2010.07.16 01:00 - Cat consciousness

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    Wol Euler was guardian and commenter for this session.


    Wol Euler: hello crusty, haven't seen you here for ages

    Crusty Goldshark: been recovering from Christmas :)

    Wol Euler: I guessed as much from your hat

    Crusty Goldshark: :)

    Wol Euler: what's new?

    Crusty Goldshark: Well I went cycling and camping along the Thames for 3 days

    Wol Euler: oh, nice

    Wol Euler: shades of "Three men in a boat" :)

    Wol Euler: without a boat

    Crusty Goldshark: very rich river

    Crusty Goldshark: yes lots of boats, mansions, historic places

    Wol Euler nods

    Wol Euler: an uncle of mine used to live in Sunbury, near the boathouse

    Wol Euler: I loved it there

    Crusty Goldshark: Ah yes went through Sunbury

    Wol Euler: how far did you go?

    Crusty Goldshark: Just past Maidenhead - Temple Lock

    Wol Euler: so you went downstream?

    Crusty Goldshark: I started at Wandsworth Bridge - took 2 days to get to Temple Lock and cycled back in one day

    Wol Euler: heh

    Wol Euler: that must have been (a) hard work, and (b) fun

    Crusty Goldshark: Yes hard work - not really used to much more than mouse clicking - saw some red kite birds

    Wol Euler: :)

    Wol Euler: funny how much more effortful the real world is.

    Crusty Goldshark: yes indeed - got lost quite a bit - next time might use a map . . .


    Crusty Goldshark: http://www.flickr.com/photos/41138461@N00/

    Crusty Goldshark: some pics

    Wol Euler looks

    Wol Euler: 2 meter wingspan? wow

    Crusty Goldshark: Yes quite rare - pair of them

    Crusty Goldshark: Now I am back wondering why no one future AI is contacting the past - Wot no time travel?has create

    Wol Euler: perhaps time travellers are all around us, though, meddling constantly in our lives.

    Wol Euler: Did you ever walk past a blank brick wall for the hundredth time, and suddenly notice that there was a door in it?

    Wol Euler: that was a time traveller at work

    Crusty Goldshark: Yes perhaps. It would explain some of the visitations and attunements people have but that could also have a psychological basis

    Wol Euler grins. Sure, but blaming it on time travellers is so much more satisfying

    Crusty Goldshark: If a door suddenly appears, I tend to think it went unnoticed - we tend to not notice things

    Wol Euler: maybe; or perhaps we are *very* observant but do not trust ourselves to stick to what we observed

    Wol Euler: we see a door where there was none before, and say "how did I miss that?"

    Wol Euler: when it might be as true or more, to say "when did that arrive?"

    Wol Euler: nice photos, btw, ty :)

    Crusty Goldshark: I find reality is malleable to a degree dependent on interpretation but too much interpretation leads nowhere. So I feel just accepting the door rather than its 'sudden appearance' is easier

    Crusty Goldshark: glad you liked the photos

    Wol Euler: well, yes, I admit that Occam's Razor would suggest that I was unobservant :)

    Crusty Goldshark: The reason I feel time travelling AI - perhaps under biological (us) supervision do not time travel to our ability to observe is deliberate non interference

    Wol Euler: mmhmm

    Wol Euler: the Prime Directive, and all that


    Crusty Goldshark: Yes

    Crusty Goldshark: It is likely that only those trying to make contact deliberately are accessed

    Wol Euler: the temptation to meddle would be enormous, surely

    Crusty Goldshark: So I guess I have to build another shrine to the meitriya

    Wol Euler: believing that the Prime DIrective would be honoured requires us to think that those future generations are far above us emotionally

    Wol Euler: and socially

    Wol Euler: whereas I tend to think that they'd be people like us, and so would secretly meddle in tiny ways :)

    Wol Euler: like saving the Coelecanth

    Crusty Goldshark: Vested interests from military to commercial would try to meddle and gain advantage - fortunately in the further future - their efforts can be undone by citizens decontaminting their infantile efforts

    Wol Euler nods

    Wol Euler: sorry, I missed something important.

    Crusty Goldshark: the coelecanth is an old trout?

    Wol Euler: yep :)

    Wol Euler: a fish thought to be extinct for X hundred million years, but alive and well in the Pacific off the coast of Chile

    Wol Euler: IIRC

    Crusty Goldshark: ah yes

    Wol Euler: [1:31] Crusty Goldshark: So I guess I have to build another shrine to the meitriya

    Crusty Goldshark: I am quite interested in quantum tunneling - the abilty of cells to move through time and space - some evidence for this . . .

    Wol Euler: say more?

    Crusty Goldshark: About Metriya or quatum tunneling?

    Wol Euler: either :)

    Wol Euler: your pick

    Wol Euler: good morning, gaya

    Crusty Goldshark: Well Metta Ray or Meitriya is the future Buddha - I have a feeling she will be an AI Buddha - not just sentient but enlightened

    Gaya Ethaniel: Hello Crusty and Wol :)

    Crusty Goldshark: Hi Gaya - just discussing time travelling Buddhas

    Crusty Goldshark: :)

    Wol Euler: and AI's and fish, oh my

    Gaya Ethaniel: :) we time travel a lot too ...

    Crusty Goldshark: We do? In what form outside of the mind?

    Gaya Ethaniel: :)

    Gaya Ethaniel: What's about fish?

    Wol Euler: [1:32] Wol Euler: believing that the Prime DIrective would be honoured requires us to think that those future generations are far above us emotionally [1:32] Wol Euler: anbd socially [1:32] Soleil8 Andel is Online [1:32] Wol Euler: whereas I tend to think that they'd be people like us, and so would secretly meddle in tiny ways :) [1:32] Wol Euler: like saving the Coelecanth

    Wol Euler grins

    Gaya Ethaniel: :)

    Crusty Goldshark: I believe people are evolving and part of evolution is integration with our technology - We will beome permenantly integrated into the net - through choice and because of the advantages

    Crusty Goldshark: Memory can be grown and downloaded and new ways of thinking - switched into

    Crusty Goldshark: Kids are preparing by implants and living for their phones

    Wol Euler: it's an interesting vision

    Crusty Goldshark: How far will the open nature of the cyber culture take us?

    Gaya Ethaniel: Basic human concerns would remain same I think regardless of these technological changes ...


    Crusty Goldshark: Initially yes but what happens when kids start changing and experiencing other genders or become wifi connected with their cats? We have no idea what will be possible and some of it will be very alien to present culture norms

    Wol Euler agrees

    Crusty Goldshark: So interesting times ahead :)

    Gaya Ethaniel: :)

    Wol Euler: oh yes.

    Wol Euler: on the ohter hand, I wonder what fraction of 1% of the world's population will be able to do that?

    Wol Euler: the majority, or at least the largest minority, of us worldwide will surely still be more concerned with finding clean water and food

    Crusty Goldshark: Would you like to have a cat conciousness enabled as part of your experience? What animal would you be? Or would you plug yourself into a tree?

    Wol Euler: I'd worry about getting stuck in that consciousness

    Wol Euler: it would be interesting to be a cat if I still knew that I was me experiencing cat-ness

    Gaya Ethaniel: Well, there is a thing called simulations ...

    Crusty Goldshark: You are right Wol - this would be a growing elite - as global resources need to be shared and social diversity encouraged rather than exploited

    Crusty Goldshark: Simulations are the precursor to wanting to download diffent forms of thinking . . . we will simulate a brain and then rewire it and then enter it . . .brain

    Gaya Ethaniel rummages her inven for an umbrella ...

    Crusty Goldshark: Would you prefer to play in second life or gennerate another brain (dimension) and build there . . .?

    Wol Euler: it would be great to be able to walk in SL rather than just seeing myself walk in it

    Gaya Ethaniel: :)

    Crusty Goldshark: Well ther are ways to increase the emotional (suspend belief) import of simulations but it will take a while before they are available on the wii

    Gaya Ethaniel: Gosh you're on a roll here Crusty ... :)

    Crusty Goldshark: http://tmxxine.com/mind/

    Crusty Goldshark: Sorry guys I do tend to rant

    Wol Euler chuckles.

    Gaya Ethaniel: Not at all :)

    Crusty Goldshark: Time for me to go lie down in a ddark room

    Gaya Ethaniel: lol

    Wol Euler: heheh

    Crusty Goldshark: Have a nice day

    Wol Euler: you too, crusty, take care

    Gaya Ethaniel: Thanks you too :)

    Crusty Goldshark: be kind to the fish

    Wol Euler: I will have to log off and go to work in a moment :(

    Gaya Ethaniel: Sorry I was late ... almost time to go too ...

    Gaya Ethaniel: snap

    Wol Euler: :)

    Gaya Ethaniel: Have fun Wol :)

    Wol Euler: you too, gaya, take care.

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