2010.05.23 13:00 - our various acceptances

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Maxine Walden. The comments are by Maxine Walden. 

    This session seemed to have several strands winding into a braid of sorts: accepting the less pleasant, even violent, or greedy aspects of our world and ourselves, then some inquiry into appetite and greed, what we need and what we want, and then re food and how eating less may be healthy, less being more; And then some focus on sleep deprivation, perhaps as a dangerous aspects of deprivation/starvation. But we seemed to come full circle about acceptance of the variety of appetites, greed, less-appealing aspects of our experience as part of the appreciation of Being.


    Sartre Placebo: hi maxine
    Maxine Walden: hi, Sartre
    Maxine Walden: not sure we have met, have you come to these meetings often?
    Sartre Placebo: yaku
    Sartre Placebo: it´s just my alt
    Maxine Walden: ah, !!, thanks!
    Maxine Walden: does it feel different being Sartre?
    Sartre Placebo: nein, not for me, but i feel that ppl like the name somehow even tho i am not that deep into literature :)
    Maxine Walden: yes, nice evocative name, and I love your hat!
    Sartre Placebo: yes, it´s the ,,mad hatter" outfit
    Maxine Walden: !!, yes it is, isn't it. Great outfit!
    Wol Euler: hello maxine, sartre
    Maxine Walden: hi, Wol
    Sartre Placebo: nabend wol
    Maxine Walden: nice outfit, Wol
    Wol Euler: ty :)
    Wol Euler: an old favourite
    Wol Euler: but one that I seldom wear
    Maxine Walden: ah
    Maxine Walden: guess you and Sartre have met, Wol?
    Wol Euler: mmhmm, but thank you :)
    Maxine Walden: :))
    Wol Euler: for implicitly offering
    Maxine Walden: I may be the least familiar with alts, but just checking...
    Wol Euler nods. Confirmation is always good.
    Maxine Walden: :)
    Wol Euler: what is the topic?
    Maxine Walden: none stated yet, anything you would like to mention?
    Wol Euler thinks. Nothing at present, no :)
    Wol Euler: hello bleu
    Maxine Walden: sometimes just being able to Be peacefully for a bit is nice
    Wol Euler nods.
    Bleu Oleander: hi Wol, Maxine and Sartre
    Maxine Walden: hi, Bleu
    Sartre Placebo: hi bleu
    Wol Euler: hello darren
    Wol Euler: you're looking very much like a day at the seaside, darren
    Maxine Walden: yes, :)
    Darren Islar: been on the seaside last few days
    Wol Euler: ah :)
    Darren Islar: but I'm afraid only in sl
    Wol Euler: ah well :)
    arabella Ella: Hiya!
    Sartre Placebo: hi ara
    Maxine Walden: hi, ara, 90 sec pause in place
    Bleu Oleander: hi Ara

    It seemed like we needed some focus so I offered a personal experience which had given me pause

    Maxine Walden: I had an interesting experience only a couple of hours ago:
    Wol Euler: hello ara
    Maxine Walden: while resting and pausing (9 sec, 90 sec) and looking out a lovely window on a garden,
    Maxine Walden: I saw a favorite 3-legged cat friend, who has been so sweet with me, catch a bird, right there on the lawn.
    Maxine Walden: The experience was one of shock and pain for me, and I found myself withdrawing feeling confused and angry at my 'friend', but then
    Mickorod Renard: hellloooo
    Maxine Walden: felt 'well, this is part of being open to Being as well, open to all the varied experiences of beauty, and violence...
    Wol Euler nods to Maxine. Hello Mick
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Maxine Walden: hi, Mick
    Maxine Walden: hard sometimes to not withdraw from the violence in nature
    Darren Islar: it is
    Mickorod Renard: mmm,,thinks about it
    Maxine Walden: I did find that when I could catch myself and resume the openness even to the pain of my 'friend' catching the bird, then I could feel even more open, have a wider view, be more accepting...
    Darren Islar: yes
    Maxine Walden: and not surprisingly let go of my 'wish' for only the pain-free and the pleasant, could see that as a limiting lens
    Wol Euler nods.
    Darren Islar: right there!!
    Wol Euler: hello kazana, have you been here before?
    Mickorod Renard: we all gotta eat,,even the animals
    Darren Islar: hi Kazana
    arabella Ella: brings to mind the food chain in nature
    Kazana Kazan: No Wol but I would like to join
    Wol Euler: ok, I'll give you an introduction in IM so we dont't disturb the others
    Kazana Kazan: TY
    Maxine Walden: thanks, Wol
    Maxine Walden: What experiences have others been having ?
    Darren Islar: it has been confusing for me, until my teacher told it is all habitual
    arabella Ella: well i just watched a part of a documentary on tuna
    Darren Islar: made sense to me
    arabella Ella: and it was very sad
    arabella Ella: europe consumes over 400 million cans of tuna annually
    Kazana Kazan: Why sad? Becasue they are just food for people?
    arabella Ella: mainly because it is not sustainable and most tuna species will soon become extinct
    Darren Islar: besides that.....
    Kazana Kazan: yes, they cannot "farm" tuna the way they have salmon
    arabella Ella: over-fishing
    arabella Ella: lack of funds for controls
    Kazana Kazan: greed
    Darren Islar: the subject here is more about the respect you have for other living creatures
    arabella Ella: good money for poor economies
    arabella Ella: isnt it lack of resp?ect that leads to extinction
    Mickorod Renard: have they got to the bottom of how that Indian chap lives without eating food?
    Darren Islar: fish to me are living creatures, more so then food
    Darren Islar: right Ara, you're right
    Wol Euler: do we believe that he does, Mick?
    Kazana Kazan: how can one live without food?
    Kazana Kazan: cells need nurishment
    Wol Euler: there's a self-proclaimed mystic who says he hasn't eaten since ... how many decades?
    arabella Ella: why should humans always over-consume everything they can lay their hands on?
    Mickorod Renard: well,,i think we have to be open minded as he has offered to be tested
    Wol Euler: it was in the news lately
    Wol Euler: oh, I'm entirely willing for him to be tested, Mick. Eager, even :-/
    Kazana Kazan: tested?
    Mickorod Renard: he hasnt eaten for something like 4 or 5 decades
    Mickorod Renard: I think
    Maxine Walden: (such interesting threads we are having right now in our conversation about food/intake/greed/respect)
    Kazana Kazan: you belive this?
    Kazana Kazan: believe
    Wol Euler: short answer: no.
    Darren Islar: I belief it is possible yes
    Kazana Kazan: anything is possible
    Mickorod Renard: well, i often remind my kids of the greed in the sense that we do eat in the west more than seems required for our output
    Kazana Kazan: no question about that
    Kazana Kazan: they have proven that a "near starvation" diet keeps mice living much longer than those on even a normal diet.
    Maxine Walden: less as more?
    Mickorod Renard: that doesnt suprise me
    Maxine Walden: seems the body streamlines its function on less food and cells live longer
    Mickorod Renard: and lets face it, much we eat is no less than poison
    Kazana Kazan: processed foods are poison
    Maxine Walden: but maybe with less, we feel emotionally more balanced as well
    Maxine Walden: so many different ways to think about these things
    Bleu Oleander is hungry .... c u later :)
    Darren Islar: bye Bleu
    Wol Euler: bye bleu, eat carefully
    arabella Ella: bye Bleu
    Mickorod Renard: bye bleu
    Kazana Kazan: bye bleu
    Mickorod Renard: much is to do with coping with temptation,,its lenths are to no abound
    Maxine Walden: yes, unbounded temptation can be disturbing
    Kazana Kazan: temptation for one person is normal appetite to another
    Maxine Walden: hmm, different baselines, perhaps?
    Mickorod Renard: its like consumation of world resourses too
    Kazana Kazan: yes, all of us need things in differen proportions
    Kazana Kazan: food, sleep, sex, social networking et cetera
    Maxine Walden: perhaps so, Kazana, maybe also a matter of how we choose our priorities
    Darren Islar: as you describe it is taking care of matter
    Kazana Kazan: choice yes or perhaps our priorities select us
    Darren Islar: which is important of course
    Mickorod Renard: yes, maybe we should consider in what order we would write those options..he he
    Kazana Kazan: has the holy man also abstained from sleep and sex as well as food?
    Darren Islar: it is not in the priorities or where they come from, it is how you deal with it
    Maxine Walden: not sure, only heard about the claim re food
    Mickorod Renard: I am sorry but I dont have any more on him
    Darren Islar: he probably did
    Kazana Kazan: there are cases of people who have not slept in many years
    Mickorod Renard: but the military are interested in finding out how he sustains himself,,naturally for armed forces survival technique
    Maxine Walden: (a 90 sec pause coming up...)
    Mickorod Renard: I have read recently, to the contrary, that without sleep we would die in a week,,but many get by on short naps,,,as per the science journal I read,,,,which i always forget the name of
    Kazana Kazan: day dreaming is a form of sleep
    Maxine Walden: have heard similarly, Mick, that the body grabs what it needs in short naps if it must
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Mickorod Renard: but total sleep deprivation is lethal
    Maxine Walden: yes, probably is
    Kazana Kazan: how many times have you been drivng somewhere and realize that you have gone for miles without realizing it? You were able to drive without knowing it.
    Wol Euler nods.
    Kazana Kazan: your mind was elsewhere
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Maxine Walden: or my understanding is that we lose touch with our conscious vs unconscious selves without sleep and that can be deadly in terms of the confusion and unravelling of the mind
    Darren Islar: I don't know if that is the same as sleeping
    Maxine Walden: we begin to hallucinate and can do dangerous things
    Kazana Kazan: I dont either but it is like dreaming
    Darren Islar: makes sense Maxine
    Mickorod Renard: I must look up the article for the dream session Maxine
    Maxine Walden: please do, Mick
    Darren Islar: would be nice :-)
    Mickorod Renard: I have managed several days without sleep,,and things start to get seriously wierd
    Maxine Walden: interesting, I do not feel greedy about sleep, but I can about other appetites if I go beyond self-respecting boundaries, certain foods, etc. Have not really thought about that before
    Mickorod Renard: I seem to recall that it is about a week without sleep and then the body rejects sleep outright,,resulting quickly in death
    Darren Islar: wow
    Maxine Walden: hmm, didn't know that, Mick, but sounds very serious
    Mickorod Renard: yes, i was suprised
    Mickorod Renard: maybe I read it in a dream
    Maxine Walden: :)
    Darren Islar: did they found out if it was a physical thing or is it more like Maxine described?
    Wol Euler: :)
    Kazana Kazan: Thank you freinds. I found our discussion stimulating. But I must go now.
    Kazana Kazan: Good bye.
    Maxine Walden: thanks for coming, Kazana
    Wol Euler: bye kaz, take care
    Mickorod Renard: bye Kazana,,cum again
    Darren Islar: bye Kazana
    arabella Ella: bye KK
    Maxine Walden: Just wanting to note that I will be away for the next 3 Sundays! Will post it on the email as well
    Darren Islar: vacation Maxine?
    Mickorod Renard: up to anything fun Max?
    Maxine Walden: sort of, Darren. Various meetings, yes fun, nice places to visit, nice people to see
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: soull
    Mickorod Renard: nice
    Wol Euler: sounds good
    arabella Ella: how lovely Maxine enjoy!
    Darren Islar: great
    Maxine Walden: thank you, I will enjoy time away, but will miss this group as well :(
    Wol Euler nods.
    arabella Ella: ah we will miss u too
    Maxine Walden: But choice does that, things gained and other things lost, at least temporarily
    Darren Islar: good practice :-)
    Maxine Walden: life is like that...guess for me being able to feel the loss helps keep the balance
    arabella Ella nods
    Darren Islar: :-)
    Mickorod Renard: perhaps thats how to view the animal issue you spoke about,,some things gained some things lost Max
    Maxine Walden: maybe so, Mick. thanks for that insight
    arabella Ella: nice way of putting it mick
    Darren Islar: I think that is the wider perspective
    Maxine Walden: well, had better go. Nice to see everyone
    Sartre Placebo: take care maxine
    Maxine Walden: bye all
    Wol Euler: 'night maxine, take care
    Darren Islar: bye Maxine
    Mickorod Renard: bye Maxine
    Wol Euler: enjoy your time away
    arabella Ella: bye Maxine
    arabella Ella: i must go too good night all!
    Sartre Placebo: night are, bye everyone
    Darren Islar: bye Ara
    Wol Euler: bye ara, take care
    Mickorod Renard: bye Ara
    Darren Islar: bye Yaku (for the record I guess)
    Mickorod Renard: I must move on too,,work tommorow as well
    Darren Islar: bye Mick
    Wol Euler: 'night mick, sleep well
    Mickorod Renard: bye Guys,,sleep well u too
    Wol Euler: how are you, darren? rested up?
    Darren Islar: a bit
    Wol Euler: I guess that's a bit good then :)
    Darren Islar: :_)
    Darren Islar: I don't know yet, because the process isn't over
    Darren Islar: but I have been talking a bit about it this morning
    Darren Islar: that is a good sign
    Wol Euler nods.
    Darren Islar: but something triggered emotions of long gone
    Darren Islar: and frustrations since the past few years
    Darren Islar: since I'm ill and can't financial take care of myself anymore
    Darren Islar: it puts me in an place where others can decide what I need to do
    Wol Euler nods
    Wol Euler: btw the recorder is still running. Is that OK=
    Wol Euler: ?
    Darren Islar: they look at me, talk to me for an hour, and they know
    Darren Islar: I know
    Wol Euler: just checking :)
    Wol Euler: because I sometimes forget
    Darren Islar: I'm pretty aware of that :-)
    Darren Islar: I do too, but not on these occasions
    Wol Euler: ok
    Wol Euler: so, yes, I can imagine that being very frustrating, and frightening too
    Darren Islar: yes
    Darren Islar: more frustration at the moment
    Darren Islar: I have feared this situation a lot
    Darren Islar: but you learn to live day by day
    Wol Euler nods.
    Darren Islar: and grief
    Darren Islar: and still pretty emotional
    Darren Islar: but have been taking better care of myself last few days
    Darren Islar: that helps
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    Wol Euler: if there's anything I can do to help, even just listening, I'm here.
    Darren Islar: thansk Wol
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Darren Islar: maybe you would like to join me for a while on the seaside
    Darren Islar: not for long
    Darren Islar: don't want to make it late
    Wol Euler: yes, that sounds good.
    Darren Islar: okay, will TP you
    Wol Euler: k
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