2016.11.10 13:00 - Heart Sutra: Whirlwind in a Stream

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    The Guardians for this meeting were Mick and Eliza and Zen...


    Aphrodite Macbain: Hiya
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Aph :)
    Eliza Madrigal: you are wearing purple, pretty...
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
    Aphrodite Macbain: thanks
    Aphrodite Macbain: I have been tempted to wear black for the next month
    Eliza Madrigal: many are
    Aphrodite Macbain: but have decided against it
    Eliza Madrigal: rough few days huh....
    Eliza Madrigal: aw, Hi Alice
    Aphrodite Macbain: Trying to be optiistic
    Eliza Madrigal: I'm trying to find ways to channel it...
    Aphrodite Macbain: We cant just lie down and let the Trump train roll over us
    Eliza Madrigal: but the emotions keep changing so fast
    Aphrodite Macbain: like anger, frustration, surprise fear?
    Eliza Madrigal: deep sadness... then beginning to find common ground and start to parse... then a new implication comes up...
    Eliza Madrigal: then despair
    Eliza Madrigal: then *wow* at the love people start to show...
    Eliza Madrigal: and the work they are starting to do or continuing....
    Eliza Madrigal: then, bam!
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Bleu
    Aphrodite Macbain: I mean Cat!
    Aphrodite Macbain: sorry
    Catrinamonblue Resident: :) Hi Aph and Eliza :)
    Eliza Madrigal: you read something else.... or, sigh... a friend texts and you find yourself unable to text back...
    Eliza Madrigal: things like that :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Cat!
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bruce
    Bruce Mowbray: Howdy!



    Eliza Madrigal: some beautiful things though... like a friend that just said that if they start making muslims register, we'll all go and register as muslims :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hi folks
    Aphrodite Macbain: lol great idea
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Mick :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Bruce, Mick
    Eliza Madrigal: isn't it... and others who are making art groups that are focused on these issues...
    Eliza Madrigal: so, dark times yet also resistance and learning who we are
    Eliza Madrigal: how doing Bruce?
    Aphrodite Macbain: we have reached bottom so here's a chance to make it new and better
    Bruce Mowbray: Still a bit dark. But bought a new laptop today and that is soothing me some.
    Eliza Madrigal: :) laptop is a vehicle to do good work!
    Mickorod Renard: its the end of the world this december anyway..isnt that weird planet coming?
    Bruce Mowbray: Yeppers.
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Mick!
    Bruce Mowbray: This is my very first PaB outing on the new machine.
    Eliza Madrigal smiles
    Mickorod Renard: cool Bruce
    Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Zen should be here soon, to begin session....
    Eliza Madrigal: if not, we'll hold hands and take turns to cry
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mickorod Renard: before you should ask, eliza, I haven't brought anything today
    Aphrodite Macbain: sniff

    Bruce Mowbray: Heya, Zen.
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen! :)
    Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Zen :)
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Mickorod Renard: Hi zen
    Aphrodite Macbain waves at Zen
    Eliza Madrigal: tbh I feel more human already, sitting here with you all
    Zen Arado: I was at french lesson
    Aphrodite Macbain: Alice,,, meet Blub
    Mickorod Renard: French lessons used to be fun once
    Mickorod Renard: Hi tura
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bleu :) Hi Tura :)
    Bleu Oleander: hi y'all
    Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Tura.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Bleu, Tura
    Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Bleu.
    Zen Arado: Hi Tura
    Zen Arado: fun but hard work
    Tura Brezoianu: hi all
    Aphrodite Macbain: Italian's fun
    Eliza Madrigal: I wish I'd joined those classes years ago...imagine how much French I'd know by now :)
    Zen Arado: takes years
    Mickorod Renard: yes, I have an app for italian on my phone
    Zen Arado: for me anyway :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: trouble is, you have to keep using it
    Eliza Madrigal: does it work well Mick?
    Aphrodite Macbain: to remember properly
    Eliza Madrigal nods... one of my daughters is rather fluent
    Eliza Madrigal: so I could talk with her
    Mickorod Renard: yes Eliza..but i dont
    Eliza Madrigal: :)

    Eliza Madrigal: Okay... are we ready to be open-hearted? some of us are probably quite soft with tears so should be easy
    Mickorod Renard: Duolingo Eliza
    Aphrodite Macbain: Canada is a bi-lingual country but it would be hard to realize it out here on the West Coast
    Eliza Madrigal nods...
    Eliza Madrigal: Zen, like to start session?
    Zen Arado: ok I'll throw some stuff up
    Eliza Madrigal: :)

    Zen Arado: I just started with the first line
    Zen Arado: ” Avalokiteshvara is practising deep prajnaparamita…” what exactly is he doing? Buddhism seems to stress practice rather than learning, education or knowledge. He isn’t just meditating, because that is one of the other 5 perfections: of giving, morality, forbearance, vigour, meditation.

    Zen Arado: This practice seems difficult to comprehend. In cultivating a path it appears that at the end it is realized that the person and the path they cultivate are just a dream or illusion. But perhaps we still have to walk the path to realize this?

    Zen Arado: ‘Pra’ means before and ‘jna’ means ‘to know,’ so it seems to be referring to something that comes before knowledge, or what we could call ’beginners mind.’

    Zen Arado: But if it comes before thought, how can we attain it? Or do we attain it by resting in non-attainment? Perhaps the insight comes as we discard or see through the obscuring veil we cling to, of static knowledge and concepts? Maybe wisdom comes more easily as we age and see by practical experience how quickly ideas and knowledge become outdated, and as accumulated experiences of past outcomes grows

    Zen Arado: But that can also be a kind of worldly wisdom gathered from observing the traits of other people interacting in this life? Do we need a totally new way to see, a new type of wisdom? We seem to have a model of ourselves as a self, a self who acts as an agent, and who is somehow separate from the rest of existence and acting to control it.

    Zen Arado: The truth seems to be that that we are an integral part of existence. More like a whirlpool in the stream rather than a cork bobbing on the surface of the stream. You could call the whirlpool a process. But a whirlpool depends on so many other factors: like the volume and velocity of the water and the nature of the sides and bottom and impediments to the flow of the stream that cause the whirlpool in the first place. You could expand the process out to include amount of rainfall and thus, weather, climate changes and the influence of the whole universe.

    Zen Arado: But: ‘A man can do what he wants, but not want what he wants.’ Arthur Schopenhauer

    Zen Arado: Therefore it seems that what we want is also something we can have no choice about? So is our behaviour determined by everything else in existence, our education, culture, experiences? But that would be to say that we are an agent outside of existence being acted on, our lives determined by outside forces.

    Zen Arado: We are acting and interacting with all of the rest of existence throughout our lives. Perhaps we gain wisdom simply because of the way it is forced upon us by seeing the outcomes of so many different experiences throughout our lives

    Zen Arado: fini

    Eliza Madrigal: Thanks, Zen
    Eliza Madrigal finishes reading....
    Zen Arado: make any sense?
    Mickorod Renard: great Zen ty
    Eliza Madrigal: brings up a quote I read this week.... that there is no such thing as an enlightened person, only enlightened action  (correction: "activity" was the correct word)
    Eliza Madrigal: (Suzuki Roshi)

    Zen Arado: yes, it's all a verb?
    Zen Arado: processes
    Aphrodite Macbain: where is your quote from Zen?
    Bleu Oleander: we are nodes, where something is happening, something that we call "self" ? is that the whirlpool idea?
    Zen Arado: what quote?
    Aphrodite Macbain: What you said.
    Zen Arado: Schopenhauer?
    Eliza Madrigal: I don't know... and want to bracket out any notion of definition for myself for now
    Aphrodite Macbain: Or is that you speaking :-)?
    Zen Arado: I wrote it myself apart from Schopenhauer
    Aphrodite Macbain: ah- wonderful. thanks


    Zen Arado: but the whirlpool isn't separate from the rest of existence
    Zen Arado: that's what I was stressing
    Zen Arado: though we label it separately
    Zen Arado: it can snuff out immediately if conditions change
    Eliza Madrigal: I like the idea of self as a 'where'
    Mickorod Renard: are we looking for the eye in the storm?
    Eliza Madrigal: like self as snapshot of conditions
    Zen Arado: same idea I guess
    Eliza Madrigal: Shall we share in a circle today?
    Zen Arado: mabe I should repost section by section?
    Mickorod Renard: could do

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: hello peeps ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Curious, long time no see
    Bleu Oleander: hey Curious
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: hey ;)
    Zen Arado: Hi Curious
    Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Curious :) gtsy
    Bruce Mowbray: Welcome, Curious.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i didnt see you guys for a year
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hiya Curious! Great to see you
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: hello everybody
    Bleu Oleander: busy doing art?
    Eliza Madrigal: Too long Curious, we'll give you an updated note :)
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i am tryin..
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: ok
    Eliza Madrigal: we've been talking about Heart Sutra lately
    Eliza Madrigal: or in general, how to stay openhearted
    Eliza Madrigal: If everyone is okay with circle sharing... want to start, Mick?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Zen has just given us some valuable observations Foo
    Eliza Madrigal: I can make a notecard of the earlier session....
    Mickorod Renard: erk what erm me?
    Bleu Oleander: all selves direct attention towards Mick :)
    Eliza Madrigal: haha
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: will try to catch you
    Mickorod Renard: ok
    Aphrodite Macbain: erm Mick
    Bruce Mowbray directs attention toward Mick.

    Mickorod Renard: I am a little behind..I missed last week and I still havnt gotten around to reading up
    Mickorod Renard: but
    Zen Arado: everybody get the note?
    Eliza Madrigal: thanks Zen yes
    Mickorod Renard: I am presently trying to empty my mind but with limited success so far
    Bleu Oleander: yes ty!
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes :-)
    Mickorod Renard: I think the key for me is to realize that all that crap that goes on is not really anything to do with me
    Mickorod Renard: and to look at it sympathetically..and without judgement..maybe with passion yet not taking on the pain
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: hm...you mean election? seems like it has everything to do with us ;)
    Mickorod Renard: and then, after getting a grip of that i will be able to be open hearted and see all as a good ol comedy show
    Mickorod Renard: done

    Aphrodite Macbain: tx Mick
    Eliza Madrigal: thanks Mick :)
    Zen Arado: ty Mick
    Eliza Madrigal: Tura?
    Tura Brezoianu: I don't really have anything
    Eliza Madrigal: (love your bright colors btw) :)
    Tura Brezoianu: (tx!)
    Tura Brezoianu: I read through a couple of commentaries about the Heart Sutura
    Tura Brezoianu: *Sutra
    Tura Brezoianu: (hm, Heart Suture)
    Eliza Madrigal: :))
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
    Bleu Oleander: :)
    Tura Brezoianu: but no more thoughts to talk about today

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: excuse me,iam trying to get into this,are this those meditations?
    Eliza Madrigal: :) thanks
    Aphrodite Macbain: These are Zen's observations
    Zen Arado: just some thots on beginning of Heart Sutra


    Eliza Madrigal: It is a practice/mantra text .. and each week we've been sharing angles that come to mind
    Zen Arado: to try to inspir some discussion
    Bruce Mowbray: The Heart Sutra is posted on the white poster, Curious.
    Eliza Madrigal: we began with the question of openheartedness and flourishing
    Eliza Madrigal: and are still exploring
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: thanks Bruce,it is different then before,no bell anymore ;)
    Bruce Mowbray: kk.
    Aphrodite Macbain: It will toll
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh, yes there is a bell
    Aphrodite Macbain: and toll for thee
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-)

    Bruce Mowbray: Well, I continue to see the Heart Sutra as being about meditation -- describing a particular form of mantra meditation.
    Bruce Mowbray: So what Zen wrote confuses me a bit: He isn’t just meditating, because that is one of the other 5 perfections: of giving, morality, forbearance, vigour, meditation.
    Bruce Mowbray: How about compassion, equanimity, loving kindness, and joy?
    Bruce Mowbray: are they also empty?
    Bruce Mowbray: ANyway, I
    Mickorod Renard: I think the practice of 'no this' and 'no that' is just up my street....some misguided folk had said in the past i am in denial about something...i never have been, butwhat they meant was i wasnt buying into their rubbish. That is a super practice that i want to try and master. yes, equanamity is a super ability.
    Bruce Mowbray: am still working on whether emptiness is all there is, or if there is also. . . . Hmmm ponder "superability"
    Bruce Mowbray: That's all from me for right now.
    Bruce Mowbray: ty.

    Zen Arado: I don't know Bruce but it says that there are 6 paramitas and wisdom is just one of them in the commentaries
    Zen Arado: that's why I said that
    Bruce Mowbray: Yes, that's what has me a bit confused, Zen.
    Mickorod Renard: sound good Bruce,,the heart Sutra is the heart sutra cos its based on compassion
    Eliza Madrigal: Thank you Bruce, nice compliment to Zen's
    Bruce Mowbray: yw.
    Eliza Madrigal: Aph?
    Aphrodite Macbain: Thanks
    Zen Arado: but it's title is 'the perfection of wisdom

    Aphrodite Macbain: I'm only latching on to things that I feel I can comment on.
    Aphrodite Macbain: For example "But that can also be a kind of worldly wisdom gathered from observing the traits of other people interacting in this life? Do we need a totally new way to see, a new type of wisdom?"
    Aphrodite Macbain: and
    Aphrodite Macbain: "We seem to have a model of ourselves as a self, a self who acts as an agent, and who is somehow separate from the rest of existence and acting to control it. "
    Zen Arado: they are just my thoughts..feel free to disagree please
    Aphrodite Macbain: Maybe we need a new way of talking about this, rather than thinking about it. New language?
    Aphrodite Macbain: New words that are more familiar to us.
    Aphrodite Macbain: That dont need defining.
    Aphrodite Macbain: But I could be very simplistic in my thinking.
    Aphrodite Macbain: I feel we can be an agent for change as well as a participator in the grand scheme of things.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Not on or the other, but both,
    Aphrodite Macbain: Fini
    Zen Arado: nods
    Aphrodite Macbain: Not ONR or the other
    Aphrodite Macbain: ONE
    Eliza Madrigal smiles

    Mickorod Renard: As long as we stay within the ballpark of dualistic thinking, there is always existence, nonexistence, permanence, extinction, good, and bad. Within that frame of reference, we will never get beyond it...a quote I found.
    Aphrodite Macbain: (I've lost my E)
    Aphrodite Macbain: Yes Mick

    Tura Brezoianu: yes, every time we so much as stand up, we are controlling our upright posture -- if we didn't we would fall over immediately.
    Zen Arado: Hi Kori
    Eliza Madrigal: thanks Aph.... somehow when one is able to question dualism, what comes after that openness seems to be a capacity for multiplicity
    Korel Laloix: Osiyo
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: hello Korel
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Kori :)
    Aphrodite Macbain smiles at Tura
    Tura Brezoianu: Everything we do, we do to make the world more like how we want it to be, whether in small things like not falling over, or big things
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Kori
    Korel Laloix: Heya
    Eliza Madrigal: :) nice point, comforting
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hey Kori

    Eliza Madrigal: So I have a quote that I think appropriate for our times...
    Mickorod Renard: listens
    Eliza Madrigal: and hm, for what many of us are feeling...
    Eliza Madrigal:
    Awakened heart comes from being willing to face your state of mind. The sitting practice of meditation is a means to awaken this within you. When you awaken your heart, to your surprise, you find that it is empty. If you search for awakened heart, if you put your hand through your rib cage and feel for your heart, there is nothing there—except for tenderness. You feel sore and soft, and if you open your eyes to the world, you feel tremendous sadness. It is not the sadness of feeling sorry for yourself or feeling deprived. It is a natural situation of fullness. The genuine heart of sadness comes from this feeling that your nonexistent heart is full. Your experience is so raw, tender, and personal that even if a tiny mosquito lands on you, you feel its touch.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Beautiful Eliza
    Zen Arado: nice Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: This is from Trungpa Rinpoche's Shambala book... and some may recognize this phrase "genuine mind of sadness"
    Eliza Madrigal: which has come to mean a lot to me... as a way of being with what is going on and not closing up
    Mickorod Renard: lovely
    Aphrodite Macbain: no...shakes her head

    Zen Arado: I am now wondering why it is called the Heart Sutra since it is about the perfection of wisdom?
    Zen Arado: hmm
    Eliza Madrigal: done :)
    Mickorod Renard: i have a little quote..rre heart sutra
    Tura Brezoianu: I thought that heart meant there the central doctrine
    Mickorod Renard: the Heart Sutra teaches emptiness through the epitome of compassion. It is often said that, in a sense, emptiness is the heart of the Mahayana, but the heart of emptiness is compassion.


    Aphrodite Macbain: It goes to the heart of things
    Eliza Madrigal: Can you elaborate Tura?
    Eliza Madrigal: (sometimes I don't understand questions until I'm posting the session later!)
    Eliza Madrigal works on a delay   (and indeed I had seen Tura's answer but not Zen's question) 
    Bruce Mowbray agrees with Tura that it's the central teaching, therefore "Heart"
    Aphrodite Macbain: yes
    Tura Brezoianu: yes, the central teaching, the core of it
    Bruce Mowbray nods.
    Eliza Madrigal: Cat?

    Catrinamonblue Resident: I really like the line "seems to stress practice rather than learning" :) intimating that perhaps we never do learn. I wonder what it is that we never learn :)
    Catrinamonblue Resident: I also like the thought that we need to walk the path before finding out it was all illusion. resonates very deeply for me...... and I have no words to be able to explain how or why.....
    Catrinamonblue Resident: done
    Eliza Madrigal: hmm
    Eliza Madrigal: ty

    Zen Arado: it isn't because the sutra has very long versions and this is a short version ie the heart of the teaching?
    Eliza Madrigal: practice of a lifetime for some/many, maybe several
    Zen Arado: it's just that it seems al about wisdom to me
    Eliza Madrigal: Bleu?
    Zen Arado: wisdom leads to good heart?
    Bleu Oleander: thanks :)
    Zen Arado: listens

    Bleu Oleander: I came across an interesting metaphor for practice and self through the life of an artist
    Bleu Oleander: Ferdinand Cheval was a 19th C postman in France
    Bleu Oleander: he used his route as a kind of practice/meditation
    Bleu Oleander: he started picking up a stone every day
    Bleu Oleander: building his "le Palais Ideal"
    Bleu Oleander: his ideal palace which he built during 33 years
    Bleu Oleander: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ferdinand_Cheval
    Bleu Oleander: it seemed a good metaphor for how we create the self
    Aphrodite Macbain: was his palace ever completed?
    Bleu Oleander: "Nature is willing to do the sculpture, I will do the masonry and the architecture"
    Bleu Oleander: yes there is a photo on that link
    Eliza Madrigal: fitting in the stones where the space seems to call?
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: never heard for this, thanks Bleu
    Bleu Oleander: yes
    Eliza Madrigal: nice metaphors Bleu
    Bleu Oleander: you can go there today
    Aphrodite Macbain: except we never finish
    Mickorod Renard: while working out what equanamity meant i had a series of dreams relating reasons why folk had bad attitudes,,and this opened my eyes to why thy acted so..once with this insite the heart was open rather than closed..practice can teach this but only a knowledge of everything can give that ability..other than trusting that all acts have reasons
    Eliza Madrigal: :) I keep rearranging them or starting over
    Bleu Oleander: anyway, I came across his story this week and thought to share
    Aphrodite Macbain: thanks Bleu
    Zen Arado: thanks Bleu
    Zen Arado: very interesting
    Mickorod Renard: thanks Bleu
    Eliza Madrigal: Curious, care to share thoughts that may have come up today?
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: no,i will just listen today ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: thanks :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Kori?
    Korel Laloix: Sorry, was getting some lunch.
    Eliza Madrigal: :))
    Bruce Mowbray: :)

    Korel Laloix: I think you know my attitude about equanimity.
    Eliza Madrigal: some do some don't :)
    Mickorod Renard: remind us kori
    Aphrodite Macbain: Listens equanimously
    Eliza Madrigal: some of us are on journeys with words :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: :-)

    Korel Laloix: Oh.. well.. as described in here, I find it to be the greatest excuse for moral apathy and abdication ever expressed.
    Korel Laloix: You should use what makes you mad to fight for what is right.
    Korel Laloix: Be passionate about things.
    Zen Arado: I seem to have a different conception of this sutra
    Zen Arado: in Zen they stressed the wisdom aspect
    Korel Laloix: Most do evidently.. smiles
    Bruce Mowbray: @Kori -- "Emptiness" as an excuse for not taking action? Or, for not being affected by whatever might happen?
    Mickorod Renard: he he ..I am sure equanamity is full of compassion when understood


    Zen Arado: the maha prajna paramita as we used to chant
    Korel Laloix: When you empty yourself of emotion, you deny your humanity and take the edge of off .. that edge is what can motivate you to right wrongs.
    Aphrodite Macbain: It is something we strive for-- but to feel that way one must fight for what she feels is right.
    Zen Arado: the Metta Sutra was more about compassion etc
    Eliza Madrigal: @ Zen, I think there is a lot of room in the sutra... that it unfolds more with different focuses...
    Aphrodite Macbain: sorry
    Zen Arado: sorry Koti
    Korel Laloix: No worries.. just my view.
    Korel Laloix: Sometimes, the child abuser down the road just needs to have shit beat our of her, instead of just talking about it for years.
    Zen Arado: does wisdom lead to the other virtues?
    Tura Brezoianu appreciates Kori's view

    Mickorod Renard: I suspect the emptiness is to allow clear thought..rather than not viewing the wrongness and being motivated to act
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Aphrodite Macbain: anger is one of many motivators
    Eliza Madrigal: One thing that came to mind with Mick's earlier quote re compassion, is that, in a kind of 'emptiness all the way down' model, that would seem quite full... a dynamic and perhaps even more enlightened process/activity...
    Eliza Madrigal: people don't step in when they should sometimes because they are attached to their lives in certain ways...
    Aphrodite Macbain: nods
    Mickorod Renard: nicely put Eliza..you have an art with words that I do not
    Eliza Madrigal: not at all Mick... i just type super fast
    Eliza Madrigal: (way too fast sometimes lol)

    Aphrodite Macbain: everyone here is very eloquent
    Eliza Madrigal nods
    Eliza Madrigal: and thoughtful
    Korel Laloix: lol
    Eliza Madrigal: and genuine
    Aphrodite Macbain: nods
    Eliza Madrigal: or trying to be
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Bleu Oleander: :)

    Mickorod Renard: I have spent the larger part of my life delving into some rotten scenarios, I can tell you that becoming too emotionally attached is contrary to good outcomes
    Catrinamonblue Resident: true
    Korel Laloix: Agreed, but being too far removed is worse.
    Mickorod Renard: being too removed is being blind
    Zen Arado: 'early Mahayana practitioners focused on wisdom as the key that makes the other paramitas effective'
    Zen Arado: Red PIne

    Bleu Oleander: becoming emotionally attached has led to very rich relationships for me ... "too" emotional attached is subjective I think
    Korel Laloix: If you are detached, you can't appreciate art or music or literature or a good sunrise fully.
    Aphrodite Macbain: Hard to decide where to place my emotions and engagement
    Eliza Madrigal: bye Aph, hugs
    Mickorod Renard: we often come back to the word balance
    Korel Laloix: Ciao
    Zen Arado: bye Aph
    Mickorod Renard: bye Aph
    Aphrodite Macbain: byee
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: byee
    Eliza Madrigal: that's why being strategic about it isn't too helpful perhaps...
    Bleu Oleander: must go too ... take care all
    Catrinamonblue Resident: Bye Aph
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: bye Bleu
    Bleu Oleander: bye bye
    Eliza Madrigal: open heartedness implies a kind of readiness
    Mickorod Renard: bye Bleu
    Zen Arado: bye Bleu
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bleu (( ))
    Catrinamonblue Resident: Bye Bleu
    Eliza Madrigal: thanks for being here today everyone... needed this company this week
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: Me too, Eliza.
    Catrinamonblue Resident: (((())))
    Eliza Madrigal: and always but surely this week
    Eliza Madrigal: ((((((((( playbeings ))))))

    Mickorod Renard: I had no company tuesday again
    Tura Brezoianu: thanks everyone
    Korel Laloix: ciao
    Mickorod Renard: :(
    Eliza Madrigal: no one Mick?
    Mickorod Renard: no
    Eliza Madrigal: it was election day...so...
    Mickorod Renard: just silly old me

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: so is it like before, every two hours people can be found here?
    Catrinamonblue Resident: sorry Mick, I wanted to be there but got caught up in work
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: some of them
    Eliza Madrigal: we have a schedule now Curious, and fewer sessions...
    Mickorod Renard: nooo..no sorrys needed
    Eliza Madrigal: the front page of the wiki has a calendar...
    Mickorod Renard: we all have commitments etc
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: aha,ok
    Eliza Madrigal: https://wiki.playasbeing.org/
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: thanks
    Eliza Madrigal: this is probably the most structured session
    Mickorod Renard: bye Bruce
    Zen Arado: bye everybody
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: bye bruce,and dream sessions?
    Bruce Mowbray: Day-o, me say daaay-o~
    Korel Laloix: ciao
    Catrinamonblue Resident: Bye guys :)need to go find food :)
    Eliza Madrigal: and I'm not sure it will always be, but we've been going that way since quite full generally
    Eliza Madrigal: OK guys :))

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: are there any dream sessons?
    Mickorod Renard: I still think the story this last week ..in sidartha is relevent
    Eliza Madrigal: we haven't been, Curious, but want to again
    Eliza Madrigal: do you remember Maxine, Curious?
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: yes,she was mediator
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, she published a book recently....
    Mickorod Renard: has anyone read her book yet?
    Eliza Madrigal: it isn't 'about' dreams
    Eliza Madrigal: yes I did Mick
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: really, cool
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    Eliza Madrigal: she has a wonderful way of integrating so much
    Eliza Madrigal: let me find her title, etc
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: maybe she did research in sl for the book
    Eliza Madrigal: The Wisdom of Lived Experience
    Mickorod Renard: yes, she prop analysed my dreams and worked out I was a crazy
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: googlin..
    Eliza Madrigal: some... but most of the book seems to draw from her psychoanalytic practice
    Eliza Madrigal: Pema wrote the forward
    Mickorod Renard: there u go
    Eliza Madrigal: and she does talk about playasbeing a little at the end
    Korel Laloix: oh lovely.
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i remember her avi,it was very basic,spirit one
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: ups..
    Eliza Madrigal nods
    Eliza Madrigal: her avi was the same for years and years ^^
    Mickorod Renard: fox's avi was weird
    Eliza Madrigal: Wol was always trying to get her to let her shop for her, haha

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: wol,does she come?
    Eliza Madrigal: which one Mick?
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, lately busy with work but often at this session, or her own 1ams
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: and agatha?
    Eliza Madrigal: we miss Agatha lately
    Mickorod Renard: ok,,gotta go folks..c ya soon
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i miss also my dreams
    Mickorod Renard: me too
    Eliza Madrigal: she wandered off for a bit :) I think she comes to Wol's session sometimes
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i dont dream like before,bye mick
    Eliza Madrigal: is that because you aren't sharing them maybe?


    Eliza Madrigal: I am not as clear a dreamer either...
    Mickorod Renard: no curious, the dream sessions kept us focused on recall
    Mickorod Renard: but I became like living two lives
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i dont know,maybe,but in general i dont dream like before,it was more like short stories,videos,now only a few flicks
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: so maybe we need to find a good time to have at least a few sessions? :)
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: yeah,maybe
    Korel Laloix: I still rarely remember my dreams... so was fun to hear.
    Eliza Madrigal: but we wouldn't have Maxine or Fox.. so no 'experts' - Luci might be able to come in evening time
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: wol dreams were always interesting
    Eliza Madrigal: but not sure I could then, nor most Europeans...
    Tura Brezoianu: I was never at any dream sessions, sounds interesting
    Eliza Madrigal: hm, let's see what we can work out time wise
    Eliza Madrigal: I think mick would like that too, and Wol, and maybe Aggers
    Eliza Madrigal: and Sama, Kori?
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i am in it
    Korel Laloix: Her dreams are still way out there.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: fingers crossed for my dreams to come back ;)
    Eliza Madrigal smiles
    Eliza Madrigal: nurturing dreams seems a good use of energies....
    Korel Laloix: But have not writeen down any in a while.
    Eliza Madrigal: vision, inspiration :)
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: one a week...i am happy
    Korel Laloix: She still giggles at being Kafkaesque.. or however you spell that.
    Eliza Madrigal: hahah
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: you put it on paper before Korel?
    Eliza Madrigal: it felt like having her with us Kori
    Korel Laloix: I typed it out wiht her edits.
    Korel Laloix: I might still have it.
    Korel Laloix: One sec.

    Eliza Madrigal: I need to go, but will get the log in email later so no worries
    Eliza Madrigal: Hugs and many thanks
    Korel Laloix: ciao
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: bye Eliza ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: will follow up with dream session plans soon
    Eliza Madrigal waves warmly
    Tura Brezoianu: goodnight Kori, Curious
    Korel Laloix: I found it if you want it...
    Korel Laloix: Ciao
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: bye Tura
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: pass it
    Tura Brezoianu: yes, if it's for everyone
    Tura Brezoianu: thanks
    Korel Laloix: Her dreams are a bit out there.

    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: and this one is from? wol?
    Korel Laloix: From my wife.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: rl or sl
    Korel Laloix: RL.. sama does not dome in SL.
    Korel Laloix: come
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: so you are a man Korel?
    Korel Laloix: No.. lol.. RL.. civil unioned to another woman.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: aa,ok
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i put on paper before only one who were connected with synchronicities
    Korel Laloix: That was a while back I think... last year or so.
    Korel Laloix: Oh OK.

    Korel Laloix: I never remember my dreams.
    Korel Laloix: I should say very rarely.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: so many different dremaers
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: one of my friends dream often same dream..and often is so often,weirdđ
    Korel Laloix: Sama's are a bit weird for sure.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: he told me once that it is like his demon(sokrates daimon) following him everywhere
    Korel Laloix: That does not sound fun.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: no,its more like a nightmare
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: and is that guy from hawaii still here?
    Mickorod Renard: Pila, no
    Korel Laloix: No idea.
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: yes
    Mickorod Renard: popped in about a year ago
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: he had problems with his conn. all the time
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: i was dreaming sl once
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: some grey goo came out of the sea and start eating the world
    Korel Laloix: Not fun.. sea level rise sort of thing?
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: we were porting like crazy
    Mediterraneanmonkseal Resident: and everywhere was the same shit,like grey tsunami

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