2010.05.12 01:00 - karma talk

The Guardian for this meeting was Bolonath Crystal. The comments are by Bolonath Crystal.

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hello Crystal
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: where is people ?
    Bolonath Crystal: namaste cosmicflower
    Bolonath Crystal: everybody is sleeping ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: _/!\_
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Have You had fun? in your day
    Bolonath Crystal: my day has just started :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, for me its midday ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: just made fire here on living room for fire place
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I thought to prepare sausage and some salad for my-Self
    Bolonath Crystal: :)
    Darren Islar: hi Bolo, hi Cosmic
    Bolonath Crystal: namaste darren
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: warmed there in coals
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hello Darren
    Darren Islar: hi

missing the sun

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: My heart feels happy, its promised warm weather also to rest of the week in Finnland, plus 24 celsius
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: summer comes
    Bolonath Crystal: wow, would be nice
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, after long cold winter
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Sun is needed ;)
    Bolonath Crystal: i miss the sun
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I do not remember, but where You live?
    Darren Islar: sounds very nice, a lot of rain here in the last weeks
    Bolonath Crystal: germany, cosmic
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I will make a remembering note for me ;)
    Bolonath Crystal: *g*
    Darren Islar: then we suffer from the same depression Bolo
    Bolonath Crystal: i'm back in germany since about two weeks now, and i had only one day without rain since then
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: can travel with astral body to sun?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it helps many times when having gray or winter
    Bolonath Crystal: it is the material body that longs for the warmth
    Darren Islar: yes and before that, we had sunshine here, a few really good weeks
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, but it can be felt when doing "travelling" through distances too
    Darren Islar: sorry?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, I said it helps if travelling with astral body to sun. Warmth can be felt in physical this way too
    Darren Islar: ah :-)
    Bolonath Crystal: maybe i should try it
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, its no need but think of bright light of sun
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and notice to be there
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its like here in sl too, being in sauna
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it can "feel" the heat
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or feel other people
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: this is also "travelling"
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with spirit

travelling as inner process

    Bolonath Crystal: travelling is always an inner process, as the outer world is a projection. shouldn't be too difficult to create some sunlight :)
    Darren Islar: ??
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: no ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: one-Self can also be like a sun with radiating light
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: as a ray of sun
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and other can feel its warmth
    Bolonath Crystal: darren, i suppose the world as we know it happens in the mind only. so everything, that happens, happens mentally. some of it we project in the outside, some inside the illusionary self. so all travelling can be regarded as an inner process
    --BELL--
    Darren Islar: maybe, you're right Bolo, but what I have experienced is that the world has a reflection on me, and that reflection can change, getting another perspective; I am also familiar of feeling the sun shine even when it is not there
    Darren Islar: but I don't know, it is not in my experience, that the world around me is only a mental projection
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Thats true Darren
    Darren Islar: coulb be, I just don't know
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think its also emotional
    Darren Islar: And I can only work with what I know
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: all what experiencing inside
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: reflects outside

connection between inside and outside

    Darren Islar: there is definetly a connection
    Bolonath Crystal: all that we know and experience is knowns and experienced because of perceptions
    Bolonath Crystal: perception "forms" the world
    Darren Islar: I mean between the outside and inner world
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what about creation?
    Bolonath Crystal: if we wouldn't be able to see colors, the world would be black and white
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have experienced I have created my life
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what I have desired
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or wished
    Bolonath Crystal: perception IS creation
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: inner, it have came also outer
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: oh
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: okey
    Bolonath Crystal: impulses from the sense organs are displayed as forms, colors, sound ...
    Darren Islar: I don't know Cosmic, thinking of a lot of people with good hearts, suffering
    Darren Islar: but senses are matter
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have suffered also and having good heart for sure
    Bolonath Crystal: no, they are displayed as matter
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: why I have suffered
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its that I have remembered from it something
    Darren Islar: maybe
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or learned
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Many people with good heart do not know the lesson when its beter not to help
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: they help and help and help
   Darren Islar: how real is the outside world for somebody who is not able to provide for himself or his family
    Darren Islar: or how unreal
    Bolonath Crystal: as real as creation can be
    Bolonath Crystal: the outer world isn't "unreal" just because it is a projection
    Darren Islar: ah :-)
    Bolonath Crystal: it is like a movie in the cinema. there is really a film, everyone can see it, but the story is unreal nevertheless
    Darren Islar: You know, I just don't know
    Darren Islar: the only thing I know is how I perceive it
    Darren Islar: and maybe some day I will find out this world is not really real
    Bolonath Crystal: also the word "illusion" doesn't mean that there is nothing. there is something, but not what we think it is
    Darren Islar: but I can only work with the tools I have
    Darren Islar: the tools I really experienced
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: own experience is the most best way I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: because then one goes own path
    Darren Islar: right
    Bolonath Crystal: sure
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and if is ablo to listen One-Self, then that path will be manifested
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or lived true
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: living one`s own truth every second
    Darren Islar: hmmm, that sounds real to me :-)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it is real
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and people might have different truths
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: depending what they have chosen to experience
    Darren Islar: I don;t know about the choosing part
    Darren Islar: that is not part of my experience, so I just don't know, might be
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I feel I have chose things
    Darren Islar: in this life yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but realicing WHY later
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: not in moment, but can be seen later
    Darren Islar: but if I would do it again, how much choice would I have to do it differently, I wonder
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, but eaven if there is "bad" chosen
    Darren Islar: because a ot of choices are about not choosing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if choosing other way, would there be a rememebering or learning
    Bolonath Crystal: there is always a choice, i think
    --BELL--
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, there is also other people`s choses made affecting. One can not alone create, but needs also people around.
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: playing their roles
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: And people do make mistakes, incuding me, and people do also Live
    Darren Islar: I don't know Cosmic, I guess anything could be possible, but if I need to do this life again, with what I knew then, I don't think it would be very different
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I wouldn`t chage a thing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: change
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: making mistakes and living life
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thats the way it goes
    Darren Islar: I think the question here is not if you would want to o it differently, but if you have the opportunity to do so
    Darren Islar: I think there is, but only in small ways
    Bolonath Crystal: different choices have different probabilities. if we face the same situation 1 million times, we might easily do the same thing 999999 times. but it is completely unthinkable to me, that everything is completely predeterminated
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I agree
    Darren Islar: right Bolo, I think so too, but can we really 'create' our lives
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its always human mind, how it goes at the end
    Darren Islar: I don;t know, and again I can only work with the tools I have
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I would Say Darren, Yes we can
    Darren Islar: hoping to make a difference for myself and also maybe for others
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Think one moment that You are able to create Your life for now on, what would You do??
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: There is no-one stopping..
    Darren Islar: I have no idea
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, perhaps having some ideas for creation
    Darren Islar: what I try to do is to go with the flow and try to observe that and see where I can change things for my own and others benefit
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: raising little by little

what is karma?

    Bolonath Crystal: having the possibility to create one's own life doesn't neccessarily mean, that we are free to vreate any form of life. there are rules for creation
    Darren Islar: and trying to get into contact with what really moves me
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what kind of rules BOlonanth?
    Bolonath Crystal: the rules of karma
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: You can do It Darren
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: who is ruling over with Karma?
    Darren Islar: right Bolo
    Bolonath Crystal: we can only create a world, that is possible
    Bolonath Crystal: the form is limited by karma
    Darren Islar: and as a teacher once told me, karma is really about habit
    Darren Islar: that I do understand
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: For me there can be chosen if there is karma or not
    Bolonath Crystal: but we can change our karma
    Darren Islar: true bolo
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think only way to create "karma" (meaning bad karma- if thinking limitations) is to do against One-Self
    Darren Islar: but that means we really need to have a close look at our patterns and see where we can change them, against all odds and fears
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: If I feel not to do something, and I will still do it, I will create for my-Self negative karma
    Bolonath Crystal: right, darren
    Darren Islar: that might come with it, opening yourself to new possibilities
    Darren Islar: that I do know
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: all other is positive and there is no limits
    Bolonath Crystal: positive and negative is nothing "objective". it depends from the goal we are struggling to
    Bolonath Crystal: of*
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, thats what I think creates karma
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if doing against One-Self
    Darren Islar: yes I can't imagine that everything is positive
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: otherwice I do not see karma
    Darren Islar: wouldn't be logica
    Darren Islar: *logical
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Karma is something someone have invited to keep people in limits
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with fears
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: like in christian religion there is hell
    Darren Islar: no karma is not about fear
    Bolonath Crystal: in my eyes karma is something entirely different, cosmic :)
    Darren Islar: christianity is about fear
    Darren Islar: karma is about not knowing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm
    Darren Islar: that is misunderstood about karma
    Bolonath Crystal: karma is the law of action and reaction
    Darren Islar: being adopted in the west and dressed with guilt and fear
    Darren Islar: yes nothing more, nothing less
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Not knowing.. I think its not being aware of
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: not karma
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but also
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: there might be several truths with karma also
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: depending one`s own experience
    Darren Islar: maybe so, but karma is a concept
    Darren Islar: coming from the east
    Bolonath Crystal: yes, it is a matter of definition. i prefer the original iondian definition
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I feel it to be like a rucksac
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it can take off
    Darren Islar: if you use karma in a different way, I would suggest to use another name
    --BELL--
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps its also reflection ones inner to outer, this Karma. Like a magnet. What I feel to be, or what I am, I will manifest it and it will return me.
    Darren Islar: maybe
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: If I choose love, I will be loved
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: If I choose being rude, I will be treated rudely
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or so one
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: kind of..
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: love increase love
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: joy increse joy
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: etc
    Darren Islar: true Cosmic, but choosing love is not that easy
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, yes, I know
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its more easy to choose fear
    Darren Islar: having all kind of negative patterns in the way
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: because that is the most common
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but rather love
    Darren Islar: in that is where I am interested in
    Darren Islar: those patterns that get in the way
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but its not need to mind of those patterns
    Darren Islar: how can I dissolve those or change them to my benefit
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: love is also inner state of being
    Bolonath Crystal: i think, it is not that easy. there are many things that happened to me, that i didn't choose (willingly, at least)
    Darren Islar: right Bolo
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: directing attention to love, with consciously
    Darren Islar: sorry, this is a very interesting discussion, but I really need to go
    Darren Islar: another rl appointment
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Forgive, Forget, and live like You have never been hurt
    Bolonath Crystal: yes, me too
    Darren Islar: don't like to take of in the middle of something like that
    Darren Islar: *this
    Bolonath Crystal: we should continue this next time
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: bye Darren
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and Bolo
    Darren Islar: see you and thanks for the lively discussion
    Bolonath Crystal: bye everybody :) om shanti