2009.10.23 13:00 - Various Topics

The Guardian for this meeting was Yakuzza Lethecus. The comments are by Yakuzza Lethecus.

Yakuzza Lethecus: usually it´s more crowded
Yakuzza Lethecus: we log everything around here
Sunfire Langer: I've been to a few before :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: ah, so you know that everything will be posed on our website ?
Yakuzza Lethecus: hi bolo
Bolonath Crystal: hi :)
Sunfire Langer: yep, seen my name there b4
Yakuzza Lethecus: take a pillow
Yakuzza Lethecus: i mean seat :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi everyone
Bolonath Crystal: hi sophia
Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya SSL :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: is it quiet here or just me
Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s quiet
Sunfire Langer: Ssh! :p
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: pema and wol did their session on wednesday
sophia Placebo: greetings
SophiaSharon Larnia: I'm looking forward to your theme meeting Bolonath
Yakuzza Lethecus: hey sophia P
Bolonath Crystal: namaste sophia
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Sophia
Bolonath Crystal: me too, sophia :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: take a pillow/seat sunfire
Sunfire Langer: if I must
SophiaSharon Larnia: i have a lot of questions, but best to save them, I guess
Yakuzza Lethecus: jep
SophiaSharon Larnia: can i ask you one?
SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
Bolonath Crystal: sure
SophiaSharon Larnia: how do buddhists and hindus look at each other beliefs
SophiaSharon Larnia: very broad i know, sorry :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: generally
Bolonath Crystal: yes, and not easy to answer
Bolonath Crystal: ;)
SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
--BELL--
Bolonath Crystal: hinduism consists of many different believes, some very close to buddhism, some nearly the opposite
Bolonath Crystal: the main difference between buddhism and hinduism ist the authority of the vedas in hinduism
Bolonath Crystal: philosophically the advaita vedanta and buddhism are nearly the same
SophiaSharon Larnia: the two do seem very silimar to me, i was looking at them both as the same idea
SophiaSharon Larnia: but the difference of the vedas vs buddhist texts, yes, i see where the difference lies (for some) :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: ive read some things that seemed brb
SophiaSharon Larnia: oops, that seemed like one was disparaging the other
sophia Placebo: *:::* WELCOME BACK *:::*
SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
Bolonath Crystal: sorry, i have troubles with my connection
SophiaSharon Larnia: me too a bit laggy here
SophiaSharon Larnia: I just said that ive read some things that seemed like one was disparaging the other
SophiaSharon Larnia: and it seems odd to me that this would be so inbelief systems that are not monothiestic
Bolonath Crystal: funny thing is, that hindus and buddhist rarely meet
SophiaSharon Larnia: even if the dieties are viewed at emanations
SophiaSharon Larnia: as*
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Mickorod
Mickorod Renard: hi
Bolonath Crystal: namaste mick
Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya mick
Mickorod Renard: all ok?
Yakuzza Lethecus: sure, thx, you too ?
SophiaSharon Larnia: :) Mick
Sunfire Langer: so-so
Mickorod Renard: good
Bolonath Crystal: some of the hindus see buddha as an incarnation of vishnu
sophia Placebo: hi mick
Mickorod Renard: hiya sophia
Yakuzza Lethecus: how was the book session on wednesday mick ?
Bolonath Crystal: hi ara
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Bolonath, why dont they meet? In this day and age it seems there would be more discorse
Yakuzza Lethecus: hi ara
Mickorod Renard: ho ara
arabella Ella: hiya
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Arabella
Bolonath Crystal: well, i think there are mainly historical reasons
SophiaSharon Larnia: ah yes
Bolonath Crystal: buddhists and hindus have been competitors once
Mickorod Renard: what book session Yaku?
Yakuzza Lethecus: on varela´s book
Yakuzza Lethecus: ethicak know how and cogniction
Mickorod Renard: yikes,,was I there?
Yakuzza Lethecus: ah, i thought so sry
Mickorod Renard: he he
Yakuzza Lethecus: it was too late for me
SophiaSharon Larnia: I went and it was great, go if you can
SophiaSharon Larnia: lol Mick
Mickorod Renard: I think i must have missed it,,but i go so many places I may have forgot
--BELL--
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Eliza
Bolonath Crystal: hello eliza
sophia Placebo: hi eliza :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: hey eliza
Mickorod Renard: hi Eliza
arabella Ella: Hiya Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bolo, Sunfire,Sophia,SophiaSharon,Yakuzza, Ara, and Mick!
Mickorod Renard: Stims may have been good lastnight but unfortunately I couldnt hear much
Mickorod Renard: the skype didnt work well for me
Eliza Madrigal: I was surprised the audio is already posted
Yakuzza Lethecus: gaya got the perfect audio :)
Eliza Madrigal: Unfortunate that sound quality isn't great for skype or for SL yet
sophia Placebo: i was thinking about future
sophia Placebo: hi plia !
Eliza Madrigal: future, Sophia?
Sunfire Langer: yes, sophia?
Mickorod Renard: yes?
arabella Ella: Hiya Pila
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Pila :)
Mickorod Renard: hi Pila
Pila Mulligan: greetings everyone
Bolonath Crystal: hi pila
Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya pila :)
Mickorod Renard: I couldnt work with skype lastnight either pila
Pila Mulligan: :)
sophia Placebo: how far in time do our current actions would detremine our future ?
arabella Ella: so is the audio being posted on the WoK wiki or not?
Mickorod Renard: If I may say,,,its sort of spoiling the sessions in Wok for me
Eliza Madrigal: Sophia, neat question
Sunfire Langer: I think theres a difference between how our actions and how our thoughts would affect the future
Mickorod Renard: just reading your question Sophia,,tryin to work it out
SophiaSharon Larnia: i dont really think there is a limit, Sophia, but then what is time
Eliza Madrigal: (And to Mick, Stim said we prob won't continue in voice and the audio is on the site now :) )
Mickorod Renard: thanks Eliza
sophia Placebo: the common term sophia
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi PIla just saw you
Pila Mulligan: hi Sharon :)
sophia Placebo: i meant the commonly used term *
Eliza Madrigal: Well, I guess there are different types of actions? Therefore different times?
Mickorod Renard: can you rephrase the question again Sophia p,,please?
SophiaSharon Larnia: i still dont think theres a limit, energy expended is energy responsible for
sophia Placebo: thoughts dont affect unless they are expressed no ?
arabella Ella: thoughts can affect the individual though
arabella Ella: and the individual affects others
Eliza Madrigal nods. Thoughts can be expressed an all kinds of ways
Sunfire Langer: I dont know, thoughts that we have to reflect on ourselves and how we view the world can redefine the way we act, so I would say thoughts have a longer determination of the future, sophia
Mickorod Renard: yes, our thoughts drive the choices we may make in the future
arabella Ella: and our moods too and feelings
sophia Placebo: ok mick , lets say one got a heart attack ,that heart attack was detremine along with his genes and stuff from the very beging when he decide not to modefy his life style
Mickorod Renard: but its questionable how much effect our contoling ways have
sophia Placebo: im not asking about genes but about actions and casaced of events that follow , that leads to some fixed result in the future
Mickorod Renard: well,,thats an intersting concept
Eliza Madrigal: Sure, there can be a cumulative effect to things... one less burger a week might make a big difference... 10 years even?
Mickorod Renard: I am most likely at the age i will find the answer
arabella Ella: well thoughts could lead someone to be in such a foul mood that the mood could affect his or her relationships too
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Eliza Madrigal: Or...not at all. Some genetic inclinations seem quite stubborn, others malleable
arabella Ella: true
sophia Placebo: sun then those thoughts are expressed . hmm some popele fantasies are not expressed , fantasies are thoughts
sophia Placebo: he vanished *
arabella Ella: but dont fantasies affect the way people act in certain circumstances?
sophia Placebo: maybe maybe not
Eliza Madrigal: yes I think so, and also there are times when we become interested in something for 'no reason' and then begin to bring that into our lives somehow...
arabella Ella: even if fantasies or wishful thinking is supressed surely it affects the individual one way or another
Eliza Madrigal: so that 20 years later it may be a real part of our life
--BELL--
arabella Ella: is it possible Eliza to be interested in something 'for no reason'?
Mickorod Renard: If I acted out my fantacies I would not last long
Eliza Madrigal: Well that's a good question Ara :) Maybe we make reasons after we become interested sometimes too?
arabella Ella: i think there is always a reason ... acknowledged or not
Eliza Madrigal: hidden motives... maybe even from ourselves
arabella Ella: yes
Eliza Madrigal: Is there another way you are looking at this Sophia?
sophia Placebo: i was thinking about dreams that went true
Eliza Madrigal: :) oh wow, nice
Eliza Madrigal: (I hope?)
sophia Placebo: and thought how long some lasts befor the become real
arabella Ella: Ah ... time's arrow ... such a mystery
sophia Placebo: then thought how long one current action may detremine his fututer that his subcounciuse might calculate it for him
sophia Placebo: bizzare idea
Eliza Madrigal: Oh, really neat idea
Eliza Madrigal: I think that happens definitely
Mickorod Renard: slow down,,trying to keep up with the thread
Eliza Madrigal: we work in the dark
arabella Ella: do you think our sub conscious could really make such calculations sophia?
Pila Mulligan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreams_Of_The_Future
Mickorod Renard: I have had at least two profound dreams that took almost exactly a year to come true
sophia Placebo: mick it is really easy , you kill some one you go to jail after months , what about giving someone charity ? what event casacde would happen and would that affect you
Mickorod Renard: I see
sophia Placebo: how long would it take to affect you
Eliza Madrigal: "No act of kindness is ever wasted"
Eliza Madrigal: Now I see how this ties in with genetics. Genes can lay dormant until conditions act on them
sophia Placebo: i dont know ara , it was just a thought
Mickorod Renard: I recently got the idea that reward from ones actions should not be expected in this lifetime..and if they are its a bonus
Eliza Madrigal: I like that idea, Mick
Mickorod Renard: but incidently,,I feel reward in myself from at least giving some relief to others
Mickorod Renard: and that is sufficient
Bolonath Crystal: tha bhagavad gita says that reward from ones actions should not be expected at all. it leads to attachment
Eliza Madrigal: though, when my kids do well for instance, there is a sense of something 'set up' well for them... or a chance given
Mickorod Renard: yes,,I have tried to detach from that desire
Eliza Madrigal nods... maybe it keeps us thinking small, looking for reward, etc
SophiaSharon Larnia: even if you dont expect reward, its hard to detach from the feeling that you did something 'good' that day
Mickorod Renard: I think this is why its better to condition onesself tpo reasonable ethical behavior out of habit,,so as there is no need to force the issue with needs of reward
Eliza Madrigal: to me there seem to be levels... from the deep to the surface
Eliza Madrigal: when I water the lawn, I want to see it grow in this lifetime :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
Mickorod Renard: in my good deeds I feel reward in the same way as seeing a beautiful flower or animal
Eliza Madrigal: MMM, yes maybe rewards aren't usually direct... give a dollar, see a nice sunrise
Eliza Madrigal: :) Who knows
Eliza Madrigal: haha
sophia Placebo: i need to go , see you all soon
arabella Ella: bye sophia
Bolonath Crystal: doing something in the expectation of being rewarded is a kind of business actually. i like the way you look at it, mick
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Sophia, thanks for the idea
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Sophia
Bolonath Crystal: bye sophia
Pila Mulligan: bye Sophia
Mickorod Renard: my frustration is ,,that I do not have to time or ability to effect enough good events
Mickorod Renard: bye Sophia
Eliza Madrigal: Sure you do, Mick
Mickorod Renard: I try
Mickorod Renard: It does seem a challenge sometimes,,like a test,,because I often would like others to be nice to me,,and it often is not forthcomming
SophiaSharon Larnia: i know what you mean Mick :)
Mickorod Renard: ;)
Eliza Madrigal: we never know what weighs more or less, do we?
Mickorod Renard: no
--BELL--
Eliza Madrigal: maybe that's where those hidden thoughts come in Ara?
arabella Ella: maybe
Bolonath Crystal: gotta go
Pila Mulligan: bye Bolonath
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bolo, I'm really looking forward to Monday
SophiaSharon Larnia: Bye Bolonath
Bolonath Crystal: bye all, om shanti :)
arabella Ella: bye Bolonath
Pila Mulligan: shanti
Eliza Madrigal: Om Shanti :)
Mickorod Renard: I think sometimes there is a balancing force,,and for the good we do there must be bad in balance,,this I sometimes think I keep to myself for fear of releasing it into the world
Mickorod Renard: bye Bol
Mickorod Renard: but just a silly thought
Pila Mulligan: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: interesting point Mick, one I've thought many times, it is dualistic though
Mickorod Renard: yes
Eliza Madrigal: hm, interesting
Mickorod Renard: from a christian point of view,,I was told that Jesus takes away the bad for us
Mickorod Renard: in diferenrt words,,so dont quote me
Eliza Madrigal: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Mickorod Renard: It is not our role to hold peoples grief etc
SophiaSharon Larnia: what would happen if we did take resposibility for our actions, not place this grace for someone else to do
Eliza Madrigal: hm quite an angle... thinking
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes too braod, i do have to go LOL
Mickorod Renard: its better to move forward in a positive manner
Eliza Madrigal: In a conversation recently with a Christian friend we talked about what does "it is finished' mean....
Eliza Madrigal: that grace is available
Eliza Madrigal: hehe SophiaSharon, Bye for now then :))
Mickorod Renard: bye Sophia
Pila Mulligan: bye Sharon
SophiaSharon Larnia: yea running late, again, bye for now
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: ;)
Eliza Madrigal: So to me, 'finished' means *we* keep grace at bay
Mickorod Renard: a bit sdeep for me too
Eliza Madrigal: donno... have been thinking of many of Jesus's lines lately... like "If you bring forth what is in you it will save you, and if you do not bring forth what is in you, what you don't bring forth will destroy you"
Eliza Madrigal: He's a radical
Eliza Madrigal giggle
Mickorod Renard: but its no good dwelling on the negative,,for sure that would keep evil alive
Eliza Madrigal: yes, dwelling on grace is perhaps better :)
Eliza Madrigal: (My daughter just walked behind me a few minutes ago and said "You have a guy from the russian mafia?"
Eliza Madrigal: re Yakuzzas name)
Mickorod Renard: ok,,I think i need to water my sl garden
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: the gaurdian one,,I neglect it
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Mick
Pila Mulligan slips away also --bye for now
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Pila :)
Mickorod Renard: bye,,be well
arabella Ella: nite all gotta go too :)
Eliza Madrigal: Nite Ara , love the purple dress, btw
arabella Ella: thanks :)
Eliza Madrigal: Nite Yakuzza