Page last modified 18:32, 26 Feb 2012 by eliza

Eliza posted this session from the auto-listener database...

[01:02] Wol Euler: good morning, yaku

[01:02] Yakuzza Lethecus: guten morngen

[01:03] Yakuzza Lethecus: morgen :)

[01:03] Wol Euler: alles in ordnung heute?

[01:04] Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, got my coffee and checked on several things, also easter vacation

[01:04] Yakuzza Lethecus: a flight i am eagling upon got cheaper and i might book today even without having a go an a needed vacation day :P

[01:05] Wol Euler: ah :)

[01:06] Wol Euler: that is an advantage, sure

[01:06] Yakuzza Lethecus: what´s an advantage ?

[01:07] Wol Euler: not needing to use a holiday for travelling

[01:07] Wol Euler: use in the sense of "waste" :)

[01:08] Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, easter is good because of the friday and monday and it´s the same in sweden, they don´t have as many vacation days as we germans recieve

[01:08] Wol Euler nods.

[01:08] Wol Euler: I doubt if many countries do :)

[01:08] Wol Euler: it seems to me that every month has at least one holiday in it, some two or three

[01:09] Yakuzza Lethecus notices that he´s using vacation and holiday interchangably sometimes, but yeah that´s also true :)

[01:10] Wol Euler: hmmmmmm, I think they are interchangeable. Vacation is english and holiday american.

[01:10] Wol Euler: not all holidays are "holy days" :)

[01:10] Wol Euler: that origin is long lost

[01:11] Yakuzza Lethecus: there was a time when i went at least for easter and christmas to church, but then i even lost that habit, just free days by now

[01:12] Wol Euler: probably the majority do not, these days

[01:12] Wol Euler: although I was reading a piece in the local paper about the struggles of the local church with declining attendance

[01:12] Wol Euler: they pointed out that still more people go to church than to live soccer

[01:12] Yakuzza Lethecus: i am still paying my tax tho

[01:13] Wol Euler: so clearly the problem is not the "audience" as such, clearly that still exists

[01:13] Wol Euler: because nobody thinks live soccer is going to go broke

[01:13] Yakuzza Lethecus: :)

[01:16] Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s a devils circle, they put "gemeindein" together and the pastor´s are becomming anonym

[01:16] Wol Euler nods.

[01:17] Yakuzza Lethecus: so less identification, more ppl leave, more putting together, and in the end the organization itself try´s to keep itself alive

[01:17] Wol Euler: yep

[01:18] Wol Euler: it's hard to know what they could do to break out of that cycle

[01:18] Wol Euler: they are trying to solve it as a corporation would, closing branch offices and consolidating their products and services

[01:18] Wol Euler: but that doesn#t apply well to people

[01:19] Wol Euler: the analogy to soccer is a false one, I think, if it relied on donatoins and a small tax support it would be in trouble too

[01:19] Wol Euler: but they charge admission.

[01:20] Yakuzza Lethecus: they don´t recieve taxes everywhere, i think even in france they rely more on donations but never really got into that

[01:20] Wol Euler nods.

[01:21] Wol Euler: I wonder when it started to go bad? Presumably some historian could tell us

[01:22] Wol Euler: because htey were getting enough income even a hundred years ago to be putting up large churches everywhere

[01:22] Wol Euler: perhaps it coincides with the modern social state

[01:22] Wol Euler: it now provides services that the church used to do

[01:23] Wol Euler: and since we pay the state through taxes, people sensibly ask why they should pay the church now for something it no longer does

[01:23] Yakuzza Lethecus: just googled, in france it was around the revolution that they lost theire chruch tenth (kirchenzehnt?)

[01:23] Wol Euler: "tithe" is the usual word in english.

[01:24] Wol Euler: still in use, apparently mormons are expected to tithe. There is said to be a huge social pressure to do so, though of course it is "optional and individual"

[01:28] Wol Euler: I don't pay Kirchensteuer, actually. Purely by chance.

[01:29] Wol Euler: when I moved here, the Anmeldeamt asked me, really casually, what church I belonged to. I had no idea what the question meant, so I answered really casually "none"

[01:29] Yakuzza Lethecus: :)

[01:29] Wol Euler:if she has asked instead "which church do you wish your taxes to support", I might have given a very different answer

[01:32] Yakuzza Lethecus: i wonder who recieves the money if you belong to a different church or won´t ppl be taxed at all if ur muslim or any other confession then lutheran or catholic

[01:33] Wol Euler: good question!

[01:33] Yakuzza Lethecus: if it count´s at all

[01:33] Wol Euler: I don't know but I would guess that all christian religions are treated in the same way, receiving kirchensteuer

[01:33] Wol Euler: and I would hope that synagogues and mosques do too

[01:33] Wol Euler: but I don't know.

[01:34] Wol Euler: that's really a good question :)

[01:34] Yakuzza Lethecus: http://de.answers.yahoo.com/question...3194012AAlganT

[01:35] Yakuzza Lethecus: sry for the log, it´s in german

[01:35] Wol Euler: nice find, yaku :)

[01:36] Wol Euler: summary: synagogues yes, mosques no. These are financed by donations, but largely by support from foreign countries

[01:36] Wol Euler: it doesn't say that the mosques could not be supported through Kirchensteuer, so presumably they choose not to

[01:36] Wol Euler: so as to escape state supervision, perhaps

[01:38] Wol Euler: perhaps "escape" is too strong a word

[01:39] Yakuzza Lethecus: but might partially be true

[01:39] Yakuzza Lethecus: i will log out, thx for the time on a sunday morning

[01:40] Yakuzza Lethecus: enjoy the day

[01:40] Wol Euler: bye yaku!

- Tag page (Edit tags)
- What links here

Images 0 | ||
---|---|---|

No images to display in the gallery. |

You must login to post a comment.

Powered by MindTouch Core