2009.12.06 01:00 - Warm tea and reality

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    Moon Fargis: morning cal
    Moon Fargis: brrrrrr storrm came on the great idea of a, snowstorm...
    Calvino Rabeni: Hello Moon.
    Moon Fargis: got some warm socks on ?
    Moon Fargis: :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Care for some tea?
    Moon Fargis: ofcourse not, my inventory is full of it, sluroing white tea atm in rl :)
    Moon Fargis: <- teajunky
    Calvino Rabeni: Same
    Calvino Rabeni: Am I levitating?
    Moon Fargis: yep
    Moon Fargis: ^^
    Moon Fargis: feeling high ?:)
    Calvino Rabeni: Levity
    Calvino Rabeni: Your rotating wheel?
    Moon Fargis: ahyes got replaced now by this witergarden
    Moon Fargis: they attach to the same spot
    Moon Fargis: ahno
    Moon Fargis: there it is
    Moon Fargis: strange
    Moon Fargis: must have changed that
    Moon Fargis: ahyes, all about the wheel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dharmacakra
    Moon Fargis: (being lazy this morning :)
    Moon Fargis: btw was it yu with the knowledge of egypt star mentiond ?
    Calvino Rabeni: I don't think it was me.
    Moon Fargis: ok:)
    Calvino Rabeni: Voice chat invite, eh?
    Moon Fargis: hm?
    Moon Fargis: who ?
    Calvino Rabeni: Popup from Xango Soulstar. Spam perhaps.
    Moon Fargis: might be
    Calvino Rabeni: I'm thinking of building a wheel.
    Moon Fargis: ah a dharma wheel ?
    Calvino Rabeni: It will calculate the Changes.
    Calvino Rabeni: Slide rule of the Yijing.
    Moon Fargis: aha
    Calvino Rabeni: Good day / eve, Boo, wherever U are.
    Calvino Rabeni: Bolo
    Moon Fargis: dont see him )
    Moon Fargis: btw
    Calvino Rabeni: Gone now
    Moon Fargis: i atatched not the normal wheel
    Moon Fargis: see that small bracelet on it ?
    Moon Fargis: on the back
    Moon Fargis: ehh the
    Moon Fargis: gem
    Calvino Rabeni: I see a small rectangular lump on my poor computer
    Moon Fargis: ok :)
    Moon Fargis: this one takes exactly 9 seconds for a full circle
    Moon Fargis: done thah long time ago for pema :)
    Moon Fargis: so everyone who stared at my wheel and have the 9 sec, have a measuring
    Moon Fargis: but well..since now its 90 seconds it doesnt fit
    Calvino Rabeni: Hmm, an hourglass timer could be fun, for 90 seconds.
    Moon Fargis: hmm well there was several stuff i the history
    Moon Fargis: of pab
    Moon Fargis: we hadl ong time a bell here
    Moon Fargis: wich made a *gonnnng*
    Moon Fargis: wich lastes exactly 9 seconds
    Moon Fargis: i also made a watch
    Moon Fargis: to wear
    Moon Fargis: wich makes a gonnng
    Calvino Rabeni: This ice and tree behind me is impressive. I just realized it is part of you avatar
    Calvino Rabeni: What is your favorite aspect of PAB?
    Moon Fargis: ah sorry was away for a sec
    Moon Fargis: ah morning nymf
    Nymf Hathaway: Hi Moon... magical environment creater :) hello Calvino :)
    Moon Fargis: ^^
    Moon Fargis: favorite aspect of pab , would say the people :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Thank you :))
    Moon Fargis: yw ^^
    Moon Fargis: *slurps the rest of his tea in rl*
    Moon Fargis: 0.8 litre cans are always to less :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Just woke up...coffee is doing its thing :)
    Moon Fargis: (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V447-Pbs8-k)
    Moon Fargis: ahyes, if youre intrested in warmer areas, we just opend a new sim yesterday, egypt theme with beaches and temples
    Nymf Hathaway: Thanks Moon...for the video as well:)
    Calvino Rabeni: TY Moon
    Moon Fargis: ^^ ill head there now, still lots of stuff todo there
    Moon Fargis: was nice to seeyou again ^^
    Nymf Hathaway: Have a beautiful day :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Same here :)
    Moon Fargis: you too ^^
    Calvino Rabeni: Care to discuss anything, Nymf?
    Nymf Hathaway: Oh yes :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Anything is fine :)
    Calvino Rabeni: What are you learning that is new?
    Nymf Hathaway: Nice question.... being dependant that would be
    Calvino Rabeni: A change in living situation?
    Nymf Hathaway: Always have been active... taking charge and now broke my foot :( and need help for everything :(
    Nymf Hathaway: Thats not like me... so a real challenge :)
    Nymf Hathaway: And you...whats your lesson for this month?
    Calvino Rabeni: hmm
    Calvino Rabeni: Some changes with meeting new people - it broaden's one's horizons. In RL as well as the Kira group
    Nymf Hathaway: Agrees...new people show you new ways to think and experience life
    Calvino Rabeni: It used to feel compartmentalized, now it feels like there is a movement of knowledge between the different people and groups
    Calvino Rabeni: Is it me, or a characteristic of the times we live in?
    Calvino Rabeni: That's one thing I wondered
    Nymf Hathaway: oooh nice thought: Is it me, or a characteristic of the times we live in?
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, perhaps there is some kind of phase transition happening
    Calvino Rabeni: Or perhaps it is just, I have time to develop the relationships
    Calvino Rabeni: I would like ot have some objectivity
    Calvino Rabeni: Kira / PAB for instance, seems poised between being a network and being a community of practice
    Nymf Hathaway: I haven't been here for a while...so the recent changes within the Kira/Pab group I didn't experience :(
    Calvino Rabeni: What is your perspective over time?
    Nymf Hathaway: But.... changes in life is all we really have... next to the certainty of death in the end
    Nymf Hathaway: I stopped with Pab due to the fact I like to discuss relity more than metaphysics
    Nymf Hathaway: reality
    Calvino Rabeni: Somewhat frustrated perhaps?
    Nymf Hathaway: No:)
    Calvino Rabeni: Can you give an example of discussing reality to you preferences?
    Nymf Hathaway: I am not frustrated easily...long before I get there.. I will be gone :)
    Nymf Hathaway: a sec please
    Calvino Rabeni: Nipped it in the bud.
    Calvino Rabeni: Proactively
    Nymf Hathaway: Back, my daughter needed me for a sec :)
    Nymf Hathaway: well... just the world around us would be nice... and yes that includes almost everything :)
    Calvino Rabeni: But not so much, metaphysics
    Nymf Hathaway: Less I would say
    Calvino Rabeni: It is a kind of virtual reality
    Nymf Hathaway: yes indeed
    Calvino Rabeni: Just the right amount gets made up as needed.
    Nymf Hathaway: Is it this quiet lately...or just coincidence?
    Calvino Rabeni: It varies, at this time slot sometimes a lot of talk, but only a few people
    Calvino Rabeni: Moon did not seem talkative.
    Calvino Rabeni: On other nights (my time) at this slot, there were 2.5 hour busy discussions
    Nymf Hathaway: Thats great
    Nymf Hathaway: You are in America?
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, and you?
    Nymf Hathaway: Netherlands
    Calvino Rabeni: Good place to be
    Calvino Rabeni: My own thoughts rarely tend to metaphysics
    Nymf Hathaway: Yes it is... we have an islamatic discussion lately which makes it at times harsh but other than that... I love it
    Calvino Rabeni: I heard about some of that
    Nymf Hathaway: sadly enough :(
    Nymf Hathaway: Media provides attention to those who shouldn't get it :)
    Calvino Rabeni: True. I recommend a fast.
    Calvino Rabeni: Actually media ecology is interesting
    Calvino Rabeni: I think most of my thoughts are culturally embedded rather than in a metaphysical background
    Nymf Hathaway: Agrees... although the som of it makes you think it has to change
    Nymf Hathaway: Free speech for example... we have a long long tradition in it... but where did responsibility go?
    Calvino Rabeni: We have known that for a while.
    Calvino Rabeni: One idea is that there are dynamics that will seek a balance between freedom and relationship
    Calvino Rabeni: Over a long period of time, perhaps.
    Calvino Rabeni: A viewpoint of technological determinism may say something else.
    Nymf Hathaway: Freedom and relationships... can you give an example?
    Calvino Rabeni: People have psychological drives for connection with others, at some cost in indepence.
    Calvino Rabeni: Depending on their age, their interest varies.
    Nymf Hathaway: Agrees
    Calvino Rabeni: Technology creates freedom from need to cooperate in groups.
    Calvino Rabeni: But can lead to alienation
    Calvino Rabeni: Religion is a well-known binding factor for groups
    Calvino Rabeni: Economic aid can destabilize traditional cultures
    Nymf Hathaway: and where did the self-awareness go to make sure you (as a person) will prevent such from happening (alienation) because we all know... we need each other to act and stay healthy
    Calvino Rabeni: There may not be as much self-awareness as you might think.
    Nymf Hathaway: Are you religious?
    Calvino Rabeni: Maybe there never was.
    Calvino Rabeni: Maybe it was social thinking
    Nymf Hathaway: Really? :))
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes
    Nymf Hathaway: I cannot agree I think
    Calvino Rabeni: When social thinking breaks down, there is a need for individual thinking
    Nymf Hathaway: It starts with oneself
    Calvino Rabeni: There are two perspectives, one is "is" and the other is "ought"
    Calvino Rabeni: Descriptive vs prescriptive, actual vs potential.
    Calvino Rabeni: or ideal
    Nymf Hathaway: Yes that might be true... thats said more often to me
    Calvino Rabeni: Often I've noticed when people are talking at cross purposes, something like that is going on.
    Calvino Rabeni: I think if one looked at the PAB chat logs, both of those perspectives would stand out.
    Nymf Hathaway: we tend to experience people to ones own thinking...atleast I seem to fall into it often
    Calvino Rabeni: That is a temptation... awareness reveals, what a difference in awareness there is between people everywhere.
    Nymf Hathaway: Yes thats interesting about people, groups and interactions :)
    Calvino Rabeni: I think, most people seek out company of others they already understand well.
    Calvino Rabeni: Instead of those who confuse or puzzle them.
    Nymf Hathaway: Familiar simularities, you mean?
    Nymf Hathaway: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: And some seem to think everybody is like them. :)
    Nymf Hathaway: That explains the power of majority as well
    Nymf Hathaway: yes :)
    Calvino Rabeni: It is good to have had relationships with different kinds of people.
    Nymf Hathaway: I agree
    Calvino Rabeni: I try to keep in mind, who lives over my horizon.
    Nymf Hathaway: Thats a great thing
    Calvino Rabeni: Figuratively. But I have liked travel.
    Nymf Hathaway: I can say I aim for the same... but acknowlegde I am not always successful at it :(
    Calvino Rabeni: It can be disturbing, I found, and a certain courage seems to help when I think about it.
    Nymf Hathaway: Yes courage is half the winning
    Calvino Rabeni: Everybody I think, has some different group of people who are the outsiders.
    Nymf Hathaway: Seems all of mankinds real problems are about being Scared... thats the root
    Nymf Hathaway: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: And they "delegate" some aspects of humanity to those others.
    Nymf Hathaway: It is said that when we would be attacked by aliens (which I think is a real idiot idea...why always negative) we would be finally one on earth... much too late
    Nymf Hathaway: Oh yes
    Calvino Rabeni: Fear is a fundamental thing.
    Calvino Rabeni: But so is eros, the drive to create and expand beyond boundaries.
    Nymf Hathaway: Majority thinks more is good
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, that is a theme to be reckoned with.
    Calvino Rabeni: What does the majority give up, to let the outsiders seem to be what they are?
    Nymf Hathaway: I wonder.... is life (humans in this case) just a circle on earth..... we discover things... make them science... we loose data...and a few or more centuries later we seem to pick up where we have left
    Calvino Rabeni: Do you mean, are there cycles of knowledge and ignorance?
    Nymf Hathaway: yes and kill knowledge...history is full of it and always fear was the reason for killing it
    Calvino Rabeni: For instance there has always been a dynamic interplay between unification and separation of science and religion.
    Calvino Rabeni: It goes one way, then the other.
    Nymf Hathaway: Knowledge is still for minorities
    Nymf Hathaway: yes seems so
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes it seems to be.
    Nymf Hathaway: I hope the internet will change this
    Calvino Rabeni: And where would the world be if the library at Alexandria had not burned?
    Nymf Hathaway: oh yes
    Nymf Hathaway: Have you seen the universe clock made by the Greeks?
    Calvino Rabeni: The antikythera device showed advanced technology around 200 bc
    Nymf Hathaway: hahhahahah wonderful :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Yes... thats just one example
    Calvino Rabeni: Lost somehow
    Calvino Rabeni: And the evidence only found through complete accident
    Nymf Hathaway: It makes you wonder how many time must pass for the world population to think a like
    Nymf Hathaway: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: What do you mean then, to think alike?
    Nymf Hathaway: our nose at the same aim.... discover the incredible eartn, universe and all other questions to be answered
    Nymf Hathaway: share food, land and provide each other with a peacefull earth to make sure it can
    Nymf Hathaway: and Education.... it should be shared freely...because it reduces fear
    Calvino Rabeni: Maybe true - but fear spreads through information also.
    Nymf Hathaway: Today we aren't burning witches.... that has a reason of education
    Nymf Hathaway: yes true
    Calvino Rabeni: But there are still hate crimes unfortunately
    Nymf Hathaway: So much depends on the teacher and his government
    Calvino Rabeni: and people seem as superstitious as ever in history
    Calvino Rabeni: On the average, I suppose
    Nymf Hathaway: yes... and those have a reason as well... forensic psychology is soo interesting
    Calvino Rabeni: And developmental psychology, when extended to adult lifespan and perhaps culture
    Calvino Rabeni: The population of course is much larger than ever before.
    Calvino Rabeni: Perhaps the average wisdom and intelligence of humans is a constant over the centuries
    Nymf Hathaway: yes.... which makes another question interesting... with the grow of population...how are the minorities doing...are they growing as well?
    Nymf Hathaway: Smles
    Calvino Rabeni: And it's hard to say whether diversity is increasing or decreasing
    Nymf Hathaway: smiles that was
    Calvino Rabeni: I am not religious, to answer your earlier question.
    Nymf Hathaway: I thought so by now :) me neither
    Nymf Hathaway: Never have been
    Nymf Hathaway: My parents always encouraged us to think by ourselves...and discuss the thoughts with as many others as you can find...to tune the thoughts
    Calvino Rabeni: Same with me.
    Calvino Rabeni: I think my scientific cosmos has plenty of room for the religious as well as their concerns, however.
    Calvino Rabeni: I am not "anti"
    Nymf Hathaway: Oh yes mine as well... although I am very sorry they never have learned to think for themselves (which doesn't mean every religious person didn't!!)
    Nymf Hathaway: I know enough I admire
    Calvino Rabeni: Religious people may think in a more nuanced way about a variety of things, compared to the non-religions
    Nymf Hathaway: and I really think for a lot of people...we should be thankfull religion shows them the way
    Nymf Hathaway: Nuanced.... not always fanatics are mostly religious ones
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes, and religion constructed the social environment that rationalists live in and benefit from.
    Nymf Hathaway: true
    Calvino Rabeni: I have rationalist or atheist friends who deny that their cultural assumptions are fundamentally christian in origin.
    Nymf Hathaway: It would be interesting to have a look on earth in about 300 years... I would love it
    Calvino Rabeni: It is a hard thing to argue with them.
    Calvino Rabeni: That is an intersting idea - actually I never *seriously* tried to envision the future.
    Nymf Hathaway: well you can call it christian...but be honest...how can christians claim they have a patent on a way of thinking or feeling? Cannot....thoughts or ways to handle things are private
    Nymf Hathaway: They where here long before christianity
    Calvino Rabeni: I don't see it that way. There is no patent, but most people's world is derived from and compatible with their culture.
    Nymf Hathaway: sure...we adapt to our environment
    Calvino Rabeni: Individuals might think / hope they create culture, but the opposite seems to be more true
    Nymf Hathaway: Its only luck or no luck where you are born...nothing more
    Nymf Hathaway: Thats why the less fortunate aren't to blame...we should help as much as we can
    Nymf Hathaway: Sorry to say I need to log off...can I offer you friendship?
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes thanks. Hope to talk again in the future :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Same here :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Wishing you a good sleep :)
    Nymf Hathaway: Bye bye
    Calvino Rabeni: I'm off,also. TY, have a great day :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Poof

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