2010.06.19 13:00 - Rock and Roll and Zen

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Darren Islar. The comments are by Darren Islar.

    We had a few newcomers in the group, one really new, baked on this day, others being here for only a few times. Also a very full group, the inner circle completely taken, and of course interesting conversations, that started after about half an hour. We talked about Rock and Roll and Zen, about dropping and ego and methods to approach that, and singing and chanting and the effects it has on us

    Darren Islar: hi Dream
    Dream Wrexan: oh, hi
    Dream Wrexan: I guess this is where I left off 4-1/2 hours ago. :-)
    Darren Islar: yes :)


    Darren Islar: and then it is possible you end up in somebody's lap :)
    Dream Wrexan: haha - it wouldn't be the first time!
    Darren Islar: maybe you have other plans, but you also might sit down :)
    Dream Wrexan: not only that - I was floating a foot off of the ground
    Darren Islar: oops
    Dream Wrexan: sure, I'm just checking the calendar of events
    Darren Islar: okay
    Darren Islar: sorry about that :)
    Darren Islar: you have been visiting us a few times?
    Dream Wrexan: I think this is #3.
    Darren Islar: okay, welcome :)
    Dream Wrexan: Unfortunately at #2 I was interrupted by a phone call
    Dream Wrexan: so only once officially
    Dream Wrexan: thanks
    Darren Islar: yes, that happens
    Dream Wrexan: RL does seem to merge in ---
    Dream Wrexan: and, I'm beginning to find, that it happens the other way around, too
    Darren Islar: so, how is your first impression, if you like to say something about it of course
    Dream Wrexan: I appreciate intelligent conversation
    Dream Wrexan: it's hard to find on first glance
    Darren Islar: true
    Dream Wrexan: Lots of lounges and dancing - role play

    Darren Islar: hi Luci
    Lucinda Lavender: hi DArren, Dream
    Dream Wrexan: Hi, Luci :-)

    Darren Islar: yes, I know :))
    Dream Wrexan: This place has been the most satisfying so far
    Lucinda Lavender: hi DArren, Dream
    Darren Islar: but people like us are also hard to find in rl
    Dream Wrexan: so true
    Dream Wrexan: Hi, Luci :-)
    Dream Wrexan: join us if you'd like
    Dream Wrexan: pull up a pillow :-)
    Darren Islar: and here there is this advantage that you find them about all at once :)
    Darren Islar: the only annoying thing is the time differences
    Darren Islar: because distance is not important
    Dream Wrexan: I've been involved with online chat since before the WWW
    Lucinda Lavender: odd
    Dream Wrexan: (text based, early on)
    Dream Wrexan: what's odd, Luci?
    Lucinda Lavender: sitting was slow
    Darren Islar: you're an oldie :)
    Dream Wrexan: oh, well you made it, Luci :-)
    Dream Wrexan: ... but a goodie!
    Darren Islar: heheh :)
    Dream Wrexan: The SIM environment is totally new to me, however
    Dream Wrexan: It's taken some getting used to
    Darren Islar: it is very visual

    Dream Wrexan: hi, cal
    Darren Islar: hi Cal :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Hi, everyone :)

    Dream Wrexan: the visual is actually a distraction for me
    Darren Islar: how so?
    Dream Wrexan: I have a highly active visual imagination
    Darren Islar: hmmm, I just like the combination
    Darren Islar: but I need to say, I'm not a chatter, so I can't compare
    Dream Wrexan: I'm getting accustomed to it
    Dream Wrexan: well, I haven't been a chatter for a long time
    Darren Islar: I think somebody crashed
    Dream Wrexan: I took a break from fantasy :-)
    Darren Islar: :))
    Dream Wrexan: hopefully she'll be back
    Darren Islar: I think so
    Calvino Rabeni: What about dreams, Dream?
    Dream Wrexan: what about them, Cal?
    Calvino Rabeni: Are they fantasy, and are you taking a break from them?
    Dream Wrexan: lol
    Dream Wrexan: No, I have very active dreams
    Dream Wrexan: some even lucid

    Dream Wrexan: speaking of Lucid...
    Darren Islar: there she is
    Calvino Rabeni: WB Lucinda
    Dream Wrexan: I mean Luci lol
    Darren Islar: :)
    Dream Wrexan: wb, Luci
    Darren Islar: wb Luci

    Dream Wrexan: Sometimes it's hard to remember dreams, though
    Dream Wrexan: even the vivid ones

    Dream Wrexan: Hi, xxxx
    Darren Islar: hi xxxx :)

    Dream Wrexan: I like your flowers, xxxx
    Dream Wrexan: ooh - Luci has them too
    Dream Wrexan: nice
    Darren Islar: those are the flowers
    Dream Wrexan: thank you :-)
    Darren Islar: yw :)
    Darren Islar: it still isn't working well with Luci


    Dream Wrexan: Is there a technical reason for the silent period?
    Darren Islar: technical?
    Darren Islar: no
    Darren Islar: we have a small practice here
    Darren Islar: every 15 minutes we take a break for 9 seconds
    Lucinda Lavender: Had a desire for piece of cheese after the disconnection. Found the kitchen full of the work of bottling beer.
    Darren Islar: to place us back in the here and now
    Darren Islar: :)@ Luci
    Lucinda Lavender: :)
    Dream Wrexan: I like that, Darren - very mindful
    Darren Islar: you can use a pen and paper to write your thoughts down
    Darren Islar: what initially comes up to you
    Darren Islar: here we do the same thing
    Darren Islar: except for 9 seconds, we take 90 seconds
    Darren Islar: every 15 minutes
    Dream Wrexan: that's great
    Darren Islar: yes, it is a way to take you back to what it is all about, instead of getting strangled up in a discussion

    Dream Wrexan: hi, arabella
    Darren Islar: hi Ara :)
    Lucinda Lavender: Hello Arabella...

    Ara arrives and I quickly put on my orange t-shirt. Soccer-time again

    arabella Ella: nice orange shirt Darren, very symbolic and appropriate, congrats!
    Darren Islar: I thought so too Ara
    arabella Ella: :)
    arabella Ella: Denmark just won too
    Darren Islar: oh no!!!!!
    Darren Islar: :))
    arabella Ella: 2-1
    arabella Ella: just finished now
    Darren Islar: ah
    Darren Islar: well, they lost from Holland so....
    arabella Ella: yes
    Darren Islar: Ara and I have a friendly argument over football :))
    arabella Ella nods
    arabella Ella: Netherlands now has 6 points so seems you are through to next round
    Dream Wrexan: I only know about American football, sorry
    Darren Islar: shame on you :))
    Darren Islar: I think so too
    Dream Wrexan: yes, I know - it's embarrasing right now
    arabella Ella: well Dream the USA is participating too in this world cup soccer tournament in S Africa
    Dream Wrexan: yes, that much I knew
    Dream Wrexan: 2 ties, right?
    arabella Ella: ah
    arabella Ella: yes
    Dream Wrexan: It's been very much in the news - couldn't be avoided

    xxxx: hi all
    Dream Wrexan: hi again, xxxx
    arabella Ella: Hiya xxxx
    Darren Islar: hi xxxx

    arabella Ella: well Dream all Europe is full of flags and parties and big screens for the soccer ;)
    Darren Islar: we take it very seriously :))
    Darren Islar: even now we know the ball is not at all round
    arabella Ella giggles ... too seriously
    Dream Wrexan: :-)
    arabella Ella: oh and the football for England last night was definitely not round
    Dream Wrexan: I've lived in a superbowl city, so I have a taste of what that must be like
    Darren Islar: no, I think the need to win the last match

    Dream Wrexan: hi, zen
    arabella Ella: Hiya Zen
    Darren Islar: hi Zen
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Lucinda Lavender: Hi Zen
    Zen Arado: Hi Luci

    arabella Ella: oh then are you from the West Coast?
    Lucinda Lavender: Dream I want to give you a lei but I am having a hard time just yet
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Dream Wrexan: Oh, Luci... thank you! But Darren has already given me one


    Lucinda Lavender: ok could not see
    Dream Wrexan: ara, I've lived all over the US - but right now I'm waiting for the oil to catch up with us in SW Florida
    arabella Ella: owwwww
    Darren Islar: sorry to hear Dream
    Lucinda Lavender: yes sorry to hear ...
    Dream Wrexan: Yes, I'll be leaving for the beach shortly - I want to take advantage of it as much as possible
    Darren Islar: it must be awful
    Dream Wrexan: it isn't here yet - I'm hoping it will pass us by
    arabella Ella: yes it is weird that they still have not managed to control the flow
    Darren Islar: or the hole
    xxxxgirl Pearl: it needs a lot of money and efforts
    xxxxgirl Pearl: but what about the aqua life?
    arabella Ella: well they pledged 20m dollars as compensation

    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey everyone
    Zen Arado: Hi Yaku
    Dream Wrexan: I think of it as Mother Earth, bleeding
    arabella Ella: Hiya Yaku
    Dream Wrexan: hi, Yaku
    Darren Islar: hi Yaku :)

    Darren Islar: there was an article about it in the Dutch newspaper
    Zen Arado: black blood
    Darren Islar: they really made o a lot of mistakes
    Dream Wrexan: yes, Zen
    Darren Islar: BP and the government
    Darren Islar: before we continue talking about oil
    Darren Islar: does somebody have a topic
    Darren Islar: maybe an awareness you had in the last week
    arabella Ella thinking ...
    Darren Islar: or today

    Darren Islar: Hey Mick
    Mickorod Renard: hiya
    arabella Ella: Hiya Mick
    Dream Wrexan: hi, mick
    Zen Arado: Hi Mick
    xxxxgirl Pearl: hi Mick
    Darren Islar: hi Bert
    arabella Ella: who is he Zen (scuse my ignorance)?
    Mickorod Renard: hi bert
    Bertram Jacobus: hehe - i´m detected - hey all ! :-)
    arabella Ella: Hiya Bert
    Darren Islar: oh sorry Bert :)
    Bertram Jacobus: lol - noo darren - fine ! :-))

    F** punk Rock and Zen, Zen meeting and inspired by Brad Warner
    Calvino: "between the seriousness of zen and the committed informality of punk rock"

    Zen Arado: I went to see Brad Warner thurs night
    Zen Arado: http://hardcorezen.blogspot.com/
    Zen Arado: he is a zen teacher
    Zen Arado: used to be a punk rocker
    arabella Ella: ah
    Zen Arado: he is very up front and honest
    Dream Wrexan: "bad boy of Zen" :-)
    Zen Arado: I liked him
    Dream Wrexan: What did he speak about?
    Zen Arado: he just talked about his life
    Zen Arado: he had a lot of problems lately
    arabella Ella: yes?
    xxxxgirl Pearl: really?
    Zen Arado: grandmother, mother died, wife left him and he lost his job
    Zen Arado: all in the same year
    Bertram Jacobus: whaow
    Mickorod Renard: yikes
    Darren Islar: that is certainly a lot
    Bertram Jacobus: so - intense learning time
    Zen Arado: yep
    Darren Islar: is that made him think about his life and what he wanted to do with it?
    Zen Arado: he gets through to younger audience
    arabella Ella: that sounds real tough
    Zen Arado: uses F*** word a lot
    Bertram Jacobus: lol
    arabella Ella: where is he from?
    Zen Arado: no - he's been into Zen for 27 years
    Zen Arado: he is head of a zen order
    Mickorod Renard: sounds australian
    Zen Arado: Ohio
    Mickorod Renard: close
    Darren Islar: okay
    Zen Arado: :)
    Zen Arado: I read one of his books
    Bertram Jacobus: close ? same planet ? :-)
    Calvino Rabeni: So the heart of rock and roll AND zen is from Cleveland ??
    Darren Islar: heheh
    arabella Ella: he he
    Zen Arado: Akron :)
    Dream Wrexan: :-))
    Dream Wrexan: Did you gain any insights from his talk, Zen?
    Bertram Jacobus: nice question
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Zen Arado: Hmmmmm...
    Zen Arado: just to be myself?
    Zen Arado: he is so down to earth
    Zen Arado: refreshing
    Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni giggles
    Darren Islar: so f** down to earth :))
    Zen Arado: :)
    Dream Wrexan: :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: why do you giggle cal !? :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: lol
    Calvino Rabeni: to release the tension
    Bertram Jacobus: ahh ... :-)
    Zen Arado: that's why we do it :)
    Calvino Rabeni: between the seriousness of zen and the committed informality of punk rock
    Darren Islar: sounds a good place to be


    Calvino Rabeni: when zen was imported to the west, along with it came a lot of japanese culture
    Zen Arado: have to be careful what you throw out tho
    Calvino Rabeni: so we sit here in formal postures, on japanese cushions, surrounded by tatami mats :)

    Bertram Jacobus: re mick
    arabella Ella: wb Mick
    Mickorod Renard: hi,,sorry crashed

    Lucinda Lavender: between the power of the word f**k and the subtlety of a spaciouspondering the power for the word and the subtlety of the spacious mind
    Lucinda Lavender: oops
    Zen Arado: Zen itself threw out a lot of add-ons that had accreted since the Buddha's time
    Lucinda Lavender: well you get what I was going to say twice

    'Being' yourself, dropping ego, what exactly does that all mean. Some thoughts:

    Mickorod Renard: its very hard to be oneself in this crazy world
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, it simplified, reduced iconography, etc. and picked up a kind of austerity
    Zen Arado: you have to read one of his books
    Bertram Jacobus: i don´t find that mick
    Mickorod Renard: no?
    Mickorod Renard: I am doing better these days at it I think
    Calvino Rabeni: This "whirlygig" world, as it was named in a previous session :)
    Bertram Jacobus: no. it´s only one variation of being - more interesting i find to loose the ego
    Zen Arado: being oneself isn't being anybody perhaps
    Mickorod Renard: maybe thats the way Zen
    Dream Wrexan: Mick, I find that's true at times as well. Especially with my liberal outlook, living in the Bible Belt - it takes discretion on my part
    arabella Ella: i too find it difficult to always be myself ... after all in life we have to wear many hats
    Zen Arado: what is yourself?
    Mickorod Renard: I have took a life time working out who I am,,so that was a stumbling block
    Dream Wrexan: It wasn't even easy for me to find a Pink Floyd t-shirt here in SL. :-)
    Zen Arado: you can't find it
    arabella Ella: you tell me Zen
    Zen Arado: I don't know either
    arabella Ella: but yet we talk about finding ourselves and dropping our ego don't we?

    Bleu Oleander: hi all :)
    Lucinda Lavender: Hi Bleu
    Dream Wrexan: hi, bleu
    Zen Arado: Hi Bleu
    arabella Ella: Hiya Bleu
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Bleu
    Darren Islar: hi Bleu
    Bertram Jacobus: hi bleu

    Mickorod Renard: the only way i can hope to achieve it is to drop my pretensions
    arabella Ella: how can we find or drop something if we don't know what it is?
    Bertram Jacobus: on the one stage it is a bunch of qualities, on another transcendence
    Zen Arado: finding our 'no-self'
    Darren Islar: good question Ara
    arabella Ella: ah ... but that rasies the same question Zen ... who is our no-self?
    arabella Ella: pushes the question over again
    Zen Arado: we don't know
    Zen Arado: and we rest in that
    Zen Arado: I think
    Mickorod Renard: just whats left after dropping pretensions I guess
    Bertram Jacobus: just be
    Darren Islar: but it is hard to see what is ego or what is being
    Darren Islar: ego has a lot of tricks up his sleeves
    Dream Wrexan: comfort in not knowing tends to take practice
    Zen Arado: she sure has :)
    Darren Islar: to examine it, you need something that can guide you

    Discussing 'new' methods that can help us with dropping and ego. But we are wondering about the purpose in those methods. Also discussing the differences between aims and goals. Then going to the meaning of chanting, uttering, speech
    Oh, and of course: Avatar

    Calvino Rabeni: There's a class being offered in some places - self-realization through Rock and Roll - that gets high marks from some buddhist I know
    arabella Ella: he he
    Zen Arado: sounds like fun anyway
    Darren Islar: that Rock and Roll part seems to be important :))
    Mickorod Renard: how does it work Cal?
    Calvino Rabeni: that is, one can also leap into the unknown through self expression as well as distanced awareness
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,that sounds liberating
    Lucinda Lavender: something fearless about it
    Bleu Oleander: sounds intreging Cal
    arabella Ella: does that mean dance as a form of self expression Cal?
    Zen Arado: BW says playing his bass can be like meditation
    Calvino Rabeni: How it works, is, your teacher helps you find songs that express and reveal unknown parts of self, and awarely
    Calvino Rabeni: the final class is a performance with a real rock band in a big audience
    Dream Wrexan: there is the experience of kiirtan - and Sufi whirling
    Darren Islar: playing music has certainly a lot of elements in it that feels like meditation
    Calvino Rabeni: And singing with "soul"
    arabella Ella: also listening to music
    Dream Wrexan: yes, Darren
    Zen Arado: yes - if you go with the flow of it
    Darren Islar: I can imagine the same goes with a lot of things
    Bleu Oleander: art too
    Dream Wrexan: art can transform
    Darren Islar: well, the things with playing music, is that you have too
    Mickorod Renard: free running
    Dream Wrexan: I've seen it in work with dementia patients, too
    Darren Islar: the music itself guides you
    Calvino Rabeni: @mick yes
    Zen Arado: yes Dream?
    Darren Islar: except that the awareness can be away
    Calvino Rabeni: or "playformation", an approach to using improv acting for dropping the rigidities of the fixated self
    Mickorod Renard: I am interested in the results with dementia patients?
    Bertram Jacobus: a former teacher told me once that a guy came to him and explained "even sitting in the forest with my gun and waiting for the deer to kill it is like meditation to me" ...
    Dream Wrexan: Zen, some who haven't talked in months begin singing to music they are familiar with
    Darren Islar: meditation is a lot about concentration
    Dream Wrexan: they can complete lyrics
    Calvino Rabeni: true, Dream
    Darren Islar: it is the purpose that makes it a real meditation
    Calvino Rabeni: it uses different capacities
    Calvino Rabeni: some can sing, but not talk
    Zen Arado: I can see that Dream - songs are buried so deeply
    Mickorod Renard: thankyou dream
    Dream Wrexan: yes, very deep
    Calvino Rabeni: Darren, makes it a real practice
    Calvino Rabeni: yes
    Bertram Jacobus: purpose - nice angle ...
    Calvino Rabeni: there needs to be some Aim
    Darren Islar: yes
    Dream Wrexan: but isn't it some specific type of aim?
    Calvino Rabeni: and with aim, then nearly anything can become a practice
    Lucinda Lavender: I used to take preschool children to sing with the alsheimers unit and the staff said they were less combative for the day...
    Darren Islar: yes Cal :)
    Calvino Rabeni: well, spining in a circle isn't in itself a practice :)
    Mickorod Renard: interesting Lucinda
    Zen Arado: we did a lot of singinng in school when I was little
    Darren Islar: you can be practicing all day
    Calvino Rabeni: but with aim, it becomes a deep tradition


    Mickorod Renard: yes, I miss the singing at assembly at school
    Mickorod Renard: oops
    Calvino Rabeni: singing with a group can be a way to communion
    Dream Wrexan: I see your point, Cal, and I agree with it - I'm trying to clarify if the aim of the concentration is of a specific type
    Zen Arado: it was mostly Christian hymns tho
    Lucinda Lavender: unity
    Dream Wrexan: what is the aim of meditative concentration?
    Dream Wrexan: of whirling - or singing - etc
    Dream Wrexan: Luci - I tend to agree that it is unity
    Bertram Jacobus: for me : enlightenment (aim of meditation)
    Calvino Rabeni: those aims depend on the practitioner
    Dream Wrexan: union with the transcendant
    Calvino Rabeni: maybe just to be present with what is
    Calvino Rabeni: maybe to open heart
    Calvino Rabeni: maybe to clear up priorities
    Calvino Rabeni: focus energy
    Lucinda Lavender: maybe especially when done with a feeling of a certain intention
    Zen Arado: in 'Shikantaza' you are supposed to drop aims
    Zen Arado: "In the sitting of Shikantaza, one radically drops (and is dropped from) all thought of discovery –”special” or not “special,” attainment, wish for change, opposites of happy/sad peaceful/disturbed, all desire to pierce a mystery, worry of “problems” to resolve, concepts of “life” and “death” or “time”, idea of “oneness”… all purpose to accomplish some goal. All of that is dropped… even the thought of a “someone” to do the achieving of some goal, too. All fully discarded, not needed in any way.
    Dream Wrexan: then would the aim be to drop aims?
    Calvino Rabeni: yes
    Bleu Oleander: :)
    Zen Arado: it's difficult
    Darren Islar: also not aiming asks an aim in a way
    Mickorod Renard: I think if I could rid myself of certain issues i could melt into the universe in a deep feeling of ,,,dunno,,and just disapear into nothing
    Zen Arado: we are goal setting creatures
    Darren Islar: my teacher once said that we don't want to create a monster
    Calvino Rabeni: An aim is different than a goal
    Darren Islar: so there is a mindsetting needed
    Darren Islar: ah, okay :)
    Calvino Rabeni: one may have aims but no goals
    Zen Arado: an aim is not necessarily achievable?
    arabella Ella: i think we always have intentions, implicit or explicit, in whatever we do as humans
    Darren Islar: riht Ara
    Dream Wrexan: to me, an aim seems a direction on a path
    Calvino Rabeni: Achievability is irrelevant to aims
    Lucinda Lavender: I noticed that when matching vowel sounds in choir there is a certain oneness achieved
    Zen Arado: part of meditation is letting go of this mindset of trying to attain something
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes I have felt that same, CInda
    Dream Wrexan: yes, Luci - I've found that in toning as well
    Mickorod Renard: I darnt go the whole way cos i am attached to certain attachments that i want to be attached to
    Lucinda Lavender: at least loss of self consciousness
    Darren Islar: that brings us back with the concentration mode of making music, dancing
    Dream Wrexan: Like the Na'vi in Avatar, Luci?
    Zen Arado: an aim seems less serious than a goal to me
    Lucinda Lavender: yes actually
    Lucinda Lavender: :)
    Bleu Oleander: aim (Merriam-Webster def) the directing of effort toward a goal .. : a clearly directed intent or purpose
    arabella Ella: why should there be a concentration mode in singing and dancing and not simply a letting go in a disinhibited way?
    Darren Islar has seen the movie but can't remember much of it
    Zen Arado: so if you strip chanting out of Buddhist practice you might lose something vital
    Darren Islar: could be ara, depends on the purpose
    Calvino Rabeni: you might, zen, but then open a door to something new and vital
    Dream Wrexan: I understand Ken Wilber finally commented on the Avatar movie - a long-awaited discourse
    Mickorod Renard: Ara,,that sounds like a nice angle on dropping
    Zen Arado: ah a goal is the end point we aim towards then?
    Calvino Rabeni: all those things that zen discarded, seemed important at the time
    Darren Islar: yes, I think so Zen
    Darren Islar: speaking is a very important instrument
    Calvino Rabeni: What did Ken say?
    Dream Wrexan: I just got the link, Cal - haven't read it yet
    Calvino Rabeni: ** Darren
    Calvino Rabeni: true
    Darren Islar: we don't chant, but at least we form the words
    Zen Arado: I think the unity that Luci mentioned is important
    Dream Wrexan: in what way, Zen?
    Calvino Rabeni: Can you put the link here, Dream?
    Darren Islar: ah, yes that is certainly true
    Zen Arado: chanting together kind of brings us together
    Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni is now multitasking several topics
    Calvino Rabeni: I would miss it if I didn't have it, Zen
    Zen Arado: me too
    Dream Wrexan: Cal, here it is: http://integrallife.com/node/76548
    Calvino Rabeni: TY DReam
    Mickorod Renard: assebly at school was a sort of combining singing thing
    Dream Wrexan: Kiirtan has been a very moving spiritual practice for me
    arabella Ella: it is not so much fun for those of us who simply cant sing
    Zen Arado: what is Kirtan DReam?
    arabella Ella: we just make spontaneous noises
    Lucinda Lavender: :)
    Dream Wrexan: Zen, it is Hindu chanting - primarily the names of the Divine
    Zen Arado: ah ok
    Lucinda Lavender: Have experienced this kirtan once and enjoyed it
    Calvino Rabeni: @ara, singing evolved before talking - anyone who can talk, can sing
    arabella Ella: :)


    Dream Wrexan: The Sufi's talk aloud (repetitive names of the Divine) in something called Zykr - similar to kiirtan, but not musical
    Darren Islar: Tibetans mostly utter :))
    Darren Islar: softly :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Uttering has more power than talking, I suppose :)
    xxxxgirl Pearl: it is heaven,
    Dream Wrexan: :-) xxxxgirl
    xxxxgirl Pearl: for the suffi
    Darren Islar: I actually don't know Dream
    Darren Islar: I mean Cal
    Zen Arado: I was at a big Tibetan centre 2 years ago and there were long periods of chanting Darren?
    Darren Islar: we sometimes do sing, and that seems to have a very nice result on the body
    Dream Wrexan: I think speaking softly requires Presence to be effective
    Zen Arado: very melodious with horns and cymbals
    Mickorod Renard: nice
    Calvino Rabeni: There are also intense chanting practices in the Shinto tradition
    Zen Arado: Samye Ling
    xxxxgirl Pearl: it is a way to get out from the human tight circle and get their concentration out from their life. daily details, it is an old tradition
    Darren Islar: but most of the time you see Tibetan Buddhists sitting in a corner with a mala uttering mantra's

    Zen Arado: Hi Shunyata
    Darren Islar: hi Shunyata
    Shunyata Enchanted: Hello
    Bertram Jacobus: wb ara - and hi shunyata :-)
    arabella Ella: Hiya
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Shunyata

    Dream Wrexan: Zen, I've heard Tibetan horns and cymbals - kind of like olives, you have to develop a taste
    Mickorod Renard: I have been to monastry in himalyers and they did lots of that stuff,,very surreal perched up on mountainside
    Mickorod Renard: thin air and stuff
    Zen Arado: this place is in Scotland
    Mickorod Renard: similar I guess zen
    Zen Arado: http://www.samyeling.org/

    Slowly we are getting into some chitchatting, paying some extra attention to the name of our newcomer, which seems to be chosen with care

    Darren Islar: I see you joined us in sl today Shunyata
    Darren Islar: so assume you are here for the first time?
    arabella Ella: hey full circle wow
    Shunyata Enchanted: Checking out places in SL
    Darren Islar: ok
    Darren Islar: I will tell you more about this place in IM so we won't disturb the others
    Mickorod Renard: I think they shud put some sort of meditation place on all hills,,where possible
    Mickorod Renard: I used to take meself of to a hill top for a cleansing of thoughts
    Dream Wrexan: This is one of the Best I've found so far, Shunyata
    arabella Ella: or next to the sea for me mick
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, mick, something I like about places like Thailand
    Mickorod Renard: even in the rain its good
    Calvino Rabeni: small temples everywhere
    arabella Ella: rain? what is rain?
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,sounds bliss
    Dream Wrexan: No hills in SW Florida :-(
    Mickorod Renard: ant hills?
    Calvino Rabeni: too bad, no hills - that would make it harder to be spiritual :)
    Dream Wrexan: :-)
    Dream Wrexan: lol, Cal
    Dream Wrexan: The Gulf is quite nice
    Darren Islar: (yes full circle, and that for the saturday :))
    Dream Wrexan: yes!
    Bertram Jacobus: full circle + 1! ;-)
    Mickorod Renard: maybe its the uncluttering of being on an open hilltop?
    Dream Wrexan: starting and ending in Florida :-)
    Calvino Rabeni: yes Mick, tha's how it seems to work
    Mickorod Renard: I sometimes dreampt of being in hilltop places in the Andes,,even though I never been there
    Mickorod Renard: what was special was the air,,
    Calvino Rabeni: ** Wow, big group today - I want to remind people, that conversations here are not private, they are recorded and published to the PlayAsBeing web site
    Mickorod Renard: I can sometimes taste it spiritually at other times
    Calvino Rabeni: Generally we inform about this and get consent
    Calvino Rabeni: So if anyone is new here and doesn't know that already, please be advised :)
    Darren Islar: Shunyata consented
    Darren Islar: nice name Shunyata :)
    Darren Islar: and Enchanted too by the way :)
    Darren Islar: you really picked a good name
    Shunyata Enchanted: Thank you!
    Zen Arado: means emptiness
    Bertram Jacobus: i know somebody who gave himself the name dharmak aya lol ... ;-)
    Shunyata Enchanted: Yes, 'Emptiness Enchanted'
    Darren Islar: yes
    Zen Arado: "In Buddhism emptiness is a characteristic of phenomena arising from the fact (as observed and taught by the Buddha) that nothing possesses essential, enduring identity (see anattā) because of such things as the impermanent nature of form."


    Zen Arado: notices I am becoming a nerd :(
    Darren Islar: huh?
    Dream Wrexan: aw, Zen - I appreciate the wisdom
    Zen Arado: always defining things
    Bertram Jacobus: could you explain that plz perhaps zen ? ;-)
    Bertram Jacobus: ah
    Dream Wrexan: it saves me from Google-ing it
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,that wud be nice Zen
    Bleu Oleander: bye all :)
    Zen Arado: what would Mick?
    Dream Wrexan: bye, bleu
    Darren Islar: bye Bleu
    Zen Arado: bye Bleu
    Bertram Jacobus: bye bleu - have a good time plz
    Mickorod Renard: bye Bleu
    Darren Islar: if we don't know Zen, we ask you :))
    Zen Arado: I'm good at Gppgling :)
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Zen Arado: but not typing :(
    Darren Islar: :))
    Mickorod Renard: Cal will explain
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Mickorod Renard: brb

    Some new arrivals and some goodbyes

    Bertram Jacobus: "okay" - i´ll leave too - ty all - have a nice time and may all beings be happy plz
    Dream Wrexan: bye, Bert
    Darren Islar: bye Bert :)
    Zen Arado: bye Bert
    Lucinda Lavender: Thanks Bertram
    Zen Arado: time I went too
    Bertram Jacobus: appreciate it all very much ...
    Darren Islar: bye Zen, Luci
    Zen Arado: bye all
    Dream Wrexan: Thank you, Darren - and I hope to see you all again
    Lucinda Lavender: in need of movement...bye all and good day!
    Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni was getting coffee
    Darren Islar: thank you too Dream, see you :)
    Darren Islar: hey Paradise, didn't see you coming in
    Darren Islar: wb Ara
    Paradise Tennant: hiya yakuzza,xxxxgirl, calvino, darren,mick, ewan :) gtsy :)
    Mickorod Renard: hi Ara
    Ewan Bonham: the ? and thn \ lol
    Paradise Tennant: hiya arabella !
    Paradise Tennant: smiles so nice to see you !
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Paradise
    arabella Ella: Hiya
    Mickorod Renard: yeaa
    arabella Ella: Hey Paradise guess what i am eating right now?
    Mickorod Renard: Hiya yaku
    arabella Ella: :)
    Mickorod Renard: pasta?
    arabella Ella: maple syrup
    arabella Ella: on ice cream
    arabella Ella: memories of the malta retreat
    Darren Islar: wow
    Paradise Tennant: waves at shunyata :) sorry did not see you there :)
    Paradise Tennant: smiles lol
    Paradise Tennant: good canadian maple syrup ?
    Shunyata Enchanted: hello.... :)
    Darren Islar: and you didn't bring us something :)
    arabella Ella: yes Paradise excellent :)
    Shunyata Enchanted: brb - I must flip the ribs I am cooking on the barbeque
    Paradise Tennant: smiles :)
    Darren Islar: somehow this silence after a discussion really feels good
    Darren Islar: but I'm afraid I need to go
    Mickorod Renard: oww,,bye darren
    Darren Islar: thank you all and see you :)
    arabella Ella: good night Darren
    Darren Islar: nite
    Calvino Rabeni: Bye, Darren
    Shunyata Enchanted: bye
    Yakuzza Lethecus: good night everyone
    Mickorod Renard: nite nite Yaku
    Paradise Tennant: good nige yakuzza shunyata :)
    Shunyata Enchanted: I am heading out as well.
    Paradise Tennant: good nite darren
    Shunyata Enchanted: See you around.
    Mickorod Renard: bye Shunyata
    Calvino Rabeni: I think I'll also go - thanks everyone :)


    Mickorod Renard: bye Cal
    Paradise Tennant: bye cal :)
    Paradise Tennant: bye xxxxgirl :)
    xxxxgirl Pearl: well i got to go, thanks everyone
    xxxxgirl Pearl: bye Paradise
    arabella Ella: bye CG
    Mickorod Renard: bye paradise
    Paradise Tennant: bye paradise ..
    Paradise Tennant: lol by mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Paradise Tennant: how have you been arabella :) how are your folks doing :)
    arabella Ella: it is lovely to see you again Paradise :)
    arabella Ella: our paths here do not seem to cross very often
    arabella Ella: how are you doing?
    Paradise Tennant: yes I know the time differences :)
    Paradise Tennant: I am on only when you are fast asleep :)
    arabella Ella: yes :)
    arabella Ella: except perhaps on a weekend like today
    Paradise Tennant: been doing very well thanks ..work is busy but it is all good :)
    arabella Ella: fantastic
    arabella Ella: are you going to the NS retreat?
    Paradise Tennant: still corresponding with your friend on the dog :) he sends me updates on what is happening and the events that are scheduled at his country place :)
    Paradise Tennant: not sure yet
    Paradise Tennant: work schedule will decide that :)
    Paradise Tennant: hoping ot go to the one in stuttgart
    Paradise Tennant: for sure ..
    arabella Ella: oh that is sweet that you are still in touch with him!
    arabella Ella: i hope to make it to the stuttgart one too
    Paradise Tennant: will bring you .. more maple syrup if you get there too !
    arabella Ella: would be lovely thanks!!!
    arabella Ella: I really hope i can make it but i cannot take a definite decision just yet
    Paradise Tennant: yes hard to commit till you are closer to the event because so many things can happen :)
    arabella Ella: exactly
    arabella Ella: but the intention to go is definite
    Paradise Tennant: I have travelled a lot in north america but not seen as much of europe as I would like to .. so I may try to see a bit of berlin too or maybe vienna :)
    arabella Ella: oh i would definitely recommend both ... both very different really and lots to see and do
    arabella Ella: and prague is lovely too
    Paradise Tennant: yes been to prague .. love it !
    Paradise Tennant: came home heavily burdened with glass...
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    Paradise Tennant: and the music !
    arabella Ella: yes i love prague too
    arabella Ella: and in my opinion
    arabella Ella: vienna is very elegant ... architecture wise i mean
    arabella Ella: while berlin is a sort of nostalgic city with a sad history
    Paradise Tennant: smiles and I hear the pastry is pretty yummy
    Paradise Tennant: yes
    Paradise Tennant: very sad history
    arabella Ella: but which has since grown out of its history too in a fast and amazing way
    arabella Ella: oh yes vienna is famous for the sacher torte
    Paradise Tennant: watched gloomy sunday .. last week .. was situated in budapest .. would like see it too .. wonderful film
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    arabella Ella: oh budapest is yet different from the rest ... really beautiful in a unique way
    Mickorod Renard: I liked vienna for the spanish horse spectacle,,and the music
    Paradise Tennant: yes
    arabella Ella: and budapest has a soviet style underground transport system
    arabella Ella: with very steep and deep escalators
    Paradise Tennant: europe echos with amazing music that .. has centuries of heritage :)
    arabella Ella: vertiginous
    Paradise Tennant: lol
    arabella Ella: yes
    Paradise Tennant: pragues escalators took my breath away like being on a roller coaster
    arabella Ella: he he
    arabella Ella: another ex east block city that has developed so much since late 80s
    arabella Ella: it's midnight here now so gtg
    arabella Ella: bye for now paradise and lovely to see you :)
    arabella Ella: bye Mick bye Ewan
    Mickorod Renard: I need to go too,,very tired today


    Mickorod Renard: bye Ara,,Paradise, Ewan
    Paradise Tennant: by mick :)
    Paradise Tennant: bye arabella :)
    Paradise Tennant: lol
    Paradise Tennant: good nite ewan going to scoot too

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    Viewing 1 of 1 comments: view all
    What a great session!
    I wonder where in SF dream lives...
    Posted 17:32, 20 Jun 2010
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