The Guardian for this meeting was Riddle Sideways. The comments are by Riddle Sideways.

A long lost session found when cleared browser tabs. 

Riddle Sideways: thank you, Listener Master
Bleu Oleander: 's current display-name is "Bleu".
Bleu Oleander: hi Riddle :)
Riddle Sideways: hi bleu
Riddle Sideways: :)
Riddle Sideways: another happy day
Bleu Oleander: nice
Riddle Sideways: at least trying that attitude
Bleu Oleander: hi Eden :)
Riddle Sideways: hi eDan
Eden Haiku: Hi Riddle and Bleu :)
Riddle Sideways: was awoken early this morning
Riddle Sideways: by a mouse issue
Eden Haiku: Oh no!
Riddle Sideways: and could not go back to sleep
Bleu Oleander: oh ... friendly one?
Eden Haiku: Found b y the cat ?
Riddle Sideways: well, the mouse did need catching out of the back room
Riddle Sideways: but is almost always taken to a bath tub
Riddle Sideways: to play
Eden Haiku: :)
Riddle Sideways: this fun is noisy
Eden Haiku: A friendly cat if not a friendly mouse :)
Bleu Oleander: cat takes mouse to bathtub to play?
Riddle Sideways: yes
Bleu Oleander: funny
Riddle Sideways: they learned the mouse (almost) can't get out of tub
Bleu Oleander: how long does that go on?
Riddle Sideways: and cat can get bored, take a nap and mouse will still be there
Riddle Sideways: or until I catch mouse and throw it outside without waking the other sleeper
Riddle Sideways: anywho, am awake thinking about a broadcast last night
Riddle Sideways: http://www.panettainstitute.org/prog...ecture-series/
Eden Haiku: loves all car stories, even the ones involving mouses :)
Eden Haiku: *cat
Riddle Sideways: lol at typo
Bleu Oleander: nice hat Eden!
Eden Haiku: hehe
--BELL--
Riddle Sideways: as chatted before this area does not have Salons like Bleu does
Eden Haiku: Thanks Bleu. A twin to yours :) Had trouble locating in in inventory :)
Riddle Sideways: Leon has a lecture series
Riddle Sideways: 19 years
Eden Haiku: Did you attend Riddle?
Riddle Sideways: years ago, but not since
Riddle Sideways: it is on public radio
Riddle Sideways: oh and little public TV station
Riddle Sideways: very interesting to have 4 experienced people speak on what a next president should do
Riddle Sideways: attend to first
Riddle Sideways: on War, Terrorism, cyberwarfare
Bleu Oleander: can u summarize?
Bleu Oleander: hehe
Riddle Sideways: mostly they said "it is complicated"
Bleu Oleander: :)
Riddle Sideways: it got a discussion going in this house afterward
Riddle Sideways: of whether this current contract should be extended to the next stage
Riddle Sideways: see, it has to do with tools that could be used for good or bad
Riddle Sideways: depending on one's focus
Eden Haiku: Oh!
Eden Haiku: Quite a responsibility Riddle,,,
Riddle Sideways: should a software developer develop something just for the money
Riddle Sideways: not caring about it final usage
Bleu Oleander: well people do that all the time
Riddle Sideways: yep
Riddle Sideways: does that make it right
Bleu Oleander: hard to control whether something is used for good or bad?
Eden Haiku: But than you can never know the outcome can you?
Riddle Sideways: in Riddle's belief system?
Bleu Oleander: not right, just hard to control
Bleu Oleander: people kill themselves with drugs invented to cure people
Bleu Oleander: how can u consider all possible usage for something?
Riddle Sideways: yep, things like that are said
Eden Haiku: Must be even more difficult to decide about the second part of the contract....
Riddle Sideways: and in light of the ongoing Apple security issue
Bleu Oleander: yep
Riddle Sideways: well, the governments security issue
Bleu Oleander: so what do you think?
Riddle Sideways: thing is .. if current beliefs were explained to employer
Riddle Sideways: he would fast talk around it
Riddle Sideways: using great examples
Eden Haiku: When Krishna convinces Arjuna to go to war against his cousins, Arjuna finally says: "I will do thy bidding". Accomplishing one's dharma, whatever happens.
Riddle Sideways: and retoric
Eden Haiku: But I see why not :)
Bleu Oleander: not sure what you're saying
Eden Haiku: Doing what one's work demands. We never know the big picture anyway. But it can lead to nazi orders being obeyed. It's a touchy issue.
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eden Haiku: I understand how puzzled you must feel Riddle :)
--BELL--
Riddle Sideways: so, laying in bed composing an email
Riddle Sideways: of all the constructed arguements
Riddle Sideways: and hearing them knocked aside
Bleu Oleander: what is your concern Riddle? doing something your employer wants you to do but that you don't believe is ethical or might have an unethical outcome?
Eden Haiku: Better go 5 hours a day for 3 weeks on the mountain top to let the sky inspire your decision :)
Bleu Oleander: :)
Riddle Sideways: :)
Riddle Sideways: that mostly covers it Bleu
Riddle Sideways: so no problem :}
Eden Haiku: You made up your mind Riddle?
Bleu Oleander: well if you feel that way I think you should be true to your heart
Eden Haiku: I think so to.
Eden Haiku: *too
Bleu Oleander: I couldn't work for someone that I felt was doing something I couldn't believe in
Riddle Sideways: ok, brought that up knowing y'all would agree and help decision
Riddle Sideways: good
Bleu Oleander: of course one might wonder whether or not one's own beliefs were justified
Bleu Oleander: how we justify our own beliefs weighs in too
Bleu Oleander: not commenting on yours ... general statement
Eden Haiku: Fear is also playing a role, here,,,
Riddle Sideways: then laying in bed, thought of the very stuborn political people stuck on beliefs
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eden Haiku: But fear can be a good advisor sometimes....
Riddle Sideways: old boss, was stuck on ObamaCare is abolutely bad
Riddle Sideways: evil and needs to be gone
Riddle Sideways: and many others
Riddle Sideways: thinking stuck thoughts
Eden Haiku: Even Ted Cruz in on Obamacare and he hates it!
Riddle Sideways: candidate X will save us
Riddle Sideways: candidate Y will sink the country, world, universe
Bleu Oleander: ObamaCare did not turn out to be good for me, however I recognize that it was good for many. It needs work esp. in area of high insurance company rates!
Riddle Sideways: X and Y are interchangable depending on focus
Riddle Sideways: well the laying in bed thoughts were becoming useless
Riddle Sideways: so turned to TSK
Eden Haiku: Ah!!!!
Bleu Oleander: over thinking?
Riddle Sideways: and a section of chapter 4
Eden Haiku: listens
Riddle Sideways: on religious beliefs
Riddle Sideways: authors went on about beliefs
Riddle Sideways: and stating the many/most people need a beginning and end
Riddle Sideways: and have been provided them by religions
Riddle Sideways: an all powerful created the world
Riddle Sideways: it started
Riddle Sideways: there that is good
Riddle Sideways: however, some others like that there was a big bang
Riddle Sideways: some/very few can like both
Riddle Sideways: at the same time
Riddle Sideways: [didn't we discuss this in PaB]
Riddle Sideways: or read it someplace
Riddle Sideways: the author had met a person
Bleu Oleander: "it started" ... how do you know that?
Riddle Sideways: that truely believed
Riddle Sideways: in both
Bleu Oleander: both what?
Riddle Sideways: and found no conflict
Eden Haiku: Creator and big bang?
Riddle Sideways: yes
Eden Haiku: hummmm
Bleu Oleander: well in concept there could be no conflict
--BELL--
Riddle Sideways: absolutely believed that there was a big bang start AND a creator start
Bleu Oleander: if you want to believe in a creator you still could
Bleu Oleander: creator started big bang LOL
Eden Haiku: Big bang as an old man with a beard coughing it out?
Bleu Oleander: LOL
Riddle Sideways: :) like that
Riddle Sideways: thing is that beliefs become ...
Bleu Oleander: I myself would like to leave the beginning of the universe open for further investigation
Riddle Sideways: unshakable
Riddle Sideways: stuck?
Riddle Sideways: one believer is always yelling at the other
Bleu Oleander: not always
Riddle Sideways: that their beliefs are wrong
Riddle Sideways: and if they would just wake up
Riddle Sideways: and see
Bleu Oleander: there are SOME rational people that prefer to discuss and investigate together, no?
Bleu Oleander: "wake up"?
Eden Haiku: Wake up from the dream...
Bleu Oleander: dream of .... ?
Eden Haiku: "our little life is but a dream rounded with some sleep "
Riddle Sideways: many times it is: prefer to discuss until you see my point exclusively?
Bleu Oleander: I'm not that negative about cooperation on discovery
Riddle Sideways: am usually not either, but
Bleu Oleander: I don't like the my way or the highway thing
Riddle Sideways: was being too blunt
Bleu Oleander: people seem to be digging in more these days to fixed sides, but I prefer not to do that
Riddle Sideways: having read with great interest about gravity waves being discovered
Bleu Oleander: certainty can be a bad thing
Riddle Sideways: then yesterday's TSK session
Bleu Oleander: Paul Davies is doing a salon for us on gravity waves soon
Riddle Sideways: thought: is it not being imagined in my mind
Bleu Oleander: and we have one this week on the metallic universe
Riddle Sideways: not witnessing the experiments in person
Riddle Sideways: dreamed it
Eden Haiku: Something interesting happened as I was starting to do exercise 15 of TSK yesterday night
Riddle Sideways: listens
Bleu Oleander: well it does come down to who do we trust to give us information, as we cannot possible see everything with our own eyes
Bleu Oleander listens
Riddle Sideways: [need to come back to Bleu's statement, someday]
Riddle Sideways: listens to Eden
Bleu Oleander smiles
Eden Haiku: Had wriiten for 2 hours about the protocol I would use to experiment: going to a mountain top I know using my imagination
Eden Haiku: Place waht crowdy will my 11 "advisors" but as we setlled in Adirondack chçairs to looks at the sky
Eden Haiku: They all vanished, flowing into me and I was left alone looking at the blue sky, feeling good. And drifted to sleep:)
Bleu Oleander: nice :)
Eden Haiku: So that,s about 2 minutes of the r hours a day for 3 weeks :)
Eden Haiku: *5
Riddle Sideways: might be enough
Bleu Oleander: The Brain – is wider than the Sky – For – put them side by side – The one the other will contain With ease – and You – beside –
Eden Haiku: This statement Riddle: [07:52] Bleu (bleu.oleander): well it does come down to who do we trust to give us information, as we cannot possible see everything with our own eyes
Riddle Sideways: well ... "who do we trust"
Eden Haiku: Important decisions we make all the time.
Riddle Sideways: looking at internet sites, there are so many to evaluate
Eden Haiku: True
Bleu Oleander: how do we choose our experts
Riddle Sideways: even the salon.com url (thank btw)
Riddle Sideways: had the right side full of questionable reads
--BELL--
Eden Haiku: That's why I like Twitter a lot. You come to know some people will always have trusty links.
Eden Haiku: Links you can trust
Riddle Sideways: wanting clicks to any number of beliefs for/against candiates X (or Y)
Bleu Oleander: getting very hard to find trustworthy news esp. about the presidential race
Riddle Sideways: actually believe that wikipedia is to be believed always
Riddle Sideways: why and should it
Eden Haiku: Read something about what incredible tasks Obama accomplished behind the scenes. But didn't retweet because the person was calling the Republicans The MadParty, Disrespect is never a good sign.
Eden Haiku: Sorr
Eden Haiku: Have to leave now. Have a great day !
Bleu Oleander: ok bfn ... take care
Riddle Sideways: by
Bleu Oleander: I should go also
Riddle Sideways: should go also
Bleu Oleander: enjoy your day
Riddle Sideways: thanks
Bleu Oleander: thank you!
Bleu Oleander: byeeee
Riddle Sideways: by Listener