2011.04.02 01:00 - c2c human interactions

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    Wol Euler was guardian for this session.


    Wol Euler: good morning obs
    Wol Euler: if you'd like to step out of your role briefly, we are celebrating our third birthday this weekend
    Wol Euler: you'd be welcome to join us
    Wol Euler: (if not, that's fine too, whatever you are comfortable with)


    Observerm remains silent, just outside the circle.

    eggsalad Ormstein: hi wol
    Wol Euler: hello egg
    Wol Euler: nice new dress :)
    eggsalad Ormstein: ty. any good news today?
    Wol Euler: new shoes too?
    eggsalad Ormstein: no, these are my favorite old shoes
    Wol Euler: ah :)
    Wol Euler: well,have a glass of champagne to celebrate our birtthday, while I get my first cup of coffee :)
    eggsalad Ormstein: none for me, but thanks
    Wol Euler: sköl
    eggsalad Ormstein: prosit!
    Wol Euler smiles and raises her mug
    Wol Euler: the party started yesterday with a tour of our previous locations, and then music and fireworks
    eggsalad Ormstein: well, sorry I missed that!
    Wol Euler: hello rhi, hello paloma
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Hi Wol; this is my friend paloma
    Paloma Porta: hellos :))


    Wol Euler: welcome paloma, have you been here before?
    Paloma Porta: No I have n't :)
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Hi Egg
    Wol Euler: okay, this is a meditation and discussion group called Play as Being. We meet here 4x daily to talk about our practices, and this weekend to celebrate our third birthday :)
    Wol Euler: I'll give you a notecard about us
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Oh, Happy Birthday
    eggsalad Ormstein: hi rhia
    Rhiannon Dragoone: And here I thought the cake was for me
    Rhiannon Dragoone: lol
    Rhiannon Dragoone: At least you didn't ask me to pop out of it.
    Wol Euler chuckles.
    Wol Euler: you'
    Wol Euler: you'd have to get dressed for that
    Paloma Porta: reading the nc Thank you
    Wol Euler: we record these meetings and publish them on our website, http://wiki.playasbeing.org/
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Um, noooo
    Rhiannon Dragoone: At least not irl
    Wol Euler: may we have your permission to include your SL name and your comments in the published log?
    Rhiannon Dragoone: ack, i've sipped the champagne and now I'm floating above my cushion
    Paloma Porta: we should try being drunk in sl for a day?
    Wol Euler: just click on the cushion to change pose, that usually fixes the floating
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Hi observum
    Wol Euler: Paloma, may we have your permission to include your SL name and your comments in the published log?
    Paloma Porta: yes
    Wol Euler: ty
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Hi Yakkuzza!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: stop
    Wol Euler: good morning yaku
    Wol Euler: sorry, I'm a bit distracted today
    eggsalad Ormstein: by my stunning good looks?
    Rhiannon Dragoone: oh, why's that, Wol
    Wol Euler: that must be it :)
    Wol Euler: unless it's the cuteness of obs' new teddy-av
    Rhiannon Dragoone: you are a hottie, egg
    eggsalad Ormstein: so sweet of you to say, rhia
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Just hoping you'll return the compliment for little ole me.


    Paloma Porta: You look fab egg and Wol
    Paloma Porta: all of you
    Paloma Porta: !
    Wol Euler: ty :)
    eggsalad Ormstein: rhia, you are beyond tha concept of beauty
    Rhiannon Dragoone blushes
    eggsalad Ormstein: your beauty comes from your soul
    Rhiannon Dragoone: ty, egg; a lot of people in sl forget that, which is wierd
    Rhiannon Dragoone: We're all just representations of our ture selves here, and irl, that's also true.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: But here, it should be obvious
    Yakuzza Lethecus: well i think it's better in secondlife then in real life
    Wol Euler nods.
    Wol Euler: with certain caveats, of course. Most SL cats are human in RL, for example
    Wol Euler: at least bodily, perhaps not their souls as you said
    Rhiannon Dragoone: lol Wol
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Especially the real cool cats
    Yakuzza Lethecus: here we all know that someone "ugly" could have the prettiest avatar, or someone hot tired of getting hit upon and flat conversations is taking an ugly and controversion avi
    Wol Euler nods.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Yaku, we all "know" that but we forget it.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Or at least the immersives do
    Wol Euler: true, it's amazing how strong our reaction to body is
    Wol Euler: even knowing the diffrerence between our RL bodies and our SL avs, we still get attracted to avs here
    Paloma Porta: SL frees the mind of the avatar perhaps ; in rl one is stuck with an avie - but in SL we free our minds of the avatar it can almost be anything one wishes. This is a release to many?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yes, i think to some extend a concept of beauty is kind of fixed wired through nurture in the unconcious
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so i still appreaciate pretty avatars of course and don't "just forget"
    Rhiannon Dragoone: There was a discussion I couldn't go to, as I had to work, but it was on how our clothes affect our practice, and also how they affect other people's perceptions of us; here in sl, it would be our avatars too.
    eggsalad Ormstein: see, in sl, I go for people who have ordinary-looking avatars
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i think longer exposure to virtual worlds will have an impact on our concepts
    Rhiannon Dragoone: oh, gee, thanks egg. So I'm ordinary now? lol
    Paloma Porta: egg "go for" ? rapport or attracted to ..er sexually perhaps?? (sorry)
    eggsalad Ormstein: well, rhia. yes. you have the body that looks like it could be on a rl woman
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Don't be sorry, Paloma; it's a good question
    eggsalad Ormstein: paloma: emotionally attracted to
    Rhiannon Dragoone: look at my 1st life picture, egg; it is on a rl woman.
    Rhiannon Dragoone the real life woman behind the ccomputer screen waves at egg
    eggsalad Ormstein: that's what I mean
    Paloma Porta: I would argue the weirder avies (?) have the weirder mind behing which one feels telepathically
    eggsalad Ormstein: your av doesn't look like barbie
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Only about 15 years younger; I know it doesn't look 15, but that's how old I was when the picture was taken.
    eggsalad Ormstein: this is why I wear a dress
    Wol Euler: I'd agree that an av that has clearly been worked on is a sign of an interesting mind
    Rhiannon Dragoone: egg, yah; my first avatar did, but I thought this would be more authentic
    Rhiannon Dragoone: er, 10 years younger is what i meant; when i was 15
    eggsalad Ormstein: zoiks, is that legal?
    Paloma Porta: 5 years younger - a typo ?? hehe
    Wol Euler: jailbait :)
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Well, I said i was 18, that makes it legal, right?
    Rhiannon Dragoone: lol
    Paloma Porta: I rarely say my age in rl - i like the separation
    Wol Euler nods.
    eggsalad Ormstein: and I feel exactly the opposite
    Rhiannon Dragoone: i only say my age when I feel I can trust the person with the info.
    Paloma Porta: Sl is my platform for a second life . not an extension of facebook !!
    Wol Euler: exactly
    Rhiannon Dragoone: ok, so I lied about my age; so sue me. lol
    Wol Euler: which is why the Lindens' current mania for RL identity is so worrying
    eggsalad Ormstein: see, I think there's a human being behind the av, and that's who I want to know
    Wol Euler nods.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: An extension of facebook; that's a horribgle idea
    Paloma Porta: I am not saying this is true and should be agreed with .heavens no!!! Each must do there own thing - in my book
    Rhiannon Dragoone: egg, yeah, there always is
    Rhiannon Dragoone: What mania for RL identity?
    Paloma Porta: hehe Ufo sightings are many and reliable - perhaps there are aliens among us who have logged in ??
    Wol Euler peers closely at Rhi.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: They just want your email address, unless you want age verification. Then you borrow your big sister's ID, just like irl
    eggsalad Ormstein: I also think some people are dissatisfied with their rl, and come to sl to find a better place
    Wol Euler: that's definitely true, eg
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Wol, lol
    Wol Euler: the handicapped for example, or there is a large autistic community in SL


    Paloma Porta: Hands up who wants to upload their mind into their sl vavatar ?
    eggsalad Ormstein: whereas I am perfectly satisfied with my life and who I am
    Yakuzza Lethecus: well, partly sl is a better place considering that we safe the planet through not using 10 tons of kerosine each meeting :P
    Wol Euler chuckles.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i really wonder how the transition in the perception of value will change in the future
    Paloma Porta: safety is a key issue Rhi pointed this out to me earlier today : this was re people safely expressing their dark side here - latex and so forth (hooray)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: for me value especially monetary value is still fixed to material goods
    Wol Euler nods to Paloma
    Wol Euler: people can experiment here in safety, with things that would be dangerous or expensive or impossible in RL
    eggsalad Ormstein: hmm, I'm probably darker in rl
    Wol Euler: interesting :)
    Wol Euler: my RL is very vanilla
    Yakuzza Lethecus: actually i don't even know if i am different in real life, the thoughts are the same
    Paloma Porta: ahaa egg perhaps there are many with full real lives in sl -but i doubt it
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Exactly, wol.
    eggsalad Ormstein: you may very well be right, paloma
    Wol Euler: I tend to get a little punchy around this point in the conversation :)
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Well, I've met some who are virtually identical in both worlds.
    Paloma Porta: I am a lot different here. Paloma is Leo i think and "I" am pisces..Paloma is very arrogant and outgoing. "I" am much less so
    Rhiannon Dragoone: And then there are role players.
    Wol Euler: I'm annoyed by the presumption that we are here because our "real" lives are inadequate.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Well, that's true of some people, and it depends on what you mean. Some people are here to augment their rl; doesn't mean it's inadequate, only that they can do things here they can't there.
    Wol Euler nods.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Like fly, for instance
    Wol Euler: or be a cat
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Go to book discussions, though; as they might not have any where they live
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Right, Wol; or a dragon.
    Wol Euler nods. It is much easier to find communities of interest in SL than in many people's physical locations
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Paloma is from the UK, i would never meet anyone like her where I live; doesn't mean I have an inadequate social life.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: you can have a perfedtly adequate social life and not meet any British person ever.
    Wol Euler chuckles.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: in rl i can only go to a philosophy meeting every wednesday, i have to drive to get there, i have to get dressed a bit better then if i hang around at home
    Paloma Porta: to replicate this meeting in rl would cost us thousands of er....dollars....thats presupposing we could get plane flights of 3 seconds journey time
    Yakuzza Lethecus: -> i need double the time since i have to drive and prepare
    Yakuzza Lethecus: and i can't google there since i am not too skilled in most of the subjects
    Wol Euler nods.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so sl is perfect
    Wol Euler: agreed :)
    Rhiannon Dragoone: there are no philosophy discussions where I live, and yeah, I come to them here attired completely different than in rl.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: yeah, Yaku, exactly.
    Paloma Porta: i needto learn to type
    Wol Euler: you
    Wol Euler: you're doing fine, paloma :)
    Paloma Porta: i find it very fristrating...i type so slowly
    Rhiannon Dragoone: yaku, SL isn't perfect by any means.
    Wol Euler: practice :)
    Wol Euler: but yes, 10-finger typing is a skill worth learning.
    Paloma Porta: 10 fingers !!!! wow
    eggsalad Ormstein: I just prefer not to have f2f human interaction
    Rhiannon Dragoone: No webcams for you, then, egg
    Wol Euler nods.
    eggsalad Ormstein: oh no, I don't even own one
    Yakuzza Lethecus: well, here it's more c2c :P
    Yakuzza Lethecus: consciousness to consciousness
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Yaku, yeah, it is that; although some people prefer avi to avi contact; no IM's for them.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: When I've had discussions in my group IM, some people ask to be tp'd.
    Wol Euler nods.
    Wol Euler: I like to look at hte people I'm talking to, generally
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i wonder if we are all soon standing or sitting in front of our screens with motioncapture devices
    eggsalad Ormstein: people in close proximity always bothers me
    Wol Euler: I hope not!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: so we would have a whole new level of interaction :D
    Wol Euler: imagine not being able to scratch your butt or pick your nose!
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Yaku, motion capture devices?


    Wol Euler: though I suppose people survive RL meetings without doing that ...
    Yakuzza Lethecus: starting from project nathal/ Kinect for xbox 360
    Yakuzza Lethecus: but i guess there will be more sensor devices for the masses soon
    Yakuzza Lethecus: friends of mine used for example headtracking and input devices with more tacticle feedback before
    Yakuzza Lethecus: like the novint falcon and trackIR
    eggsalad Ormstein: good, then I can retreat more and more
    Wol Euler raises an eyebrow.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Can you imagine it when they implant chips so that virtual life will be indistinguisble from rl, at least as the brain perceives it?
    Paloma Porta: the future of SL is the stuff of science fiction...Azimov and so forth . holograms and oyher perceptions
    Wol Euler: we already live in the future (points around herself)
    Paloma Porta: I'd love to put the screen on one of those huge tv's
    Yakuzza Lethecus: or directly drawn on ur retina paloma :P
    Yakuzza Lethecus: http://www.engadget.com/2010/09/17/b...your-eye-bisc/
    Paloma Porta: sure ..great idea
    Wol Euler: wow.
    Wol Euler: I can imagine so many uses for that.
    Wol Euler: walking down the street, asking "how old is that house"?
    Wol Euler: or "what bird is that?"
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yes and these tools are already in development and partly exist on smartphones
    Yakuzza Lethecus: it's just the user interfaces
    Yakuzza Lethecus: the connectivity to the cloud :P
    Wol Euler nods.
    Paloma Porta: well sci-fi predicts or maps the future a little....we will all be on the net in implanted chips....which will include full video etcetc to replace email
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i have a new internet connection since this week and this mobile connection is actually 5-6 times faster then the landline we had
    Wol Euler: congratulations :)
    Paloma Porta: happy for you :/ lol
    Yakuzza Lethecus: nah, it's just an aspect considering us running around and being connected
    Yakuzza Lethecus: the premise was on mobile for me
    Paloma Porta: ohhh
    Yakuzza Lethecus: being in secondlife anywhere you actually are, on your iphone or android
    Wol Euler nods.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: yeah, i love being on my phone, right Wol?
    Rhiannon Dragoone: lol
    eggsalad Ormstein: oh, I do not like that level of connectivity
    Wol Euler: I would *hope* that it would be optional, and loaded with privacy features
    Rhiannon Dragoone: yaku, that's awesome about your internet connection; I'm hoping to get DSL eventally; on satellite now
    Wol Euler: I don't want to be broadcasting my every gesture and unconscious noise that I make
    eggsalad Ormstein: but young people have an entirely different concept of privacy now
    Wol Euler nods.
    eggsalad Ormstein: people will tweet that they just pooped
    Paloma Porta: there voyeurism and exhibitionism also to consider..privacy is not a alsways desired thing
    Wol Euler: nor do I always want the whole world to know whcih store I just walked out of
    Wol Euler: sure,paloma,but they need to be optional
    Wol Euler: the trouble to us oldies (nods to egg) is that systems like facebook are set up by default to be anti-privacy
    Wol Euler: they default to telling everyone everything
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i am afk for 20-30 minutes
    Rhiannon Dragoone: oh, see you, yaku; i'll be gone by the time you get back.
    Rhiannon Dragoone: Should leave now, actgually; it's late for me.
    Wol Euler nods.
    eggsalad Ormstein: it's 2:15 here
    Wol Euler: goodnight rhi, it was nice to see you again
    Rhiannon Dragoone: oh, you too Wol
    Rhiannon Dragoone: And paloma, take care
    Paloma Porta: I am not on facebbook i deleted myself....rl is mired in redundant issues for me....sl is cleaner somehow.
    Wol Euler: agreed
    Paloma Porta: see soon Rhi
    Wol Euler: erm, sorry, I misread what you'd said, scrub that.
    Wol Euler: bye for now
    Rhiannon Dragoone: bye for now


    Paloma Porta: why is it i chat in sl and dislike chat in facebook?
    Wol Euler nods.
    Wol Euler: it's because of the avatars, the embodiment that they bring
    Wol Euler: (imho ymmv)
    Wol Euler: and perhaps also because fb is crap :)
    eggsalad Ormstein: my fb friends are people I don't care to chat with, else I would chat with them, rather than reading their antics on FB
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Paloma Porta: I can't pin it down for the monment
    Paloma Porta: ahaa its the news...rl news I don't watch it!!
    Paloma Porta: fb discusses the rl world..and the news and antics of politicians and the price of fish ..as if..as if..there was somerthing to learn there!!
    Wol Euler: heheh
    Wol Euler: too much of "news" is just gossip
    Wol Euler: who the hell cares what [fake celebrity] said about what [other fake celebrity] wore last night
    Wol Euler grumbles
    Paloma Porta: "OH my i wne to the shops and the prices have gone upagain and i sed to my friend this always happens when we get an oil crisis its just the big corporations ripping us off as usual and this weather doesn't help with it wet all the time my daughter can't get her hair dry when she goes to school and the shcool is no help cos they don't care like they id in the old days it was better then when my father was alive...."
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: hello Visitor
    Wol Euler: have you been here before?
    Visitor: hi wol...........
    Paloma Porta: hello Visitor:))
    Visitor: hi
    Wol Euler: have you been here before?


    There is a short pause, then he silently TPs away.

    Wol Euler: see, this is one of the many reasons why I think viewer2 is shite. Newbies simply don't see many chat messages because (a) they pop up in that ridiculous little chatbox, and (b) they don't yet know where to look.
    Paloma Porta: ohh really
    Wol Euler: well that's what I infer is going on :)


    Paloma Porta: i am viewer one based..i tried v2 i was lost
    eggsalad Ormstein: good night all
    Wol Euler: 'night egg, sleep well
    Paloma Porta: too late ..gone..nn egg..lol
    Wol Euler: :)
    Wol Euler: he'll read it in the log, perhaps,
    Wol Euler: note to self: Visitor never replied, anonymize him
    Paloma Porta: hehe
    Paloma Porta: anonymize ?
    Wol Euler: well, as I asked you for permission to quote you
    Wol Euler: he didn't reply so in effect he didn't give permission
    Wol Euler: I'll change his name to "Visitor" in the published log
    Paloma Porta: ahaaa
    Wol Euler: we have to be careful about that, the Terms of Service forbid publishing SL chat out of world
    Wol Euler: without permission
    Paloma Porta: right
    Paloma Porta: and its fair
    Wol Euler: sure
    Paloma Porta: Ok then If i may leave and thank you ?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: take care paloma
    Wol Euler: bye paloma, it was nice meeting you.
    Paloma Porta: Indded thank you for your hospitality :))
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: our pleasure
    Wol Euler: wander well :)
    Paloma Porta: Thank you
    Wol Euler: I'm going to move on as well, I have shopping to do
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, i am also moving cleaning the whole flat in front of me
    Yakuzza Lethecus: "es vor sich her schieben"
    Wol Euler: I did see your comment earlier about how online life may change our ideas of value, yaku
    Wol Euler: but there wasn'T a good time to return to that.
    Wol Euler: we'll save the topic for anohter time :)
    Wol Euler: in english we'd say that you are putting off cleaning the flat
    Yakuzza Lethecus: take care wol
    Wol Euler: you too
    Wol Euler: bye for now

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