2008.09.28 13:00 - Terry Pratchetts visit

Adams arrives, Terry Pratchett is anticipated

Quilty Bookmite: Hi Adams.
Adams Rubble: Hi Quilty :)
Quel Karillion: Hi Adams :)
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Adams Rubble: Hi Avastu, Gaya, Quel, Corvi :)
Avastu Maruti: love to you my friend
Adams Rubble thinking it is very quiet
Quilty Bookmite: I hope it is. I'm concerned that it is just the lag I have been seeing.
Adams Rubble: testing lag 1, 2 , 3
Adams Rubble: :)
Gaya Ethaniel smiles
Quilty Bookmite: I've just heard that my favourite author is going to do a live Q&A in SL!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Who is that?
Gaya Ethaniel: ah
Quilty Bookmite: Terry Pratchett.
Gaya Ethaniel: wow
Gaya Ethaniel wonders how Pratchette's av may look like
Quilty Bookmite: 9th October apparently.
Adams Rubble has to plead ignorance

Quel introduced acceptance for the topic,

Quel Karillion: how about acceptance for today's topic?
Faenik: why not?
Quilty Bookmite: He wrote the Discworld novels, although you may not have heard of them.
Adams Rubble: Hello Udge :)
Quilty Bookmite: Fantasy / English humour.
Adams Rubble: Ah
Gaya Ethaniel: http://www.terrypratchettbooks.com/
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Adams Rubble: ty Gaya

Udge arrives..

Udge Watanabe: evening everyone :-)
Corvuscorva Nightfire grins! Yay!
Quel Karillion: Hi Udge :)
Quilty Bookmite: Sadly he has been diagnosed with an acute form of Alzheimers and may not live for much longer.
Quilty Bookmite: Hi Udge.
Gaya Ethaniel: acceptance...  please say more?
Avastu Maruti: love to you my friends
Gaya Ethaniel: that's sad...
Udge Watanabe: hello quilty, quel, corvi, avastu, gaya, adams
Gaya Ethaniel smiles
Quilty Bookmite: Did I miss something?
Quilty Bookmite: Yes. Would be interesting. :-)
Quel Karillion: How do you accept?
Gaya Ethaniel: first by seeing for what it is

Avastu disappears..sort of

Quilty Bookmite: Adams seems to be sitting on Avastu's lap.
Gaya Ethaniel: Avastu has left Quilty
Faenik loves wells!
Adams Rubble thinks Avastu left us
Udge Watanabe: his ghost perhaps.
Quilty Bookmite: Spooky. I can still see him but sitting facing away from the table.
Adams Rubble: He is offline
Adams Rubble sorry to interrupt
Quilty Bookmite: Perhaps I had better reboot.
Quilty Bookmite: Sorry. Will be back in a couple of minutes, I hope.
Adams Rubble: no need Quilty, I'll move
Quilty Bookmite: No, I seem to be missing things.
Faenik: make sure you brush your teeth well tonight Gaya
Udge Watanabe chuckles
Gaya Ethaniel: shush Faenik

statements and questions

Corvuscorva Nightfire: I have been talking/thinking alot about accepting myself as being...
Adams Rubble: Hmm. I seem to be missing things too
Corvuscorva Nightfire: or not doing it.
Udge Watanabe: mm?
Gaya Ethaniel listens
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I am having trouble with that concept, with understanding the idea of acceptance..despite talking it over and intellectually kinda getting it...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I don't know that I have a question...this might be a bit of a dud...
Gaya Ethaniel: shoot Corvi
Corvuscorva Nightfire: But it's what has been on my mind from the practice lately.
Udge Watanabe: we could discuss statements as well as questions.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: hahahha..I think I'm having too much trouble to even make a statement.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: still working on that.
Quel Karillion: wb Quilty :)
Udge Watanabe: is it the idea or the act of accepting that troubles you?
Adams Rubble: wb Quilty :)
Udge Watanabe: wb quilty

seeing instead of accepting

Gaya Ethaniel: the word 'accept' can be confusing to me... I use 'see' instead of 'accept' Corvi
Gaya Ethaniel: wb Quilty
Quilty Bookmite: Thanks. Sorry about that.
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
Gaya Ethaniel: accept sounds as though I need to 'do' something about it
Gaya Ethaniel: while 'see' is just that
Faenik loves wells!

Perfect as you are

Corvuscorva Nightfire: Adelene Dawner: You're perfect as you are.
Gaya Ethaniel: all I have had to do is 'open and turn my eyes to whatever it is'
Quel Karillion: Yes, it could be called just seeing things for what they are.
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
Gaya Ethaniel: for me, you're perfect as you are means 'I am what I am'
Udge Watanabe smiles. A simple statement but very hard to believe (speaking for myself)
Quel Karillion: as for doing, well, it sort of is the opposite of doing :)
Gaya Ethaniel: well... I am what I am and I'm ok with that to be more precise
Corvuscorva Nightfire: It's the ok with that bit that is so very hard.
Adams Rubble: Our inner person is perfect; our "self" may have problems with acceptance
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods to Udge.
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Udge Watanabe: mmhmm

where the glitch is

Quel Karillion: because, to see yourself for what you are, it's necessary to stop judging yourself.
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Gaya Ethaniel: or comparing
Quel Karillion finds sentences of the form "I should be/do this/that" or "I shouldn't ..." to be very visible indicator of self judgement
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Quel Karillion: so, whenever I notice myself thinking "should" or "shouldn't" it sort of raises a red flag right there.
Quilty Bookmite: Popeye philosophy?
Quel Karillion: red flag that reads "pay attention"
Gaya Ethaniel smiles

the PaB 411...

Quilty Bookmite: Hi Davmar.
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Welcome, DAv...
Udge Watanabe: hello davmar
Corvuscorva Nightfire: come sit down?
Udge Watanabe: nice pulse piercings ;-)
Faenik loves wells!
Davmar Hykova: hello all
Quel Karillion: the should is there often to hide true things such as "I want" or "I don't want"
Quel Karillion: Hello Davmar :)
Quilty Bookmite: have you been here before Davmar?
Corvuscorva Nightfire thinks about the I want, don't want..
Davmar Hykova: thank you seems you are a jewely expert
Adams Rubble: The want seems to indicate desire
Davmar Hykova: no I havent
Quilty Bookmite: Do you know about Play As being?
Davmar Hykova: no sorry i don't
Davmar Hykova: yet
Adams Rubble: no problem :)
Quilty Bookmite: http://playasbeing.wiki.is
Davmar Hykova: But Corvi did explain a little
Quilty Bookmite: We are a group that experiments with perception of reality. :-)
Davmar Hykova: my Finnish is a bit lacking
Adams Rubble: mine too :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: hahahah
Quilty Bookmite: If you look on the website I just sent there are some short excerts from discussions which explains what the group is about.
Quel Karillion: Voin minä suomeakin visertää :)
Quilty Bookmite: Mine is non-existent. :-)
Adams Rubble: mine too :)
Quilty Bookmite: I need to ask you, do you mind if your words are recorded on a Wiki page?
Davmar Hykova: no
Quilty Bookmite: Thank you. :-)
Davmar Hykova: but that page wont open for me
Adams Rubble: should there be a slash after the is?
Quilty Bookmite: oops. sorry, mistyped.
Davmar Hykova: yes that wouldnt stop it
Quilty Bookmite: http://playasbeing.wik.is
Faenik: なるほど^^
Quilty Bookmite: There was an extra i in there.
Davmar Hykova: that works for me thx
Quilty Bookmite: For some reason cut and paste isn;t working.

acceptance, seeing and attachement

Adams Rubble: Corvi, sometimes are attachments seem very formidable, that they can't be bridged
 Adams Rubble: It may be less acceptance that bridges them than the fact that we just see them clearly and they no longer pose a threat
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
Faenik loves wells!
Quel Karillion: you could say acceptance is knowing yourself.
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Faenik loves wells!
Quilty Bookmite: Would it be possible for someone else to post the chat log? I seem to be missing out on great chunks of it. I can see people typing but nothing gets said.

Acceptance, assumptions and not doing

Corvuscorva Nightfire: I think..the hard part is getting there...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: the other part of the message is..."don't do"
Adams Rubble: yes Corvi
Corvuscorva Nightfire: stop trying.
Quel Karillion: when you try to do something, there's an assumption behind it.
Quel Karillion: assumptions that you can't
Quel Karillion: if you just do something, that assumption is not there.
Corvuscorva Nightfire looks very interested here...
Udge Watanabe: huh.
Adams Rubble: could you explain more Fael?

Trying and making effort are two different things

Gaya Ethaniel: trying and making effort are two different things?
Quel Karillion: it's another clue you can get from words.
Quel Karillion: if you speak of trying, you're assuming you can't.
Udge Watanabe remembers Yoda.
Faenik: indeed?
Gaya Ethaniel smiles
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Well...as the core of the question for me right now is how to sleep through an entire night...
Quel Karillion raises an eyebrow.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: and I seem not to be able to....
Udge Watanabe: "Do, or do not. There is no 'try'."
Corvuscorva Nightfire: try is the operative word.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: argh
Udge Watanabe: lol
Quel Karillion: Ah, yes, wise words :)
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Quilty Bookmite: The wisdom of Star Wars. :-)
Adams Rubble: Losing sleep is a problem

Try is about excuses?  Turmoil is about insights.

Quel Karillion: when you feel the need to use the word 'try' about doing something, you're giving excuses you can point to when you fail.
Corvuscorva Nightfire looks quite surprised..."yes, I think you are right."
Adams Rubble: but it indicates turmoil.
Adams Rubble: Often when we have turmoil is when we get the most insights
Gaya Ethaniel nods
Quel Karillion: the important question then would be, why do you need excuses?
Quel Karillion: and for whom
Corvuscorva Nightfire thinks quietly about this...

Bye Quilty and Adams

Adams Rubble: It was good seeing you all. bye for now :)
Quel Karillion: See you later Adams :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Thank you Adams.
Udge Watanabe: bye adams
Quilty Bookmite: Bye Adams.
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Udge Watanabe: gaya, do you have the link to that "Not good enough" MP3 to hand?
Udge Watanabe: I'd like to suggest it to Corvi, if you haven#t heard it yet.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Oh, I have..*grins at Gaya*
Quilty Bookmite: I must go too. Bed time. I will try and piece together as much of the log as I have. If anyone feels like send me or posting the whole thing, i would be very grateful.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Thank you, quilty...
Udge Watanabe: ok, good,.
Udge Watanabe: bye
Quilty Bookmite: Thank you. Goodnight.
Gaya Ethaniel smiles
Udge Watanabe: bye quilty, take care
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.

"trying" to explain

Davmar Hykova: isnt concentrating to much on the meaning of words purely an exercise in simantics
Udge Watanabe: where did the "too much" come from? was that before I arrived?
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: no...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Dav...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: which part of the conversation seems to be concentrating too much on the meaning of words?
Davmar Hykova: the trying concept
Corvuscorva Nightfire: ah..
Corvuscorva Nightfire: yes.
Davmar Hykova: where trying was deemed to be preparing to fail
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I see...
Davmar Hykova: to that word whilst it can be contexed in such a way
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I think..the thing is...I am "trying" to understand a concept....
Corvuscorva Nightfire: and find a way to sleep...
Udge Watanabe nods
Corvuscorva Nightfire: and find a way to know that it's alright to be what ever I am.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: and...somewhere in those words is a way to stop trying and just do it.
Davmar Hykova: but what then if you try to fail, are you preparing to succeed
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I am soooo glad you asked that.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: cause...it's helping me.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: but I don't know that I can really answer your question...you might just be right.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I'm not sure.
Corvuscorva Nightfire laughs at Dav's last comment..
Corvuscorva Nightfire: maybe?
Corvuscorva Nightfire: hahahhah
Gaya Ethaniel: ...mm... what's wrong with failing?
Corvuscorva Nightfire: maybe indeed.
Faenik: indeed?
Davmar Hykova: well nothing as long as you didn't set out to succeed otherwise everything
Udge Watanabe chuckles
Corvuscorva Nightfire: hmmmm
Corvuscorva Nightfire considers....
Davmar Hykova: its just language that for most people is used in a flippant way purely as a form of communication

Perspective

Udge Watanabe: one of the madder of my profs took us to the shooting gallery at a local fair for a lesson in perspective.
Udge Watanabe: You can take a gun and try to shoot the little metal ducks as they roll past, taking your time, aiming carefully
Udge Watanabe: or you can try to maintain a constant rate of fire but hit NOTHING while doing so.
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods....
Udge Watanabe: They’re actually both equally difficult.
Udge Watanabe: the pressure of knowing "I must shoot right now" and aiming between the ducks is enormous.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Oh!
Davmar Hykova: but that is statistical
Udge Watanabe: when you aim at them, they seem tiny, but if you are aiming at the space between, htey are enormous.
Faenik: なるほど^^
Davmar Hykova: or could spray bullets wildly with no aim and hit a few ducks
Udge Watanabe: no, it’s practical. I have held the gun and tried to do it.
Davmar Hykova: and a few passersby lol
Davmar Hykova: pot luck
Udge Watanabe: yes, ok, I left out a few steps. "Shoot towards the targets as usual, without endangering any persons."
Corvuscorva Nightfire laughs.

Bye Gaya

Gaya Ethaniel: time to go. lovely to see you all again. good day/night
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Davmar Hykova: bye
Udge Watanabe: goodnight gaya, take care.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye, Gaya...thank you!
Gaya Ethaniel: ty Udge