2009.10.07 19:00 - The End of the Long Summer

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    The Guardian for this meeting was  Paradise Tennant. The comments are by Paradise Tennant's.


    doug Sosa: hi.
    Tennant: hiya doug
    doug Sosa: so quiet sometimes.

    Paradise Tennant: how are you this evening :)
    doug Sosa: tired. night before last i started reading a new book and couldn't stop
    doug Sosa: so read all night, then meetings all day yesterday and again this morning and then the long drive home.
    doug Sosa: Yourself?
    Paradise Tennant: hmm that is a nice kind of tired what is the book?
    doug Sosa: well, its The End of the Long Summer.
    Paradise Tennant: hmm do not think I have heard of it
    doug Sosa: A very competent and distressing view of climate.
    Paradise Tennant: ahh
    doug Sosa: 12,000 years of relatively stable warm, looking like coming to an end with unpredictable results.
    Paradise Tennant: all because we fell in love with the automobile?
    doug Sosa: At the same time, though not that night, reading don quixote. great contrast!
    Paradise Tennant: :) indeed been a long time since I read it ...
    doug Sosa: no, not the auto, the long summer would come to an end anyway. in the last 400,000 years
    doug Sosa: only several warm periods as long.
    doug Sosa: or as stable.
    Paradise Tennant: so we are to bundle up
    doug Sosa: well, heating looks like it is first. the tragic effects are on agriculture.
    Paradise Tennant: and populated regions in the developing world
    doug Sosa: yes.
    doug Sosa: Both our understanding and the facts themselves seem to be n a gal up.
    doug Sosa: n-in
    Paradise Tennant: there is confusing science on it
    doug Sosa: the science seems pretty clear. co2 and temp go up and down together, but we have now increased the co2 well beyond the normal cycle.
    Paradise Tennant: is the coming volatility linked to our consumption of resources
    Paradise Tennant: or naturally occurring
    doug Sosa: this within the say 10,000 year cycle
    doug Sosa: both. that is the weird part. It was coming anyway but we seem to have accelerated it.
    Paradise Tennant: how rapid will be the change
    doug Sosa: Interesting little sidelights.
    doug Sosa: like the purple glaze on oily residues by mudflats.
    doug Sosa: is from plankton so ancient the go back to nitrogen rich atmosphere, that being because of the nitrates in runoff from age.
    doug Sosa: support the little fellows.

    doug Sosa: Rapid not sure.
    doug Sosa: 15 min :)
    Paradise  Tennant: ;)
    doug Sosa: historical record from tree rings and ice core drilling suggest changes can be very rapid, few years, and start suddenly.
    Paradise Tennant: we are always part of a much bigger picture
    Paradise Tennant: scary
    doug Sosa: And we have big events going on, the co2 rise, the much more rapid melting - and breaking up - of glaciers.
    doug Sosa: so i couldn't sleep, read the book. figured good to get it behind me. i am much more
    doug Sosa: settled now than i was the other night.
    doug Sosa: Stewart brand is coming out with a new book Wednesday on how tech can solve all the problems.
    Tennant: ;)
    Paradise Tennant: what did you experience in the last 90 secs

    doug Sosa: well, complex feelings.
    doug Sosa: a long conversation today about the difference between looking at humans as logic machines vs. concerned with love, despair, hypocrisy, chagrin...
    Paradise Tennant: lol we are anything but logical
    doug Sosa: much more interesting.
    doug Sosa: the 90 sec for you?
    Paradise Tennant: there is an emotional intelligence I am convinced that is a great processor of information... though sometimes below the surface
    Paradise Tennant: just quiet... long day
    Paradise Tennant: at rest
    doug Sosa: wonderful recent book Philosophical baby, about little ones and how much smarter about feelings than adults.
     Tennant: yes you mentioned it .. will look for it
    doug Sosa: it is really quite thrilling.
    Paradise Tennant: you mentioned you had read temple grandin 's work .. really like her perspective
    doug Sosa: Ah, right. Now i remember. yes. temple too is good.
    doug Sosa: autism is so sad.
    Paradise Tennant: :) she has empathy
    Paradise Tennant: hmm not so sure it is sad
    Paradise Tennant: just different
    Paradise Tennant: not sure...they would comprehend it as a loss because there is a flip side gain
    doug Sosa: yes. There is another book by an autistic mathematician, haven't read it but hear an interview with him on BBC. very impressive cast of mind.
    Tennant: tremendous visual comprehension
    Paradise Tennant: on a blue day ?
    doug Sosa: blue day?
    doug Sosa: ah, book title, maybe that's it.
    Paradise Tennant: that was a lovely book by an autistic savant .. who is perhaps the smartest person in the world on some parameters
    doug Sosa: And why do you read about autism, and if so, what else?
    Paradise Tennant: like science
    Paradise Tennant: history
    Paradise Tennant: biographies
    Paradise Tennant: usually have about five on the go ..
    Paradise Tennant: one that is pure fluff
    doug Sosa: I just read simon schama's American Future, really good.
    doug Sosa: And rereading Polanyi Great Transformation.
    Paradise Tennant: ;)
    doug Sosa: Novels?
    doug Sosa: I am just reading The Welch Woman
    doug Sosa: and Mararet Atwood's new systopic The Flood.
    doug Sosa: dystopic
    Paradise Tennant: she is good ..i have heard her read
    Paradise Tennant: well I just finished What Happens When We Die by Parnia.. rereading brian greene the fabric of the cosmos very very good been dallying through a sense of the world by jason roberts ...nice historical biography
    Paradise Tennant: ;)
    doug Sosa: good these are one's i don't know. from the other side..
    Paradise Tennant: just started why your world is about to get a whole lot smaller by jeff rubin .. a bit repetitive but he has been right more than wrong..
    Tennant: you know we should likely get back to a pab topic of sorts
    doug Sosa: well, interesting question, why aren't these core to PaB?
     Tennant: they are abstractions
    Paradise Tennant: items of interest
    Paradise Tennant: but not reflection
    doug Sosa: why are they not items of reflection?
     Tennant: long way off of reality
    Paradise Tennant: well usually opinion .. argument .. factual .. rhetoric are expressions of the ego
    doug Sosa: so is he economy real?
    Tennant: economies are group think
    Paradise Tennant: is group think real
    doug Sosa: but is that not real?
    Paradise Tennant: or a shared distraction
    doug Sosa: distraction from..?
    Paradise Tennant: i guess the first response would be the true nature of mind
    doug Sosa: but is not that true nature also a collective judgment?
    doug Sosa: part of a culture?
    doug Sosa: culture...
    Tennant: no there is something much more elemental fundamental
    Paradise Tennant: I suspect
    doug Sosa: To me what s important, what l has learned from Pub, is the possibility of looking at experience without categories.
    Paradise Tennant: or judgments
    doug Sosa: "fundamental" privileges some kind of things vs. other kinds of things.
    Tennant: no deeper... beyond... dualistic thought
    Paradise Tennant: there is nondualism
    doug Sosa: yes, experience is not dualistic.
    doug Sosa: it just is.
    Paradise Tennant: think of nondualism as completely out of the box .. of our .. usual mental grid
    Paradise Tennant: beyond the self...the observer... the anything
    doug Sosa: I agree, it is a deep and distressing part of our upbringing, education...
    doug Sosa: i think need to go and let you read five books and not be too exasperated by me. :)
    Paradise Tennant: have a good nite doug .thanks kindly for dropping by .. :))
    doug Sosa: we both dropped by. equal. bye.
    Paradise Tennant: nite nite


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