2011.05.16 01:00 - Allowing silence in

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Wester Kiranov. The comments are by Wester Kiranov.

    I had a lovely conversation and equally lovely silence with oO0Oo Resident, and later Bertram Jacobus shared a meditation with us. Alfred Kelberry came in when I had left already. At the very end a newbie came in, and Alfred did a fine job of introducing her to PaB - thanks, Boxy!

    Wester Kiranov: hi oOo
    oO0Oo Resident: hi Wester :)
    oO0Oo Resident: Wester.. first of all.. ty for the spaciousness.. has felt relaxing and uncontrived.. I notice you have been on SL for a few years, and I wonder what now is most meaningful here for you.
    Wester Kiranov: I am happy you like the space
    Wester Kiranov: yes, it has been a while on SL, but I have spent most of that time here in the PaB pavillion
    Wester Kiranov: I started at the kira cafe, and I have tried out some other places, but just sitting here, with the space, and the people that are all willing to allow space in, is the thing that makes it worth coming to SL
    oO0Oo Resident nods .. mmm
    Wester Kiranov: the talk here can be a vehicle for space and silence, and joy
    oO0Oo Resident smiles and sits up a bit straighter
    Wester Kiranov: :-)
    oO0Oo Resident: that statement fills me with joy
    Wester Kiranov: and that statement makes me smile
    oO0Oo Resident: :-D
    oO0Oo Resident: I sense that in RL.. places and things can become imbued with something that is a product of repetitive use. I wonder about virtual spaces.. the pavilion has been host to so many aspects of connection and sharing over time
    Wester Kiranov: that's an interesting thought
    Wester Kiranov: I don't go to enough other places in SL to really compare
    Wester Kiranov: but I agree about the effect in RL
    Wester Kiranov: I also feel the openness and birdsong of this place agree well with the openness and silence in PaB
    oO0Oo Resident: agreed
    Wester Kiranov: hi bertram
    oO0Oo Resident: Halo Bertram :)
    Bertram Jacobus: hi wester and sam ! :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: oops
    Bertram Jacobus: are you still here ? - did / do i disturb something ?
    Wester Kiranov: I'm still here
    Wester Kiranov: and undisturbed :-)
    oO0Oo Resident: still here.. and your presence has always been nothing but comfortable and edifying
    Bertram Jacobus: ty so much ... i just read a meditation description and ask myself whether you wouldn´t mind it if i would like or try to share the small text part about it (?) ...
    oO0Oo Resident: wonderful.. for me yes
    Bertram Jacobus: oh ty again. because of the time, i simply start with it
    Bertram Jacobus: "when we look at our breathing -
    Bertram Jacobus: we can look at it in the following way :
    Bertram Jacobus: breathing in :
    Bertram Jacobus: in the beginning - at the nose ...
    Bertram Jacobus: in the middle - in our breast
    Bertram Jacobus: in the end - in our stomach
    Bertram Jacobus: breathing out :
    Bertram Jacobus: in the beginning - in our stomach
    Bertram Jacobus: in the middle - in our breast
    Bertram Jacobus: at the end : at the nose ...
    Bertram Jacobus: (that´s not wordly but as i understood the sense) ...
    Bertram Jacobus: i hope, i wrote it understandable ...
    Wester Kiranov: very understandable
    oO0Oo Resident: yes.. very clear :) ty.. it is a helpful thing to read, and stimulates my curiosity about breathing
    Bertram Jacobus: wonderful - ty again ! :-)
    Wester Kiranov: I like the way it really focuses on the experience in the body
    Bertram Jacobus: it´s from the meditation master ajahn chah and he says that would be a first method to meditate / watch the breathing ...
    Wester Kiranov: yes, very good as a first method
    Bertram Jacobus: he goes on then with other forms of focussing to the breath ...
    Wester Kiranov: if you stay with it for a long time it might start to feel too directive
    Bertram Jacobus: but I found those first words so wonderful, calming and so on - could and liked to practise it at once (!) ... :-)
    oO0Oo Resident: good in the beginning.. the middle.. and the end.. ongoingly ;)
    Bertram Jacobus: *agree*
    oO0Oo Resident: I also began .. even as you were writing Bertram
    Bertram Jacobus: that was the effort i felt as well as i found these words sam ...
    oO0Oo Resident: effort as joy
    Wester Kiranov: :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: sry : effect i wanted to write
    Wester Kiranov: ;-P
    Bertram Jacobus: always these damned language problems ! ... :o)
    Bertram Jacobus: but ty again very much both for having shared this with me and sry for my coming with it so late !
    Wester Kiranov: what I find with this exercise: the focus on the stomach feels grounding, and that counters the lightness normally associated with the inbreath
    Wester Kiranov: so that balances things a bit
    Bertram Jacobus: interesting : so very much worked out, precised, detailled wester (!) ...
    Wester Kiranov: the focus on the nose feels light, and that balances the grounding associated with outbreath
    Bertram Jacobus: and what about the breast ? ;-)
    Wester Kiranov: that's in the middle of both the inbreath and the outbreath, so the impression doesn't linger as much.
    oO0Oo Resident nods
    Bertram Jacobus: i see -
    Bertram Jacobus: but my impression is, that everybody experiences all that with similarities to others but differences as well
    Wester Kiranov: and the impression in the breat also is quite different in in and out, as it is either expanding or contracting
    Bertram Jacobus: yes !
    Wester Kiranov: and of course, these are just my impressions
    Bertram Jacobus: did you also have some impressions sam which you could or would like to tell perhaps pls ? :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: but i don´t want to push - so
    Bertram Jacobus: sry pls if that feels so - and in that case
    Wester Kiranov: i'm curious too :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: pls simply do as it hasn´t been written ... ;-)
    Bertram Jacobus: my experience - before wester desribed hers - was mostly peace and calmness ...
    Bertram Jacobus: and i can wait ...
    Bertram Jacobus: it´s so nice when one knows meditation because so one can do it always when phases of waiting occure ...

    It was time for me to leave, but the conversation went on bit more.

    Wester Kiranov: well, i actually have some rl things to do now
    Wester Kiranov: so i have say bye, and thank you
    Bertram Jacobus: okay wester - have a nice time ! ...
    Wester Kiranov: namaste
    oO0Oo Resident: nice sitting with you Wester.. ty
    oO0Oo Resident: Wester's descriptions were for me articulate, and felt similar to my own.. Mentally.. I did begin to question the habit of my breathing.. as a comparison can arise between natural breathing, and kind of practicing with the three areas of the body. Sometimes.. It takes a while to relax my breath..
    Bertram Jacobus: i see ... but it´s stressed sometimes that no artifical element should disturb the breathing ...
    Bertram Jacobus: while other methods modify it ...
    oO0Oo Resident: yes.. true
    Bertram Jacobus: but the sheer fact of being aware of it - changes already something
    Bertram Jacobus: one may even say - "a lot" ...
    oO0Oo Resident: can you say what changes please?
    Bertram Jacobus: the rhythm of breathing i meant
    Bertram Jacobus: the depth
    Bertram Jacobus: the breathing in a whole in a way -
    Bertram Jacobus: at least this is my experience ...
    oO0Oo Resident: agreed.. and would add perhaps.. something about the muscles themselves relaxing in ways that reveal body habits
    Bertram Jacobus: may be because breathing is a quite subtile "thing" ...
    Bertram Jacobus: and every influence makes so a quite big impact on it -
    oO0Oo Resident nods
    oO0Oo Resident: yes.. a close relationship between mind and soft front of body, and breath
    Bertram Jacobus: and so - a really nice object to look at, to train awareness
    oO0Oo Resident: agreed.. nice object.. coming and going 'through'... as with thoughts, emotions, perceptions
    oO0Oo Resident: but a kind of place to come back to
    oO0Oo Resident: as everything moves through
    Bertram Jacobus: *agree* ... :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: nicely said
    oO0Oo Resident: tyvm.. and for raising this helpful topic
    Bertram Jacobus: tyvm for having been willing to share this with me
    oO0Oo Resident: it is odd to think that the entire pathway of our breath is somehow not really closed off.. as if we had an outside and an inside. Rather.. we are kind of open and constantly penetrated by the world
    oO0Oo Resident: aspects of the air becoming us, and aspects of us becoming air
    Bertram Jacobus: what means "closed off" pls ?
    oO0Oo Resident: well.. as if our body were a wine bottle with a cork.. but it is not like that.. it is always open in some way
    Bertram Jacobus: yes
    oO0Oo Resident: the path mixing with the air
    Bertram Jacobus: yes
    Bertram Jacobus: but why should that be "odd" ?
    oO0Oo Resident: it has to do with how i am visualising it i think.. a new way of thinking of the surfaces and the topography so to speak.. for me
    Bertram Jacobus: in which way "new" - if i may ask this (?) ...
    oO0Oo Resident: mmm difficult to say.. like there is no outside or inside... just a continuous surface..
    Bertram Jacobus: wonderful ! now i see, can be more sure that i understand. you describe it very interesting and clearly
    Bertram Jacobus: i could try to find the link for you ... where the article i read from is ...
    Bertram Jacobus: and i would like to take a pause then from here ...
    oO0Oo Resident: that would be nice.. if it is not too much trouble to find :)
    Bertram Jacobus: no. not at all - i appreciate it when we can share things , especially things like this ! - so one moment pls ... :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: yes ! i found it ! ... :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: http://www.ajahnchah.org/book/On_Meditation1.php
    Bertram Jacobus: it´s also there in german - really nice for me ... :-9
    Alfred Kelberry: wuff!
    Alfred Kelberry: hi :)
    Bertram Jacobus: *grins* - alfi ! - sry i was just leaving ... :-/
    Alfred Kelberry: ah, bye then :)
    oO0Oo Resident: ty Bertram.. I will be glad to read this (oh nice.. in German)
    Alfred Kelberry: i popped in to see if anyone is present
    Alfred Kelberry: guten morgen :)
    oO0Oo Resident: :) all present and now accounted for .. hi Boxy
    Alfred Kelberry: sam, good :)
    Bertram Jacobus: hehe - yes - but so sry both - need a rest - hope that you have a nice day and time pls ! cu soon again ... *wave* ...
    oO0Oo Resident: likewise.. I'm sorry to leave so soon friends.. but must also transition.. ty Bertram for the nice conversation.. and nice to see you boxy :)
    Alfred Kelberry: kings of convenience is a nice guitar band
    Alfred Kelberry: heh, bye sam :)
    oO0Oo Resident: will check out K's of C! thanks Boxy
    Alfred Kelberry: :)
    Alfred Kelberry: wuff!
    Cristavi Catronis: oh hello
    Alfred Kelberry: hi :)
    Alfred Kelberry: just passing by?
    Cristavi Catronis: oh perhaps, perhaps not :)
    Alfred Kelberry: hehe
    Cristavi Catronis: looks interesting
    Alfred Kelberry: it's manga from our anniversary meeting
    Alfred Kelberry: 3 years of the group
    Cristavi Catronis: I see
    Cristavi Catronis: congratulations
    Alfred Kelberry: wee! :)
    Alfred Kelberry: thanks
    Cristavi Catronis: thats a long time to keep a group going in sl
    Alfred Kelberry: true
    Cristavi Catronis: so what goes on here
    Cristavi Catronis: discussions I can imagine
    Alfred Kelberry: we gather 4 times a day
    Cristavi Catronis: all sitting on these little cushions
    Alfred Kelberry: yep
    Cristavi Catronis: in voice?
    Alfred Kelberry: mindfull talks :)
    Alfred Kelberry: yes, there's a voice session on friday
    Cristavi Catronis: oh I like mindfull talking
    Alfred Kelberry: otherwise, chat mostly
    Alfred Kelberry: then you're welcomed to attend our meetings :)
    Cristavi Catronis: hahah I was just trying to word that without sounding, erm rude
    Cristavi Catronis: once just doesnt invite oneself
    Alfred Kelberry: easy to remember - each 1 and 7 hours :)
    Cristavi Catronis: *smiles
    Alfred Kelberry: why not? :)
    Cristavi Catronis: oh I might not fit in
    Cristavi Catronis: they might not like me
    Cristavi Catronis: they might take one look at me and think.. oh no.. not her
    Cristavi Catronis: *grins
    Alfred Kelberry: haha
    Cristavi Catronis: im english you will have to excuse me
    Cristavi Catronis: we are very reserved you know
    Cristavi Catronis: and overly polite, mostly
    Cristavi Catronis: and for some reason, I am teasing you
    Alfred Kelberry: we all are... now and then
    Cristavi Catronis: shhh
    Alfred Kelberry: :)
    Cristavi Catronis: we have to be silent
    Alfred Kelberry: ding!
    Cristavi Catronis: so, what did you say about the timings
    Cristavi Catronis: that it was easy
    Alfred Kelberry: 90 sec of awareness :)
    Cristavi Catronis: to remember
    Cristavi Catronis: hahaha
    Alfred Kelberry: meeting schedule
    Alfred Kelberry: 1am/pm 7am/pm
    Cristavi Catronis: all sl time
    Alfred Kelberry: yep
    Cristavi Catronis: do I need to be in the group to attend?
    Alfred Kelberry: sit in the circle and you're part of the group :)
    Cristavi Catronis: I like this place already
    Cristavi Catronis: it has a nice abience
    Cristavi Catronis: oops missed the M
    Alfred Kelberry: storm will like to hear that :)
    Alfred Kelberry: the guy who built it
    Cristavi Catronis: is this the group that puts the meetings on the internet
    Alfred Kelberry: ah, yea
    Cristavi Catronis: ahhh
    Cristavi Catronis: I stumbled on those
    Alfred Kelberry: so, you can't say bad words :)
    Alfred Kelberry: *giggles*
    Cristavi Catronis: I never do, bad language is so very ugly
    Cristavi Catronis: enough ugliness in the world
    Alfred Kelberry: well, you can really. if you want :)
    Cristavi Catronis: certainly not
    Cristavi Catronis: *smile
    Cristavi Catronis: I think I will go for a walk and look around if thats alright
    Alfred Kelberry: sure, it's lovely here
    Cristavi Catronis: thank you

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