2010.02.11 19:00 -"Dialogue and Discussion Based on a Simple Practice of Awareness" & "Malta Almond Cookies / First Taste Still Sticks Embedded / In No-Time Fullness

The Guardian for this meeting was Paradise Tennant. The comments are by Calvino, Eos, dsharpe and Widget.

Paradise Tennant: hiya cal :)
Paradise Tennant: how are you :)
Calvino Rabeni: Hello Paradise!
Calvino Rabeni: Very well, and you?
Paradise Tennant: sleepy ..still on europe time been waking up at 5 am :) and conking out at 8 :)
Paradise Tennant: :)
Calvino Rabeni: We could just sleep through the session :)
Paradise Tennant: you have had some good sessions I have been reading the logs
Paradise Tennant: lol
Calvino Rabeni: They are all different, that's the engaging thing about this place
Paradise Tennant: was surprised how nice it was to be with people and not say anything ..
Paradise Tennant: on the retreat we had a day of silence
Paradise Tennant: some of us took naps
Paradise Tennant: very peaceful
Calvino Rabeni: Naps together?
Paradise Tennant: yes engaging and different
Paradise Tennant: yes all in one room curled up like cats
Calvino Rabeni: It's nice to do that. Can relax a different part of oneself.
Paradise Tennant: yes
dsharpe Footman: hi
Paradise Tennant: hiya dsharpe welcome
dsharpe Footman: am i interrupting anything?
Paradise Tennant: this is a discussion group you are welcome to join ..
Paradise Tennant: I will give you a notecard one sec
dsharpe Footman: thank you
Paradise Tennant: how would you describe playasbeing cal ..
Paradise Tennant: besides being engaging and different :)
Calvino Rabeni: I would say it is a group interested in dialogue and discussion based on a simple practice of awareness
dsharpe Footman: how are you
Paradise Tennant: well and working on my awareness :) nicely put
Paradise Tennant: if you right click on one of the cushions it will let you sit down :)
Calvino Rabeni: It is basically dogma-free and people bring many viewpoints here, but do not try to debate or persuade. The emphasis is learning for one self.

--BELL--

Calvino Rabeni: During these "breaks" we pause and turn awareness to whatever is going on
Paradise Tennant: the conversations here are recorded and posted on a wiki page
Paradise Tennant: hiya eos nice to see you!
Eos Amaterasu: Hi Para, Cal, d#
dsharpe Footman: so why isnt anyone talking
Paradise Tennant: lol
Paradise Tennant: there are 90 sec pauses every 15 minutes
Paradise Tennant: sort of a breather to provide space to focus
Paradise Tennant: :)
dsharpe Footman: when does the next discussion start
Paradise Tennant: now
dsharpe Footman: what shall we discuss
Eos Amaterasu: we can discuss whatever we want
Paradise Tennant: often the topics relate to the nature of appearance .. the way the world presents itself to us
Eos Amaterasu: in the context of being able to drop it whenever we want
dsharpe Footman: interesting, it kind of is interesting how we are trying to perceive the world as we sit in a virtual world
Paradise Tennant: yes very much so
Paradise Tennant: :)
Paradise Tennant: layer upon layer
Eos Amaterasu: exactly right, and vice versa as well :-)
Calvino Rabeni: Or, perspectives of and through perspectives
dsharpe Footman: where is eveyone from
Paradise Tennant: toronto :)
Eos Amaterasu: dsharpe, we are about to jump into a 90 second pause
Calvino Rabeni: Western USA
dsharpe Footman: im from Canada as well!
Eos Amaterasu: afterward, we report what happened
Paradise Tennant: ;)
Calvino Rabeni: Calvino Rabeni wonders what things go on in the mind of visitors
Paradise Tennant: smiles
Paradise Tennant: well must seem kind of odd
Paradise Tennant: we just sit really :)
Eos Amaterasu: it's a kind of game
Calvino Rabeni: No jive, no problems to solve, what
Calvino Rabeni: is it about anyway?
Paradise Tennant: yes
Eos Amaterasu: exploration into direct experience?
Eos Amaterasu: & the experience of experience
Eos Amaterasu: "Play as Being" is a strange attractor
Paradise Tennant: yes
Calvino Rabeni: such an omnipresent unavoidable thing - yet seems so foreign to people ?
Eos Amaterasu: invisible?
Paradise Tennant: find I have started sleeping more .. almost on the premise if rl is a dream .. then I might as well be rested for it :)

--BELL--

Eos Amaterasu: more thoroughly explore all the realms that you inhabit anyway....
Paradise Tennant: yes
Calvino Rabeni: That's good as a description of it
Eos Amaterasu: I think I'm beginning to appreciate more "ways of knowing", some of which I've previously ignored
Paradise Tennant: say more
Calvino Rabeni: (what is PlayAsBeing)?
Calvino Rabeni: sweet
Eos Amaterasu: such as the more visual, imagistic, story-line telling & listening ways of opening a world and creating it and describing it
Paradise Tennant: :)
Calvino Rabeni: I appreciate that one
Paradise Tennant: yes
Paradise Tennant: every thought .. every perception is a creation in a way
Eos Amaterasu: the experience in Malta helped open that up
Paradise Tennant: smiles
Eos Amaterasu: being arises as any perception whatsoever
Calvino Rabeni: As is every act
Eos Amaterasu: Paradise, with more sleep you're probably getting more dreams
Paradise Tennant: yes hoping
Eos Amaterasu: I had a dream of that almond cookie
Paradise Tennant: lol
Calvino Rabeni: Dreams can be very generative
Paradise Tennant: may 1sts that was their name .. worthy of dreaming about
Paradise Tennant: and healing I think
Eos Amaterasu: ?
Calvino Rabeni: They are a different state of consciousness than waking, but they also reflect the different qualities of the dreamer
Calvino Rabeni: Basically, they are an expression of the dreamer's intelligence, doing what it knows how to do
Paradise Tennant: will go to bed thinking of the really great pistachio gelato in taormina .. be fun to taste it again
Eos Amaterasu: In the dream Tulku Ugyen had just made a YouTube video of the almond cookie, demonstrating its empty nature as well as doing a zoom to macro and zoom to micro, meanwhile cookie is still tasty - very funny, humorous
Calvino Rabeni: :)
Paradise Tennant: lol
Paradise Tennant: lol what a great dream
Eos Amaterasu: It prompted my Malta haiku
Paradise Tennant: have not read your haiku :)
Calvino Rabeni: Dreams are good reflections of oneself, and also possibly paths to new knowledge
Calvino Rabeni: Feedback
Eos Amaterasu: malta almond cookies / first taste still sticks embedded / in no-time fullness
Paradise Tennant: wow
Eos Amaterasu: also a comment on the no time discussion :-)
Paradise Tennant: yes been listening to a no time teaching from dongsar rinpoche
Paradise Tennant: trying to get it
Eos Amaterasu: Ah
Eos Amaterasu: Are you doing the gar?
Paradise Tennant: well have not yet decided but just do not see how I have 2 hours a day .. I work too many hours to fit that in .. blinking onit
Calvino Rabeni: I was reading some poems by a person who attends tibetan darkness retreats - written during the retreats - it was somewhat inspiring
Eos Amaterasu listens
Paradise Tennant: smiles and listens
Calvino Rabeni: I think I'd like doing that - but don't want to take the time to spend 49 days in complete darkness
Calvino Rabeni: I think I can connect with it through imagination to some degree though
Calvino Rabeni: Do you remember the scare stories about sensory deprivation - that it would make people go crazy :)
Eos Amaterasu: various traditions have ways to approach and do it
Paradise Tennant: wonders if there are dancing retreat .. :) retreats where you just dance with the wind .. with music ..with colour .. with space :) that would befun
Calvino Rabeni: But it doesn't seem to work that way

--BELL--

Eos Amaterasu: Re sensory deprivation, set and setting make big diff, so to speak
Eos Amaterasu: Re dancing retreats - Sufi?
Paradise Tennant: yes ..
Eos Amaterasu: I'm sure other tradtions. There are music retreats....
Paradise Tennant: sufi have the same kind of thing but really intense no?
Eos Amaterasu: It's fairly specific, don't have personal experience.
Paradise Tennant: 49 days in complete darkness .. trys to imagine what that would be like
Calvino Rabeni: Relaxing?
Eos Amaterasu: Boring?
Eos Amaterasu: Scary?
Eos Amaterasu: Hallucinatory?
Paradise Tennant: lol liberating too
Eos Amaterasu: Black?
Calvino Rabeni: Perhaps if it was involuntary
Eos Amaterasu: White?
Paradise Tennant: liberating from appearances :)
Calvino Rabeni: there you go.
Eos Amaterasu: nothing to see, nothing to do, nothing to hear.....
Eos Amaterasu: awake!
Calvino Rabeni: Or at least, see. Lots to feel and sense.
Calvino Rabeni: It just that people are visually oriented.
Calvino Rabeni: Take that away, there is still a lot left
Eos Amaterasu: yes
Paradise Tennant: yes
Eos Amaterasu: how to relate to what happens, in lit world or darkness world.....
Eos Amaterasu: is the thing
Eos Amaterasu: the play
Eos Amaterasu: :-)
Paradise Tennant: ;)
Eos Amaterasu: the storylines
Eos Amaterasu: the dreamtime weaving
Eos Amaterasu: even the taste of the almond cookie :-)
Widget Whiteberry thinks she may have missed an intriguing hr
Paradise Tennant: hiya widget :)
Eos Amaterasu: Oh!
Calvino Rabeni: You could call it a hallucination, but it would be I think misleading, to describe what happens when the activity in the sense of sight is run by internal rather than external activity
Widget Whiteberry: hi
Eos Amaterasu: Hi widg, you were rezzing and de-rezzing
Widget Whiteberry: I was having a cyber adventure
Widget Whiteberry: please continue
Eos Amaterasu: the brain / mind adjusts, or can adjust, quickly
Eos Amaterasu: but maybe freakouts slow adjustment
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, just through simple activities
Calvino Rabeni: I was at a "playshop" today, and one thing we did in a group was just walk around with eyes closed and arms held in front
Paradise Tennant: cool
Calvino Rabeni: So, active moving, not seeing
Calvino Rabeni: We also did a great set of "appreciating" exercises
Eos Amaterasu: yes, the activity really does the perceiving
Widget Whiteberry: what did you do when you contacted other people?
Calvino Rabeni: Notice how it felt, maybe say something, move on
Calvino Rabeni: It would have been quite interesting to start conversations :)
Widget Whiteberry: was there laughter?
Widget Whiteberry: murmuring?
Calvino Rabeni: Because you would not have the preconception of who it was, exactly
Calvino Rabeni: Yes naturally, some laughter, very relaxed setting
Paradise Tennant: the appreciating exercises were ....
Calvino Rabeni: One is, you just walk around the room, and take each thing as an appearance, I mean, an encounter, and say - "I really like this X" or something like that.
Calvino Rabeni: And then keep going on to the next appreciation of appearance
Calvino Rabeni: And after awhile, people get into it more and more
Calvino Rabeni: they find the world is full of wonderful and surprising things
Paradise Tennant: smiles
Calvino Rabeni: and might experience general sense of gratitude
Widget Whiteberry: I am reminded of Weir Labs, from the .... 80s & 90s I think
Calvino Rabeni: it is just a "dropping" of the usual problem-mind or utility-mind and a use of the other ways of seeing
Calvino Rabeni: And we did this with the "object" being another person also :)

--BELL--

Paradise Tennant: sounds lovely :)
Calvino Rabeni: The idea of the meeting was "Play As Transformative Practice" similar to the Play in Play As Being in some ways
Widget Whiteberry nods
Calvino Rabeni: Well facilitated, lots of good ideas
Calvino Rabeni: and applications
Eos Amaterasu: btw, any of you going to be in San Francisco in April?
Eos Amaterasu: For the RL retreat?
Calvino Rabeni: I think so, I can drive there in 16 hours
Widget Whiteberry: I am consideing it
Widget Whiteberry: and I'm wondering abut these Play encounters
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, considering it
Calvino Rabeni: Yes Widget?
Widget Whiteberry: I wonder if we could do some of these same things
Widget Whiteberry: in a retreat setting
Calvino Rabeni: :)
Widget Whiteberry: Play as ... what ever
Widget Whiteberry: ☆smiles☆
Calvino Rabeni: Eminently feasible!
Paradise Tennant: yes
Widget Whiteberry: I dont know how the retreats are designed
Eos Amaterasu: play as ... anything whatsoever
Widget Whiteberry: I know the stories from Malta ...
Widget Whiteberry smiles at Eos
Calvino Rabeni: I'm all for silence and meditation of course, but :)))
Widget Whiteberry: 16 hrs?
Widget Whiteberry: that could be a silent practice too
Eos Amaterasu: basic pattern is some kind of container / setting, plus longer time period - retreats are now starting to be 5 days
Eos Amaterasu: plus more "pauses", practicies of seconds or minutes
Calvino Rabeni: USA is a big country - coming just halfway down the West coast takes that long
Eos Amaterasu: plus discussions
Widget Whiteberry nods
Eos Amaterasu: plus silent day in the middle, maybe more for longer retreats
Paradise Tennant: likes the silent day
Eos Amaterasu: different balance of isolated / in-the-world, depending on setting
Eos Amaterasu: silence can really open things up
Calvino Rabeni: Some kind of "transformational play" would be delightful, I believe also very "furthering" to whatever it is people want from this endeavor
Paradise Tennant: quietly excuses herself .. very sleepy still on europe time ti seems .. good night ... all .. thank you .. going to try to dream of almond cookies .:)
Widget Whiteberry: I like the way it seems to fit with what Eos describes
Calvino Rabeni: The contrasts often make a difference. Like a wave. The higher the crest, the deeper the trough.
Calvino Rabeni: Silence being the trough
Widget Whiteberry: Good night, Paradise
Eos Amaterasu: must also de-cohere
Calvino Rabeni: Sweet dreams
Eos Amaterasu: sweet cookies
Widget Whiteberry: de-cohere?
Widget Whiteberry: oops
Widget Whiteberry: any idea about de-cohere?
Calvino Rabeni: Widget, you have a cloak of invisibility
Calvino Rabeni: Now I see
Widget Whiteberry: for a while, all I saw here was water
Calvino Rabeni: De-cohere ? I am guessing at this
Calvino Rabeni: Seems like a metaphor of a physicist
Widget Whiteberry: to cohere is to hold together?
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, and to I think, coordinate and function as one.
Widget Whiteberry: a unity
Widget Whiteberry: maybe to de-cohere is to break into parts, when no parts were evident
Calvino Rabeni: Decohere would be to allow lots of different activities, rhythms, etc. to be independent
Calvino Rabeni: Waking consciousness is pretty coherent in some ways
Widget Whiteberry nods
Widget Whiteberry: we are always at the center
Calvino Rabeni: In dreaming, what you see is no longer tied to what objects are being perceived visually
Widget Whiteberry: hmm
Widget Whiteberry: or maybe we foget the meanings we assign
Calvino Rabeni: If that decoheres in normal consciousness it is regarded as a dysfunction, a hallucination
Widget Whiteberry nods
Calvino Rabeni: But in dream state, no such restriction
Widget Whiteberry: I no longer catch my dreams
Widget Whiteberry: not in a long time
Calvino Rabeni: Tried to, but couldn't? Or didn't reach for it?
Widget Whiteberry: haven't been thinking much about it

--BELL--

Widget Whiteberry: so I suppose I am not reaching
Widget Whiteberry: so much of SL is like a dream state
Widget Whiteberry: maybe I get enough here
Calvino Rabeni: True? Is it fulfilling in the ways that dreams are?
Widget Whiteberry: some
Widget Whiteberry: this is a very creative place for me
Calvino Rabeni: Yes in part because you have created many structures here
Widget Whiteberry: social structures, org structures
Calvino Rabeni: But, the ideal thing would be - does it have a life of its own and surprise you, exceeding the limits of your imagination...
Widget Whiteberry: well
Calvino Rabeni: This is the gift of dreaming
Widget Whiteberry: things I understand now
Widget Whiteberry: I never imagined 2 yrs ago
Widget Whiteberry: so perhaps
Widget Whiteberry: you still carry the talking stick!
Calvino Rabeni: It's relative to one's current horizon I believe
Widget Whiteberry: what is relative to one's current horizon?
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, I like carrying it.
Calvino Rabeni: The function of dreaming to bring new things to surprise or disturb one
Calvino Rabeni: It has to come over the edge from the unknown
Calvino Rabeni: and the edge changes, with learning
Calvino Rabeni: One's horizon may broaden
Widget Whiteberry: yes
Widget Whiteberry: that makes sense
Widget Whiteberry: this is the cane I carried when I felt hermity
Calvino Rabeni: So what used to surprise and amaze becomes a commonplace or a taken-for-granted
Widget Whiteberry: hmmm
Calvino Rabeni: I've seen it before - but actually don't know if you had it 5 minutes ago
Widget Whiteberry: yes, I see that
Widget Whiteberry: 5 min ago I wasn't wearing it
Calvino Rabeni: Mostly SL doesn't create a "new experience" thrill
Widget Whiteberry: hmm
Widget Whiteberry: not a thrill but
Calvino Rabeni: But occasionally - I enjoyed flying around with a jetpack, carrying the talking stick
Widget Whiteberry: well, lot's of new experiences
Calvino Rabeni: It reminded me of a kind of spirit journey
Widget Whiteberry: learning how things work
Widget Whiteberry: yes
Calvino Rabeni: It would be interesting for someone to make a sim for traditional trance journeying
Widget Whiteberry: 3rd life might have that
Calvino Rabeni: Although I don't know if it would actually work
Widget Whiteberry: would have to be more than an enviroment
Widget Whiteberry: an experience
Calvino Rabeni: Hmm, Life 3.0, is that someone's project?
Widget Whiteberry: yes
Widget Whiteberry: would you like to see it?
Calvino Rabeni: Indeed
Widget Whiteberry: I may have a landmark
Calvino Rabeni: ? whad did digby say ?
Widget Whiteberry: digby is a well regarded political blogger
Calvino Rabeni: Ah, and I am a hermit :)