2010.04.05 07:00 - Wrestling with an alligator (as well as with a title for this log)

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Eden Haiku. The comments are by Eden Haiku.

    "Very slow going this morning"

    Eden Haiku: Good morning Yaku!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: do you have that poetry group in sl or in RL ?
    Liza Deischer: hi Yaku, Eden
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey liza
    Eden Haiku: Totempoetry you mean Yakuzza?
    Eden Haiku: Hello Eliza, good morning :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: oh, you have many poetry groups ?
    Liza Deischer: good morning...eh...afternoon
    Liza Deischer: :_)
    Eden Haiku: Liza, I mean, sorry :)
    Liza Deischer: oh, no problem, didn't even see it
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey bleu
    Liza Deischer: sometimes I get lost myself
    Eden Haiku: With the new viewer, more difficult to recognize people :)
    Liza Deischer: hi Bleu
    Bleu Oleander: hi everyone
    Liza Deischer: more difficult?
    Eden Haiku: Good morning Bleu :)
    Liza Deischer: I don't have that experience
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i think i get used to it slowly
    Yakuzza Lethecus: but i can't see the coordinates where i am and how high
    Eden Haiku: Maybe not really more difficult, just getting used to it yes.
    Liza Deischer: oh that is in prefs
    Liza Deischer: have been looking for it too :-)
    Liza Deischer: and of course I can't find it anymore :-)
    Eden Haiku: I changed the chat window in preferences, now it is much easier,
    Eden Haiku: Yes, Yaku, I'm part of poetry groups in SL and in RL I attend many poetry events too.
    Liza Deischer: yes, you didn't saw the tags any more
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Bleu Oleander: hi Eliza
    Liza Deischer: Hi Zen, Eliza
    Bleu Oleander: hi Zen
    Zen Arado: Hi Eliza :)
    Eden Haiku: hello Zen, and elisabethan Eliza!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey zen, eliza :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bleu, Eden, Ya, Liza, and Zen :)
    Eliza Madrigal is just waking up... can't believe it... so late :)


    Liza Deischer: hmm, sounds very relaxing Eliza
    Bleu Oleander: cute cat Zen
    Liza Deischer: (World, Show, Coordinates)
    Eden Haiku: I overslept also Eliza. Just woke up too ;)
    Zen Arado: yes thought she was going to drown there :)
    Bleu Oleander: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Sweet, Zen :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Really Eden? Maybe something in the air...
    Eliza Madrigal: Actually, I took cold tablets last night, which i never do :)
    Eden Haiku: Some chocolate OD maybe? (in my case, it was.. : )
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Widget :)
    Widget Whiteberry: gm
    Eden Haiku: Hello Widget!
    Widget Whiteberry: smiles
    Bleu Oleander: hi Widget
    Zen Arado: Hi Widget :)
    Liza Deischer: hi widget
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey widget
    Widget Whiteberry: has a focus emerged yet?
    Zen Arado: a focus?
    Eden Haiku: Not yet, you are welcome to suggest one Widget.
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh no... very slow going this morning I think :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: and hey bertram and fay
    Bertram Jacobus: hy everybody ... :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bert and Fay :)
    Widget Whiteberry blinks and grins
    Liza Deischer: hi Betram and fay
    Eden Haiku: Hello Bertram!
    Zen Arado: Hi Bert, Fay:)
    Fay Yedmore: hi all
    Eden Haiku: And Fay, welcome,
    Bleu Oleander: hi Bert and Fay
    Bertram Jacobus: ty for the as always so warm welcome - and please, don't feel distracted (!) ... ty ...
    Zen Arado: bought some CD's from Itunes
    Zen Arado: but they won't back up
    Zen Arado: will figure it out
    Zen Arado: hopefully
    Zen Arado: takes so much time
    Liza Deischer: sorry, can't help you
    Eden Haiku: What do you mean Zen, you can't import them on your computer?
    Zen Arado: no I have them downloaded
    Eden Haiku: Yes and then?
    Zen Arado: and I know what to do to back up
    Zen Arado: but nothing happens when I press the back up button
    Eden Haiku: To save them?
    Zen Arado: no just back up in case anything goes wrong with computer
    Zen Arado: maybe I will just burn to a disc
    Eden Haiku: Ah yes, sorry, I don't know either,
    Zen Arado: if you have a lot of stuff on Itunes it is best to back up
    Liza Deischer: you have Time Machine?
    Zen Arado: or you lose the lot if your hard drive fails
    Zen Arado: no Liza?
    Liza Deischer: if you connect an external harddisk to your iMac, he will back up everything every hour or so
    Liza Deischer: I think Time Machine is default to a Mac
    Liza Deischer: so you never need to worry about that again
    Zen Arado: I have a PC
    Eden Haiku: No you have to buy the Time Machine and it is rather expensive but it is worth it. I plan to get one.
    Liza Deischer: ah, not mac?
    Zen Arado: nope
    Liza Deischer: I thought so because you mentioned ITunes
    Zen Arado: it runs on PCs too
    Liza Deischer: mistaken there m sorry
    Liza Deischer: oh, new to me :-)
    Widget Whiteberry: please excuse me, I need to take care of something
    Eden Haiku: What about ok
    Zen Arado: maybe they make it so it doesn't work so well on PCs
    Liza Deischer: bye Widget
    Zen Arado: bye Widget
    Zen Arado: being cynical
    Bertram Jacobus: was too fast for me to say goodbye - so for the log ;-) : bye widget :o)
    Liza Deischer: or Windows hasn;t put enough time into it
    Liza Deischer: but whatever it is, it doesn't seem that we are able to help you :-)
    Zen Arado: it's ok
    Zen Arado: :)
    Bertram Jacobus: but at least the cat is nice ! ;-)
    Eliza Madrigal: hehehe
    Liza Deischer: :-))
    Zen Arado: yes gettin fond of her :)
    Zen Arado: not sure what to call her though :)


    Zen Arado: but not meep :)
    Liza Deischer: the cat won't let me touch her :-)
    Fay Yedmore: ppl i will leave you need to go rl
    Fay Yedmore: bye bye
    Liza Deischer: bye Fay
    Eden Haiku: Soory, I have been distracted ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: Zen, perhaps she would benefit from a zenish name like Dogenita
    Eliza Madrigal: heh
    Zen Arado: ha ha
    Eliza Madrigal: something to remind you to practice...
    Eden Haiku: smiles
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: Or something to help you to remember to be light with yourself...


    The new Working Group (see the Guardians meeting log at http://bit.ly/cWyanB)

    Eden Haiku: Thank you Eliza for committing to the coordination job in the Working Group for another three months.
    Liza Deischer: a cat that likes water :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh, Eden. That's sweet of you :)
    Zen Arado: yes Eliza
    Eden Haiku: So Storm will still be responsible of the platform and Eos of the retreats?
    Eliza Madrigal: You're welcome. I've learned a lot thus far, so in that way and others I'm well rewarded for my time.. feel rather priveledged to be able to do it :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Storm is inworld... which includes all that Storm does, which is impossible to define fully! :)
    Eden Haiku: Pema, Maxine and Genesis stepping out Bleu, Calvino stepping in.
    Eliza Madrigal: Calvino will be taking the platform role, which includes vitalizing the wiki
    Eliza Madrigal: or rather coordinating of that... many involved in that
    Eliza Madrigal: wayyyyy over my head :)
    Bertram Jacobus: (really nice kitty) :-))
    Eliza Madrigal: but its really needed... think everyone agrees that the way the wiki reads needs work :)
    Eden Haiku: Oh and Sophia Sharon with the Chronicles.
    Eden Haiku: That is great: thank you guys!
    Eliza Madrigal: Thank you Eden :))
    Eliza Madrigal: I hope that everyone will generate ideas and be involved though... would be a shame if people felt the wg being in place was somehow ... hm...
    Eliza Madrigal: a signal that everyone's energy wasn't deeply needed
    Liza Deischer: is that the experience in the last 6 months?
    Eliza Madrigal: for instance, when I came back from the wg meeting recently, I was so amazed that you and bleu and zen and ya, and well, everyone, had gotten on board with Art of Being... that it was rolling along...
    Eden Haiku: Oh sure Eliza. But that is good to know that the basis is taken care of.
    Eliza Madrigal: felt like I wasn't 'needed' here.... all the logs were posted....
    Eliza Madrigal: was simply thrilled :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Liza, which experience? my learning?
    Liza Deischer: no, I mean, you said: would be a shame if people felt the wg being in place was somehow ... hm... [07:37] Eliza Madrigal: a signal that everyone's energy wasn't deeply needed
    Eliza Madrigal: The last 6 months have been a lot of pema showing what was needed behind the scenes....
    Eliza Madrigal: what he was doing automatically
    Liza Deischer: only being here for a few months, I don't now what happened before
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah :) yes that makes sense
    Liza Deischer: so I was wondering if people backed off a bit in the last few months
    Liza Deischer: feeling everything is already aranged
    Bertram Jacobus: (brb)
    Eliza Madrigal: Ooooh
    Eliza Madrigal: No, actually that's what I mean... it does seem to have been the case that there is a feeling of even more layers of support for things...
    Eliza Madrigal: which is *great*
    Liza Deischer: ah, okay
    Liza Deischer: you meant the opposite :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: yes , guess so:))
    Liza Deischer: or I misunderstoood, never mind :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: I think there was concern in the beginning that it would be the opposite... maybe why I qualified it in the beginning
    Liza Deischer: ok
    Eden Haiku: It is always amazing to me to see how the GoC slots are filled when people cannot make it.
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, me too.... very generous


    Eliza Madrigal: There is something about pab which makes one want to contribute/participate.. get one's hands into the practical part of things...
    Eden Haiku: Lately, I haven't been able to help with that and was relieved to see that new guardians were stepping in. It feels that PaB is a very healthy organization, very much alive. With much new blood.
    Eliza Madrigal: maybe because our topics are sometimes so lofty :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Yes, Eden. Indeed
    Zen Arado: or so silly :)
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, that too. hah
    Eliza Madrigal: lofty silly deep.. wide range
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Liza Deischer: cattisch, not to forget :-)
    Zen Arado: miaow ;)
    Eliza Madrigal: In all seriousness though, when I am processing something abstract or hm... beyond me... it helps to wash dishes, or do practical things...
    Eden Haiku: You cat just asked me something Zen?
    Liza Deischer: :-)
    Eliza Madrigal: uh oh.... he wants to talk about TSK
    Eliza Madrigal: :) hahah
    Eliza Madrigal: *she
    Zen Arado: something she didn't quite get :)
    Eliza Madrigal giggles... I know, its the grazing space part... or was it the mountain exercize?
    Eden Haiku: Bye Liza
    Liza Deischer: I need to get some sleep
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Liza :) Night
    Liza Deischer: cu
    Bertram Jacobus: bye liza ;-)
    Zen Arado: bye Liza
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye liza


    A cat and a turtle oddly lead us into a conversation about animals in the form of food!

    Eden Haiku: Oh I see the cat now!
    Eliza Madrigal: The cat was right in front of you before, Eden, in the pool :)
    Zen Arado: it's a great animation
    Eliza Madrigal: My son brought home a turtle yesterday
    Zen Arado: she wanted to be petted
    Eliza Madrigal: ooh, look she's curled up :)
    Eden Haiku: Was it? So confused with the new viewer still...
    Zen Arado: better than an alligator!
    Eliza Madrigal: yes... emerald seems the way to go with viewers from what I'm hearing
    Yakuzza Lethecus: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: haha, yes for sure better than an alligator
    Eden Haiku: But all these viewers take sapce on the computer?
    Zen Arado: I saw a man wrestle with one In Florida once
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, and then I guess you get rid of one when you focus on another
    Zen Arado: a Seminole Indian
    Bertram Jacobus: ;-)
    Eden Haiku: Alligators and SL Viewers intertwined….
    Zen Arado: wrestle with SL viewers is hard too
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, have seen that too zen... the thing is those alligators they have for the show are sooooo domesticated :)
    Eliza Madrigal: well fed :)
    Zen Arado: oh
    Zen Arado: disillusioned now :(
    Bleu Oleander: c u later everyone .... bfn
    Eliza Madrigal: they get irritated.... but well... not like running into one in the swamp I'd guess
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bleu :)
    Bertram Jacobus: i wouldn't wrestle it anyway ! ;-)
    Zen Arado: bye Bleu
    Yakuzza Lethecus: cya bleu
    Eden Haiku: Bye Bleu.
    Eliza Madrigal: heheh Bert, nor would I :)
    Bertram Jacobus: bye bleu ...
    Zen Arado: better to avoid if hungry I suspect :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: do aligators taste so badly ?
    Bertram Jacobus: lol
    Zen Arado: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Before I was mostly vegetarian I'd eaten alligator...
    Zen Arado: can make handbags from them :)
    Bertram Jacobus: bad bad pabers ! :o)
    Zen Arado: was it nice?
    Eliza Madrigal: and fried is awful, but I don't like fried foods much anyway... There was once I ate it in a fancy restaurant and it was delicious!
    Bertram Jacobus: bah bad*
    Eden Haiku: smiles
    Eliza Madrigal: sautee'd...
    Eliza Madrigal: Same for frog's legs :)
    Eden Haiku: @bad bad pabers@bertram
    Zen Arado: gator rare :)
    Bertram Jacobus decides to giggle a bit :o)
    Eden Haiku: I'm French speaking BUT I do not eat frog legs!
    Eliza Madrigal: hehehe
    Zen Arado: or snails ?
    Eliza Madrigal: Nor do I anymore, but I like to try things....
    Eliza Madrigal: like rattlesnake
    Eden Haiku: vomiting
    Eliza Madrigal: Yum
    Eliza Madrigal: and yes definitely snails
    Zen Arado: yuk
    Eliza Madrigal: heheheh
    Eliza Madrigal: heavy garlic butter
    Zen Arado: better move cat before she appears on Eliza's menu :)
    Eliza Madrigal: those I used to cook at home, just to annoy my mother as a teen....
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: hahahah Zen
    Eliza Madrigal: She's quite safe now
    Bertram Jacobus: quite ?
    Eliza Madrigal: extremely :)
    Eden Haiku: @Zen beware of Eliza's witch tastebuds!
    Bertram Jacobus: hehe. aso :o)
    Bertram Jacobus: sry - that was german :o)
    Eliza Madrigal is domesticated extraordinaire these day
    Yakuzza Lethecus: there was a time in germany when they left a food on the rabbit after it was slaughtered to assure that it wasn't a cat before
    Eden Haiku: yakkkk
    Zen Arado: a wise precaution :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Zen Arado: cats probably taste nice
    Eden Haiku: So now you are 'mostly' vegetarian Eliza?
    Zen Arado: nice
    Eliza Madrigal: yes.... have almost given up seafood Eden
    Eliza Madrigal: that's been the last thing
    Zen Arado: that's the difficult one for me
    Zen Arado: can't live on veggie burgers
    Eden Haiku: I ate shrimps yesterday.


    Eliza Madrigal: Then again I don't foresee myself ever being so strict that I would be at a party and insist one things being 'pure', no eggs/dairy, etc
    Eden Haiku: On BBQ. That was delicious. Yes, same here. When invited, you have to be able to eat something...
    Zen Arado: I see vegetarianism as a scale
    Zen Arado: not black and white
    Eliza Madrigal: just feel better when I don't eat meat... so its about being sensitive and paying attention I think
    Bertram Jacobus: "ok" - i"ll leave - ty all for the nice talk and may all beings be happy please (!) ...
    Eliza Madrigal nods @ Eden and Zen
    Zen Arado: better to eat as little animal produce as possible though
    Eden Haiku: Bye Bertram.
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bert :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye bert
    Zen Arado: bye Bert
    Eliza Madrigal: We live in a very wasteful society....
    Eliza Madrigal: the way we package foods, etc
    Eliza Madrigal: and when you think of that waste... and wasting animals like that...
    Eden Haiku: Me too, even eating fish or sea food rarely, I feel different when I do,
    Eliza Madrigal: well, not very appreciative
    Eliza Madrigal: It isn't like in Am Indian culture where one is thankful and uses everything
    Zen Arado: read an article recently that said we are more suited to vegetarian diet
    Zen Arado: wew only recently evolved to eating meat
    Eliza Madrigal: really? how is that possible?
    Zen Arado: our digestive system
    Eliza Madrigal sees image of caveman with club in his hand
    Yakuzza Lethecus: nobody can say that so generally, there are culture's with a genepoole whom can't generally process milk very well, or alcohol or even meat
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah
    Eliza Madrigal: we have to notice our bodies personally I think
    Zen Arado: yes true
    Eliza Madrigal: and not be legalistic
    Zen Arado: factory farming gives me horrors though
    Zen Arado: and that is how most meat is produced
    Eliza Madrigal: If I really wanted to eat a cheeseburger today, I'd do it. Hah... just don't want to, from paying attention to the way it makes me feel
    Eden Haiku: Most Tibetans eat meat, even if they are buddhists, not just enough green in their country.
    Zen Arado: I started being vegetarian from studying topic in philosophy
    Eliza Madrigal: yes... definitely contextual
    Zen Arado: philosophy
    Eden Haiku: I was a natural. Always disliked meat.
    Eliza Madrigal: So just makes sense for you then Eden
    Zen Arado: 'what gives us the right to kill and eat other animals?' was the question
    Yakuzza Lethecus thinks about the marinated beef he's going to be eating in 3/4 hrs :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hm, and you worked with that and felt more sensitive, Zen?
    Eliza Madrigal: hehehe Yakuzza
    Eliza Madrigal: Just appreciate it ! :)
    Zen Arado: yes I studied the arguments
    Eden Haiku: Did not like the fact that I had to eat meat when growing up (my parents thought I needed to)..
    Zen Arado: yes people do think that Eden
    Zen Arado: you won't get enough protein - myth
    Eliza Madrigal: yes common thought
    Eliza Madrigal: and truthfully, some don't
    Eliza Madrigal: thus the paying attention part being important
    Zen Arado: there is protein in nearly everything you eat
    Zen Arado: bread , cereals
    Eliza Madrigal: It must also depend on lifestyle...
    Eliza Madrigal: on the type of work one does, etc
    Zen Arado: the old myth is that we are superior because we have rational thought
    Eden Haiku: My Dad at supper time when I was maybe 10: "Think about all these poor children in Warshaw's ghetto who had to eat rats".
    Eden Haiku: Very yummy...;)))
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh My
    Eden Haiku: A subtle psychologist my Dad :)))
    Zen Arado: ever read Peter Singer?
    Eliza Madrigal: thinking about being ten and considering the world....
    Eden Haiku: No, who is he?
    Eliza Madrigal: Yes Zen, actually
    Eliza Madrigal: I think he's at Harvard... an ethics professor
    Zen Arado: he is an Australian philosopher who wrote about vegetarianism principles
    Eliza Madrigal: very provoking
    Zen Arado: yes
    Zen Arado: he is also a utilitarian
    Zen Arado: he would eat if it became necessary
    Eden Haiku: Googled him, interesting...
    Zen Arado: eat meat I meant
    Eliza Madrigal: yes... I think I'm like that honestly.... I don't like to have too many 'no's in my life
    Zen Arado: he got into trouble one time
    Eliza Madrigal: how so zen?
    Zen Arado: trying to remember
    Eliza Madrigal: and I definitely don't want to be sitting with friends judging their food
    Zen Arado: something about new born children
    Eliza Madrigal: hm
    Zen Arado: I will look it up sometime
    Zen Arado: agree Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: I just like the way he really gets his students to think for themselves...
    Eliza Madrigal: he doesn't want theoretical answers
    Zen Arado: easy to become judgmental and sanctimonious
    Eliza Madrigal: Indeed, Zen! We have to be responsible for ourselves and the moment we are in.... that's enough :)
    Zen Arado: "Similar to his argument for abortion, Singer argues that newborns similarly lack the essential characteristics of personhood ” "rationality, autonomy, and self-consciousness"[17] ” and therefore "killing a newborn baby is never equivalent to killing a person, that is, a being who wants to go on living."
    Eden Haiku: Winter camping with my brother years ago, he had said he was taking care of the food. But he forgot I am vegetarian. His wife had prepared a stew with meat balls. There was nothing else to eat. So I ate a bit. Spent a very cold night in a tent, hearing all the animals in the forest, not sleeping at all. A nightmare!
    Zen Arado: sounds like it Eden
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh My
    Zen Arado: anyway I better go and heat my pizza
    Eden Haiku: Killing newborns quite a nightmare too!
    Zen Arado: he didn't mean it that way though I think
    Eden Haiku: Will cat eat something?
    Zen Arado: cats sure aren't vegetarians!
    Zen Arado: pure carnivores
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Zen
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye zen
    Zen Arado: let's go pussy cat
    Eden Haiku: Bye Zen, enjoy your pizza!
    Yakuzza Lethecus: bye everyone
    Eliza Madrigal: Spose i should be productive today.... cold feels a bit better... yesterday was awful
    Zen Arado: bye
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Yakuzza :)
    Eden Haiku: Still cold in Florida Eliza?
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh, not cold here as far as weather... but I woke with a terrible cold yesterday
    Eden Haiku: Bye Yakuzza.
    Eden Haiku: Oh, hope you get well soon. Take care dear Eliza :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Yes, you too.... wonderful that you spent the holiday with your dad
    Eliza Madrigal: :) (((Eden)))
    Eden Haiku: Yes, we had a great easter Sunday.
    Eden Haiku: (((((Eliza)))))
    Eden Haiku: Dress fantastic!
    Eliza Madrigal: That's beautiful :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah, thank you... fun to wear
    Eden Haiku: Gorgeous!
    Eden Haiku: Bye for now!
    Eliza Madrigal: I love your easter bonnet :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye :)
    Eden Haiku: Yes, thanks.
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