2009.10.23 13:00 - Various Topics

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Yakuzza Lethecus. The comments are by Yakuzza Lethecus.

    Yakuzza Lethecus: usually it´s more crowded
    Yakuzza Lethecus: we log everything around here
    Sunfire Langer: I've been to a few before :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: ah, so you know that everything will be posed on our website ?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi bolo
    Bolonath Crystal: hi :)
    Sunfire Langer: yep, seen my name there b4
    Yakuzza Lethecus: take a pillow
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i mean seat :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi everyone
    Bolonath Crystal: hi sophia
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya SSL :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: is it quiet here or just me
    Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s quiet
    Sunfire Langer: Ssh! :p
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: pema and wol did their session on wednesday
    sophia Placebo: greetings
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I'm looking forward to your theme meeting Bolonath
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey sophia P
    Bolonath Crystal: namaste sophia
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Sophia
    Bolonath Crystal: me too, sophia :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: take a pillow/seat sunfire
    Sunfire Langer: if I must
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i have a lot of questions, but best to save them, I guess
    Yakuzza Lethecus: jep
    SophiaSharon Larnia: can i ask you one?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
    Bolonath Crystal: sure
    SophiaSharon Larnia: how do buddhists and hindus look at each other beliefs
    SophiaSharon Larnia: very broad i know, sorry :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: generally
    Bolonath Crystal: yes, and not easy to answer
    Bolonath Crystal: ;)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
    --BELL--
    Bolonath Crystal: hinduism consists of many different believes, some very close to buddhism, some nearly the opposite
    Bolonath Crystal: the main difference between buddhism and hinduism ist the authority of the vedas in hinduism
    Bolonath Crystal: philosophically the advaita vedanta and buddhism are nearly the same
    SophiaSharon Larnia: the two do seem very silimar to me, i was looking at them both as the same idea
    SophiaSharon Larnia: but the difference of the vedas vs buddhist texts, yes, i see where the difference lies (for some) :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ive read some things that seemed brb
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oops, that seemed like one was disparaging the other
    sophia Placebo: *:::* WELCOME BACK *:::*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
    Bolonath Crystal: sorry, i have troubles with my connection
    SophiaSharon Larnia: me too a bit laggy here
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I just said that ive read some things that seemed like one was disparaging the other
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and it seems odd to me that this would be so inbelief systems that are not monothiestic
    Bolonath Crystal: funny thing is, that hindus and buddhist rarely meet
    SophiaSharon Larnia: even if the dieties are viewed at emanations
    SophiaSharon Larnia: as*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Mickorod
    Mickorod Renard: hi
    Bolonath Crystal: namaste mick
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya mick
    Mickorod Renard: all ok?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: sure, thx, you too ?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :) Mick
    Sunfire Langer: so-so
    Mickorod Renard: good
    Bolonath Crystal: some of the hindus see buddha as an incarnation of vishnu
    sophia Placebo: hi mick
    Mickorod Renard: hiya sophia
    Yakuzza Lethecus: how was the book session on wednesday mick ?
    Bolonath Crystal: hi ara
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Bolonath, why dont they meet? In this day and age it seems there would be more discorse
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi ara
    Mickorod Renard: ho ara
    arabella Ella: hiya
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Arabella
    Bolonath Crystal: well, i think there are mainly historical reasons
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ah yes
    Bolonath Crystal: buddhists and hindus have been competitors once
    Mickorod Renard: what book session Yaku?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: on varela´s book
    Yakuzza Lethecus: ethicak know how and cogniction
    Mickorod Renard: yikes,,was I there?
    Yakuzza Lethecus: ah, i thought so sry
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Yakuzza Lethecus: it was too late for me
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I went and it was great, go if you can
    SophiaSharon Larnia: lol Mick
    Mickorod Renard: I think i must have missed it,,but i go so many places I may have forgot
    --BELL--
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Eliza
    Bolonath Crystal: hello eliza
    sophia Placebo: hi eliza :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey eliza
    Mickorod Renard: hi Eliza
    arabella Ella: Hiya Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bolo, Sunfire,Sophia,SophiaSharon,Yakuzza, Ara, and Mick!
    Mickorod Renard: Stims may have been good lastnight but unfortunately I couldnt hear much
    Mickorod Renard: the skype didnt work well for me
    Eliza Madrigal: I was surprised the audio is already posted
    Yakuzza Lethecus: gaya got the perfect audio :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Unfortunate that sound quality isn't great for skype or for SL yet
    sophia Placebo: i was thinking about future
    sophia Placebo: hi plia !
    Eliza Madrigal: future, Sophia?
    Sunfire Langer: yes, sophia?
    Mickorod Renard: yes?
    arabella Ella: Hiya Pila
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Pila :)
    Mickorod Renard: hi Pila
    Pila Mulligan: greetings everyone
    Bolonath Crystal: hi pila
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hiya pila :)
    Mickorod Renard: I couldnt work with skype lastnight either pila
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    sophia Placebo: how far in time do our current actions would detremine our future ?
    arabella Ella: so is the audio being posted on the WoK wiki or not?
    Mickorod Renard: If I may say,,,its sort of spoiling the sessions in Wok for me
    Eliza Madrigal: Sophia, neat question
    Sunfire Langer: I think theres a difference between how our actions and how our thoughts would affect the future
    Mickorod Renard: just reading your question Sophia,,tryin to work it out
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i dont really think there is a limit, Sophia, but then what is time
    Eliza Madrigal: (And to Mick, Stim said we prob won't continue in voice and the audio is on the site now :) )
    Mickorod Renard: thanks Eliza
    sophia Placebo: the common term sophia
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi PIla just saw you
    Pila Mulligan: hi Sharon :)
    sophia Placebo: i meant the commonly used term *
    Eliza Madrigal: Well, I guess there are different types of actions? Therefore different times?
    Mickorod Renard: can you rephrase the question again Sophia p,,please?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i still dont think theres a limit, energy expended is energy responsible for
    sophia Placebo: thoughts dont affect unless they are expressed no ?
    arabella Ella: thoughts can affect the individual though
    arabella Ella: and the individual affects others
    Eliza Madrigal nods. Thoughts can be expressed an all kinds of ways
    Sunfire Langer: I dont know, thoughts that we have to reflect on ourselves and how we view the world can redefine the way we act, so I would say thoughts have a longer determination of the future, sophia
    Mickorod Renard: yes, our thoughts drive the choices we may make in the future
    arabella Ella: and our moods too and feelings
    sophia Placebo: ok mick , lets say one got a heart attack ,that heart attack was detremine along with his genes and stuff from the very beging when he decide not to modefy his life style
    Mickorod Renard: but its questionable how much effect our contoling ways have
    sophia Placebo: im not asking about genes but about actions and casaced of events that follow , that leads to some fixed result in the future
    Mickorod Renard: well,,thats an intersting concept
    Eliza Madrigal: Sure, there can be a cumulative effect to things... one less burger a week might make a big difference... 10 years even?
    Mickorod Renard: I am most likely at the age i will find the answer
    arabella Ella: well thoughts could lead someone to be in such a foul mood that the mood could affect his or her relationships too
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Or...not at all. Some genetic inclinations seem quite stubborn, others malleable
    arabella Ella: true
    sophia Placebo: sun then those thoughts are expressed . hmm some popele fantasies are not expressed , fantasies are thoughts
    sophia Placebo: he vanished *
    arabella Ella: but dont fantasies affect the way people act in certain circumstances?
    sophia Placebo: maybe maybe not
    Eliza Madrigal: yes I think so, and also there are times when we become interested in something for 'no reason' and then begin to bring that into our lives somehow...
    arabella Ella: even if fantasies or wishful thinking is supressed surely it affects the individual one way or another
    Eliza Madrigal: so that 20 years later it may be a real part of our life
    --BELL--
    arabella Ella: is it possible Eliza to be interested in something 'for no reason'?
    Mickorod Renard: If I acted out my fantacies I would not last long
    Eliza Madrigal: Well that's a good question Ara :) Maybe we make reasons after we become interested sometimes too?
    arabella Ella: i think there is always a reason ... acknowledged or not
    Eliza Madrigal: hidden motives... maybe even from ourselves
    arabella Ella: yes
    Eliza Madrigal: Is there another way you are looking at this Sophia?
    sophia Placebo: i was thinking about dreams that went true
    Eliza Madrigal: :) oh wow, nice
    Eliza Madrigal: (I hope?)
    sophia Placebo: and thought how long some lasts befor the become real
    arabella Ella: Ah ... time's arrow ... such a mystery
    sophia Placebo: then thought how long one current action may detremine his fututer that his subcounciuse might calculate it for him
    sophia Placebo: bizzare idea
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh, really neat idea
    Eliza Madrigal: I think that happens definitely
    Mickorod Renard: slow down,,trying to keep up with the thread
    Eliza Madrigal: we work in the dark
    arabella Ella: do you think our sub conscious could really make such calculations sophia?
    Pila Mulligan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreams_Of_The_Future
    Mickorod Renard: I have had at least two profound dreams that took almost exactly a year to come true
    sophia Placebo: mick it is really easy , you kill some one you go to jail after months , what about giving someone charity ? what event casacde would happen and would that affect you
    Mickorod Renard: I see
    sophia Placebo: how long would it take to affect you
    Eliza Madrigal: "No act of kindness is ever wasted"
    Eliza Madrigal: Now I see how this ties in with genetics. Genes can lay dormant until conditions act on them
    sophia Placebo: i dont know ara , it was just a thought
    Mickorod Renard: I recently got the idea that reward from ones actions should not be expected in this lifetime..and if they are its a bonus
    Eliza Madrigal: I like that idea, Mick
    Mickorod Renard: but incidently,,I feel reward in myself from at least giving some relief to others
    Mickorod Renard: and that is sufficient
    Bolonath Crystal: tha bhagavad gita says that reward from ones actions should not be expected at all. it leads to attachment
    Eliza Madrigal: though, when my kids do well for instance, there is a sense of something 'set up' well for them... or a chance given
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,I have tried to detach from that desire
    Eliza Madrigal nods... maybe it keeps us thinking small, looking for reward, etc
    SophiaSharon Larnia: even if you dont expect reward, its hard to detach from the feeling that you did something 'good' that day
    Mickorod Renard: I think this is why its better to condition onesself tpo reasonable ethical behavior out of habit,,so as there is no need to force the issue with needs of reward
    Eliza Madrigal: to me there seem to be levels... from the deep to the surface
    Eliza Madrigal: when I water the lawn, I want to see it grow in this lifetime :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
    Mickorod Renard: in my good deeds I feel reward in the same way as seeing a beautiful flower or animal
    Eliza Madrigal: MMM, yes maybe rewards aren't usually direct... give a dollar, see a nice sunrise
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Who knows
    Eliza Madrigal: haha
    sophia Placebo: i need to go , see you all soon
    arabella Ella: bye sophia
    Bolonath Crystal: doing something in the expectation of being rewarded is a kind of business actually. i like the way you look at it, mick
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Sophia, thanks for the idea
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Sophia
    Bolonath Crystal: bye sophia
    Pila Mulligan: bye Sophia
    Mickorod Renard: my frustration is ,,that I do not have to time or ability to effect enough good events
    Mickorod Renard: bye Sophia
    Eliza Madrigal: Sure you do, Mick
    Mickorod Renard: I try
    Mickorod Renard: It does seem a challenge sometimes,,like a test,,because I often would like others to be nice to me,,and it often is not forthcomming
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i know what you mean Mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: we never know what weighs more or less, do we?
    Mickorod Renard: no
    --BELL--
    Eliza Madrigal: maybe that's where those hidden thoughts come in Ara?
    arabella Ella: maybe
    Bolonath Crystal: gotta go
    Pila Mulligan: bye Bolonath
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bolo, I'm really looking forward to Monday
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Bye Bolonath
    Bolonath Crystal: bye all, om shanti :)
    arabella Ella: bye Bolonath
    Pila Mulligan: shanti
    Eliza Madrigal: Om Shanti :)
    Mickorod Renard: I think sometimes there is a balancing force,,and for the good we do there must be bad in balance,,this I sometimes think I keep to myself for fear of releasing it into the world
    Mickorod Renard: bye Bol
    Mickorod Renard: but just a silly thought
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: interesting point Mick, one I've thought many times, it is dualistic though
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Eliza Madrigal: hm, interesting
    Mickorod Renard: from a christian point of view,,I was told that Jesus takes away the bad for us
    Mickorod Renard: in diferenrt words,,so dont quote me
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Mickorod Renard: It is not our role to hold peoples grief etc
    SophiaSharon Larnia: what would happen if we did take resposibility for our actions, not place this grace for someone else to do
    Eliza Madrigal: hm quite an angle... thinking
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes too braod, i do have to go LOL
    Mickorod Renard: its better to move forward in a positive manner
    Eliza Madrigal: In a conversation recently with a Christian friend we talked about what does "it is finished' mean....
    Eliza Madrigal: that grace is available
    Eliza Madrigal: hehe SophiaSharon, Bye for now then :))
    Mickorod Renard: bye Sophia
    Pila Mulligan: bye Sharon
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yea running late, again, bye for now
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mickorod Renard: ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: So to me, 'finished' means *we* keep grace at bay
    Mickorod Renard: a bit sdeep for me too
    Eliza Madrigal: donno... have been thinking of many of Jesus's lines lately... like "If you bring forth what is in you it will save you, and if you do not bring forth what is in you, what you don't bring forth will destroy you"
    Eliza Madrigal: He's a radical
    Eliza Madrigal giggle
    Mickorod Renard: but its no good dwelling on the negative,,for sure that would keep evil alive
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, dwelling on grace is perhaps better :)
    Eliza Madrigal: (My daughter just walked behind me a few minutes ago and said "You have a guy from the russian mafia?"
    Eliza Madrigal: re Yakuzzas name)
    Mickorod Renard: ok,,I think i need to water my sl garden
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mickorod Renard: the gaurdian one,,I neglect it
    Eliza Madrigal smiles
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Mick
    Pila Mulligan slips away also --bye for now
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Pila :)
    Mickorod Renard: bye,,be well
    arabella Ella: nite all gotta go too :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Nite Ara , love the purple dress, btw
    arabella Ella: thanks :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Nite Yakuzza
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