2011.04.14 13:00 - creative sadness

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Lia Rikugun. The comments are by Lia Rikugun.

    Lia Rikugun: hello wol
    Lia Rikugun: hello korel
    Lia Rikugun: nice to meet you
    Lia Rikugun: i guess you have been to the pavillion?
    Wol Euler: hello lia, korel
    Korel Laloix: Yes I have quite a few times... thanks.
    Korel Laloix: osiyo Wol.
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Lia Rikugun: so how are you doing today?
    Korel Laloix: Busy, but getting some time to breath.
    Lia Rikugun: thats important
    Wol Euler: relaxing
    Lia Rikugun: :)


    realizing how fast time passes

    Lia Rikugun: i had a thought about time
    Wol Euler: mm?
    Lia Rikugun: and it shocked me how fast it went by
    Lia Rikugun: and no moment will come back
    Lia Rikugun: like in a sand clock
    Wol Euler nods.
    Lia Rikugun: every sand corn falls through and is gone
    Wol Euler: hello arch
    Lia Rikugun: hello arch
    Lia Rikugun: i dont know if i should be sad or happy :)
    Wol Euler: there are quite a few moments that I wouldn't wish to relive
    Lia Rikugun: or nothing
    Archmage Atlantis: Helo Lia, Korel, Wol
    Wol Euler: but the declining quantity gives one pause
    Lia Rikugun: the only thing from this thought I logically can get is "live every moment fully"
    Archmage Atlantis: The difficult moments give us our character
    Lia Rikugun: it wont come back
    Korel Laloix: Nice pic.. thanks.
    Archmage Atlantis: our strength
    Lia Rikugun: it seems i am rushing through life
    Wol Euler nods.
    Lia Rikugun: always to the next challenge
    Lia Rikugun: and then there are these moments where you look back 7 years and think where did the time go?
    Archmage Atlantis: That is why PaB is important
    Archmage Atlantis: To reflect
    Lia Rikugun: what happened to these 7 years
    Lia Rikugun: yes arch
    Wol Euler: hello sam
    Lia Rikugun: hello oO0Oo
    oO0Oo Resident: hi everyone.. gtsy all :)
    Lia Rikugun: we are talking about time and enjoying the momtn
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi everyone :)
    Wol Euler: hello sharon
    Lia Rikugun: hi sophiasharon
    Wol Euler: hi zon
    Lia Rikugun: hi zon
    Zon Kwan: heya



    Lia Rikugun: so I guess i feel sad a little bit
    Archmage Atlantis: It is the time to choose the yellow star or the blue star
    Lia Rikugun: because i couldnt hold on to so many moments
    Wol Euler: n
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ooh
    Wol Euler nods.
    oO0Oo Resident nods
    Lia Rikugun: and all have passed and will not come back
    Wol Euler smiles. You
    Wol Euler: you're having a blade runner moment :)
    Lia Rikugun: i dont think i have seen the movie
    Wol Euler: O.O
    Lia Rikugun: what does it mean
    Wol Euler: an amazing and serious omission :)
    Wol Euler: it's a great film, highly recommended
    Lia Rikugun: ok i put it on my list ;)
    Wol Euler: without wanting to give away the story, there is a moment at the end of the film which echoes in the memory of everyone I know who's seen it
    Wol Euler: where a character dies, on a rooftop in the rain, and talks sadly about all that he has seen, and how his memories will wash away with his life
    oO0Oo Resident remembers rain dripping off noses
    Wol Euler: right
    SophiaSharon Larnia: have to admit i havent een it either although its rather old now :)
    Wol Euler is getting chills thinking of it :)
    Pinky Kira: hi :)
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Lia Rikugun: hi pinky
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i will fix that ommision here sometime :)
    Lia Rikugun: nice to meet you pinky
    oO0Oo Resident: hi pinky
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Pinky
    Wol Euler: hello pinky, have you been here before?
    Pinky Kira: yep
    Wol Euler: ah, yes, I recognize you now :)
    Lia Rikugun: right now we are talking about blade runner :)
    Pinky Kira: :)
    Lia Rikugun: and how moments become memories
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    SophiaSharon Larnia: welcome and neat avatar :)
    Wol Euler: which in a way means that you still have them ...
    Pinky Kira: ty!
    Lia Rikugun: it is not the same
    oO0Oo Resident: and the sadness that underlies some of our experience of the passing of time and moments gone?
    Lia Rikugun: a memory can change depending on your feeling at that day
    Lia Rikugun: yes sadness
    Wol Euler nods.
    Archmage Atlantis: Love can go viral


    should I be sad or happy? do I cling to the memory when I am sad?

    SophiaSharon Larnia: i feel that often Lia
    Wol Euler: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JjJzMBGUwo
    Zon Kwan: sadness.. means we cling to the memory ..to the passing thing..
    Lia Rikugun: yes this was also a question
    Lia Rikugun: should i be happy or sad about it
    Lia Rikugun: now i am sad
    Pinky Kira: some sadness is ok I think
    Lia Rikugun: i am not thinking of any moments in particular
    Lia Rikugun: just realizing that 7 years have passed
    Wol Euler nods.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: nods
    Lia Rikugun: 7 years!!!
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Lia Rikugun: where did the time go??
    Lia Rikugun: mybe under the sofa?
    Lia Rikugun: let me check
    Archmage Atlantis: Where all time goes, Lia
    Wol Euler: if only it was that simple :)


    doing things differently? so many possibilities

    SophiaSharon Larnia: i feel that the most loking at something i wouldve done differently
    Lia Rikugun: hm no...
    Alfred Kelberry: meep!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Boxy :)
    Alfred Kelberry: hi :)
    Lia Rikugun: hi alfred
    Pinky Kira: hi boxy :)
    Alfred Kelberry: pinky? new member? :)
    Lia Rikugun: yes sohpiasharon?
    Pinky Kira: not new
    oO0Oo Resident: hi boxy
    Wol Euler: used member :)
    Wol Euler: not new
    Alfred Kelberry: ah
    SophiaSharon Larnia: or at looking at pictures
    Archmage Atlantis: Chuckle.......would have done this life differently if i knew the outcomes
    Pinky Kira: slightly used :)
    Alfred Kelberry: new outfit maybe :)
    oO0Oo Resident: thanks for the link Wol
    Alfred Kelberry: *looks at lia's tail*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: wonder what direction my life would be if i ad that and not this
    Lia Rikugun: hehe
    Alfred Kelberry: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: had done*
    Alfred Kelberry: oni!
    Lia Rikugun: but maybe you can only have this thought because of this and not that
    Archmage Atlantis: it is not the destination, it is the journey
    SophiaSharon Larnia: haha Lia :D
    SophiaSharon Larnia: very true, that
    Lia Rikugun: no i am serious
    Alfred Kelberry: sophia, multitude of possibilities :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes i understand
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: the fractuals hurt my head thinking of it lol
    Lia Rikugun: HAHA
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ;p
    Alfred Kelberry: i prefer this moment now :)
    Alfred Kelberry: :P


    topological thought

    Archmage Atlantis: Use topolical thought then SSL
    Pinky Kira: good choice boxy
    Alfred Kelberry: stormy!
    Lia Rikugun: hi storm
    SophiaSharon Larnia: what is topilical thought
    Wol Euler: hello storm
    Archmage Atlantis: There are no fractals there
    Archmage Atlantis: Only conundrums
    Storm Nordwind: Hi everyone
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Storm
    Pinky Kira: hi Storm
    Wol Euler: topological?
    Alfred Kelberry: you're spoiling us with your presence lately, stormy :)
    Lia Rikugun: hello sinequanon
    Wol Euler: (geography/mapping/transformation maths)
    Alfred Kelberry: i hope you'll make it a habit :)
    sinequanon Sahara: Hello Lia. everyone
    Lia Rikugun: nice to meet you have you been here before sinequanon?
    Wol Euler: hello sine
    Archmage Atlantis: I have an opinion to express on the inclusion of the yound
    sinequanon Sahara: hello Wol
    Alfred Kelberry: *listens*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: topological to me implies you are about the action and not part of it, Arch
    Archmage Atlantis: They are
    SophiaSharon Larnia: above** (sorry)
    Archmage Atlantis: We are afraid as adults if we do not be
    oO0Oo Resident: hi storm :), hi sinequanon :)
    sinequanon Sahara: yes i have been here before Lia...i am aware of the rules
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Sinequanon :)
    Lia Rikugun: ok great ;)
    sinequanon Sahara: Sophia
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, younger ppl can be abused
    Archmage Atlantis: It is also abuse to not allow those who can learn
    SophiaSharon Larnia: brb
    Archmage Atlantis: Stand in the fire, burn the flesh.......those are sometimes noble
    Lia Rikugun: i dont understand
    Archmage Atlantis: And sometimes only punishment
    Lia Rikugun: what are we talking about?
    sinequanon Sahara: to bring a lighted firebrand so you may warm yourself
    Archmage Atlantis: ty shi


    being in sadness

    SophiaSharon Larnia: what do you do when you feel that way Lia?
    Lia Rikugun: oh like now?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Lia Rikugun: well i dont think this sadness is bad in any way
    Lia Rikugun: i want to try to understand why i feel that way
    Lia Rikugun: i dont want to convince myself to be happy
    Lia Rikugun: i could
    sinequanon Sahara: one cant always exhale....
    sinequanon Sahara: you need to breathe in to be able to breathe out
    Alfred Kelberry: it's fine to be sad
    Lia Rikugun: i am just fascinated that it came so sudden this realization
    Lia Rikugun: 7 years are gone in no time
    Wol Euler: let's try to focus on what you are sad about, Lia. Is it the past, actually, or is it more the future?
    Pinky Kira: was wondering that too
    Lia Rikugun: haha we dont need to talk baout my sadness
    SophiaSharon Larnia: its helpful to many of us,a nd me Lia :)
    Wol Euler: it's a real topic, and many of us face it daily
    Archmage Atlantis: Lia has a right to privacy
    Lia Rikugun: i guess i am sad that i cannot hold on to so many moments
    Wol Euler: you are not alone
    Lia Rikugun: and i dont mean any moments in particular
    Lia Rikugun: and also i must say it is a good sad
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Lia Rikugun: a sadness from which i can get energy and thoughts
    Archmage Atlantis: look around this crcle.....there are skin tones chosen by each of us
    Lia Rikugun: not a depressing sadness but a thinking sadness :)
    Lia Rikugun: but then i see that I am holding on to things
    Archmage Atlantis: Mine matches my rl one
    Storm Nordwind: perhaps a creative sadness?
    Lia Rikugun: and we are talking a lot about the moments and no time etc
    Lia Rikugun: and it seems that I dont really get it
    sinequanon Sahara: love may miss its mark...but the sadness is real...it never misses
    Wol Euler: well, I think there is a possible distinction to make
    Archmage Atlantis: What is there to get?
    Lia Rikugun: that things are not permanent
    Wol Euler nods.
    Lia Rikugun: usually it is not a problem
    Lia Rikugun: but now after meeting a friend from lets say former times i realize this very strongly, time passes
    Lia Rikugun: i am sorry i dont want to talk too much
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    oO0Oo Resident smiles... understand
    sinequanon Sahara: this is interesting...our sense of time
    Archmage Atlantis: In the late 1500s, ace, my male ancestor came to this place.......from what is now the UK.....60,000 years, according to DNA, that male ancestor came out of Africa
    SophiaSharon Larnia: sometimes i have a sense of wanting to cling to that, although i know its not 'healthy'
    Archmage Atlantis: I asked for none of this
    SophiaSharon Larnia: wb Zon :)
    Zon Kwan: hi hi
    sinequanon Sahara: free for what...not free from what..your ruling thought would i hear of and not that you have escaped from a yoke...nietzsche reminds us


    being in the now

    SophiaSharon Larnia: being engaged in the now is one of the only thing that alleviates it for a while, but it doesn't deal with the feelings when they come back
    Wol Euler nods.
    Storm Nordwind: The years help - and being in the now eventually consumes all - with practice
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Susan
    iwandertoo Resident: waves :)
    Archmage Atlantis: To tell the stories, true or false, is to be human
    oO0Oo Resident waves also... ;) hi susan
    Wol Euler: hello susan
    Pinky Kira: hi Susan :)
    Lia Rikugun: but being in the now can also mean remembering no?


    the left and right hemispheres

    sinequanon Sahara: the interplay between the hemispheres ...the right one is for the things right now and the left one binds us to our past and our present giving us our personality...and the othe rhandicap that comes with it
    Wol Euler: I think so, yes, lia
    Lia Rikugun: and also looking ahead
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, true, sine.....but there is more
    Archmage Atlantis: like knowing how a car works
    Archmage Atlantis: but not knowing why
    Lia Rikugun: i like to make a connection
    Lia Rikugun: since we talk about being in the moment in the now
    sinequanon Sahara: i recall an interesting incident ..a neurosurgeon having some brain seizure where she lost connection with her left hemisphere...she couldnt dial a telephone number
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, the brain is like a computer.....and fails at times
    sinequanon Sahara: she could read the symbols on her dial pad and match them with the calling card she had...but she couldnt remember which numbers she had already dialled
    Wol Euler: I don't think that means you should not remember, I think that would be inhuman. If your "now" is the moment in which a memory comes up, then accept the momory as this "now"
    sinequanon Sahara: let me give a link..
    Pinky Kira: my stroke of insight .... great book
    Lia Rikugun: yes yes
    Lia Rikugun: i think in the past i have misundrstood :)
    Wol Euler: yes, that's right, she gave a TED talk about it
    Archmage Atlantis: I listen to Wol......I would advise others to do the same
    sinequanon Sahara: http://www.ted.com/talks/jill_bolte_taylor_s_powerful_stroke_of_insight.html
    sinequanon Sahara: exactly Wol
    oO0Oo Resident feels a collective benevolence playing
    Archmage Atlantis: BOGO
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :) Samuo
    Archmage Atlantis: :)
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Storm Nordwind nods recalls seeing that video 3 years ago
    sinequanon Sahara: your timings are very precise storm :)
    sinequanon Sahara: they must fall with some incident worth recollecting
    Storm Nordwind: It's always now, and now is always worthwhile in some way :)
    Wol Euler: :)
    sinequanon Sahara: yes we can take the now in our hands


    what is creative sadness?

    SophiaSharon Larnia: has to interupt to ask what creative sadness is
    Lia Rikugun: storm?
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    sinequanon Sahara: the sadness of the poet
    Storm Nordwind: An example: I recall a passionate affaire I had once, at the end of which I was probablt at my most prolific artistically
    SophiaSharon Larnia: alot of energy flying about :)
    Storm Nordwind: Not so much energy, as awareness
    Storm Nordwind: Like the sense of poise one has after a long Tai Chi session
    SophiaSharon Larnia: so creative energy is tied to awareness?
    oO0Oo Resident thinks.. when another is authentically sad.. perhaps crying.. it often opens my heart. Created? Creative?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: creative sadness i mean
    sinequanon Sahara: an empathic awareness too
    Zon Kwan doesnt see teh link between awareness and sadness
    Storm Nordwind: Creative sadness can increase awareness (just as depressing sadness can diminish it) and in turn may be a precursor for successful use of such creative energy
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i see, thans for putting it into words i can understand
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thanks*
    Zon Kwan: what is creative sadness ?
    Lia Rikugun: yes thanks
    oO0Oo Resident: one can be open to openness, with awareness
    sinequanon Sahara: a sadness that has its roots not in misery but in longing
    Wol Euler nods.
    oO0Oo Resident nods.. longing
    Wol Euler: an important distinction
    Zon Kwan: sadness is not rigth word then
    Storm Nordwind: A sadness that brings awareness but no identification with that sadness. Immersion in it, but no attachment to it.
    Zon Kwan: longing to create
    Storm Nordwind: The creative side may or may not happen - it is not the same thing. One merely faciitates the other.
    Zon Kwan: to me the word sad means i miss something
    Lia Rikugun: thats very interesting
    Pinky Kira: many emotions can spark creativity
    Storm Nordwind: That's because, Zon, you are identifying with what you feel.
    Zon Kwan: hm
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Pinky :)
    sinequanon Sahara: creativity is another faculty altogether....all creativity stems from some longing but not all longing would lead everything worthwhile everytime
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye for now all, take care :))
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Wol Euler: bye sharon
    Wol Euler: take care
    Lia Rikugun: byeybe
    sinequanon Sahara: bye Sophia
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Pinky Kira: bye :)
    oO0Oo Resident: bye SSL :) gtsy
    Wol Euler: bye pinky
    Storm Nordwind slips away too
    Lia Rikugun: i will leave too, thank you
    oO0Oo Resident: bye pinky :)
    Wol Euler: bye storm
    Lia Rikugun: bye everyone
    oO0Oo Resident: gtsy storm :)
    Wol Euler: bye lia, I hope you're feeling better
    Wol Euler: if not less sad :)
    Wol Euler: *better aobut being sad, I mean
    Lia Rikugun: oh its fine just thinking which is good
    oO0Oo Resident: bye Lia.. ntsy :)
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Wol Euler: :)
    sinequanon Sahara: must beg leave too
    sinequanon Sahara: bye all
    oO0Oo Resident: nice to meet you sine
    Wol Euler: bye sine, nice to meet you
    sinequanon Sahara: a perfect pleasure
    Wol Euler: :)
    oO0Oo Resident: :)
    oO0Oo Resident: Yahoo!
    Wol Euler: :)
    Wol Euler: [13:57] Storm Nordwind: A sadness that brings awareness but no identification with that sadness. Immersion in it, but no attachment to it.
    Wol Euler: worth remembering :)
    oO0Oo Resident thinks of the beauty of scuffed shells
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Wol Euler: my dears, I think I'm going to move on
    Wol Euler: my bed is calling me
    Zon Kwan: me 2, waves
    Wol Euler: goodngiht, sam, 'night zon
    oO0Oo Resident smiles.. tc dears

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