2010.02.24 01:00 - The game of genes

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Bolonath Crystal. The comments are by Bolonath Crystal.
    We talked about how genetic competition influences our daily life.

        Bolonath Crystal: hello aztlan
        Bolonath Crystal: test
        Bolonath Crystal: ah, ok
        Aztlan Foss: hi bolonath
        Bolonath Crystal: sorry, i'm heavily lagging :(
        Bolonath Crystal: but it'll work
        Aztlan Foss: it's ok it happens
        Bolonath Crystal: how are you this morning (or whatever time it is at your place)?
        Aztlan Foss: it's 1am here
        Aztlan Foss: I'm doing well, I just got back home from riding my push scooter by the beach and eating sushi
        Bolonath Crystal: wow, sounds nice :)
        Bolonath Crystal: hi lawrence
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Hey, guys.
        Aztlan Foss: sup lawrence
        Bolonath Crystal: any suggestions to chat about?
        Aztlan Foss: what haven't you guys talke about?
        Aztlan Foss: I was wondering today two things
        Aztlan Foss: one is, why do girls look at my feet
        Bolonath Crystal listens
        Aztlan Foss: and the other is not realy a question
        Aztlan Foss: I was thinking about when people say "enjoy your life because other people's lives are shitty"
        Lawrence Vyceratops: hmmm...
        Aztlan Foss: or like when someone sees something tragic on TV they are like "oh what a tragedy, what poor people, makes you appretiate what you have"
        Aztlan Foss: which I don't realy think it does
        Aztlan Foss: i think they're just saying that
        Bolonath Crystal: a pity we haven't any girls around to clarify your first question, aztlan
        Aztlan Foss: it's like, if you give a kid a gift and he goes "well thanks, at least it's not as shitty as what the neighbor kid has" then he's not REALY appretiating the gift
        Lawrence Vyceratops: haha Right...
        Aztlan Foss: I think they should just appretiate what they got dispite the troubles of the world
        Bolonath Crystal: it seems as if ppl are not really looking at what they have. they are looking at what others have and compare it with their own havings
        Aztlan Foss: like, if you give a 4 year old a ball as a gift and they're stoked like "YEAH A BALL! TOTALLY AWESOME!!! YEAH!" then you're pretty sure he's appretiating it, it's that indulgence in the gift
        Bolonath Crystal: kind of social competition maybe
        Aztlan Foss: where as if you give some other kid the same gift he might be like "thank you" which is polite but he's not really indulging in the experience.
        Aztlan Foss: yeah I guess my pint is that people should appretiate life by indulging in it not tryin got quantify it against people who are less fortunate
        Aztlan Foss: because I realy think it does the opposite
        Aztlan Foss: it puts others down for having shitty lives and they are just making up for their lack of enthusiasm
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Isn't the interplay of logic and emotion an interesting thing...
        --BELL--
        Bolonath Crystal: in a group of kids the one with the ball has a higher social position than the others who don't have one. the ball gives him a kind of power
        Bolonath Crystal: this continues throughout the whole life. later we don't only want to have a car: it must be a bigger car than our neighbor's
        Bolonath Crystal: just to tell him: "my balls are bigger than yours" ;)
        Aztlan Foss: yeah or more fueld efficient
        Aztlan Foss: depending on what we're agreeing is better
        Lawrence Vyceratops: It gives meaning to our interests.
        Aztlan Foss: ther's also moral competition I think
        Aztlan Foss: I guess people compete in everything
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Hey, Cal.
        Aztlan Foss: like "my beliefs are more logical than yours"
        Bolonath Crystal: namaste cal
        Calvino Rabeni: _/!\_
        Bolonath Crystal: probably this competition is simply another form of sexual competition
        Lawrence Vyceratops: That and we need some kind of meaning to exist.
        Aztlan Foss: sex and meaning?
        Bolonath Crystal: a big car would be a poor meaning to exist
        Lawrence Vyceratops: That may be, but it seems true, nonetheless.
        Lawrence Vyceratops: We seek meaning in every endeavor.
        Aztlan Foss: yeah I guess the cooler we are the more likely we are to get the hotter girl
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes. haha
        Bolonath Crystal: that's the game of the genes
        Aztlan Foss: yeah I guess we have no choice but to play it
        Bolonath Crystal: well, it is meaningful in an evolutionary sense
        Aztlan Foss: I was reading an article today about some guy who raped and cracked the skull of his 8 month old baby
        Aztlan Foss: how does a person like that reproduce?
        Bolonath Crystal: omg
        Aztlan Foss: I think the mother was 15
        Aztlan Foss: and he was 18 or something
        Aztlan Foss: maybe they had some crazy genes
        Lawrence Vyceratops: That's pretty horrible...
        Bolonath Crystal: the recombination of genes happens more or less at random. bad combinations are wiped out by evolution, because the reproductive success is lessened
        Aztlan Foss: hmmm interesting, I guess that baby had to go anyway
        Bolonath Crystal: the baby's recombination might be 'good' in an evolutionary sense - but the father's obviously wasn't
        Aztlan Foss: then he should go!
        --BELL--
        Aztlan Foss: hey you think one day people could pair up by analysing their DNA?
        Bolonath Crystal: nature can be cruel
        Aztlan Foss: like on dating site where instead of filling out forms you just submit a DNA sample
        Bolonath Crystal: that might be technically possible, aztlan, but i'm not sure that it is a wise thing to do
        Bolonath Crystal: the game of the genes works since a billion years. why stop playing it?
        Aztlan Foss: because we have the technology for it
        Aztlan Foss: it could be the genes themselves developing better ways of combining
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Anything is possible with the right amount and type of influence.
        Calvino Rabeni: It would be a worthwhile experiment, but would be inconclusive and I think somewhat pointless
        Aztlan Foss: I don't think we should discredit ourselves. Our technology could be the way our genes are preparing to speed up the process
        Aztlan Foss: we're just as much a part of nature as nature it's self
        Bolonath Crystal: our genes take care of us being adopted to the environment. we cannot know how environment changes in the future, so we also cannot know which combination will be most useful
        Lawrence Vyceratops: If you propose the idea with the concept of health potential, it could catch on.
        Aztlan Foss: at least for now we can't figure it out but we do know that your environment has to do with how healthy you live and for how long
        Lawrence Vyceratops: It doesn't have to work, you just have to convince people of supporting you.
        Aztlan Foss: depending on the environment you'll be living in you can pick the genes that are well adapted to that environment
        Aztlan Foss: we'll have longer healthier lives
        Aztlan Foss: maybe even adapting the environment
        Aztlan Foss: someone should write a book about that
        Aztlan Foss: like one of those "people farming" type of distopian books but make this a utopia
        Calvino Rabeni: The problem is the genes don't work in isolation
        Bolonath Crystal: hm, this sounds like a technically sophisticated version of hitler's race selection
        Calvino Rabeni: And therefore couldn't be effectively designed in combinations
        Aztlan Foss: i'm sure you could advertise it in terms of health concerns
        Aztlan Foss: we already pick people who aren't our close relatives for genetic complications
        Bolonath Crystal: that's a different thing
        Aztlan Foss: and when we select people with profiles we tend to go for people certain traits, so why not add a layer of DNA to see if at the very least you'll have adequately strong offspring
        Lawrence Vyceratops: I can't speculate on that...
        Aztlan Foss: yeah i'm not qualified either but it's fun to just throw stuff out there
        Bolonath Crystal: that's the point: we don't know which combination is the best, because this depends on the environment (which is permanently changing)
        Aztlan Foss: yeah but that's now. in the future we might have more control of our environment and we might be able to identify at least some genes that we know work better together than others
        Aztlan Foss: maybe combinations that promote inteligence or longer lifespan
        Calvino Rabeni: The idea of genes as a blueprint is overrated - in a way they are just switches that remember responses to environmental and epigenetic conditions
        --BELL--
        Bolonath Crystal: in early times the atmosphere of the earth was free of oxygen. nobody would have deliberately invented genes that make it neccessary to breathe oxygen. but nevertheless most living beings carry those genes now - and are very successful with it
        Aztlan Foss: yeah
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Either way, scientists are going to keep tampering with DNA and agendas will still be pursued, regardless of good or detriment of society.
        Lawrence Vyceratops: to*
        Aztlan Foss: I think that's why they're working on gene therapies and changing up genes to make you breathe longer under whater and what not
        Aztlan Foss: I'd want genes that make it so my skin can change color like a camaleaon
        Lawrence Vyceratops: haha
        Bolonath Crystal: ;)
        Bolonath Crystal: i'd like a green skin for doing photosynthesis :)
        Aztlan Foss: holy shit that's an awesome idea
        Aztlan Foss: you'd probably get realy sad during the winter, though
        Aztlan Foss: that already happens
        Bolonath Crystal: yes, true
        Calvino Rabeni: I'd rather my house had a green skin. I don't want to spend all my time sunbathing.
        Aztlan Foss: ok so you get photosynthesis skin and I'll throw in a mood booster gene along with some glow in the dark hair
        Calvino Rabeni: Sounds like a perpetual motion machine :)
        Bolonath Crystal: the sun triggers quite a number of physiological pattern anyway
        Aztlan Foss: you know, photosynth could just supplement your regular omnivorous tendensies
        Bolonath Crystal: lol, i just imagined fast food restaurants selling candles :)
        Aztlan Foss: hahaha
        Aztlan Foss: hey have you guys ever tried one of those oxygen bars?
        Bolonath Crystal: never heard of
        Aztlan Foss: you go sit somewhere and they stick tubes up your nose and it's just oxygen
        Bolonath Crystal: amazing
        Aztlan Foss: I thought it was rediculous to spend money to breathe in air but then I thought maybe it's more than just that
        Bolonath Crystal: so you tried it?
        Aztlan Foss: nope I want to get people's opinions
        Aztlan Foss: $20 is a lot to me
        Bolonath Crystal: $20 for some fresh air?
        Bolonath Crystal: wow
        Lawrence Vyceratops: haha
        Aztlan Foss: hehe yeah it's quite a luxury
        Lawrence Vyceratops: I'm fine with free, dirty air.
        Calvino Rabeni: Why do it, for health, or a buzz?
        --BELL--
        Bolonath Crystal: i live in a small village with pretty fresh air. but maybe it is interesting for ppl in big, smelly cities
        Aztlan Foss: i doubt you'll add any kind of length to your life by doing it so I'd do it for the buzz
        Aztlan Foss: yeah I live in LA, there's no fresh air around here
        Lawrence Vyceratops: I always forget what we're talking about after 90 seconds... LA has pretty thick air...
        Bolonath Crystal: sorry, i have to go back to work
        Lawrence Vyceratops: See ya, Bolonath.
        Bolonath Crystal: bfn, om shanti :)
        Calvino Rabeni: Bye Bolo
        Aztlan Foss: bye
        Aztlan Foss: have you guys have one of those Naked drinks?
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Haven't heard of it.
        Calvino Rabeni: neither
        Aztlan Foss: it's these drink that are made of real fruit, supposed to be good quality
        Aztlan Foss: today I found a new one were they combine watermelon and lime
        Aztlan Foss: it's soooo delicious
        Aztlan Foss: I put lime on my watermelon sometimes so it made perfect sense to me
        Aztlan Foss: when I tried it the taste was exactly what I would hope
        Aztlan Foss: just thought I'd let you guys know :-P
        Lawrence Vyceratops: Unfortunately, I'm hooked on Coca-Cola...
        Calvino Rabeni: I'm hooked on coffee and tea, but nothing that comes in bottles
        Calvino Rabeni: My favorite technology is an electric tea kettle :)
        Aztlan Foss: you drink your tea and coffee sugarless ?
        Calvino Rabeni: Yes
        Calvino Rabeni: I also searched to find a non-digital microwave oven
        Calvino Rabeni: For no good reason other than aesthetics
        Calvino Rabeni: Nowadays machines have to look good, beyond getting the job done, I guess
        Aztlan Foss: yeah I like things that look nice too
        Calvino Rabeni: It's a fashion show, even though they don't have genes
        Aztlan Foss: I think it does add to the experience
        Calvino Rabeni: agree
        Aztlan Foss: why have ugly soroundings when they can be pleasing instead?
        Calvino Rabeni: right.
        Calvino Rabeni: Older generations don't care nearly so much
        Calvino Rabeni: The bar has raised, due to the glut of competing products
        Aztlan Foss: my dad just turned 60 and he seems to like nice looking things too
        Aztlan Foss: is 60 old any more?
        Calvino Rabeni: not really old, that is post WW2.
        --BELL--
        Aztlan Foss: your welcome
        Lawrence Vyceratops: I always eat Chinese food too fast... why is that?
        Aztlan Foss: because it's delicious
        Calvino Rabeni: because it is salty and tasty
        Calvino Rabeni: except the vegetables
        Aztlan Foss: it's 2am I should head to bed
        Aztlan Foss: good night
        Calvino Rabeni: Right, same here
        Lawrence Vyceratops: night
        Calvino Rabeni: Bye for now Az

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