2010.04.18 19:00 - Dream & Cultivate Receptivity?

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Calvino Rabeni. Nice session, thanks to the attendees.  The non-existent comments are by Calvino Rabeni.


    Paradise Tennant: hiya cal :)
    Paradise Tennant: how are you :)
    Calvino Rabeni: How are you, Paradise :)
    Paradise Tennant: well thanks .. beautiful day here ..cleaned .. read a bit napped .. was all good
    Paradise Tennant: and you :)
    Calvino Rabeni: It is morning here - still in thailand
    Paradise Tennant: smiles :) 13 hours difference so around 8 am
    Calvino Rabeni: These cities could be a model for either past times of the efficient cities of the future
    Paradise Tennant: did you have trouble adjusting to such a big shit
    Paradise Tennant: lol that would be shift
    Calvino Rabeni: Very liveable, everything you need right on your street nearby
    Paradise Tennant: a walking model
    Calvino Rabeni: Walkable - yes
    Calvino Rabeni: The dense urban future could look like this -
    Calvino Rabeni: It feels village -like in spite of that, like many villages conjoined
    Calvino Rabeni: Not like the dystopian urban futures of science fiction
    Calvino Rabeni: Hi, Lucinda
    Paradise Tennant: dystopian ?
    Paradise Tennant: hiya lucincda
    Calvino Rabeni: The anti-utopia that everyone is scared about tue future becoming
    Lucinda Lavender: hi all...
    Lucinda Lavender: :)
    Paradise Tennant: how are you tonight lucinda :)
    Lucinda Lavender: pretty good...:)
    Lucinda Lavender: AND YOU?
    Lucinda Lavender: ooops
    Paradise Tennant: very well thanks ... we have just been talking about Thailand .. Cal is visiting there now :)
    Lucinda Lavender: wondering about how it is there...
    Calvino Rabeni: Wonder ful Lucinda I AM GOOD TOO :)
    Lucinda Lavender: so nice to hear!
    Paradise Tennant: smiles
    Lucinda Lavender: we are having naice weather today in Seattle
    Lucinda Lavender: oops
    Calvino Rabeni: I think the rainy season is approaching here - massed thunderclouds last night, cloudy today
    Paradise Tennant: liked Seattle ..was there only once .. watched them throw the fish in the market :)
    Lucinda Lavender: what are some of the highlights of your experience?
    Calvino Rabeni: They are idiosyncratic for me - For instance riding mountain roads in motorbike with many others - I look over there are maybe 3 people on many bikes, but when I turn to look, a big black lab dog is looking back at me
    Calvino Rabeni: So I like the unexpected
    Calvino Rabeni: Also, the sunset on the thunderclouds from the top of the mountain with an immense buddha
    Lucinda Lavender: lovely!
    Lucinda Lavender: you are in mountains then?
    Calvino Rabeni: And, chatting / bs-ing with locals in Thai, always something I enjoy once I get into the swing of it (my thai skills are minimal)
    Calvino Rabeni: It's like improv on a saxophone when you "can't hard;y" play
    Lucinda Lavender: ha ha
    Lucinda Lavender: !
    Calvino Rabeni: Hi Mitzi
    Lucinda Lavender: that makes me smile.
    Paradise Tennant: hello mitzi :)
    Lucinda Lavender: hi Mitzi!
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Hi lucinda, and nice to meet you paradise.
    Calvino Rabeni: Another hilight - I bought a cheap cell phone, so I have 2, and gave one to my friendwho is 90 and finds them hard to use - when Igot my first call from him, it was a highlight too
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Hi Calvino too
    Calvino Rabeni: How's rocky mountain weather, Mitzi?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Did he enjoy it or just grudgingly?
    Calvino Rabeni: He vented about the design. And I realized again how comp;letely not-simple it is to use such devices
    Calvino Rabeni: It would be a fine model for the "ineffable" that language cannot ever describe :)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Oh rocky mountain weather! Fantastic, evocative, the buds just poppoing out, almost you can watch the leaves getting larger as you stand there. Cool nights, 70ish days, bright sun alternates with misty moments.
    Calvino Rabeni: Not really, but it would take simply, volumes
    Lucinda Lavender: there does seem to be a learning period
    Lucinda Lavender: may I ask where you speak from Paradise?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: My mom could not deal with the tiny buttons. But she has had a stroke
    Paradise Tennant: toronto ..was also beautiful here today :)
    Lucinda Lavender: A sunday that is beautiful can be restful and recharging...
    Lucinda Lavender: Cal you are ahead tho ?yes?
    Paradise Tennant: we have both future and past here :)
    Lucinda Lavender: :))
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, it is monday at 9:24 AM
    Calvino Rabeni: (For you googlers, reading the log, that is, - it *was* )
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: are you bright eyed calvino?
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, I went to bed early, can now sleep through urban-soundscape-ambient
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: you have been safe there?
    Calvino Rabeni: Oh yes, too much so - I sought out some risk
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: ha ha
    Paradise Tennant: are you referencing a PAB log cal ?
    Lucinda Lavender: is it something you would like to describe?
    Calvino Rabeni: Riding in the rush hour traffic on a motorbike; mountain roads that are randomly not paved; getting somewhat lost at night
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: that does sound fun!
    Calvino Rabeni: Sure, it felt good to get my wheels and be able to range out of my walking neighborhood
    Lucinda Lavender: Dreams? or experiences of Know special things?
    Paradise Tennant: smiles .. well I think I should trundle off to bed .. thank you everyone .. nice to see you again Lucinda .. a pleasure MItzi :) big wave from Toronto :)
    Calvino Rabeni: I don't plan and arrange - the main thing I like when travelling is to explore and do people watching
    Calvino Rabeni: Sleep well Paradise :)
    Paradise Tennant: nite nite all :)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: SOunds lovely Paradise. ENjoy.
    Lucinda Lavender: good night Paradise!:)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Well Lucinda I had a cool dream recently.
    Lucinda Lavender: I would love to hear it...
    Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni is all ears
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Well it was about initation. I was somehow in a room receiving a sacred initiation ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: .... it was a woman teacher. There was a framed sacred symbol on a low wall ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: something between an Irish eternal knot and a Tibetan symbol of some type .. .carved into dark red stone ... this was our focus.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Each part of the symbol had a meaning - I think there were three parts of the symbol. ... THe interesting thing is that I seemed to have stumbled into the room at the last moment ...
    Lucinda Lavender: In the color Iwork I have studied red is the color of dreaming
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: .. and somehow found myself awkwardly at the very front of the room right under the sacredt symbol - everyone else was seated further back in the room.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: But, no one seemed to mind, and the teacher began to elucidate the meaning of the parts of the symbol as I tried to find where to sit down so I could listen ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: ... that's all I recall ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: red is the color of dreaming? ...
    Lucinda Lavender: Yes
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: can you say more, or any thoughts about my dream?
    Lucinda Lavender: the color some how resonates with the principle of dreaming. Well the question I ask isg
    Lucinda Lavender: what did the dreamer experience in the void? And there seems to be an initiatory feel to it.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: what do you mean by "in the void?"
    Lucinda Lavender: We are seeing that symbols express a message...and that stones also deliver the message.
    Lucinda Lavender: Well when you enter sleep...eventually after the resting stahge is accomplished then the story starts up ...
    Lucinda Lavender: one that you can remeber...because you are rested enough.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I guess I had a sense that I shouldn't be there - then, the dream faded before I received the information. A sense I don't deserve, or am there by somemistake
    Lucinda Lavender: there is a rich velvtey blackness that is the void?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: MMM!
    Lucinda Lavender: well the dream might be asking you to ponder where do I belong?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Hmmm. ... indeed. Yes that's certainly a question that I have.
    Lucinda Lavender: and with trust...one might create the environment in the dream that one can belong.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: you asked - what did I experience in the void? I awoke feeling satisfied and good.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: So I was rested and refreshed while I was there, I can assume.
    Lucinda Lavender: ah! then it has a regenerating effect...
    Lucinda Lavender: it must be nice at least to know that feeling.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: It did this time. But, I often have a good sense upon awakening. Often I don't recall my dreams though.
    Lucinda Lavender: in a place and time so seemingly separate from waking
    Lucinda Lavender: but not
    Lucinda Lavender: it got carried into waking...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I had an emotional neutrality about the initiation ... I didn't seem to really care about getting initiated ... more concerned about how to behave in the room and where t place myself.
    Lucinda Lavender: placement
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Yes, I just notice that too. Placement is a concern.
    Lucinda Lavender: so there was observation going on too...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I don't know about that ... perhaps that is after the fact observation ...
    Lucinda Lavender: observation of a seemless placement as a possibility
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: It's very interesting that you brought up velvety blackness and the void. It just happens that I am working with a practice on this exact topic.
    Calvino Rabeni: :)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: he smiles
    Lucinda Lavender: in the study I have done there is much reference to the velvetey blackness of the void.
    Calvino Rabeni: Not just plain old blank blackness, but the rich variety
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: serendipity - synergy - synchronicity here in Plays as Being
    Lucinda Lavender: maybe it is related then to this initiation.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Well yes, I do in fact think that.
    Lucinda Lavender: yes the light of the blackness...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: when we sleep we rest in our true nature which is identical with God.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: "God" - energy - source - you know
    Lucinda Lavender: yes!
    Lucinda Lavender: and we connect with a bigger consciousness?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: seamless placement. in the dream I felt awkward, but no one else seemed to notice or mind.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Well that's my belief.
    Lucinda Lavender: sometimes we have the dream during a time of expansion
    Lucinda Lavender: so that we can notice how the personal aspect of the story is merging with the more universal?
    Calvino Rabeni: During the waking time, the connection wouldstill be present, but there is a lot of distraction due to "content" ?
    Lucinda Lavender: yes
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: during the waking time, and during the dreaming time, the connection would still be present, but perhaps not percivable directly in either state ... comments?
    Lucinda Lavender: I remember a dream once where I was wrapped in a sage green cloth and sitting in a sage green stone dish trying to figure out whether I should face the court yard or the stone wall covered with some kind of writing in another language...I am just reminded of it...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: or, I'd like to amend my statement ... perhaps not easily perceivable direclty in either state, or perceivable with dresire, practice, or training?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: that dream has several of the same elements of my dream, Lucinda ...
    Lucinda Lavender: that is what I was noticing.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: symbols carved in stone ... of unknown meaning ... trying to figure out ones "placement"
    Lucinda Lavender: yes
    Lucinda Lavender: can you expain more about connection during waking or dreaming...?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I also awoke today with one of those phrases in my brain - (the dream I just described was a couple of days ago). Today's phrase was "internal structure."
    Calvino Rabeni: I get "phrases" from time to time also
    Lucinda Lavender: as do I
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I am thinking of mystical or divine communication.
    Calvino Rabeni: Or message-like things
    Lucinda Lavender: yes.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I wrote "divine communication." Yet, I had intended to write "divine communion."
    Calvino Rabeni: That makes sense
    Lucinda Lavender: I guess that is how I see the dream...as connection to a source...
    Lucinda Lavender: or communion with...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: One part of us reaches out to our waking mundane self.
    Calvino Rabeni: Lucinda, have you experimented with waking dreams?
    Lucinda Lavender: so I am wondering of you do any special intentional thing before sleep?
    Lucinda Lavender: no only dream circle
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I have not been ... but I might start soon.
    Lucinda Lavender: I have noticed these times when time seems to slow or speed up. and that sometimes seem like a listening to source
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: interesting clue
    Lucinda Lavender: when the mind slows and there is sort of a meditative feeling to it...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: clue for the metaphysical detective ... like you Cavino ... the Peter Gunn of reality
    Lucinda Lavender: I never have had a particular story develop in my mind tho.
    Lucinda Lavender: I except in play, or while viewing art, or listening to music.
    Calvino Rabeni: I don't do much in that regard, but I do try to query the dream while awake, with the idea of it being a continuation - letting it unfold more if possible
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I like that idea Calvino. I usually feel it will never come back.
    Calvino Rabeni: You could also think, it is still there - we remember them all, yes?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Yet, at times, when I am in a dream, I can remember being in the same place or same world in a different dream. Only when in the dream though, not otherwise.
    Calvino Rabeni: And with attention it could be "reactivated" is an assumption one could take on
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: IF we believe in the 5th and 6th dimensions, parallel universes that are slight variations off of this one - these experiences in dreams might be us bleeding through to our correlates in nearby "branes"
    Lucinda Lavender: I have a friend in my choir who told me about a place like a retreat in her dream...
    Calvino Rabeni: Maybe there is a bridge between the waking and dream world, - fragile as a spiderweb but walkable nonetheless
    Lucinda Lavender: the description turned out to be very close to one I designed in a dream workshopp.
    Calvino Rabeni: That has also been said about mythic symbols - that they live in two worlds at once
    Lucinda Lavender: maybe they act as bridges for our consciousness.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I feel this idea of multiple versions of our universe has a lot to it that resonates.
    Calvino Rabeni: BUt it seems reasonable, if you assume it works, it *might* be possible, butif we assume it can't work, then it *won't* be possible
    Calvino Rabeni: Thus one's intention - as Lucinda mentioned earlier - is important to this work. WOuld you agree?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Yes, intention. That'ds more grounding. At one time of my life I experimented more intentionally with lucid dreaming.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I tried to change various elements of the situation in the dream simply by willing it so, once I realized I was dreaming.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I dicsovered that the intention would have in impact, but would not instantly change the immediate surroundings. But after a while I would walk into a new envionment that matched my wish.
    Lucinda Lavender: what if one were to notice and observe the the dream while giving it space to change.
    Calvino Rabeni: The entry point I'm interested in, aboutdreaming, is querying it afterward, in a way that it can be somewhat active
    Calvino Rabeni: SO instead of being dreaming and trying to be awake, it is the opposite
    Lucinda Lavender: I have been advised to relax the personal will so that the mind can write the story
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Wow, that is a creative approach. You are turning the tables a little bit from the way I usually thinkg about relating to dreams.
    Lucinda Lavender: it allows the willful nature to rest
    Calvino Rabeni: I've only had minimal success, but I think it could go much farthe, if things work the way I think they do
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Yes, I found I really didn't want to work in my dreams. Not relaxing, restful.
    Calvino Rabeni: The "work" attitude spoils it , that s why
    Lucinda Lavender: Also, to clear the emotions in the mind and body
    Lucinda Lavender: before sleep
    Calvino Rabeni: One has to leave / drop "work" as far as I can see
    Lucinda Lavender: yes
    Lucinda Lavender: then the gifts come in
    Calvino Rabeni: A little like those emergent practices like subud, I believe
    Calvino Rabeni: BTW, a man in my men's group does latihan in Seattle - I might be able to check it out
    Lucinda Lavender: maintaining a childlike innocence
    Calvino Rabeni: I am drawn toward the practice, but not necessarily the religious aspect
    Lucinda Lavender: and noting that the dream is coming from a collective body of information...we are just forming the story about that body.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: IF I have an intension, but there are mysterious about how to go about seeking it in the best way, then dreams might be giving the waking self sme help, cludes.
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, they bypass "work"
    Lucinda Lavender: just being receptive seems enough to me
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I am pretty open about where that information is coming from .. not necessarily "my" subconscious - could be other people, astral worlds, parallel worlds, dieties and devas ... anywhere.
    Calvino Rabeni: Except, there are habits of being not-receptive, which it takes some intention to overcome
    Lucinda Lavender: I think that just view the dream as the friend helping is helpful.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I agree that cultivating receptivity is kind of the simple, underlying skill to wish for
    Calvino Rabeni: how exactly does one cultivate receptivity?
    Lucinda Lavender: good question...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: by inaction ... listening ... being curious ... leaving open questions ... for a start ... what else guys!
    Calvino Rabeni: I'd say, purification from addictions
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I mean ... what else do you think cultivates receptivity?
    Lucinda Lavender: good answer.
    Lucinda Lavender: humility
    Calvino Rabeni: Whatever creates automatisms, interferes with receptivity
    Lucinda Lavender: knowing we are a part of something bery big
    Lucinda Lavender: oops
    Calvino Rabeni: and it might take some swimming upstream to break that
    Calvino Rabeni: ZGood ansswer, Lucinda
    Lucinda Lavender: call in the angels
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: About 10 years ago I tried a practice of not initiating any activity whatsoever. Giving up scheming, planning all that. My life improved so enormousely I've kind of incorporated that perspective permanently. Very un-American though.
    Lucinda Lavender: sounds good...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Especially not trying to get people to do something that I think they ought to do.
    Lucinda Lavender: ah!
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: That alone has eliminated so much useless pointless activity.
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Can you become more receptive by swimming upstream? Sounds like an exertion.
    Lucinda Lavender: hmmm
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: one of those zen things. effortless efforting?
    Lucinda Lavender: maybe working with the image of planting seeds?
    Calvino Rabeni: I think in the business of cultivating almost everything, an early thing to do is to let go the idea that exertion and intention is the opposite of receptivity. That is an untrue logic, it might be good to try to drop it
    Calvino Rabeni: The idea of watering the white seeds not the black seeds (from lojong) is one idea of getting around that logic
    Lucinda Lavender: how does that work?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Probably there's a qualititative feeling you can feel inside yourself. So resisting an intuitive urge to exert would being non-recetive to your inner self in that case.
    Calvino Rabeni: You can't control the results of action, but can control one's response and what is done to them
    Calvino Rabeni: Agreee, Mitzi that is a good way to look at it
    Calvino Rabeni: Quality over logic
    Calvino Rabeni: When you query the dream it may respond qualitatively, not cognitively or logically
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: And of course we are imperfect, so we just see how that unfolcs and learn to refine that qualititive sensitivity over time.
    Calvino Rabeni: Exactly
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Ah yes, back to the idea of querying the dream. Thanks for keeping the thread and linking it up to what we were talking about.
    Calvino Rabeni: YW
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: I think that when we have an intention, or are actively querying our dreams or other intentional thing going on ...
    Calvino Rabeni: THere are many ways to carry an intention, yes?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: ... it's because we are in a time of our life when it's ripe to do so. Thus being receptive to our inner longings, urgings. I think it take smore energy or focus to do that though ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: So ... we aren't always in a space with that more focused bit of energy to deploy ...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: .. so when it's there we should really take advantage and go with it.
    Calvino Rabeni: One intention can be to cultivate that energy, prior to its use
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Absolutely - like investing in the stock market!
    Calvino Rabeni: Pretty simple, receptivity on day N depends on getting ince and rested on day N - 1
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: if that's the recipe ... or standing or your head, or eating grass.
    Calvino Rabeni: As, we (a self?) are a completely holistic system
    Calvino Rabeni: So the influences mingle, not entirely predicatable
    Calvino Rabeni: An art, not a recipe :)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Sure, a very very complex system! Each one of us.
    Lucinda Lavender: exactly!
    Calvino Rabeni: And "us" even more
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Mmmm a nice stoping point ... it's almost upon a nice round hour ... I am feeling time to depart soon.
    Lucinda Lavender: I have certain dream images that show up for me. I am currious if either of you do ? reacurrent themes or images that feel special
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Such as?
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: ... (starting a whole new topice after just announcing an intention to disengage!)
    Lucinda Lavender: sorry...we were at that same moment moving in different directions:)
    Lucinda Lavender: I have stones...maybe another time we can discuss it.
    Calvino Rabeni: Great conversation - thanks
    Calvino Rabeni: Got to go now, to check out of my hotel
    Calvino Rabeni: Take care Mitzi and Lucinda :)
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: For me: traveling in a boat, climbing mountainsby cal!
    Lucinda Lavender: thanks...good travels to all!yes take care...
    Mitzi Mimistrobell: Pleasant dreams Lucinda and a lovely rest in a rich black velvety pillow.
    Calvino Rabeni: _/!\_
    Calvino Rabeni: both of you
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