2010.07.30 07:00 - Puppets, Snow Globes & All That

    Table of contents
    No headers

    The Guardian for this meeting was Eliza Madrigal. The comments are by Eliza Madrigal.


    Bruce Mowbray: I need to scoot off to meditation group now. Will look forward to reading the rest of this in the wiki.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Bruce :)
    Bleu Oleander: bye Bruce
    Eden Haiku: Bye Bruce :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bruce, enjoy
    Darren Islar: bye everyone leaving
    Susan Aloix: and that *separateness* illusion functions in a way that allows for a certain kind of awareness to materialise
    Pema Pera: bye Bruce!
    Fefonz Quan: I'll leave too, a wonderful weekend to all of you
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Fefonz
    Adams Rubble sneaks off too. Thanks everyoe :)
    Eliza Madrigal: well the act of exposing may be close to immediacy...
    Bleu Oleander: bye Fef
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye Bruce and Fefonz :)
    Eden Haiku: Bye Fefonz ;)
    Darren Islar: right Susan, and that makes it complicated
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Fef and Adams :)
    Darren Islar: ......and interesting
    SophiaSharon Larnia: I'm thinking about your statements Maxine! Will need a bit of time with it
    Darren Islar waves
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye Adams, nice outfit :)
    Maxine Walden: :) Sharon
    Eliza Madrigal: exposing illusions I meant to say.. hah
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (brb)
    Eliza Madrigal: I think the comparison to awake/aware/lucid dreaming seems helpful in this too... in that sense of feeling of being in the globe and outside of the globe and aware of no there being no separation?
    Pema Pera: the funny thing about awareness and experience is: within experience there seems to be no room for awareness, while within awareness experience is nothing special, just one more form of awareness
    Darren Islar: :)
    Pema Pera: the snow globe, Eliza?
    Eliza Madrigal: (sorry to get hung up on that imagery but I find it really hellpful personally)
    Eliza Madrigal: Yes, that Sharon mentioned...
    Maxine Walden: agree, Pema. Awareness seems more vast, spacious
    Pema Pera: very vivid image indeed, Sharon!
    Eliza Madrigal: So there is this scene (I'm sure I'm going too far with it) inside...and something looking outside--> in...
    Eliza Madrigal: and then awareness opens up that sense of partition without undoing the pleasure of the scene...
    Eliza Madrigal: one can be delighted playing in the snow
    Eliza Madrigal: because there isn't the fear of 'how do I get out' or the concern about 'how do I get in'
    Susan Aloix: do you see awareness as having no intention Pema?
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah, wonderful question Susan
    Eden Haiku: Yes some awareness looking at us behind our computers looking at these avatars in a snow globe of a screen...
    SophiaSharon Larnia: looking for pupose seem to be a subjective justification fo existence
    Gaya Ethaniel: Who is aware of awareness being vast ... ?
    Eliza Madrigal nods @ Eden, yes... very much so!
    Pema Pera: the *appearance* of subject and object does not bring us out of awareness -- it just means that we forget the unity that is intrinsic to awareness, but we can never really leave it
    Susan Aloix: :) ty eliza... great discussion...:)
    Eliza Madrigal: :))
    Pema Pera: so any intention we normally have can be accomodated by awareness
    Maxine Walden: :) Gaya
    Pema Pera: in a light way
    Susan Aloix: ahhh interesting pema
    Gaya Ethaniel: ^.- Maxine
    Pema Pera: awareness is aware, I'd say, Gaya :-)
    Susan Aloix: and so intention uses awareness like some kind of searchlight?
    Pema Pera: but awareness sometimes like to play as subject
    Pema Pera: like a hand puppet
    Pema Pera: awareness is the hand
    Gaya Ethaniel: Awareness looking at itself? :P
    Pema Pera: the subject/self/ego the puppet
    Eliza Madrigal: yes
    Bleu Oleander: puppet=avatar?
    Pema Pera: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: so puppets in snow globes? hahahah
    Maxine Walden: :)
    Pema Pera: duality is a snow job . . . .
    Darren Islar: I guess we feel the need to make awareness concrete, like puting it into words
    Maxine Walden: :))
    SophiaSharon Larnia: to let go of why, hmm
    Eden Haiku: Our roles as puppeters...
    Darren Islar: seperating it from the experience, freezing it in time
    Gaya Ethaniel: The universe had to wait so long to see itself then :)
    Susan Aloix: yes darren...............
    Bleu Oleander: ha! Pema
    Eliza Madrigal: so no separation between puppet and puppeteer is likened to awareness/immediacy
    Pema Pera: the universe may not mind, Gaya :-)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and maybe the universe did this lots of times
    Gaya Ethaniel: How longn ago was the Big Bang?
    Gaya Ethaniel: long*
    Eliza Madrigal: time may be a great pleasure then... if it doesn't mind...
    Pema Pera: 13.7 billion years, in linear time
    Bleu Oleander: universe = subject?
    Pema Pera: right now, in timeless time
    Gaya Ethaniel: I don't think the Universe thinks in terms of the time we get by.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Zen
    Darren Islar: time doesn't mind
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen :))
    Pema Pera: hi Zen!
    Bleu Oleander: hi Zen
    Eden Haiku: Hi Zen;)
    Zen Arado: Hi all
    Darren Islar: I thought there was a ghost coming up :)), but it happens to be Zen
    Darren Islar: hi Zen :)
    Susan Aloix: Hi Zen :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Hello Zen :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Zen :) *nods*
    Dao Yheng: hi Zen!
    Maxine Walden: I had better go, nice conversation, see you all later
    Maxine Walden: bye all
    Pema Pera: by Maxine!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Maxine!
    Zen Arado: was there a Time meeting today?
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Maxine, thanks!
    Bleu Oleander: bye Maxine
    Pema Pera: yes, Zen
    Dao Yheng: bye maxine!
    Zen Arado: bye Maxine
    Darren Islar: going too
    Pema Pera: bye Darren!
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Darren :)
    Eden Haiku: Have to leave also, bye everyone!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Darren!
    Darren Islar: bye everyone :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Bye Maxine :) Bye Darren :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and Eden :)
    Zen Arado: oh I missed it - but I can read the log
    Bleu Oleander: bye everyone :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye those leaving :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Bye Eden, Bleu. :) and yes, those who must go
    Gaya Ethaniel: And have a great retreat :)
    Pema Pera: thank you, Gaya!
    Eliza Madrigal: Oh, thank you so much Gaya. I'm sure it will be great
    Gaya Ethaniel: :)
    Gaya Ethaniel moves into the inner circle of the things.
    Eliza Madrigal: :))
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: this is so hard, I keep wanting to bring subjectivity into everything :)
    Zen Arado: Nova Scotia must be nice at this time of year
    Pema Pera: be our guest, Sharon :-)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ha!
    Susan Aloix: :) sophia.....throws in intersubjectivity ...just cause
    SophiaSharon Larnia resorts to philosphically tearing it apart
    Zen Arado: what is subectivity I wonder?
    Susan Aloix: lol
    Zen Arado: subjectivity*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: the more i think of it, the less i need to speak of it
    Zen Arado: is it a false duality with objectivity?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: even to share
    Zen Arado: am reading Nisargadatta atm so don't know what anything is :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: grins
    Pema Pera: hehehe
    Eliza Madrigal giggles @ Zen
    Archmage Atlantis: My most immediate thought is that subjectivity is the objective viewpoint of another individual that I do not see
    Zen Arado: just 'I am'
    Archmage Atlantis: And the same in reverse
    Pema Pera: interesting angle, Arch
    Zen Arado: so it's a viewpoint?
    Zen Arado: only?
    Pema Pera: well, words can be defined any way you like, Zen :-)
    Archmage Atlantis: Well, that is a word.......it might be clearer to say that another's reality may or may not overlap with mine
    Zen Arado: they cam nean anything I want them to mean' somebody said in Alice in Wonderland :)
    Susan Aloix: I like *objective viewpoint*....its like the pragmatic choice we make ....to *other* something as *object* in the course of pursuing our projects
    Pema Pera: I was thinking about that very sentence, Zen :-)
    Gaya Ethaniel: :)
    Pema Pera nods at Susan: it is all intersubjective
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah, that resonates with me also Susan re 'choice' seeming dynamic there....
    Eliza Madrigal: in that sense of offering/allowing, etc
    Susan Aloix: yeah pema
    Archmage Atlantis: A simple example is when I am asked at the grocery store to get something from the top shelf by someone less tall......our viewpoints overlap, but are not the same.
    Pema Pera: scientific truth become acknowledged "objective truth" through peer review which is just blatantly intersubjective
    Pema Pera: hahaha, Arch, nice image!
    Bruce Mowbray muses: "Overlapping viewpoints." Cool.
    Susan Aloix: at its most extreme when we *objectify* another human as *not human* or *not us*...as seen in the practices of scapegoating or marginalising (just talking as i think here)
    Gaya Ethaniel: lol
    Archmage Atlantis: ty, Pema....I understand simple examples better than complex concepts, just my reality
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ha :0 mine too
    Eliza Madrigal nods at Susan... and we do this in subtle ways all the time without realizing it...
    Pema Pera: yes, Susan -- "objectivity" is a political concept . . .
    Susan Aloix: yes pema....re peer review
    Eliza Madrigal: even those aware of the trap...
    Zen Arado: what absolute and relative then? Is the absolute the subjective?
    Susan Aloix: yes eliza
    SophiaSharon Larnia: winnie the pooh contemplating the universe haha
    Pema Pera: :)
    Pema Pera: absolute and relative are tricky terms
    Archmage Atlantis: :) ..... The Tao of Pooh
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yay :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: I want to find this quote ... I know we already passed that point.
    Pema Pera: when we use them to mean "non-dual" and "dual" there is the funny contract between them, but *not* a duality :-)
    Susan Aloix: Ivan Buber survived concentration camps in auschwitz - he wanted to know how such cruelty could have ever occurred....he came up with the whole narrative on *objectification* ...he called it the *I - it* relationship.....when we make a human or an entity into an *it* or an *object*....
    Susan Aloix: opps
    Gaya Ethaniel: If there is a god, he is not only a wizard at leaving clues behind. More than anything, he's a master of concealment. And the world is not something that gives itself away. The heaves still keep their secrets. There is little gossip amongst the stars.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: it must be very quiet
    Zen Arado: ah yes - the objectification of others in war so it is easier to kill them
    Susan Aloix: (almost interupted the silence )
    Gaya Ethaniel: But no one has forgotten the Big Bang yet. Since then, silence has reigned supreme, and everything there is moving away. One can still come across a moon. Or a comet. Just don't expect friendly greetings. No visiting cards are printed in space.
    Archmage Atlantis: Both good comments, Gaya and Susan
    Susan Aloix: yes zen
    Gaya Ethaniel: Maya by Jostein Gaarder
    Bruce Mowbray: If a galaxy is not a "group hug, " then what is it?
    Eliza Madrigal: indeed, thank you
    Eliza Madrigal: :)) Bruce
    Susan Aloix: :) Gaya
    Susan Aloix: ty arch
    Zen Arado: a galaxy seems a very cold , lonely, inhuman thing to me
    Gaya Ethaniel: I like this book a lot :)
    Susan Aloix: :)
    Susan Aloix: nice
    Bruce Mowbray: How about forests, Zen. Are they not also "group hugging"?
    Zen Arado: forests yes - they ar teeming with life though
    Zen Arado: and trees are so beautiful
    Bruce Mowbray: We dwell in a galaxy, Zen. . . and we are "life"
    SophiaSharon Larnia: each tree is experiencing itself
    Susan Aloix: has intersubjectivity with plants all the time :)
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Zen Arado: yes but was thinking of faraway ones
    Bruce Mowbray: The trees are hugging - the stars are hugging -- we are hugging.
    Bruce Mowbray: To me, that is what "sharing Being" is all about.
    Zen Arado: ok maybe - but isn't my initial impression
    Bruce Mowbray: inter-subjectivity, by another name: inter-hugging.
    Susan Aloix: i like
    Pema Pera thinking about a cartoon in the New Yorker, a dog pissing against a fire hydrant ; title "Our Galaxy, detail"
    Archmage Atlantis: A room full of people can also be very cold, lonely and "inhuman"
    Bruce Mowbray: ;-) cool image, Pema!
    Susan Aloix: LOL
    Zen Arado: I feel more a sense of awe and alienation at the vast distances of instellar space
    Zen Arado: :)
    Pema Pera: yes, Arch!
    Gaya Ethaniel: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: agreed, Zen. So humbling and so "right here."
    Pema Pera: Bruce, would you like to say more about experience versus awareness -- just wondering whether you finished your earlier thought about the difference or lack thereof
    Bruce Mowbray muses about distant starts - and how those photos traveled all that distance to crash into Zen's retinas.
    Pema Pera: hit by a star . . .
    Bruce Mowbray: No more to sya, Pema, actually. Just an observation that for me, there's no difference (separation) between experience and awareness.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hit by yesterday
    Pema Pera: :)
    Pema Pera: it may be just a matter of definition of the words, Bruce
    Bruce Mowbray: Also -- the "idea" (discovery) that something always emerges (rises) in awareness. . .
    Zen Arado: Nisargadatta says the world is in me ...not me in the world....so all those galaxies are constructed in me really
    Bruce Mowbray: that awareness/experience seems never to be empty.
    Pema Pera: I was pointing to the kind of "experience" without an "experiencer" if that makes any sense . . .
    Eliza Madrigal: the ocean is in the drop as much as the drop is in the ocean... maybe not either/or Zen?
    Pema Pera: and I like to use the word "awareness" for that -- just a choice
    Bruce Mowbray: Yes, it makes perfect sense, Pema.
    Pema Pera: the "ex" in experience seems to point to a drawing out/away tendency
    Zen Arado: I remember a zen teacher saying our world dies with us
    Pema Pera: awareness perhaps as an inperience :-)
    Bruce Mowbray: like the ec- in ecstasy.
    Zen Arado: never quite grasped that
    Zen Arado: yes maybe both Eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: if the world is new each moment does it also die each moment then zen?
    Pema Pera: yes, words are interesting, aren't they -- but we can make them mean what we like, as long as we're clear about what we mean :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Ty, Zen.....the zen teacher is seeing what I see
    Bruce Mowbray muses: IN-perience. Cool.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :D
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Zen Arado: yes that too Eliza
    Zen Arado: but there is no birth and death anyway
    Eliza Madrigal smiles @ zen... so those teachers are all right and all wrong/ giggles
    Lucinda Lavender: Just thinking that I will have to listen along time..before I know something to say
    SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles, ive been thinking and listening and dont know how to say what im thinking :D
    Pema Pera: "_
    Pema Pera: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: oops bell, sorry
    Eliza Madrigal: the bell is apologized to quite often
    SophiaSharon Larnia: heheh
    Eliza Madrigal: hehe
    Zen Arado: think I have subjectively baffled myself :)
    Eliza Madrigal: bewilderment seems a rich state somehow...
    Gaya Ethaniel: :)
    Zen Arado: but that's good probably...agree Eliza
    Archmage Atlantis: A mentor of mine used to call the rules of accounting equal to guidelines
    Eliza Madrigal: yes laws are written to be 'interpretted'
    Lucinda Lavender: what if consciousness bridges what appears to be separate?
    Eliza Madrigal: Lucinda, what do you think? sort of touches on dreams as waking tools...?
    Eliza Madrigal: or waking bridges is nicer
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Archmage Atlantis: As long as the bridge holds, there is no separation....if the bridge ceases to exist, separation returns
    SophiaSharon Larnia: like some form of consciousness being in all things?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: all pieces of matter?
    Eliza Madrigal: hmm yes... or all levels of consciousness... even matter... donno :)
    Eliza Madrigal: levels not as in hierarchy necessarily
    Zen Arado: we have to stop thinking there is separation maybe
    Bruce Mowbray: For me, "separation" is the illusion that we do not share Being.
    Eliza Madrigal: yes
    Zen Arado: we create the illusion of it yes
    Eliza Madrigal: texture
    Dao Yheng: SophiaSharon, I must confess that I "subscribe" to the view that awareness is matter as well :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i beleive that, yes, but how do I know that?
    Bruce Mowbray: We share Being with trees as well as distant galazies.
    Bruce Mowbray: galqaxies.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Doa, I do too
    Bruce Mowbray: galaxies.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: eep i mean Dao :)
    Zen Arado: is feeling more warmth to distant galaxies :)
    Lucinda Lavender: something about our viewing ...makes a appearance of separation . and yet everythought seems also like a participation as well.
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: ;-) glad to hear that, Zen.
    Gaya Ethaniel: So forms/matters are prerequisite for awareness to rise?
    Lucinda Lavender: gravity:)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Forms - vessels for awareness ...
    Zen Arado: we are always looking for causation
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and a medium for experience in my humble opinion
    SophiaSharon Larnia: as a *
    Gaya Ethaniel: Yes precious human life :)
    Eliza Madrigal: somehow prerequisite doesn't seem to ring... but yes we do seem to be zen
    Lucinda Lavender: Gaya..I don't know but we do have the special ability to view...know we are alive
    Bruce Mowbray muses: How does "emergence" compare to or differ from "causation"?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes, causation, why and how
    Gaya Ethaniel: Awareness isn't a mere by-product of organisms ... rather it is the main course.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: (for me anyway)
    Zen Arado: why not let things be as they are?
    Eliza Madrigal: or it does, but like we need the reflecting to see ourselves... but the need creates the reflection too somehow.. or the feeling of solidness of it...
    Eliza Madrigal: so drop needs and it opens? still there but maybe in more forms...
    Eliza Madrigal: textures...
    Zen Arado: sorry but I am regurgitating half digested Nisargatta teachings
    Eliza Madrigal is rambling aloud :)
    Eliza Madrigal giggles
    Lucinda Lavender: sentience:)))
    Gaya Ethaniel: :)
    Bruce Mowbray: ;-)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :D Zen, it does hit one thaqt way
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i am that and all that :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Please feel free to regurgitate away Zen. It helps you to clarify things I'm sure.
    Eliza Madrigal: hahahahah Sharon
    SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
    Eliza Madrigal: all that and a bag of chips
    Bruce Mowbray: Time for me to dis-emerge. Thank you to everyone.
    Zen Arado: that's the idea Gaya :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Bruce
    Zen Arado: bye Bruce :)
    Lucinda Lavender: bye Bruce
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bruce :)
    Susan Aloix: back
    Dao Yheng: I'd better be off as well -- thanks everyone!
    Susan Aloix: bye bruce....
    Eliza Madrigal: WB Susan
    SophiaSharon Larnia: wb susan
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Dao :) Nice to see you
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Dao :)
    Zen Arado: bye Dao
    Susan Aloix: ty eliza..sophia :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye :)
    Susan Aloix: Bye Dao
    Archmage Atlantis: Bye both :)
    Lucinda Lavender: bye Dao
    Pema Pera: hello and goodbye :-)
    Pema Pera: sorry, heavy carsh
    Pema Pera: crash
    Gaya Ethaniel: wb
    Pema Pera: hard to get back in again
    SophiaSharon Larnia: wb Pema and bye :D
    Gaya Ethaniel: What's your plan today Eliza?
    Zen Arado: bye Pema
    Archmage Atlantis: I never manage to type bye before someone leaves (smile)
    Pema Pera: and actually I have to leave now, sorry!
    Lucinda Lavender: me to arch
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Pema :)
    Susan Aloix: wb pema...bye pema
    Pema Pera: thanks for the great conversations!
    Susan Aloix: :)
    Pema Pera: bfn
    Gaya Ethaniel: Bye :)
    Gaya Ethaniel: I should get going too :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: thank you!
    Susan Aloix: thankl you bye
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Gaya :)
    Zen Arado: yes me too
    Zen Arado: bye all
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Gaya dn Zen
    Gaya Ethaniel: Thanks everyone :)
    Eliza Madrigal: *and
    Archmage Atlantis: It is the hour, time to move on to other pleasures
    Eliza Madrigal: Thank you :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Zen
    Archmage Atlantis: Thank you all, and blessings
    Susan Aloix: thanks everyone :)) bye bye as well
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Susan
    Susan Aloix: bye all
    Susan Aloix: bye sophia....
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and Arch :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Susan, thanks for your contributions
    Lucinda Lavender: thank sGabye all
    Eliza Madrigal: Bye Arch :)
    Lucinda Lavender: wow...bye all
    Susan Aloix: thanks you as well eilza...bye for now
    SophiaSharon Larnia: a short 20 min nap after this conversation :D
    Susan Aloix: bye arch
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hehe
    Eliza Madrigal: hahah
    Eliza Madrigal: yes to process sharon
    Eliza Madrigal: nothing better
    SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
    SophiaSharon Larnia: wondering what would happen if the 'snow globe' world suddenly melded in to the one holding it all at once, would i 'lose my mind'?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
    SophiaSharon Larnia: what mind ?? hahahaha
    Eliza Madrigal: eek... av is typing
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :D
    Eliza Madrigal: Sharon! those are the things I think about too...
    Eliza Madrigal: used to worry about being disoriented by the openness
    SophiaSharon Larnia: and you're not now?
    Eliza Madrigal: takes over?
    Eliza Madrigal: until hm, realizing that's where the immediacy
    Eliza Madrigal: (sentences reversed)
    Lucinda Lavender: see...I am forgetting...what if the different ways of seeing being are just there to take turns?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: hmm
    Eliza Madrigal: well yes, the activity doesn't really 'go' anywhere in awareness?
    Lucinda Lavender: to give some sort of rythm
    Eliza Madrigal: :) the dance...
    Lucinda Lavender: I don't know ...likes the dance:)
    Eliza Madrigal: it is a particular reference so I hesitate to bring it up... but my imagery is Avalokitesvara.... a thousand arms and Still, persent
    Eliza Madrigal: present
    SophiaSharon Larnia: seeing being taking turns, that kind of limits being
    SophiaSharon Larnia: ?
    Eliza Madrigal: well, if there is time, then turns limits being
    SophiaSharon Larnia: relatively?
    Eliza Madrigal: yes ?
    Eliza Madrigal: heheh
    SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
    Lucinda Lavender: maybe turns is my way of saying this is how my mind proceeds through the ideas...giving them turns
    Eliza Madrigal: Really wonderful conversations this morning, but I need to get going....
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes Lucinda :D
    Lucinda Lavender: me too.
    Eliza Madrigal: (((( Friends )))))
    SophiaSharon Larnia: me too! haha
    Eliza Madrigal: have wonderful days
    Eliza Madrigal: hah
    Eliza Madrigal: bye for now
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Lucinda and Elia!!!
    SophiaSharon Larnia: Eliza*
    SophiaSharon Larnia: bye for now
    Lucinda Lavender: Bye all!
    Eliza Madrigal: oh, I actually like Elia too...
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :D

    Tag page (Edit tags)
    • No tags
    You must login to post a comment.
    Powered by MindTouch Core