aurel Miles: la la la
aurel Miles: oops
Storm Nordwind smiles
aurel Miles: Hi Storm
Storm Nordwind: Hi aurel
Storm Nordwind: Welcome Pema!
aurel Miles: Hi Pema
Pema Pera: Hi Storm and Aurel!
Pema Pera: And hi Wester!
aurel Miles: Hello Wester
Storm Nordwind: Hi Wester
aurel Miles: I don't see you
aurel Miles: but i will take Storm and Pema's word for it that you're here
Pema Pera: (approaching)
Wester Kiranov: hi pema, storm, aurel
Storm Nordwind: incoming!
Storm Nordwind: Are we expecting Fefonz again today, maintaining the series of dialogues?
Pema Pera: presumably
Pema Pera: hi Mick!
Storm Nordwind: Welcome Mick!
Pema Pera: at least that was my understanding :)
Wester Kiranov: hi mick
Mickorod Renard: hiya Pema, Webs ,Storm, aurel
aurel Miles: Hi Mick!
Mickorod Renard: nice bit of mail today Pema
Pema Pera: Thank you, Mick!
Storm Nordwind seems to have a laggy connection... no groups and no about land title :-/
Wester Kiranov: i thought so too
Wester Kiranov: (about the mail)
Pema Pera: thanks Wester!
Mickorod Renard: I pasted it to my RL guru and am going out walking the dogs together tommorow with him
Mickorod Renard: hopefully i will become enlightened
Pema Pera: :-)
Storm Nordwind: Are we talking about illusion of illusion here?
Mickorod Renard: Hi Scath
Mickorod Renard: yes
Scathach Rhiadra: Hello all:)
Pema Pera: hi Scathach!
Wester Kiranov: hi scat
Storm Nordwind is now down to single figures of unread emails, but that's one of them
Pema Pera: :)
Pema Pera: yeah, it was a bit lengthy . . . .
Wester Kiranov: i just read it right before i cam here
Mickorod Renard: I was just watching a program tonite on tele,,and this artist reminded me of how when u sit and make sketches etc you make time to be still and observe
Pema Pera: stopping . . . .
Storm Nordwind wonders what this "tele" is of which Mick speaks ;)
Mickorod Renard: television
Storm Nordwind has heard reports of such a device but has not witnessed one in person
Mickorod Renard: he he he
Wester Kiranov: :)
Scathach Rhiadra: :)
Mickorod Renard: I had nearly forgoten about them,,but thios week I am alone,,and on holiday
Mickorod Renard: so rediscovered it
Storm Nordwind: You are welcome to visit me in Glasgow if you get fed up of walking with your guru! ;)
Mickorod Renard: lol,,maybe next hols
Mickorod Renard: tommorow its over this time
Storm Nordwind: Next hols you'll have a 4000 mile flight not a 400 mile one!
Mickorod Renard: well,,you never know
Mickorod Renard: are you about sorted then,,for your move?
Storm Nordwind: My future congresswoman has delivered :)
Mickorod Renard: yeaaaaaa
Pema Pera: As for Fefonz, I remember now that he has family visiting him, but that he thought that he would be free for this session -- I guess the family visit took unexpected turns
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Pema Pera: yes, great news, Storm!!!
Storm Nordwind: Then let us extemporise without him
Storm Nordwind: Thank you Pema!
Mickorod Renard: I feel that the idea of the artist ,,purging away the usual busy thoughts of life in exchange for that peace whilst drawing is a good way of feeling being?
Mickorod Renard: maybe I am wrong?
Wester Kiranov: I guess it's a good start
Storm Nordwind: I wonder if it's really being an artist though, or rather whether what this person did to "get in the mood"
Storm Nordwind: If the latter, then anyone can do it, not just artists
Mickorod Renard: yes,,I was meaning the latter
Mickorod Renard: just another way of relating to the feeling
Storm Nordwind nods
Storm Nordwind: Can you describe what this person did?
Mickorod Renard: not really,,more reminded me of what it feels like to draw or paint,,something I stopped doing some years ago
Mickorod Renard: I have too much noise in the head at the mom
aurel Miles: I remember one week
aurel Miles: right before i changed my whole life, left victoria moved to ottawa, started university
aurel Miles: i felt compelled to make art
aurel Miles: so i just did
Storm Nordwind: I know that feeling, yes
aurel Miles: and it was the right thing to do - even though i did keep stopping myself and saying, this is dumb
aurel Miles: what am i doing?
Storm Nordwind: Sometimes it comes with music composing or songwriting too
Mickorod Renard: yes?
aurel Miles: probably
aurel Miles: it happens when you're singing a lot
aurel Miles: that the top of your head just feels opened up
aurel Miles: and this column of stuff - i think of it as sparks
aurel Miles: flows down through your head
aurel Miles: and out your mouth
aurel Miles: and you couldn't stop it
aurel Miles: even if you wanted to
Mickorod Renard: never experienced that
aurel Miles: really?
Mickorod Renard: fraid not
aurel Miles: join a choir - sooner or later it will happen
Mickorod Renard: once when I was drunk maybe
Storm Nordwind: I have felt there comes a point of clarity...
Storm Nordwind: totally unforced...
Storm Nordwind: a flow from one place to another...
Storm Nordwind: and you don't even think but you're the agent for expressing all this flow
aurel Miles: i can't say but this feeling, for me, is one that is subtly different from that kind of opening to the flow
Storm Nordwind: And then you look back and say "Did I do all that? Wow! How?!"
aurel Miles: it requires you to break something in yourself
aurel Miles: some kind of shell - and when you're in it yuo know for sure nothing could ever push you off course
aurel Miles: the first time it happened for me, i was singing in a concert and i had been asked to stand underneath this iron crown of thorns
Storm Nordwind: A shell? Some kind of resistance? Or protection?
aurel Miles: the crown was a good 8 feet in diameter
Mickorod Renard: or conditioning
aurel Miles: it was art in a cathedral
aurel Miles: and i was underneath a spike
aurel Miles: for the first part of the performance i was terrified
aurel Miles: what would happen if one of the chains broke
aurel Miles: that spike was taller than me
Scathach Rhiadra leaves quitely, got something to do before Stim's workshop
aurel Miles: it would have gone right through the top of my head
Mickorod Renard: bye scath
aurel Miles: bye scath
Storm Nordwind: And all the ions off the sword tip were directed at the top of your head!
aurel Miles: but i had to stay there, it was a performance
aurel Miles: so i had to get comfortable with the fear
aurel Miles: and then something broke
aurel Miles: and instead of the fear and that intense feeling of vulnerability
aurel Miles: i felt this column of light pour through the top of my head
aurel Miles: anbd out to the audience
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aurel Miles: and it changed everything
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Mickorod Renard: I did sing once at a wedding,,kareoki...and i did a huge solo ,,just went for it,,everyone started joining in full time and I got a huge ,,whats the word,,well lots of cheers and claps
Pema Pera: that must have been quite an experience, Aurel !
aurel Miles: applause
Pema Pera: hi Ari!
Arisia Vita: Hi all....
aurel Miles: it was - it changed things
Storm Nordwind: Come join us Ari!
Arisia Vita: thanks
aurel Miles: Hello Ari!
Mickorod Renard: Hi Ari
Wester Kiranov: hi ari
Arisia Vita: great to see you all
Mickorod Renard: yes,,not seen you for a while
Arisia Vita: I was probably hiding in the bushes... :)
Mickorod Renard: not seen kori either
Mickorod Renard: so where do we go with the illusion of the illusion?
Pema Pera: well, Wester read it most recently
Pema Pera: do you have some comments, Wester ?
Wester Kiranov: :)
Wester Kiranov: (thinking)
Wester Kiranov: it did sound a bit like ""hey you guys, I have found the answer to everything" at first, but you clariified that later.
Mickorod Renard: grin
Wester Kiranov: And it did help me see better waht you mean with the movie metaphor
Pema Pera: :)
Mickorod Renard: sometimes when its in a relevent context it helps
Wester Kiranov: the importance of engaging in the illusion, not just saying "it's all an illusion (so nothig matters, so I won't care)"
Pema Pera: YES!
Pema Pera: really going into it totally, that's so important
Pema Pera: I'm learning that more and more, day by day
Pema Pera: yes, without identifying
Pema Pera: without getting glued to it, buying into it
Wester Kiranov: you certainly express it more than you did a few years ago :)
Pema Pera: (it = the usual interpretations)
Pema Pera: hahaha
Mickorod Renard: I am sure most of us here are well capable people in RL,,yet i find that because of this people put on me their problems,,which leads to my frustration,,,however,,if I can see that as an amusing illusion then it looks heaps better]
Pema Pera: appreciation is key, and appreciation can have many sides, from amusing to deeply sympatico
Mickorod Renard: yes,,its so much easier to cope with stuff when viewed from the outside
Mickorod Renard: or above
Pema Pera: how so, Mick?
Pema Pera: as opposed to from the inside?
Mickorod Renard: well,,its like stuff can be focussed on better from a lil distance,,rather than when you are suffocated by it
Storm Nordwind: What is "outside"? Is there such a place? :)
Pema Pera: but you can also get underneath somebody's skin, so to speak
Pema Pera: really stepping in somebody's shoes
Mickorod Renard: I am sure I do that
Pema Pera: :) -> Storm
aurel Miles: i think when you know it is not going to kill you
aurel Miles: that yuo can go in
aurel Miles: and come out
aurel Miles: and still be whole
Pema Pera: yes
Mickorod Renard: but on your terms
aurel Miles: that makes it possible to appreciate and engage
Mickorod Renard: yes
Pema Pera: well . . . . . what are your terms Mick :-) ?
aurel Miles: without being overwhelmed
Mickorod Renard: that it doesnt upset my peace of mind
Pema Pera: hmm . . .. .
Mickorod Renard: grin
Pema Pera: what if it does?
aurel Miles: but that is kind of what i mean
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Mickorod Renard: then I go mad
Mickorod Renard: joking,,sort of
aurel Miles: i do not try to preserve my peace of mind
Mickorod Renard: but it raises an interesting point
aurel Miles: but i do remind myself that i will come back to me
aurel Miles: and i won't die from experiencing that kind of engagement
Mickorod Renard: I like to think i am compassionate and whatever
Mickorod Renard: and to some degree have worried about loosing that emotional contact through becoming more ,,erm seeing through new eyes
Mickorod Renard: I am a sensitive person,,and its said I have good instinct
Mickorod Renard: I dont want to loose that
Pema Pera: in some sense the point is to lose yourself . . . .
Pema Pera: . . . . and then true intimacy can arise
Storm Nordwind nods
Pema Pera: Sufi actually describe that as "mad"
Mickorod Renard: yes,,seems a bit paradoxical
Pema Pera: in poems about love and wine and all that
aurel Miles: but you do come back
Mickorod Renard: I have been described as mad too
aurel Miles: we all come back from madness - it is not an absolute state
Pema Pera: of course everything is always a matter of balance -- even loosing balance :)
aurel Miles: not something you are or are not
aurel Miles: yeah
aurel Miles: when i forget that
aurel Miles: fear takes the reins and i lose my way
Pema Pera: motivation and intention are the best safety devices . . . probably the *only* ones
aurel Miles: you can go crazy because you can and will come back
Wester Kiranov: if the illusion of you and the other fades you can more easily see what is really there where you thought you and the other were
aurel Miles: or go beyond - or whatever
Pema Pera: yes, that's what I tried to point at with "Being Seeing"
Mickorod Renard: howd u mean Webster?
Pema Pera: letting go of your own seeing
aurel Miles: it seems to me i am always trying to remember that whatever i am is not static
aurel Miles: i am not stuck with one way of being forever
Mickorod Renard: fluid?
Pema Pera: yes
Wester Kiranov: The idea of who you are gets in the way of seeing what this part of reaity you call "me" really is
Mickorod Renard: I have managed to drop much of myself over last couple of years
Wester Kiranov: I don't have nearly enough quote marks in the previous sentence
Mickorod Renard: its dificult for some people to cope with the openness I now show
Wester Kiranov: how is that?
Mickorod Renard: I think so many people live behind viels
Mickorod Renard: veils
Wester Kiranov: (I will leave for Stims in about 5 mins, and I think some others might too)Whoosh!
Mickorod Renard: yes,,me too
Storm Nordwind was just going to politely remind people that Stim's "Ways of Knowing" workshop will be starting in the Kira Cafe in a few short minutes!
aurel Miles: can i wear my bunny suit?
Storm Nordwind: You can ask Stim. I doubt he will mind!
Wester Kiranov: maybe he has some monks outfit you could borrow ;)
aurel Miles: i have another new outfit - maybe i will take a moment and change. Excuse me
Pema Pera: isn't it interesting, Mick, to surprise people :)
Pema Pera: can be a gauge of what you've learned
Mickorod Renard: it is,,but I find that many have a deep set idea that anyone that is honest must be lying
Storm Nordwind: So if we have come to a hiatus, I suggest all those who are going high tail it to the Kira Cafe
Pema Pera: yup, see you there!
Mickorod Renard: ok,,c u soon
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