Adams and I discuss timelessness

Adams Rubble: Wol, I just read through some of Saturday morning log as I am working on mine
Wol Euler: mmm?
Adams Rubble: When I first heard about the possibility of time not exisiting I was very hostile
Adams Rubble: after all I am a historian
Wol Euler laughs
Adams Rubble: but that is not what I am working with now
Adams Rubble: timelessness is another thing altogether
Adams Rubble: still past, present and future
Adams Rubble: but like you said this morning it is God's time
Adams Rubble: it is seeing beyond the restraints of time
Adams Rubble: to the eternal
Adams Rubble: it is a freedom
Adams Rubble waits for Wol's response. hehe
Wol Euler is trying not to wail "But I can't see what it is FOR"
Wol Euler would find that unproductive
Adams Rubble: I use it to get past my identities...as a tool
Adams Rubble: our identities (selves) are mired in time
Adams Rubble: like quicksand
Adams Rubble: helpless
Adams Rubble: trapped
Wol Euler nods
Wol Euler: I have a fragment of Auden in mind (or Pound?) who says "... like giants immersed in time"
Wol Euler: with exactly that sense of floundering helplessness
Adams Rubble: Cheer up Wol, out of our struggles comes the insight
Adams Rubble: It will happen
Adams Rubble: keep fighting :)
Wol Euler nods. I am not un-cheered. And I certainly hope I didn't sound hostile.
Adams Rubble: No, I had no idea of anything that was said after the milk bottle broke
Wol Euler: :)
Adams Rubble: Maybe when I do the log it will make some sense to me
Adams Rubble: I was mildly annoyed myself because I was feeling pretty good about things before that :)
Wol Euler: before the bottle broke? Sorry.
Adams Rubble: The timelessness thing is just a context for presence in the APAPB phrase
Adams Rubble: It was the missing piece for me
Adams Rubble: and the missing piece for me to be able to drop my identities more when I need to rather than just when it happens
Wol Euler ponders.
Wol Euler: I am looking for reasons to believe, not to reject.
Wol Euler: but my sticking point is "reality", that time DOES flow damn it.
Adams Rubble: You can have that and still have presence in the context of timelessness
Adams Rubble: at least I can :)
Wol Euler: I accept the context of timelessness, I fully accept God's time and that ours is contained within it but at right angles, not measurable in any sensible way in his time, as his is not measurable in ours. That is fine.
Adams Rubble: now use that to look at yourself
Adams Rubble: how do you fit into God's time?
Wol Euler: that is granularity to me, like the knowledge that my body consists primarily of empty space surrounding a few carbon atoms
Wol Euler: I know this, but I cannot perceive it.
Wol Euler: hmmmm
Adams Rubble: One thing I see when I look is my connection with very human being that ever lived
Adams Rubble: my fears
Adams Rubble: my angers
Adams Rubble: my loves
Adams Rubble: my pleasures
Adams Rubble: I do not have to be anxious about any of these
Adams Rubble: they are part of being human
Wol Euler nods
Adams Rubble: and yet we can spend a month worrying about some incident that happened because we got angry
Adams Rubble: that is not reality
Adams Rubble: it is a story
Wol Euler: hmmmm
Adams Rubble: Anyway, to make a long story short, if we can apply the context of timelessness to that incident, what happens?
Wol Euler: seeing God's timescale (timelessness) reduces your ... attachment to ... distractions?
Adams Rubble: yes!
Adams Rubble: hopefully (hehe)
Wol Euler chuckles
Wol Euler: hmmmm
Wol Euler: I think I get it.
Wol Euler: it isn't either/or
Adams Rubble: right!
Wol Euler: it's both/and - but not in any way that is perceptible
Wol Euler: like saying "ten lightyears plus seven inches". The scales are incompatible, you cannot usefully express one in the terms of the other.
Adams Rubble shrugs and says "whatever works" (in a kind way)
Wol Euler: heheheheh
Wol Euler: I need these images to help me think. I am a bear of very little brain - but of many words which sometimes confuses people and makes them think me clever
Adams Rubble: Not so, dear Wol :)
Adams Rubble: we all are going about this in a different way...a way that works for us
Adams Rubble: sometimes we are able to get together and make some sense togther :)
Adams Rubble: but I roll my eyes everytime Wikapedia comes up. hehe
Wol Euler: heheheh
Wol Euler: thank you, adams, I appreciate this and thank you for it.
Adams Rubble: Oh, you are very welcome. I have much to thaank you for :)