2010.07.13 07:00 - Another one dies

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Storm Nordwind. The comments are by Riddle Sideways.
    Thank you Storm for picking up the session chat log when I could not function enough to attend.

    First, I have been experimenting with sleep deprivation.  In the form of triple work loads.  Have pulled a 16 hour, then a 25 hour (before this session) and then a 21 hour separated by 4 hour sleeps.  More on what that has done to me later (or you can gleam from my mis-spellings)

    Second, give  http://www.npr.org/templates/player/...0911&m=5670912 a listen if you can find 6 minutes 30 seconds of space.  "Disappering Number" will be coming to many theaters in October, "SEE IT".
    Listen to the link.  Toward the end there are many parts PaB will see as familar.

    Third, as I was about to write this...  Spouse came and told me that... 
    Jorge, a member of a local community inter-faith support and enpowerment group (COPA)
    ,
    [mine...] is one of 35 faith-based and nonprofit institutions that is part of an Interfaith Organizing group called COPA - Communities Organized for Relational Power in Action - which supports social action projects such as promoting affordable housing, funding for public education and health education throughout the Monterey and Santa Cruz Counties.

    COPA, formerly Central Coast Interfaith Sponsors, was founded to address the "enormous economic, social and political pressures" in the region. It is affiliated with the Industrial Areas Foundation (IAF), a national "faith-based" organization working for social justice.

    who joined to support all peoples and raise himself and all his community out of the shit they endure daily.  An early 20 year old soul who only wanted a better life for all, has had his younger brother murdered tonight.
    "Why do bad things happen to good people?" - Melvin Tinker
    "Why do all the good die young?" - Billy Joel

    "Fuck!!!!" - George Carlin (Jorge???)

     

    Bruce Mowbray: Ahhhh! Some waking up music!
    Bruce Mowbray: ;-)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: lol

    Not knowing what they are listening to.

    Yakuzza Lethecus: does it steam fluently to you ?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: for me it´s often interrupted
    Yakuzza Lethecus: stream
    Bruce Mowbray: yes -- bits of silence here and there - but mostly uninterrupted (98%)
    Bruce Mowbray: 99%
    Bruce Mowbray: 99.9%
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i just recieved this item before the 1 pm session yesterday and didn´t even hear it fully :)
    Bruce Mowbray: A nice item! -- but now is all silence...
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey storm
    Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Storm.
    --BELL--
    Storm Nordwind: Good day both :)
    Bruce Mowbray: An excellent concert, Yuka -- opps He disappeared!
    Storm Nordwind: It's the stress of performance I guess :)
    Bruce Mowbray: ;-) Strange that he'd go without bidding us adieu.
    Storm Nordwind: These artist types - so temperamental ;) (I should know - I'm one of them!)
    Storm Nordwind: wb Yaku - you were ruthed when you reappeared
    Bruce Mowbray: WB, Yaku! Did you crash?
    Storm Nordwind: still partially ruthed to me
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yes, i look weired
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i relog again
    Storm Nordwind: k
    Bruce Mowbray: I'd just thanked you for the fine concert before you disappeared, Yaku.
    Bruce Mowbray: You look great to me -- just like your normal self.
    Bruce Mowbray: oops -- he's gone again.
    Storm Nordwind: Two out of three consumers could tell the difference! ;)
    Bruce Mowbray: wp, Yaku.
    Bruce Mowbray: wb.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: thx
    Storm Nordwind: Now THAT'S better - wb!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: ah, normal now
    Bruce Mowbray: looking good.
    Storm Nordwind: Ruth is banished :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i use emerald twice on the comp but only one instance of emerald can use voice
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so i closed both clients and logged with my alt first before


    Bruce Mowbray: Both of you have far more experience with the PaB method than I -- so I'd like to ask you a question regarding your 'experience...'
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i already envy ur experience bruce :)
    Storm Nordwind: Please go ahead (though I've never heard it called 'method' befoe)
    Bruce Mowbray: TY, Yaku -- but what I am about to ask might erase that envy.
    Storm Nordwind chuckles
    Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s a sharing group and as more experience you gathered in real life as more you are able to share, i am a shadow around here
    Bruce Mowbray: It regards "?" and "."
    Bruce Mowbray: questions -- and [potential] answers.
    Bruce Mowbray: With the method -- the questions remain -- never quite being transformed into period. (coming to no final conclusions).
    Bruce Mowbray: I do not want "answers" -- but is the PaB method intent on getting them?
    Storm Nordwind: Is that your question?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: We are starting in the end :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: There are no final solutions, we already got them.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: Everything is already there.
    Bruce Mowbray: Yes -- it seems to be than an authentic use of the PaB method would want to "Stay with the question."
    Yakuzza Lethecus: We just have to see.
    Bruce Mowbray: ,e that an ...
    Bruce Mowbray: I meant to type "seems to me that an authentic use...." would stay wqith the open question rather than going for the "." (conclusion)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: Yes, i believe there will be the same questions for the rest of our life from my point of view, just to learn to appreciate them a little bit more :)
    --BELL--
    Storm Nordwind: I think the core PaB techniques are neither question nor answer driven. I find it useful to remember the title is "Play as Being". In Play there is not the earnestness that might come from Q&A, though there is the light-hearted sincerity. In Being, there is a resting - as Yaku says - in what is already there.
    Bruce Mowbray: Pema's 'Introduction' sent me back to Husserl and Heidegger.
    Storm Nordwind: Yes - and it's useful, therefore, to remember that Epoché involves a rather different attitude than many are familiar with
    Bruce Mowbray: yes, indeed. all that bracketing stuff ;-)


    Bruce Mowbray: but for me the real issue -- play or serious, either - is the matter of "authenticity."
    Storm Nordwind: Please say more about what you mean by authenticity
    Bruce Mowbray: Mmmm.. This is more from Heidegger than Husserl.
    Bruce Mowbray: Authenticy involves resolution - choice - to be in the ecstatic moment, unified, seeing experience as I-Thou (slipping into Buber for a sec)...
    Bruce Mowbray: Choice is definitely part of the thing - and for me, also part of the Method.
    Storm Nordwind: Cannot one have authenticity without resolution, for example, being the perpetual as it were?
    Storm Nordwind: *perpetual traveller


    Bruce Mowbray: ooopsss-- It's raining here and I have to run outside to roll up car windows -- sorry! BRB.
    Bruce Mowbray: ok -- I'm here and wet.
    Storm Nordwind chuckles
    Bruce Mowbray: let me go back to what was just written...


    Bruce Mowbray: yes -- even with staying in the perpetual "?" of existence, one has resolution . . .
    Bruce Mowbray: to see himself and others as ecstatically unified. . . and not to use anyone (including self) as a MEANS but rather as present-moment I-Thou. (didn't want to conclude that thought with "Ends." --
    Storm Nordwind: That would seem to be a philosophical discourse way beyond the scope of the PaB 'method'.
    Storm Nordwind: The secret of PaB is simplicity
    Storm Nordwind: The effect may be the same


    Bruce Mowbray: yes, of course. I am experiencing it -- bodily -- not in the reational mind, though.
    Storm Nordwind: Simplicity brings accessibility
    Bruce Mowbray: yes -- the moment of ecstatic union is the simplest thing I can experience.
    Bruce Mowbray: Being Itself.


    Storm Nordwind: Accessibility has meant PaB is not an elite talking shop but we have a very diverse set of backgrounds. Not to disparage any one of those backgrounds, of course


    Bruce Mowbray: of course -- Where do you come in on this Yaku?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: I just found the kira cafe
    Yakuzza Lethecus: because of science events like relam
    Yakuzza Lethecus: and gilles kuhn´s philosophical seminar
    Yakuzza Lethecus: then there was play as being, the ppl in the cafe didn´t show up for the happyhours
    Yakuzza Lethecus: and there was always someone in the circle :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: at the sessions
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so there were a few nice conversations, and when i saw that the ppl have all more kind of a real life background and aren´t new age geeks i became more interested

    oh,
    to comment
    per chance to comment
    to state some poetic prophetic
    to trumpet the door Yaku opens.
    Yet, all I can do is but echo and amplify and point to the solo
    with applause!


    Bruce Mowbray: yes. and some of the most ecsatic unions I've felt have been when we broke into dancing, joking, hugging, etc.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: especially since these topics were more kinda mumbo jumbo for me if anyone else even in real life would have tried to introduce it to me


    Bruce Mowbray: jumping into the pool to cool off. ;-)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so it was good that i found it
    --BELL--
    Bruce Mowbray: My friend Bopbby will be joining us soon.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey bobby
    Bruce Mowbray: Welcome, Bobby.
    Bobby Couerblanc: ty


    Bruce Mowbray: for me "ecstasy" means standing outside of the discursive mental processes -- and hugging, dancing, juming into pool, etc. enables that break.
    Bruce Mowbray: jumping
    Bruce Mowbray: an authentic laugh, like an authentic orgasm, is always a her/now event.
    Bruce Mowbray: here/now -- freudian slip there.... haha!
    Storm Nordwind: Please excuse me gentlefolk. I need to be elsewhere - I was just catching the chat log for the usual PaB host at this time who could not make it today
    Thanking you, Storm


    Bruce Mowbray: OK. Go in peace, bro.
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Bruce Mowbray: How goes it with you today, Bobby?
    Bobby Couerblanc: Going well Bruce.
    Bruce Mowbray: Did you know that by lef-click your pillow you can change your seated posture?
    Bobby Couerblanc: great!
    Bobby Couerblanc: I was wondering about this pose.
    Bobby Couerblanc: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Aph! Welcome.
    Aphrodite Macbain: I was already here! Hello everyone
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hello aphrodite
    Bobby Couerblanc: Thanks for the coffee!
    Bobby Couerblanc: Now I mimic what I do in real life at the moment.
    Bobby Couerblanc: Authentic!
    Bobby Couerblanc: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: Did you get some Turkish coffee, Aph?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Wow Turkish. No I just have a borng old latte
    Aphrodite Macbain: boring
    Yakuzza Lethecus: you´re supposed to have one from me
    Yakuzza Lethecus: in the recend items
    Yakuzza Lethecus: recent
    Aphrodite Macbain: Oh! I'll check.
    --BELL--
    Aphrodite Macbain: Uymm Thanks Yakuzza
    Aphrodite Macbain: Yumm
    Aphrodite Macbain: (Uymm is Yumm in Turkish)
    Bruce Mowbray: communion!
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hahaha
    Bruce Mowbray: comm-uymmm-ion.


    Aphrodite Macbain: What were you talking about before I rudely interrupted?
    Bruce Mowbray: We (or rather, I) were/was talking about "authenticity" as Ecstatic Union..." before you arrived, Aph.
    Bruce Mowbray: Bobby has to go. Have a good day, Bobby.
    Bobby Couerblanc: ty
    Bobby Couerblanc: Sorry to stop in and leave like this.
    Aphrodite Macbain: wow and so early in the morning! what is Ectaric Union?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Bye bobby
    Aphrodite Macbain: Ecstatic
    Yakuzza Lethecus: that´s our chatlog so far
    Aphrodite Macbain: Thanks

    Yakuzza Lethecus: bruce asked for our experience
    Bruce Mowbray: Welll -it's sprt of a term I borrowed from Matin Buber and Heidegger -- to "say" (not really describe) my state of Being when I am doing PaB.
    Bruce Mowbray: Play as Being.
    Bruce Mowbray: sort of a term.
    Bruce Mowbray: Martin Buber.
    Bruce Mowbray: You're welcome to join us up front, Aph, if you like.
    Bruce Mowbray wonders: perhaps Aph is experiencing an Ecstatic Union at the moment.
    Aphrodite Macbain is readding the fascinating chat history and wonders whether she is equippped to join in
    Bruce Mowbray: Oh yes -- You and MOST equipped to oin in -- Do not be intimidated by all those high-falooting words!
    Bruce Mowbray: are.
    Bruce Mowbray: join.

    Bruce Mowbray: We're all about experience here -- not philosophical prat.

    Aphrodite Macbain: It's all your references to the various philosophers - of whom I only have the smalest knowledge

    Bruce Mowbray: NO problem... NO problem. Let's leave them all out of it and simple be three of us.
    Bruce Mowbray: simple be.
    Bruce Mowbray: simpLY be.
    Aphrodite Macbain: No, I'd preer to learn something new. But it might take longer for you to explain
    Aphrodite Macbain: prefer
    Aphrodite Macbain: I totally understand authentic. That's a beginning
    Bruce Mowbray: My EXPERIENCE with PaB (very limited experience) says that there is a "union" with the environment and with other humans -- inside the experience itself.
    Bruce Mowbray: This is what I am calling Being - with a capital B.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: for me pab means to have a forum where you can share ur contemplative idea´s and thoughts with others
    Yakuzza Lethecus: there is the mediation yes, but everything else is what the ppl bring into it
    Bruce Mowbray: yes -- precisely so, Yaku.

    Aphrodite Macbain: The experience elicits a feeling of one-ness with all beings ithin the circle and without?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: and i really envy you for your´s :)
    Bruce Mowbray: I totally lack that in RL -- and that's why I am here.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yes, me too
    Yakuzza Lethecus: or it just takes too long until ppl are opening up upon these idea´s
    Bruce Mowbray: Yes, Aph --- please say more.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: since they are usually kinda private
    Aphrodite Macbain: I get that feeling occasionally - with certain friends, in my yoga class, and tai chi class, listening to concerts
    Aphrodite Macbain: and sometimes even when I meditate on SL

    Aphrodite Macbain: Is that what you're talking about?
    Bruce Mowbray: you're saying that you feel some "union" in yoga class, with some friends, and while meditating, Aph?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Yes, union with beings beyond myself. we are all sharing something in common
    Aphrodite Macbain: It's a good feeling tho I wouldn't call it ecstatic

    Bruce Mowbray: That's exactl what I was trying to say with all of my high-falooting words... earlier.
    Bruce Mowbray: "Ecstatic" - for me - means that I am temporarily "standing outside of " my normal experience of subject-object.
    --BELL--
    Bruce Mowbray: Other beings are sharing BEING with me when I am in Ecstatic Being.
     

    Aphrodite Macbain: :-) really? It seemed you were also grounding your ideas in accepted academic theory Bruce
    Bruce Mowbray: yes -- I was trying to use their "code" (language) - as with the term "authentic" to make my point -- But the point is far better made by referring to actual experience rather than to philosophers.
    Bruce Mowbray: Yesterday morning, for example, I shqared Being with a thunderstorm.
    Bruce Mowbray: Last night - HERE- I shared ecstatic being with MEEP MEEP a mad-hugger.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: It made my day!
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-) Wow! Does this mean the ecstatic state may not always be peaceful or pleasurable, it is instead empathetic?
    Bruce Mowbray: and I told he so.
    Bruce Mowbray: Indeed -- it is not a pleasure principle.
    Bruce Mowbray: I would not describe my union with the lightning as "pleasureable" -- although is was powerful.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Putting oneself in a state like that would require personal development, no? An ability to take out the ego
    Bruce Mowbray: we shared the power of Being itself.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye everyone
    Bruce Mowbray: Yes -- taking out the ego is what I am calling "standing outside of" -- ecstatic.

    Peace be with thee

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