2010.06.06 07:00 - Love and Compassion

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Adams Rubble. The comments are by Adams Rubble.

    Adams Rubble: Hello Sophia :)
    Adams Rubble: Good morning :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: good morning Adams!
    Adams Rubble: How are you today?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: good :) so very humid here, how are you?
    Adams Rubble: yes, the humidity has been pretty brutal. I still have my cold so I am sleepy :)
    Adams Rubble: too hot to sleep right at night :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ah sorry I hope you feel better
    Adams Rubble: otherwise very good :)
    Adams Rubble: looking forward to after the thunderstorm
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I'm looking forward to the thunderstorms in general, I love them
    Adams Rubble: I always worry the roof will blow off (giggles)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes! true :)
    Adams Rubble: or the trees will topple
    SophiaSharon Larnia: in my area thats more likely
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i live in a patch of dense woods :)
    Adams Rubble: ohhh
    SophiaSharon Larnia: after storms have to do clean up each time
    Adams Rubble: That must be nice most of the time :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: natures way of pruming the trees
    Adams Rubble: yes
    SophiaSharon Larnia: pruning*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (it;s buggy) laughs
    Adams Rubble: you must have lots of birds
    Adams Rubble: oh yes, the bugs (yikes)
    Adams Rubble: good bird food though
    SophiaSharon Larnia: flowers dont do well on my property because they get eaten by the deer
    SophiaSharon Larnia: you loveeee them
    Adams Rubble: the deer are getting bolder
    SophiaSharon Larnia: who rather*
    Adams Rubble: they are walking down the sidewalks now
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :))
    SophiaSharon Larnia: someone recommended that i get a dog, the deer wont come around then but i like them
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Adams Rubble: nice to see in the woods but not nice when the have a run in on the road
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes, i see them all the time
    Adams Rubble: We usually see them on weekends in the woods
    Adams Rubble: forthunately they have no made it to our yard yet but the are very close now
    Adams Rubble: on the next block behind our house
    SophiaSharon Larnia: part of my gardening is finding plants the animals wont munch on :)
    Adams Rubble: there is so little area for them to live, it is amazing
    Adams Rubble: yes :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes a very small area, here too
    SophiaSharon Larnia: why they are so condensed
    Adams Rubble: we have hundreds of squirrels munching on everything
    Adams Rubble: including our house
    Adams Rubble: Hello Agatha :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ! Adams yikes :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Agatha :)
    Adams Rubble: They were inside last year
    --BELL--
    Agatha Macbeth: Hello SSL and Adams :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oh scritch scritch
    SophiaSharon Larnia: gorgeous outfit Agatha (and Adams too, I didn't say yet ^^)
    Agatha Macbeth: TY :)
    Adams Rubble: Thank you :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Mm, very red Adams :)
    Adams Rubble: I read something very interesting this week

    Love and Compassion

    Adams Rubble: Many times we have talked about the difference beytween love and compassion
    Agatha Macbeth nods
    Adams Rubble: In an introduction to Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, The Wish-Fulfilling Wheel, the author gives a Tibetan Buddhist answer
    Agatha Macbeth: Aha
    Adams Rubble: "In Tibetan Buddhism, Love is defined as desiring the happiness of others. Compassion is defined as desiring that they have freedom from all forms of suffering"
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hmm
    Adams Rubble: I have been thinking about that for the past couple of days
    Agatha Macbeth: I would think one compliments the other
    Adams Rubble: It is a wonderful distinction though
    Adams Rubble: That was followed by another zonger
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i didn't think of love as being based on a concept of self, if I read that right
    Adams Rubble: zinger
    Agatha Macbeth: Yes, a subtle distinction

    Happiness and Suffering

    Adams Rubble: "Space is infinite. It is filled with all sorts of sentient beings. Each and every one of them wants to be happy. None of them wants to suffer. Unfortunately, most are ignorant of what constitutes the causes of happiness and the causes of suffering., Therefore, although they wish to be happy, they do not tend to engage in those activities that produce happiness. Likewise, although they do not wish to suffer, they engage in those actions which will cause them suffering in the future. Because of this ignorance and because of the actions produced by ignorance, sentient beings experience all the many kinds of suffering that exist throughout the universe."
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles @ zonger
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Agatha Macbeth: A long zonger!
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Just finished reading
    SophiaSharon Larnia: sweeping statement, the universe!
    Agatha Macbeth: Well yes, that is quite thought-provoking
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thinking
    Agatha Macbeth: It's kinda big
    Adams Rubble: yes, so simple isn't it ?
    Adams Rubble: Much like starting at the end :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Simplicity is usually the essence of perfection
    Agatha Macbeth: I agree, very cute
    Adams Rubble: What makes us happy is love and compassion :)
    Agatha Macbeth: oh, definitely!
    Adams Rubble: but we look for everything else but that
    Agatha Macbeth: Or we look for it but never find it
    SophiaSharon Larnia: so happiness is freedom from the suffering caused by ignorance and wrong action
    Agatha Macbeth: Caused by who tho, oneself or others?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: when i first read that, what popped in my head first was causal action
    Adams Rubble: hmmm, yes Sharon
    Adams Rubble: unthinking action
    SophiaSharon Larnia: to me implying a linear stream
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Agatha Macbeth: 'Knock-on effect'
    SophiaSharon Larnia: but things are not necessarily linear?
    Agatha Macbeth: Maybe circular?
    Adams Rubble: We are most content when concerned most about the happiness and suffering of others
    Adams Rubble: we are most unhappy when we are concerned about our own happiness and suffering
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i can say experientially for myself thats true
    Agatha Macbeth: Not necessarily 'content' but 'alive'
    SophiaSharon Larnia: however you tend to neglegt your own things when doing that
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Adams Rubble: yes
    SophiaSharon Larnia: whether you mean to or not
    Adams Rubble: there are extenuating circumstances
    Adams Rubble: we must sustain ourselves
    Adams Rubble: That was one of the things Buddha learned by being an ascetic
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hmm
    Adams Rubble: He could not be any good to anyone if he starved to dreath
    Adams Rubble: death
    Agatha Macbeth: Good job he didn't then:)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i was thinking about this too, but in a different way
    Adams Rubble: yes?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: its kind of personal
    Adams Rubble: ohh. OK
    --BELL--
    Fael Innovia: meep! :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Fael :))
    Agatha Macbeth: Hi Fael :)
    Adams Rubble: Hello Fael :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
    Agatha Macbeth: Feeling energetic?
    Adams Rubble: a new Fael?
    Fael Innovia: Yes :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: been thinking on how to say it Adams, and dont how to put it into words
    Agatha Macbeth: Two Faels now, how lucky are we?
    Fael Innovia: yep, my other side
    Adams Rubble: don;t feel you need to Sharon if it is personal
    Adams Rubble: Nice to meet you new Fael :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: its a matter of finding vocabulary that isnt tainted by unintended meaning
    Fael Innovia: Ah, Agatha, something feels very good about your dress :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Yes? :)
    Fael Innovia: I like the parts on your head especially :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
    Agatha Macbeth: Ah, right. Cute hat eh?
    Fael Innovia: yep :)
    Fael Innovia: and the veil
    Agatha Macbeth: Only bought it today actually
    Agatha Macbeth: Thought it would go nice with this outfit
    Fael Innovia: Sharon looks kind of blessed somehow :)
    Agatha Macbeth: She usually does :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i do? giggles
    Fael Innovia: yep :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i am blessed
    Agatha Macbeth: Our beloved Chronicler
    SophiaSharon Larnia: you all are too ^^
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oh i need to actually post something to be called that LOL
    Agatha Macbeth: Is that a word- Chrocler?
    Fael Innovia: I can't find the words for what I feel from Adams but I like the feel too :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Chronicler rather
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i dunno :))
    Agatha Macbeth: The Fael feel
    SophiaSharon Larnia feels Fael hahaha
    Fael Innovia giggles.
    Fael Innovia: so, did I break up your conversation?
    Adams Rubble: Fael, we were discussin two staements from a book I just bought
    SophiaSharon Larnia: no i think i got stuck on words again
    Agatha Macbeth can't remember what the conversation was
    Adams Rubble: "In Tibetan Buddhism, Love is defined as desiring the happiness of others. Compassion is defined as desiring that they have freedom from all forms of suffering. Space is infinite. It is filled with all sorts of sentient beings. Each and every one of them wants to be happy. None of them wants to suffer. Unfortunately, most are ignorant of what constitutes the causes of happiness and the causes of suffering., Therefore, although they wish to be happy, they do not tend to engage in those activities that produce happiness. Likewise, although they do not wish to suffer, they engage in those actions which will cause them suffering in the future. Because of this ignorance and because of the actions produced by ignorance, sentient beings experience all the many kinds of suffering that exist throughout the universe." from Khenpo Karthar Rinpoche, The Wish-Fulfilling Wheel.
    Agatha Macbeth: Oh, right
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Fael Innovia smiles.
    Fael Innovia: sounds about right :)
    Adams Rubble: We don't all have to be Mother Theresa (hehe)
    Agatha Macbeth: A very hard act to follow
    Adams Rubble: yes, very
    Fael Innovia: well, yes, it would be impossible. At least for the moment.
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Agatha Macbeth: For me at any rate :)
    Fael Innovia: But I'm happy I can manage to come close sometimes :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Ha, indeed Fael!
    SophiaSharon Larnia wonders if mother teresa took care of her own affairs, or did everything for everyone else
    Agatha Macbeth: Probably both
    Fael Innovia: if she didn't do both, then I'd be surprised to see her touted as a role model :)
    Agatha Macbeth: And *what* a role model
    Adams Rubble: We cna fulfill our own roles the best we can :)
    Agatha Macbeth nods
    SophiaSharon Larnia: arrgghs, frustrating to not think of the words
    Fael Innovia: yep :)
    --BELL--
    Fael Innovia: what words?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: if given the choice to help someone else clean their house, or to clean my own, i would always help someone else, while my house falls down and bills dont get paid
    Agatha Macbeth: That's called altruism Shaz! :))
    SophiaSharon Larnia: im not saying this to seem a certain way, its just to point to something
    Agatha Macbeth understands
    Adams Rubble nods
    Agatha Macbeth: In fact it sounds a lot like someone else I know! :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: this is unhealthy but hats not the whole story either
    Fael Innovia: Yes, I understand
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thats*
    Agatha Macbeth: 'The whole story' is a big subject Shaz
    Fael Innovia: I've helped others clean their houses while mine has been a horrid mess :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: nods :)) me too
    Fael Innovia: and I've still done nothing for my own
    Agatha Macbeth: Maybe they should then help you clean yours?
    Fael Innovia: I didn't invite them over, so they didn't know it's dirty :P
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thats what i was thinking compassion is, but am having a hard time bringing it around
    Agatha Macbeth: :DDDDDDD Fae!!!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes my coworkers think im a neat freak if only they knew ^^
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Mine think I'm just a freak [grin]
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :D
    Agatha Macbeth: Aww
    Agatha Macbeth: /e smiles inwardly
    Adams Rubble: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i'll think about that all day Adams :)
    Agatha Macbeth: (This keyboard is annoying me)
    Adams Rubble: The ignorance part is tricky. If it was easy to focus on what makes us happy, we'd all be doing it, right?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: nods
    SophiaSharon Larnia: reminds me of the fisherman story, teach a man to fish....
    Adams Rubble: yes, we all go for the easy fish (giggles)
    Agatha Macbeth: 'The one that got away'
    SophiaSharon Larnia: part of the suffering comes from mourning what got away
    Adams Rubble nods
    Agatha Macbeth: Well yes, there's always that...
    Fael Innovia: I wouldn't call mourning suffering.
    Adams Rubble: it can be
    Agatha Macbeth: No, but it can be
    Agatha Macbeth: Snap
    SophiaSharon Larnia: in this case i would, desiring something you dont have, sematics though
    Fael Innovia smiles.
    Agatha Macbeth nods @ Sharon
    Adams Rubble: It is almost time for the guardian meeting
    SophiaSharon Larnia: mourning at the state of the world for example, i dint know what that is
    SophiaSharon Larnia: don't*
    Adams Rubble wondering how I will do posting the log today
    SophiaSharon Larnia: eh?
    Agatha Macbeth: That's another big subject Shaz
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oh how, not who lol
    Agatha Macbeth: Well, I posted Thursday's 1300 ok earlier on
    SophiaSharon Larnia: carefuly Adams? hahahhaa
    Adams Rubble: unless someone wants to do it for me (giggles)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: it seems to be the same way
    Adams Rubble: good for you Agatha :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Calvino? :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i can Adams :)
    Adams Rubble: thanks for the encouragement :)
    Agatha Macbeth: The new Wili seems sorted now
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hehe
    Adams Rubble: change is always scary
    Agatha Macbeth: Wiki
    Agatha Macbeth sorts her Wili
    Adams Rubble: time for us to migrate I guess
    SophiaSharon Larnia: eh?
    Agatha Macbeth nods
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes :)
    Agatha Macbeth: Guardian meeting
    Fael Innovia: Ah, yes :)
    Agatha Macbeth: I will walk
    Fael Innovia: hmm, should I come as Illyar? :P not in the group with this one :)
    --BELL--
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ill double transport tp, cause i love it
    Fael Innovia: ... well, I'll see if anyone feels like ejecting me :P
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ha!

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