called the north the south
    Fefonz Quan: well, this is just some technical glitch :)
    Zen Arado: just a convention
    Mickorod Renard: I suppose if u headed in the same direction that the universe expanded from u wud end up at all points of the compass at the same place
    Agatha Macbeth: Don't maps of the moon usually put south at the top?
    Fefonz Quan: well, the point is that the universe exapnds in ALL directions :)
    Zen Arado: the top?
    Liza Deischer: right fonz
    Woolcinder Oxidor: there is a thing called a unipole...a magnet with just one pole...either north or south
    Agatha Macbeth: Believe s, yes
    Agatha Macbeth: so
    Zen Arado: it's all relative to the observer
    Archmage Atlantis: Socrates basic messige was to question, ......he was willing to drink the hemlock
    Liza Deischer: need to get some work done
    Zen Arado: was he Arch?
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye Liza
    Zen Arado: bye Liza
    Woolcinder Oxidor: unipoles are expected to be found at the very early age of the universe
    Liza Deischer: see you
    Fefonz Quan: bye Liza
    Mickorod Renard: but if u travelled faster than light, surely the universe would shrink?
    Wol Euler: bye liza
    Woolcinder Oxidor: bye liza
    Mickorod Renard: bye Liza
    Archmage Atlantis: He did not want to Zen
    Woolcinder Oxidor: but you cant do that....your mass will reach infinity
    Zen Arado: he was forced surely?
    Zen Arado: a death sentence
    Archmage Atlantis: but to make new future, he did
    Fefonz Quan: are you sure about magnetic unipoles Wool? I thought they don't exist
    Woolcinder Oxidor: they are stilla theory yes...
    Zen Arado: if he didn't drink it they would have killed him some other way
    Woolcinder Oxidor: we do not have enough energy to create one...as yet
    Mickorod Renard: u cud travel faster than light if u had no mass
    Fefonz Quan: ok, now i am more relaxed :)
    Zen Arado: sorry 2 threads here
    Archmage Atlantis: of course Zwn
    Woolcinder Oxidor: no mick...to travel faster then light you would need a negative mass....
    Fefonz Quan: in a way, if you had no mass you could travel exactly at the speed of light
    Woolcinder Oxidor: photons dont have mass and they travel at the speed of light
    Mickorod Renard: I had no breakfast this morning in my attempt to reduce mass
    Archmage Atlantis: He chose so his ideas would live
    Fefonz Quan: so do you feel lighter Mick?
    Mickorod Renard: well, I have made up for it during lunch and dinner
    Mickorod Renard: but the thought was there
    Zen Arado: don't think he had much of a choice Arch
    Zen Arado: just to be able to perform his own execution
    Woolcinder Oxidor: they are caled tachyons..theoretical again..having negative mass...and travelling faster then light
    Zen Arado: not a choice I would like
    Fefonz Quan: (and that;'s called mass conversation mick
    Mickorod Renard: coooool
    Agatha Macbeth: Didn't einstein say you cant travel faster than light?
    Fefonz Quan: yes he did
    Mickorod Renard: only cos of his crazy theory
    Agatha Macbeth: Ah
    Woolcinder Oxidor: tachyons satisfy relativity by having negative mass...
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Fael Illyar: did he mention traveling or did he mean just moving?
    Fefonz Quan: you can't travel faster if you nstarted slower]
    Mickorod Renard: thats a point
    Agatha Macbeth: Samwe thing Fael ;-)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: there is a way you can actually travel faster than light
    Agatha Macbeth: -w
    Mickorod Renard: but is it?
    Fael Illyar: Agatha, not necessarily :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Is it?
    Zen Arado: trying to visualise negative mass
    Mickorod Renard: and how is that WOOL?
    Agatha Macbeth: If i travel, I move
    Woolcinder Oxidor: if you were travelling in water...the speed of light in water is less than that in vacuum
    Mickorod Renard: SORRY,FOR SHOUTING
    Fael Illyar: Agatha, yes, today, it's the only known method of traveling.
    Agatha Macbeth: THAT'S OK MICK
    Archmage Atlantis: Within the boundaries of Einstien, he knew he did not do a good thing
    Woolcinder Oxidor: so you could exceed the speed of light in water...doing this releases a blue light
    Archmage Atlantis: He did an necssicary thing, that is faith
    Woolcinder Oxidor: its called karenkovs radiation
    Fefonz Quan: yes, cherniak radiation i think
    Mickorod Renard: so in the water relative universe things are diferent
    Fefonz Quan: yet Einstein wqas talking about the speed of light in vacuum i believe
    Archmage Atlantis: Buh
    Woolcinder Oxidor: no the absolute speed is the light speed in vacuum...not in other media
    Wol Euler slips out quietly. Goodnight all, take care not to travel too fast.
    Zen Arado: bye Wol
    Woolcinder Oxidor: yes Fef
    Mickorod Renard: nite Wol
    Zen Arado: time I went too
    Zen Arado: nite all
    Mickorod Renard: nite Zen
    Fefonz Quan: me too. Good night all, _/!\_
    Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni will beam out also :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: bye Zen
    Mickorod Renard: nite Fef
    Mickorod Renard: nameste
    Calvino Rabeni: namaste all
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye for now Zen, Fonz
    Mickorod Renard: I must go too,,I need some sleep
    Mickorod Renard: thankyou for the fun night
    Fael Illyar: Good night Mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: nite nite all
    Agatha Macbeth: Off to bed with you Mick :)
    Woolcinder Oxidor: bye Mick
    Archmage Atlantis: Ah, Moon is oline.....perhaps he will take comfort. ...Namaste all
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye Arch
    Woolcinder Oxidor: i must leavetoo
    Woolcinder Oxidor: my viewer is playing tricks on me
    Woolcinder Oxidor: bye ladies
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye for now
    Fael Illyar: Bye wool :)
    Spider Paule: namaste all :-)
    Fael Illyar: Have fun Spider :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Bye
    Fael Illyar: well, people evaporated rather fast tonight :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Mm, yes
    Agatha Macbeth: Maybe it was something we said
    Agatha Macbeth: That is a very lovely outfit
    Fael Illyar: nah, they were just in a hurry :)
    Fael Illyar smiles 'Thank you.'
    Fael Illyar: You did see it yesterday too though :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Yes, I meant to ask where you got it from?
    Fael Illyar: let me see if it came with a landmark :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Some landmark!
    Fael Illyar: see you there? :)
    Agatha Macbeth: TY :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Ok
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