2011.06.17 19:00 - Imagination is from our heads


    The Guardian for this meeting was Sylectra Darwin. The comments are by Sylectra Darwin.


    Sylectra Darwin: Hi Paradise
    Paradise Tennant: hiya sylectra
    Paradise Tennant: how are you :)
    Sylectra Darwin: under the weather today unfortunately
    Sylectra Darwin: But should be better with some rest
    Paradise Tennant: oh no what's wrong
    Sylectra Darwin: Some kinda cold with a fever
    Sylectra Darwin: Not a bad one
    Sylectra Darwin: How are you?
    Paradise Tennant: very well thanks if you are not feeling well would you like me to sub for you so you can go back to bed ?
    Sylectra Darwin: maybe soon, thank you so much
    Paradise Tennant: your very welcome here is something to cheer you up :)
    Paradise Tennant: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nGeKSiCQkPw
    Sylectra Darwin: ooh
    Sylectra Darwin: thank you!
    Sylectra Darwin: I love that video - such a cute doggie
    Paradise Tennant: yes :) very very expressive
    Sylectra Darwin: second life is trying to insist on downloading an update :)
    Paradise Tennant: computer fascism :)
    Sylectra Darwin: I sure hope that guy in the video didn't tease his doggie by talking about bacon.
    Paradise Tennant: I suspect he and his doggie have long dialgues and there is lots of teasing on both sides :0
    Paradise Tennant: hiya druth nice to see you :)
    Sylectra Darwin: hi!
    druth Vlodovic: hi guys
    Lia Rikugun: hello
    Paradise Tennant: hiya lia :)
    druth Vlodovic: awsome uniform btw syl
    Sylectra Darwin: hey thanks!
    Sylectra Darwin: sorry, was moving my laptop to another room and couldn't type
    druth Vlodovic: ah
    druth Vlodovic: I was wondering if the topic today was silent meditation
    Sylectra Darwin: heh
    Sylectra Darwin: it can be :)
    Sylectra Darwin: or kitty ears
    Sylectra Darwin: Druths kitty ears are awesome
    druth Vlodovic: I like to switch viewers and see what SL makes up for me :)
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    Sylectra Darwin: you mean your kitty ears don't really exist?
    Sylectra Darwin: wow, you blew my mind
    Paradise Tennant: lol
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Paradise Tennant: illusory .. kitten appendages
    Sylectra Darwin: okay, I can accept that :)
    Sylectra Darwin: how about illusion for a topic?
    druth Vlodovic: a lot of a kitty's life is illusory
    Sylectra Darwin: how so
    Sylectra Darwin: ?
    druth Vlodovic: you ever see them chasing little bits of imagination under bags and around the house?
    Paradise Tennant: maybe kitties are really very small zen masters .. or bodhisatvas who have come here to train us to let go of the illusion of ears :)
    Lia Rikugun: hehe
    Sylectra Darwin: hehe
    Sylectra Darwin: i like that
    Sylectra Darwin: I always thought animals could see ghosts better than us.
    Sylectra Darwin: You know how cats are always staring past your shoulder with their eyes as big as saucers?
    Sylectra Darwin: well, either it's catnip or they are seeing something you can't.
    Lia Rikugun: yes i was thinking of that too :)
    druth Vlodovic: or they turn their heads to watch something invisible and start to purr
    Lia Rikugun: so who is standing there ? :)
    Sylectra Darwin: dunno
    Sylectra Darwin: I think our cat Jasmine could see our dog Deco after he passed away
    Lia Rikugun: oh
    Sylectra Darwin: but she might have just been making stuff up :)
    druth Vlodovic: "reality is what you make up"
    Sylectra Darwin: lol - yes
    Lia Rikugun: how much is imagination and how much is not?
    Sylectra Darwin: most of it is imagination, IMO
    druth Vlodovic: 1. Breathing in, I calm my body. Breathing out, I smile. 2. Breathing in, I dwell in the present moment. Breathing out, I know it is a wonderful moment.
    Sylectra Darwin: illusion is what you focus on in th present moment that is actually a memory from the past, or a fear about the future
    Sylectra Darwin: Thank you Druth
    druth Vlodovic: :) I thought it a more proper use of imagining our lives
    Lia Rikugun: hm
    druth Vlodovic: if our reality is mostly imagination, and imagination is from our heads, then we have both power and responsibility for our happiness
    Lia Rikugun: i am full of illusion i guess
    Lia Rikugun: yes thats true
    Sylectra Darwin: In native American culture, the dragonfly is the symbol of illusion.
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    druth Vlodovic: they probably couldn't think of anything stranger to look at
    druth Vlodovic: what illusions are you full of Lia?
    Lia Rikugun: memory from teh past fear about the future
    Lia Rikugun: thats why I am here to learn to be present in the moment
    Lia Rikugun: let the ego go
    Lia Rikugun: be open
    Lia Rikugun: i dont think it is that easy especially in difficult life situations
    druth Vlodovic: that's why I came, then I found out that they don't teach, not really :)
    Lia Rikugun: haha
    druth Vlodovic: no, it's not easy
    Lia Rikugun: yes but practicing together
    Sylectra Darwin: it's worth so much more if we can come to conclusions ourselves...
    Sylectra Darwin: yes
    Sylectra Darwin: and sharing ideas
    druth Vlodovic: never feel bad about failing
    Lia Rikugun: right now i am trying to be open
    Lia Rikugun: towards someone who wants to harm my career
    Paradise Tennant: smiles .. there is something about a group presence that amplifies :) helps create energy toward what ever purpose is on the table
    Lia Rikugun: and i dont really know how
    druth Vlodovic: nasty
    Paradise Tennant: oh no lia
    druth Vlodovic: not sure I can help but I can emphathise
    Lia Rikugun: i dont want to be treated badly so I need to stand up but in a way that does not close everything up
    Lia Rikugun: this seems difficult
    Paradise Tennant: yes it is difficult to face a threat in a relaxed and open manner ..
    Lia Rikugun: i think i can be relaxed
    Lia Rikugun: but i am wondering how i can be open
    Paradise Tennant: everything is better relaxed
    druth Vlodovic: who do you need to be open to?
    Lia Rikugun: the person who wants to harm my career
    druth Vlodovic: why?
    Sylectra Darwin: Lia, a vice president once told me it's okay to show some emotion if you are trying to clear the air with a colleague or even a boss.
    Lia Rikugun: to have an open atmosphere
    Sylectra Darwin: Sometimes there is a lot of emotion going on, and expressing your truth is the way towards clarity and understanding
    Lia Rikugun: yes it is difficult to just watch the emotion and not get caught up by it too much
    druth Vlodovic: I guess my usual tactic is to depersonalize people, figure out what they are and why they are doing what they are doing
    druth Vlodovic: lol, but then I develop too much empathy to slap them down effectively
    Lia Rikugun: this is what I cannot figure out :)
    Lia Rikugun: HAHA thats the problem
    Paradise Tennant: hmmm what I try to do is take the person out of it and reduce it to actions decisions communication ..
    Lia Rikugun: so do we divide up the people into people we can deal with and people we cant?
    Sylectra Darwin: When smeone is acting in a way that seems or feels unfair to you, maybe you could paraphrase what they say back to them to better understand what they are saying and open the way to mutual communication.
    Lia Rikugun: yes this is what I need to try
    Lia Rikugun: building an atmosphee of open communictaion
    Lia Rikugun: but it seems impossoble
    Lia Rikugun: oh sorry
    druth Vlodovic: the funny thing when you get in the habit of "reflecting" like that you end up having long conversations and finding out later they thought you were agreeing with them :)
    Sylectra Darwin: I like to bring up our mutual goals when someone appears to be attacking me on a personal level
    Lia Rikugun: i didnt want to talk only about that problem
    druth Vlodovic: we were so busy with other stuff too :)
    Sylectra Darwin: Hi Geo :)
    Hokon Cazalet: hi all =)
    Paradise Tennant: hiya geo :)
    druth Vlodovic: hi geo
    Paradise Tennant: hiya hokon :) gtsy
    Hokon Cazalet: Weeee! ^.^
    Lia Rikugun: hello geo
    Lia Rikugun: hi hokon
    druth Vlodovic: if it get's too involved we might want to avoid recording it though
    Sylectra Darwin: Hokon, heya :)
    Hokon Cazalet: =)
    Lia Rikugun: i think this was ok and not too much detail :)
    druth Vlodovic: I find people complex, i usually divide them up into those bits I can deal with and those bits I avoid
    Lia Rikugun: yes this is what I am wondering
    Lia Rikugun: if the goal is to be open towrads anybody
    Geo Netizen: But those bits avoided can be the most interesting :)
    druth Vlodovic: I got nailed by a new supervisor at work who pulled the old "you can't talk to me like that, we're going to the principle" crap
    druth Vlodovic: I still say "hi" to him and such
    Sylectra Darwin: True, Geo. But sometimes well, someone can reallly push your buttons, you know?
    druth Vlodovic: but now I know how far to trust him, something I'm not generally good at :(
    Geo Netizen: Hai, very true ...
    Lia Rikugun: yes thats good to know
    Sylectra Darwin: Druth, that is so obnoxious!
    druth Vlodovic: if it was just obnoxious it wouldn't burn me so bad, it has material consequences as well
    Sylectra Darwin: Some people are caught up in their little pecking order dramas and can't see the big picture of what we are all trying to help each other do here.
    druth Vlodovic: lol, I guess I'm not much help
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Geo Netizen: But there are many who are very fragile
    Lia Rikugun: you are, maybe now is the time for me to be clear about what I think would be right and fair
    Lia Rikugun: instead of thinking how I can generate a good atmosphere
    Lia Rikugun: i guess there is no gerneal solution
    Geo Netizen nods
    Sylectra Darwin: yes lia
    Sylectra Darwin: right speech
    Geo Netizen: We cannot control others, only ourselves.
    Paradise Tennant: right action :)
    druth Vlodovic: be aware of illusions as well
    Paradise Tennant: so right action right speech .. right thought .. no worries
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Geo Netizen smiles
    Lia Rikugun: no problem
    druth Vlodovic: I had a kid at my daycare smack another kid and tell me his dad told him to defend himself if pushed
    druth Vlodovic: I told him he'd better be damned sure it was self-defence and not just starting a fight over a misunderstanding
    Sylectra Darwin: wow, that's young!
    druth Vlodovic: well, he was 5 or so
    Sylectra Darwin: hehe
    Lia Rikugun: what did th other kid say?
    druth Vlodovic: "ouch"
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    druth Vlodovic: I had them trained to give me the facts and go away and let me deal with things
    Lia Rikugun: wow thats good, and they can just give the facts?
    Sylectra Darwin: hmm
    druth Vlodovic: with enough coaching
    Sylectra Darwin: I can't say I know much about 5 year olds.
    Lia Rikugun: great
    druth Vlodovic: they are easier to deal with and much more intelligent than managers
    Geo Netizen chuckles
    Lia Rikugun: haha very nice
    Lia Rikugun: i think i will go back to bed, thank you for the discussion
    druth Vlodovic: good luck lia
    Lia Rikugun: thanks :)
    Hokon Cazalet: bye lia =)
    druth Vlodovic: and don't let them get you upset or fearful
    Lia Rikugun: i couldnt sleep, so i am already upset
    Hokon Cazalet: =(
    Lia Rikugun: but that will go away I m not dependent on them anymore
    Sylectra Darwin: aww
    Sylectra Darwin: sorry
    druth Vlodovic: do my little meditation mantra for a bit, you'd be suprised by how much it helps
    Lia Rikugun: thank you guys
    Lia Rikugun: let me check quickly again what you wrote before
    Sylectra Darwin: we've all been there
    Sylectra Darwin: smiles
    Hokon Cazalet: =)
    Lia Rikugun: [19:32] druth Vlodovic: 1. Breathing in, I calm my body. Breathing out, I smile. 2. Breathing in, I dwell in the present moment. Breathing out, I know it is a wonderful moment.
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    Lia Rikugun: will do
    Lia Rikugun: thanks
    druth Vlodovic: it's the only one I know, so far :)
    Lia Rikugun: if it is effective thats sufficient
    Paradise Tennant: smiling is a wonderful practise too .. just focusing on smiling
    Sylectra Darwin: all, I must go to bed
    Lia Rikugun: good night bye
    Hokon Cazalet: bye sylectra =)
    Geo Netizen nods
    druth Vlodovic: "it makes them wonder what you're up to"
    Hokon Cazalet: bye lia =)
    Sylectra Darwin: good to see you all!
    Paradise Tennant: good nite sylectra I hope you feel better soon :) sweet dreams
    Sylectra Darwin: night
    Sylectra Darwin: thanks
    druth Vlodovic: bye lia, and syl
    Geo Netizen: But so young to begin to learn to defend personal space and yet end up only creating walls instead.
    druth Vlodovic: a defensive attitude is inherently damaging
    Hokon Cazalet: yeah
    Geo Netizen nods
    druth Vlodovic: but a co-operative one often leaves you open to attack
    Hokon Cazalet: ive fopund that with myself to be the case
    Hokon Cazalet: i think its better to be open, and be resilient, be able to aborb attacks, than make a hard shell
    Hokon Cazalet: absorb*
    Geo Netizen: It is in the risk that we are open to possibilities
    druth Vlodovic: we learn to heal and to accept the world as the world
    Hokon Cazalet: yup
    druth Vlodovic: I'd guess this is another angle on "attachment"
    Hokon Cazalet: hehe yup
    Geo Netizen: Attachment is the window to many things
    druth Vlodovic: attachment leads to fearing loss
    druth Vlodovic: openess I'd think of more as a window, but that requires
    Hokon Cazalet: brb drinky
    druth Vlodovic: a different relationship with fear ;-/
    Geo Netizen nods smiling
    Paradise Tennant: attachment is a detour sign ..everyone perhaps every sentient and about to sentient being is on a path to becoming aware .. attachment makes you take the long way around :)
    Geo Netizen: To let the other be free of my desires is give a gift of true freedom to them and to myself.
    Hokon Cazalet: back
    druth Vlodovic: attachment to others and things
    druth Vlodovic: and to the life I currently live
    druth Vlodovic: it's what gives us meaning and purpose
    druth Vlodovic: "a reason" :-/
    Geo Netizen: Being in relation to and being attached to are two very different things IMHO
    Hokon Cazalet: i feel as you do druth, if im reading you right
    druth Vlodovic: "ambiguous" :)
    Paradise Tennant: ok what is the life you current live .. what forms it .. is it the things ..is it you .. when start poking .. it all kind of falls away
    Paradise Tennant: * you
    Geo Netizen: All that remains is how I have related to the other; all else falls away.
    druth Vlodovic: if you are very attached to the things and situations around you then they form part of your being
    Paradise Tennant: do they ?
    druth Vlodovic: loosening those attachments means chipping away at your "self"
    Paradise Tennant: you are not your job .. your life situation ..
    Paradise Tennant: your things
    Geo Netizen: From The Dhammapada: Those whose minds are thoroughly practices in the factors of enlightenment, who find delight in freedom from attachment in the renunciation of clinging, free from the inflow of thoughts, they are like shining lights, having reached final liberation in the world. (89)
    Hokon Cazalet: being-in-the-world - heidegger's term for our Being, that we are not a substance distinct from the world, but are "absorbed" into-the-world, trying to fission off the self from his situation for heidegger, is actually a breaking down of Being
    Paradise Tennant: those are narrow cramped shadows of what really exists which is perfection .. if you are anything it is boundless perfection :)
    Paradise Tennant: smiles at druth if anyone asks me that is what I am going to tell them ..druth is boundless perfection :))
    Geo Netizen: I’m not sure I can see myself as boundless perfection :D)
    druth Vlodovic: aww, you're sweet :)
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    druth Vlodovic: "freedom is another word for nothing left to lose..."
    druth Vlodovic: except when you do still have things to lose
    Geo Netizen chuckles quietly
    druth Vlodovic: things to loose
    Paradise Tennant: Buddha: "This unity alone in the world is boundless in its reality, and being boundless is yet one. Though in small things, yet it is in great. Though in great things, yet it is in small. Pervading all things, present in every minutest hair, and yet including the infinite worlds in its embrace; enthroned in the minutest particle of dust, and yet turning the Great Wheel of the Law; opposed to all sensible phenomena; it is one with Divine Knowledge.
    Paradise Tennant: so dust mites and us .. all pretty much divine :)
    Hokon Cazalet likes the dust mites on her eyelashes, keeping them clean
    Geo Netizen: Yet the divine spark can be very much hidden in me.
    Geo Netizen: And I can fail to see it in others.
    Paradise Tennant: smiles at geo and hokon
    Hokon Cazalet: =)
    Paradise Tennant: lol my mom would say if you let your own light shine you will see it in others :)
    Hokon Cazalet: =)
    Paradise Tennant: on that flickering note I am going to say thank you and good nite :) namaste my friends :)
    Geo Netizen: Goodnight
    druth Vlodovic: goodnight paradise
    Hokon Cazalet: bye paradise =)
    Geo Netizen bows deeply
    Paradise Tennant: sweet boundless perfect dreams :)))
    druth Vlodovic: hi luci
    Hokon Cazalet: hi luci =)
    Lucinda Lavender: hi ;0
    Lucinda Lavender: How quiet it seems here...
    druth Vlodovic: you just missed all the fireworks :)
    Hokon Cazalet: hehe
    Lucinda Lavender: ah...
    Lucinda Lavender: what kind if I may ask...?
    druth Vlodovic: everyone was saying nice things about me
    druth Vlodovic: I was hoping you had come to continue the tradition :)
    Hokon Cazalet: hehe
    Lucinda Lavender: certainly!
    Lucinda Lavender: was Paradise just here?
    druth Vlodovic: you passed her on her way out
    Lucinda Lavender: ah...was not sure since I thought perhaps it was a message from yesterday or something
    druth Vlodovic: I should go, things to do tomorrow
    Hokon Cazalet: aw ok, byebyes druth =)
    druth Vlodovic: 'night guys
    Lucinda Lavender: Have a good eve druth:)
    Lucinda Lavender: I cannot really think of much to say...
    Hokon Cazalet: me either =)
    Lucinda Lavender: today I took my old college books to a second hand store to give away:)
    Hokon Cazalet: =)
    Lucinda Lavender: I decided to give away the books I do not open...
    Hokon Cazalet: thats a good thing to do
    Lucinda Lavender: Have not opened them in a lomng time
    Lucinda Lavender: long
    Hokon Cazalet: what ikind of books, math books?
    Lucinda Lavender: One was called Theories of Knowledge
    Hokon Cazalet: oh cool
    Lucinda Lavender: you might have liked it I was thinking
    Hokon Cazalet: hehe
    Hokon Cazalet: quite possible, with a name like that =)
    Lucinda Lavender: do you study philosophy?
    Hokon Cazalet: yup
    Lucinda Lavender: ah...
    Lucinda Lavender: It came from a program I took in college called On Knowing
    Hokon Cazalet: cool, i hope to head back to college this fall, i actually miss school hehe
    Lucinda Lavender: and it had the theories of Kant and Descarte...etc
    Hokon Cazalet: !
    Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
    Hokon Cazalet: i would like that book hehe
    Lucinda Lavender: ah...I hope that you get to too
    Lucinda Lavender: sheesh...I should have sent it to you...
    Hokon Cazalet: its ok =)
    Lucinda Lavender: do you have losts of books?
    Hokon Cazalet: quite a few
    Hokon Cazalet: yes
    Hokon Cazalet: mostly primary sources though, not too many secondary source books like that one
    Lucinda Lavender: ah
    Hokon Cazalet: i use encyclopedias online for most of the secondary source research i need to do
    Lucinda Lavender: I guess it is the way these days
    Hokon Cazalet: yup,
    Lucinda Lavender: do you like to research?
    Hokon Cazalet: philosophy yes, anything else, i hate it =P
    Lucinda Lavender: I was interested in philosophical topics in college but I do not have as much attention for reading as I once did
    Hokon Cazalet: thats ok, it does take quite a bit of reading, and careful reading too
    Lucinda Lavender: going back over things until you understand
    Hokon Cazalet: hehe yup
    Hokon Cazalet: or until you give up frustrated =P
    Lucinda Lavender: :)
    Hokon Cazalet: hegel is really hard to read . . .
    Hokon Cazalet: i gave up on him several times
    Lucinda Lavender: ah...is it very logic oriented?
    Lucinda Lavender: I forget
    Hokon Cazalet: no, just obscure style of writing, i dunno what hegel is talking about sometimes
    Lucinda Lavender: I just learned about the Kahn Academy for learning some things have you heard of that?
    Lucinda Lavender: online and on youtube
    Hokon Cazalet: no i hadnt, is it in rl or sl?
    Hokon Cazalet: oh cool
    Lucinda Lavender: this fellow was teaching his nieces and nephews in another town so he started making youtube installments for them. There is an interesting Ted Talk where he describes the process he came up with.
    Hokon Cazalet: cool =)
    Lucinda Lavender: I think if I had had this in college I might have handled difficult theories a little better
    Lucinda Lavender: I will look for the lionk
    Hokon Cazalet: cool
    Lucinda Lavender: http://www.ted.com/talks/salman_khan...education.html
    Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
    Hokon Cazalet: ty
    Lucinda Lavender: you are welcome
    Lucinda Lavender: It goes for 20 minutes...it is worth it tho.
    Hokon Cazalet: ok cool, ty =()
    Hokon Cazalet: =)*
    Hokon Cazalet: im gonna go for a bit, chat with another friend, ill see you later, ty for the link =)
    Hokon Cazalet waves =)
    Lucinda Lavender: bye then:)
    Hokon Cazalet: Weeee! ^.^
    Lucinda Lavender: have a nice night:)
    Hokon Cazalet: you too =)

    Tag page (Edit tags)
    • No tags
    You must login to post a comment.
    Powered by MindTouch Core