2011.01.15 13:00 - Apocalyptic fears and the future Dalai Lama

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Aphrodite Macbain. The comments are by Aphrodite Macbain.


    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Arch
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Koya
    Aphrodite Macbain: How are you today?
    Archmage Atlantis: Too deep a question for today
    Aphrodite Macbain: every thing OK ?
    Archmage Atlantis: The sun outside is nice.
    Aphrodite Macbain: makes a big diference to my mood when the sun's out
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, me also...though it is cold for here in sw florida
    Aphrodite Macbain: my RL cat is watching your SL cat
    Aphrodite Macbain: very intently
    Aphrodite Macbain: the weather is strange everywhere
    Aphrodite Macbain: I've been feeling quite glum recently and have been trying to meditate
    Aphrodite Macbain: to understand why I feel this way
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, the apocalypse...don't truly think that, it just sits in my mind that way
    Darren Islar: hi A + A :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: apocalypse?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hello Leaping. Great to see you
    Aphrodite Macbain: How are you feeling?
    Darren Islar: tired, but besides that I'm okay
    Archmage Atlantis: something like this quote:
    Archmage Atlantis: "An Apocalypse (Greek:  apokálypsis; "lifting of the veil" or "revelation") is a disclosure of something hidden from the majority of mankind in an era dominated by falsehood and misconception, i.e. the veil to be lifted.
    Darren Islar: hmmmm, interesting, because that is a different interpretation than people would normally give to it
    Aphrodite Macbain: I don't believe in an apocalypse - just climate change
    Archmage Atlantis: I know Darrem
    Aphrodite Macbain: It comes from the Apocalyptic gospels - Revelations
    Aphrodite Macbain: 4 horsemen of the apocalypse
    Aphrodite Macbain: etc
    Darren Islar: yes, but I think you might be right arch, sounds more plausible
    Archmage Atlantis: Much fear has been piled on to the original meanings
    Darren Islar: yes
    Aphrodite Macbain: what do you fear Arch?
    Archmage Atlantis: That I will not be there for those whom I love
    Aphrodite Macbain: Ah. why wouldn't you be there?
    Aphrodite Macbain: My fear is the world will be uninhabitable for my great grandnieces and nephews
    Darren Islar looks at Aphro
    Darren Islar: yeah.......
    Aphrodite Macbain: I am trying to get motivated to join an environmental group and do something about it
    Aphrodite Macbain: rather than watching helplessly
    Aphrodite Macbain: so easy to put off things...
    Darren Islar smiles

    Aphrodite Macbain: I should act rather than just talk
    Archmage Atlantis: I am male in my aspect, a true man should protect, even to the point of giving his life........but I do not feel I can protect even the small ones who have come into my life.......as they are "only" animals
    Aphrodite Macbain: why do you feel so helpless arch?
    Aphrodite Macbain: do you mind if I ask?
    Archmage Atlantis: If I tell you I will sound insane........but I will tell you


    Darren Islar: reminds me of something His Holiness the Dalai Lama said
    Darren Islar: "If you think you are too small to make a difference you have never spent the night with a mosquito." - The Dalai Lama
    Aphrodite Macbain: Please do Arch. (Nice quote Leaping)
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, but which Dalai Lam?
    Darren Islar: the 14th
    Aphrodite Macbain: the current one
    Aphrodite Macbain: tho he's about to retire
    Archmage Atlantis: Is one false, and one true?.....how does one know that
    Darren Islar: ?
    Archmage Atlantis: There are 2
    Aphrodite Macbain: there is a new Dalai Lama that the Chinese have installed, but no one believes he is the true one
    Darren Islar: is there?
    Aphrodite Macbain: then there is the Panchen Lama
    Darren Islar: I know about the Panchen Lama
    Darren Islar: yes
    Darren Islar: but that is not the same person
    Archmage Atlantis: Really, or perhaps the Dali Lama needed to be in more places than one human body had access to
    Darren Islar: they used to be
    Aphrodite Macbain: Let's try and observe the pauses
    Darren Islar: tried Aph :)
    Zen Arado: sorry
    Aphrodite Macbain: Thanks
    Darren Islar: np
    Archmage Atlantis: [silence-pause} - observing now
    Darren Islar: now, it is the Dalai Lama who confirms who is the Panchen Lama and the other way around
    Darren Islar: not sure what is going to happen if this Dalai Lama dies
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Darren Islar: hi Zen
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hiya Zen
    Aphrodite Macbain: Arch, please continue with what you were saying earlier.PAUSE...
    Aphrodite Macbain: Normally the Tibetan monks go through a process of searching using complex rituals. They would search all through Tibet
    Aphrodite Macbain: once they identify the child, they train him intensely.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Not sure how they can do this now with the Chinese occupation
    Archmage Atlantis: I know the ritual of discovery
    Aphrodite Macbain: please tell us Arch
    Archmage Atlantis: You just did Aph, I was only confirming
    Aphrodite Macbain: Oh - was I correct?
    Archmage Atlantis: yes you were
    Archmage Atlantis: To the extent of my understanding
    Zen Arado: the child has to pass tests I think
    Darren Islar: yes
    Archmage Atlantis: And both passes
    Darren Islar: the last test for the Panchen Lama is done by the Dalai Lama and vise versa
    Aphrodite Macbain: There is so much division within the Tibentan Buddhist community
    Aphrodite Macbain: I'm not sure what the solution will be now
    Zen Arado: they put things down in front of him and see if he picks them up - something like that
    Darren Islar: it is about some personal items that belonged to the one before
    Zen Arado: yes
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes - each has a significance
    Darren Islar: and the Chinese Panchen Lama is not recognized by the Dalai Lama
    Zen Arado: I think the present Dalai Lama will not be for this method of passing on the leadership
    Darren Islar: ?
    Zen Arado: he thinks it is out of date too
    Zen Arado: Darren Islar: well, it is about recognizing an incarnation
    Archmage Atlantis: Would a loving Dalai Lama leave those who have nurtured his being......would a loving Dalai Lama not leave to help others?
    Aphrodite Macbain: That's how he was chosen. What does he suggest Zen?
    Darren Islar: which isn't the same as getting reborn again
    Darren Islar: a reincarnation has knowledge about his own incarnation
    Zen Arado: don't know - but seem to remember him saying this somewhere
    Zen Arado: Hi Zon
    Zon Kwan: hi all
    Aphrodite Macbain: He's not dying, just passing the reins of power on to some one stronger
    Darren Islar: it won't work in the current situation
    Darren Islar: hi zon
    Archmage Atlantis: oh ye of little faith
    Zen Arado: HH is very modern in outlook I think
    Zen Arado: into science and technology
    Zen Arado: maybe he is on SL
    Darren Islar: no, of breaking open the system
    Darren Islar: the system is not whole anymore
    Darren Islar: he is both
    Darren Islar: interest in science is a real Gelugpa thing
    Darren Islar: biggest school in Tibet
    Zen Arado: he was always into science
    Zen Arado: might have become an engineer
    Darren Islar: but that is part of buddhism, doesn't mean that things are outdated
    Zen Arado: Hi Ewan
    Darren Islar: hi Ewan
    Zon Kwan: ewan
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hello Ewan
    Darren Islar: I think there are other reasons to it
    Aphrodite Macbain: He's interested in so much-especially education
    Ewan Bonham: Hi Folks!
    Archmage Atlantis: Very bugs b, Ewan
    Zen Arado: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010...ccession-fears
    Aphrodite Macbain: Thanks Zen!
    Archmage Atlantis: That the word "fear" is there, that tells much without looking
    Darren Islar: need to go
    Darren Islar: gf calls :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi to gf
    Darren Islar: see you all :))
    Aphrodite Macbain: Bye! leaping panther
    Zen Arado: bye Darrren :)

    Projecting charisma

    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Zon
    Archmage Atlantis: hello Zon
    Aphrodite Macbain: The Dalai Lama has had an powerful effect on me. He's been to Vancouver 3 or 4 times and I've heard him speak a few times. An enormous, loving presence
    Zen Arado: yes - I saw him about 4 years ago
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes?
    Zen Arado: in Belfast
    Zen Arado: but wonder if we project that presence ourselves
    Zen Arado: thought just came to me
    Archmage Atlantis: In the 70's thai monks immolated themselves; do any of u have that memory?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Yes- against the Americans in Vietnam
    Archmage Atlantis: Against injustice, as they saw it
    Aphrodite Macbain: I don't think I project anything like what he projects
    Zen Arado: but how do we know Aph?
    Zen Arado: Hi Steve
    Aphrodite Macbain: How do we know that those monk were burning and turning to ashes?
    Aphrodite Macbain: do you think it was a fake publicity stunt?
    stevenaia Michinaga: hello
    Zen Arado: no - that we project charisma onto famous people like the Dalai Lama
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi steve
    Zen Arado: something in us wants so much to be moved
    Zon Kwan: dont we project all
    Zen Arado: I think

    Archmage Atlantis: I agree with the leader, there was no holocaust.....I did not observe it

    Aphrodite Macbain: I don't know if we project it or not. I just know that what what he says and does makes sense to me and I admire him for it

    Zen Arado: well there are facts too but......
    Aphrodite Macbain: his "charisma" stems from what he says, writes and does
    Zen Arado: yes I agree with that too
    Ewan Bonham: For me , the key is how the experience touches my heart..:)
    Zen Arado: I'm thinking more about the presence, charisma...
    Aphrodite Macbain: and what he says & writes and does makes sense to me
    Zen Arado: yes - the emotional response
    Zon Kwan: he might not be charismatic to every person
    Aphrodite Macbain: he's a sweet smiling man in his seventies wearing a baseball cap
    Zon Kwan: one has to be responsive
    Zen Arado: I felt moved by him when I saw him
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes that's true Zon - open to his warmth. Desmond Tutu has the same effect on me
    Zen Arado: maybe I am just suspicious of emotional responses
    Archmage Atlantis: Agree. Aph....how did he obtain that cap?
    Aphrodite Macbain: He wears one when he speaks cos the lights get in his eyes
    Aphrodite Macbain: Really Zen. Don't you trust your emotions?
    Zen Arado: should I? :)
    Zen Arado: they have misled me many times
    Aphrodite Macbain: They are one of the ways of reading reality
    Aphrodite Macbain: but they need to be tempered by rational thought
    Aphrodite Macbain: shark brain + cerebral cortex
    Zen Arado: well - that's what I was trying to do just then
    Zon Kwan: there r emotions and emotions
    Zen Arado: yes :)
    Zen Arado: not getting carried away
    Zen Arado: and not being cold either
    Aphrodite Macbain: Emotions are great motivators for action
    Archmage Atlantis: must go, ty much
    Zen Arado: bye Arch
    Aphrodite Macbain: If I just thought about things and didn't feel them, I may not take any action
    Aphrodite Macbain: Bye! arch
    Zon Kwan: intuition is a feeling, as well as bodily desire, but they' re different in nature

    Aphrodite Macbain: I must go, I'm afraid. I really enjoyed our discussions

    Note from Aphro: As I edit these words I am more convinced that we do need to question more deeply our emotional responses to stars and celebrities like the Dalai Lama. Do we construct a reality and call it "charisma" ? Does charisma emanate from the viewer or the viewed?  Thanks Zen!

    Zen Arado: bye Aphro
    stevenaia Michinaga: bye Aphrodite
    Aphrodite Macbain: Bye
    Aphrodite Macbain: Bye! Zen, Zon, ewan
    Aphrodite Macbain: steve (you've been quiet!)
    Ewan Bonham: I think intuition is inspired by tuning into spirit...and that is the difference between that a raw emotion..
    Ewan Bonham: It also has loving overtones if so inspired...
    Zon Kwan: bye arch, aphro
    stevenaia Michinaga: :) No idea what the conversation was about, hard coming in on the end of these things
    stevenaia Michinaga: cept about emotions and intuition
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Ewan Bonham: I will have to leave as well for a while..
    stevenaia Michinaga: bye Ewan
    Zen Arado: bye Ewan
    Ewan Bonham: Thank you and see you all!
    Zon Kwan: bye ewan
    stevenaia Michinaga: I'm off as well, see you Arch, Xen
    stevenaia Michinaga: Zen
    Zen Arado: looks like we're all going
    Zon Kwan: me too to sleep go must
    Zen Arado: bye

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