2009.07.18 13:00 - Autism, Bullying, and Responsibility

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    The Guardian for this meeting was SophiaSharon Larnia. The comments are by SophiaSharon Larnia.


    Nymf Hathaway: Hello SophiaSharon :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: HI Nymf!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: how are you?
    Nymf Hathaway: Doing well thanks, and you?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: good, love saturdays, most of the time :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Mick
    Nymf Hathaway: Good evening Mickorod :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hiya,,sorry who put that post in my way
    SophiaSharon Larnia: haha
    Mickorod Renard: I am never sure what day it is for some folk
    Mickorod Renard: I know its still saturday here in uk
    Nymf Hathaway: ah the time zone problem, I have the same
    Mickorod Renard: lol
    Nymf Hathaway: Saturday in the Netherlands :)
    Mickorod Renard: what hapened then nymf
    SophiaSharon Larnia: it is saturday in the us its 4 pm here
    Mickorod Renard: ok
    Nymf Hathaway: well ever since I started the forum and wanted to please every member...from of course different time zones... I failed :)
    Mickorod Renard: ok, on my chart I have 4pm pdt as midnight here
    Mickorod Renard: so u r not pdt
    Mickorod Renard: eeek
    Nymf Hathaway: no
    SophiaSharon Larnia: very difficult Nymf
    Nymf Hathaway: yes it is... I use my website now to check them :)
    Mickorod Renard: we could do with a world clock somewhere on sl
    Nymf Hathaway: I agree
    SophiaSharon Larnia: isn't there an applet somewhere where you can choose different cities and have them all displayed? I've looked around some and can't find on perfect
    Mickorod Renard: in the inventory or somewhere handy
    Mickorod Renard: I will have to look into it
    Nymf Hathaway: Never found such Sophia :(
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :( ok
    Mickorod Renard: I have a watch on my avi that can tell diferent times
    SophiaSharon Larnia: cool
    Nymf Hathaway: oh nice
    Mickorod Renard: but i cant see it very well
    SophiaSharon Larnia: aww
    SophiaSharon Larnia: you avi will have to get a braile watch
    SophiaSharon Larnia: lol
    Mickorod Renard: he he he
    Nymf Hathaway: Well since it is here (in sl your watch I mean) it will be improved by someone...lets hope he or she will do such soon :)
    Mickorod Renard: yea
    Nymf Hathaway: I am not a programmer :(
    Mickorod Renard: I can see it now,,but its upside down
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i have 100's of silly projects as it is, thank goodness im not a programmer
    Nymf Hathaway: hahahhaha
    SophiaSharon Larnia: then stand on your avi head
    Nymf Hathaway: smiles
    Mickorod Renard: cant,,just had dinner
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oh!
    Mickorod Renard: brb..desert
    Nymf Hathaway: what does an avi eat? :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: time
    Nymf Hathaway: yes

    SophiaSharon Larnia: what kind of science do you talk about in your group Nymf? (strange way to put that)
    Nymf Hathaway: any
    Nymf Hathaway: whatever one of us is interested in to learn more about
    Nymf Hathaway: next one will be about Autism, aspergers and the Rainman...but we have had Stem cells as well for example
    SophiaSharon Larnia: interesting
    Nymf Hathaway: yes t sure is...but the best is the passion from those who teach :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i read the other day that sl attracts people from the autism spectrum, im still trying decide if the author meant this negatively
    Nymf Hathaway: well... I think he has a point
    Mickorod Renard: strange,,was just talking about autism and rainman with my son
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes...
    Nymf Hathaway: Smiles at Mickorod
    Nymf Hathaway: They (people who have it) themselfs say SL is a good way for learning social skills
    Nymf Hathaway: Hello Neela
    SophiaSharon Larnia: in conversation, subtle nuances of inflection from speech is harder to learn here
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Neela
    Nymf Hathaway: very true
    Neela Blaisdale: Helllo Nymph ans MIck, nice to meet you Sharon..
    SophiaSharon Larnia smiles
    Mickorod Renard: social skills seem to be the isue with them..i wonder whether they hve diferent social skills when amongst folk with similar diferences?
    Mickorod Renard: hi neela
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (ty for calling me sharon, i dont want to make a new avi to change my name because i have too much inventory with this one)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thats an interesting question Mick.
    Nymf Hathaway: I agree
    Nymf Hathaway: I suspect they are the same...but do not mind since they all have the same needs... but I shall ask the question, its interesting
    Mickorod Renard: I read recently that autism is perhaps a ,,erm,,whats the word for it,,developement ,genetically for the human spiecies,,maybe we need to addapt rather than see autism as something to isolate
    Nymf Hathaway: what made me interested in this seminar is the fact.... each one I met seems highly intelligent, and almost all said they are bullied in childhood.
    Nymf Hathaway: Well I can fully agree with that
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes I agree too
    Mickorod Renard: I work in a school and am making it a personal goal to try and understand what creates the underpinning for someone to be bullied
    Nymf Hathaway: oh what a great innitiative Mickorod!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: being taught by others that its okay to denigrate someone
    Mickorod Renard: I know lots of books are on the subject,,but many are geared to be politically correct
    Nymf Hathaway: Good for you!
    Mickorod Renard: I think its deeper
    SophiaSharon Larnia: can you say more?
    Mickorod Renard: I dont think I can,,and am likely to attract alot of flak due to being naive on the subject at the momment
    SophiaSharon Larnia: sometimes concepts arise on instinct, i understand that
    Mickorod Renard: I will say that from initial observations the folk I would refer to as victim,,in worst cases,,seem to create an aura
    Mickorod Renard: in a negative way
    Nymf Hathaway: it is known they indeed send feelings as; take me
    Nymf Hathaway: some do
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i feel this is learned response as well
    Nymf Hathaway: oh yes or insecurity
    Mickorod Renard: of course everyone call fall victim,,thats normal,,but I am refering to those individuals that are most obviously victim to bad bullying
    Nymf Hathaway: well in case of autism it is obvious... they are shy, like to study and are serious in all their answers
    Neela Blaisdale: sorry, phoen call..
    SophiaSharon Larnia: in that case, bullying can be because they are different, I think Mick, that you are talking about something else
    Mickorod Renard: I have come across several with autism that have meerly been treated as interesting and no more
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes
    Nymf Hathaway: wonderful environment Mickorod
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and I have to say, I do know what you mean
    Mickorod Renard: the ones I am thinking about are not autistic,,outwardly anyway,,but have a sort of grating personality
    Mickorod Renard: almost as if they wat to attract bullying
    Mickorod Renard: want*
    Nymf Hathaway: ah selffulfilling prophecy you are talking about Mickorod
    Mickorod Renard: looks that way
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i think these individuals are in pain, for variable reasons. The pain is what the aura is, perhaps.
    Nymf Hathaway: I think Sharon is right here
    Mickorod Renard: hard to say, I feel I am sensitive, but i dont pick up pain as I would normally
    Neela Blaisdale wonders if we're obseerving the 90 sec of silence?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (sorry)
    Mickorod Renard: sorry
    Neela Blaisdale: :)
    Neela Blaisdale: I'm just curius, what brought up the subject of bullying?
    Neela Blaisdale: *o
    SophiaSharon Larnia: because the appearance is abrasive, Mick>
    Mickorod Renard: not even appearance
    Mickorod Renard: actions I think
    Mickorod Renard: words too (hidden from many)
    Mickorod Renard: its interesting to watch it in playgrounds
    Nymf Hathaway: and what about the bullies?
    Mickorod Renard: equally, there are pleanty of damaged and frustrated kids that want to release their pain on someone else too
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I'm sorry neela, missed your question, Mick brought it up...
    Mickorod Renard: maybe they take out the hurt they feel on someone less able
    Nymf Hathaway: maybe we need to focus on those... get the torn out and heal the issue
    Nymf Hathaway: Smiles

    Mickorod Renard: is the one bullied the only victim??
    Nymf Hathaway: no often the bullie is one as well... by someone else
    Neela Blaisdale: probably not..
    Neela Blaisdale: exactly Nymf
    Mickorod Renard: just being a kid going through the changes can create huge frustrations
    SophiaSharon Larnia nods
    Nymf Hathaway: and questions, anxiety etc etc
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Mickorod Renard: and I dont think its so clear as pointing the finger at parents either
    Nymf Hathaway: its a package deal
    Mickorod Renard: it is, I think a year or two out from school at around the age of 14/15 for character building is the way forward
    Mickorod Renard: never happen of course
    Neela Blaisdale: intersting idea...
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i was just thinking that Mock, but the idea is good
    Neela Blaisdale: but what would they do?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Mick*
    Nymf Hathaway: ooh nice...I suggested such in our parliament a couple of years ago....they looked at me as if I was a fool, how could I suggest such :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Fox
    Fox Monacular: hi everyone
    Mickorod Renard: what some may want to do,,perhaps find their true direction for the future,,help poorer countries,,?
    Nymf Hathaway: Hello Fox :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hiya Fox
    Mickorod Renard: nature programs
    Nymf Hathaway: Living life is an education in itself
    SophiaSharon Larnia: like service work?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: great idea :)
    Mickorod Renard: it is,,and perhaps some sort of outward bounds type regime..climbing and seafaring
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,helping the aged
    Nymf Hathaway: and just for those who need it...those who like to study; please continue
    Fox Monacular: living life is not only the education but also responsibilities
    Mickorod Renard: he he he
    Nymf Hathaway: agrees with Fox
    Fox Monacular: for example, is it irresponsible to be uneducated in today's world? (i mean when htere are means for it)
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,but its amazing how responsible they get once they feel they are no longer school kids
    Fox Monacular: true:)
    Fox Monacular: I think I was more responsible in high school living with my parents, then in a university living with friends :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Good question Fox...need to think this through
    SophiaSharon Larnia: irresponsible of the educators perhaps
    Mickorod Renard: kids today seem so grown up too,,but then I remind myself of all those kids being sent to the war front in the first world war etc
    Mickorod Renard: ooops
    Fox Monacular: yeah, i know... my grandfather had his childhood during wwii in russia
    Fox Monacular: that's a whole other growing up
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (we stop for the 90 sec bell, Fox) :)
    Fox Monacular: i think peole in the west are often immature and childish during their whole lives
    Fox Monacular: sorry about 90 sec
    SophiaSharon Larnia: many of them are, as a result of materialism, i belive
    Nymf Hathaway: i think peole in the west are often immature and childish during their whole lives....only in the west or is it human?
    Fox Monacular: materialism and lack of danger ...
    Fox Monacular: lack of need to survive too
    Mickorod Renard: I appol about the 90 secs,,i still look at my keyboard when typing,,and dont notice the 90 second start
    Neela Blaisdale: Np:)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I have to look at my keyboard too, bad typer
    Nymf Hathaway: I see suffering in africa.... but still a whole bunch of males with immature skills
    Fox Monacular: true
    Mickorod Renard: I am sure most the questions have been asked before,,but I think the answers are always taylored to meet the interests of those who pull the leavers
    Fox Monacular: then what does it even mean to be mature?
    Mickorod Renard: levers
    Nymf Hathaway: Being responsible
    Fox Monacular: Roshi Joan Halifax quoted someone, I can't remember, saying that enlightenment is a state of complete unselfishness
    Mickorod Renard: I remember my least feeling of lifes importance was in my early teens
    Mickorod Renard: thats why they send the young ones to war
    Mickorod Renard: the old un would say 'get lost'
    Neela Blaisdale: maturity...being more c omfortable with oneself...
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,and having a nice warm house wife n kids
    Fox Monacular: the young are also more maleable... they don't have responsibilities towards others yet
    Mickorod Renard: exactly
    Mickorod Renard: so do we conveiently label older as more mature?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: no, not necessarily
    Fox Monacular: perhaps it is not always true
    Mickorod Renard: wheras its just another perspective?
    Fox Monacular: when we say mature we mean some sort of actualized potential or intrinsic nature
    Mickorod Renard: mmmmm..is that a question Fox?
    Fox Monacular: yes
    Fox Monacular: or a vague statement, trying to unpack a term
    Mickorod Renard: well,,a pensioner then would be outside that
    Mickorod Renard: perhaps
    Mickorod Renard: in a ruthless way one cud argue they are now surpluss and an expense
    Mickorod Renard: (pensioners)
    Fox Monacular: but we also could see them as an asset
    Fox Monacular: in terms of accumulated experience
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Fox
    Mickorod Renard: and kids
    Mickorod Renard: accumulated education
    Mickorod Renard: mature for me is a tasty cheese
    SophiaSharon Larnia: lol
    Fox Monacular: or an expensive wine
    Mickorod Renard: yeaa
    Fox Monacular: and even better wive and cheese
    Mickorod Renard: its funny,,its hard to see , when you look at mainstream kids,,that they will be running the country soon..but we go through this every generation
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I have to go Nymf, Mick, and Fox, I'm going to have a hard time thinking of a title for this log ;)
    Nymf Hathaway: and all will follow a cycle
    SophiaSharon Larnia smiles, yes Mick
    Mickorod Renard: bye Sophia s
    Fox Monacular: I wonder though do we really go through in every generation or just since industrial revolution?
    Nymf Hathaway: Have a good evening Sharon, see you later
    Fox Monacular: bye Sophia
    Nymf Hathaway: Hello Reileo96
    Mickorod Renard: Lol,,thats a tough one Fox
    Mickorod Renard: Hi REilo
    Fox Monacular: 'cause children were never really that independent
    Fox Monacular: nor women for that matter
    Mickorod Renard: are you new Reileo?
    Mickorod Renard: to here?
    Fox Monacular: and nuclear family is relatively new in the history of humanity
    Fox Monacular: hi Reileo
    Mickorod Renard: life expectancy would have suggested to me that kids would have become quite responsible earlier
    Mickorod Renard: I gave Reileo a note card
    Fox Monacular: but not in the same way, responsible yes but not expected to be independent
    Nymf Hathaway: Wishes everyone a beautiful rest of the evening or day :) and thanks for the new thoughts :)
    Mickorod Renard: are u going?
    Nymf Hathaway: yes time to log off, a bit tired :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Have a good evening Mickorod :)
    Mickorod Renard: oww,,i spose i have to as well
    Fox Monacular: have a good evening Nymf
    Mickorod Renard: you have a good weekend nymf
    Fox Monacular: yeah, me too
    Mickorod Renard: guess me too,,thanks fox for the consversaytion
    Fox Monacular: bye Mickorod, good talking to you again
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,bye

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