13-15 Gaya's Pick

2009.05.13 01:00 - Appreciation & the retreat

Being in present:

Pema Pera: As for me, recently I have noticed more and more the tendency to "lean into the future" in more and more subtle ways. It is one thing to tell myself to live in the present, and not to run after goals. To do what I can do in a non-doing way, in a wu-wei way, without expectations, leaving the results of my actions to the universe.
Tarmel Udimo nods. “That's a good one to work on.”
Pema Pera: And in many ways I have tried to cultivate that way of acting for decades now, ever since I first heard about it …
Pema Pera: Really resting in the present would mean to let go of everything completely, to see that each moment is totally complete. You could die after that moment or not, it doesn't make a difference. And if there actually is another moment, you could say "thank you" to the universe, and live that completely too and so on.

2009.05.13 07:00 - 3 People, 4 Selves

On intoxication and addiction:

Fefonz Quan: I also wondered this week about intoxications that are not 'habit', are they less intoxicating?
Eliza Madrigal: You mean like having a glass of wine occasionally rather than every night? … I think moderation is often better than restriction... seems healthier. Not to label anything 'no'...

sophia Placebo: I guess , but who would consider an innocent pleasure that harm no one not even self as intoxication. Why is being happy for a few minutes intoxication? Porn for example, weed, alcohol, smoking.
Fefonz Quan: I think one factor is the addiction level. The addiction itself is intoxicating our mind and feelings, creates craving when we are without the intoxicant.
sophia Placebo agrees.
Fefonz Quan: Maybe that's one good sign: what happen when we are without the substance. If we suffer without it, I guess we got poisoned...

“The poor anger” as intoxicant and beyond:

sophia Placebo: anger ?
Fefonz Quan: A frequent automatic reaction - that's the meaning I aimed at.
sophia Placebo: A lack of a better way to deal with things
Fefonz Quan: Yes, though it feels sometimes so spontaneously, almost like a reflex  like there is no time to free decision in the process … I totally agree the effect of anger is toxic, in many levels, physical, emotional, perceptual, etc. … it is not 'something' that came from outside though according to the effect, it is very polluting …

Fefonz Quan: So in fact on the third level, anything that distorts our perceptions, thoughts, and our 'seeing' of reality, is intoxicating in a way. Anything that prevents us from seeing things as they are.

2009.05.13 13:00 Eyes Wide Shut

Sharing experiences with change of season:

aurel Miles: Do the seasons alter your practice? They have such an impact on me. How does everyone else perceive the change?
genesis Zhangsun: I definitely notice an difference in energetic level.
Fefonz Quan: And indeed, I believe the energies and moods change according to seasons.
aurel Miles: Almost all of my friends seem to be being reborn right now.
Fael Illyar: Oh, yes, I've been feeling quite lighter with the sun shining again :)
Fefonz Quan: Some traditions take it into account, changing the intentional practice accordingly, emphasizing inner work in autumn/winter, and more external work on spring / summer.
Fefonz Quan: More active work, more towards interaction outside, more energetic practices etc., less 'diving inside yourself' practices. Like there is some synchronization between the macro (outside universe) and the micro (internal world).

2009.05.13 19:00 - Stopping to Stop

Pema Pera: This morning, while walking on the street, it struck me how many ways of stopping there are . . . I realized that I could stop further, in the middle of stopping, dropping more. I could take another "move", stepping to the side so to speak, to let something stop less my volition.
Pema Pera: So hard to put these things into words.

2009.05.14 01:00 - Sisu

People from countries with harsh weather often have similar traits, in this case Finland:

Susi Alcott: [sisu means] … something like … somebody has 'balls'... willing to stand on our own feet against even the whole wide world ... not the government we have chose and we prefer die that to be the slave, we fight against hard nature, but we love to take care of it too, 'never give up'...

2009.05.14 07:00 - Transcending Conditions

Eliza Madrigal: Relaxation is a funny word for the explorations here [PaB]… because 'taking things lightly' is a good way to begin to find a more expansive connection, rather than a disconnection. So yes, it is relaxation... and yet very attentive.

Yakuzza Lethecus: I am interested in concrete issues on social justice but as soon as I read about psychology it seems that I really have to know discussions of Descartes and mind body problem issues or social justice and contract theories and Hobbes, Hume...
Eliza Madrigal nods... I think meditation and mindfulness are the way to make one's work in those areas effective... to see more clearly. While thinking is 'great'... when unilluminated it can tangle... so I look at our practice here... the pauses every fifteen minutes and such... as opening the windows. And then yes... go about one's day and reading and learning... but with a 'lightness' perhaps which does seem to make it easier.

Eliza Madrigal: ... Breath is free! We all have to do it. Paying attention to one's breath can actually begin to change the quality of interaction. I work with children who struggle in various ways... what I find is that they 'cannot' concentrate until they feel secure... Often they sit with me and cannot begin to learn until they are able to unload something... put it aside... get 'relaxed'. So, sitting with them and getting into that place before beginning any 'work' is helpful … [this ] I believe it universal.

2009.05.14 13:00 - A rose would smell as sweet

Names:

aurel Miles: do you think your name effects your path through life?
Storm Nordwind: A very interesting question, the answer has to be yes. It affects how others see you. It can even affect how you think of yourself - if you let it!
Fefonz Quan nods.

aurel Miles: Stephen King, same first name as me … but I have never met anyone whose name was antithetical to what they do for a living … I am a writer and a poet … the Greek crown, stephanos was awarded to poets among others. That is where the name comes from.
Fefonz Quan: I see many people whose name has nothing to do with their profession.
aurel Miles: but have you looked deeper into their middle names? Or the meanings of their names? The roots.
Fefonz Quan: no middle name mostly where I live
Storm Nordwind does not have a middle name

2009.05.14 19:00 - Synchronicity and Connectedness

Social elements of PaB:

Pila Mulligan: … it could be therapeutic, such as in the case of your neighborhood’s recovery from the fire if you organized sessions once a week for the neighbors to Play as Being.
Eos Amaterasu: Yes, shared movement from seeming having, solidity, to not having, losing it, but maybe never having had it. Some of the meditative traditions are clearly related.
Pila Mulligan: In any event it would be a nice inlet for socializing and maybe an outlet for some people's grief.
Eos Amaterasu: Yes, to touch it, not run away from it, and then in sensing that touch to feel its openness. Start with neighbourhoods, being held in community.
Pila Mulligan: Help people restore their sense of a home, a secure personal nest and to better appreciate the inevitability of impermanence if they want to go that far.

Wonder if Eos saw the film ‘No Man’s Land’ set in the Bosnian war where two soldiers from each side meet in the no man’s land:

Pila Mulligan: Religion has pretty well muddied just about all the waters of philosophy, meaning primarily that by associating a philosophical idea with a group you invite conflict, the ownership aspect.
Eos Amaterasu: It's hard to avoid, our very language being so subject-having-object oriented, or subject having identity but it's the essence of genuine practice, I think, to work with that "ego" emergence … I think, or hope, that people who actually have depth, or real, practice of whatever their tradition is can meet each other in "no man's land" :-)

Religious elements of PaB:

Eos Amaterasu: Do you consider Playing as Being to be a religious practice, or one involving the sacred?
Pila Mulligan: It could be, depending on the person. A religious person doing these things could have a religious or sacred insight. A more secular person may have an epiphany. Same result, different words … personally, with due apology to Pema, I think of PaB as more of a yoga practice than a meditation but the result is available just the same. And lots of religions are embracing secular yoga these days so the 9 second pause as an asana http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asanas gives rise to experiences that can lead people further both by discussion and continuing practice, 'a position intended primarily to restore and maintain a practitioner's well-being'.
Eos Amaterasu: My own journey was through phenomenology (& the epoché http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epoche) to being to meditation, as in Buddhist mindfulness/awareness & recognition practice.

Connectedness:

Paradise Tennant: If we go to the minute… on the atomic level we are kind of one thing. Many traditions believe the self is a delusion...
Pila Mulligan: Yes, a neighbor was emphasizing how fundamental and common nano-energy [nano as in lowest level] is. Some Buddhists say we are inter-connected with all things, Taoists have nature as the common ground, but not many Western traditions seem to share these ideas beyond the scientific theory … Jung wrote of a collective unconscious. This is close.
Paradise Tennant: Yes kind of a primal memory.
Pila Mulligan: and even a continuing connectedness. Threedee -- a neurologist here from time to time -- uses the term pre-conscious … We have a deeper sense that feeds us awareness.
Paradise Tennant: A good concept. Well just have to believe we are limited by our sensory perceptions in a very big way...

2009.05.15 01:00 - Life University

Yakuzza Lethecus: … sometimes it’s really funny when atheists know more about Christianity then believing Christians, I believe those things can just happen when we accept beliefs of our environment.
Gaya Ethaniel: I'm not entirely sure what makes one religious ... surely knowledge alone doesn't make one Christian or Buddhist etc.
Yakuzza Lethecus: I don’t know either, but I want to loosen my biases and reflect more.
Gaya Ethaniel: I'd call someone trying to live their life 'Christian ways' more ‘Christian’ than someone who read all the books.
Yakuzza Lethecus: Yeah, being helpful, free social work that could make you a good Christian even without books or volunteering here :)
Gaya Ethaniel: :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: But you don’t even have to be Christian for something like that.

2009.05.15 07:00 - Space for Plan B

Change:

Eliza Madrigal: May I share a dream I had two nights ago ... I was a hermit crab … crawling around on the floor beneath the corner of my bed... shell broken in large pieces all around me... the shell pieces were obstacles I couldn't see around... no new shell in sight.
Eliza Madrigal: Then I was myself...standing...looking down at the crab... which touched my toe... and was sticky … I thought about the perspective aspect of it... that obstacles can seem so huge... Until maybe I just pick up the little sticky crab and go find a new shell :) … my way of working out the puzzles of my life... like a totally blank page that can seem overwhelming ... Sometimes it helps to sit 'next to' someone going working on a similar puzzle though, doesn't it?
sophia Placebo: It helps much :)

sophia Placebo: Love whom you love but leave a space that would allow you to not being taken aback when the relationship turn to 180 degrees and hate whom you hate but leave a space for change.

2009.05.15 13:00 - Mental Parasites

Good and evil:

Scathach Rhiadra: Has everyone read Kahil Gibran's The Prophet? … just thinking about seeing everything as it is, his verse on 'good and Evil is very good ... "Of the good in you I can speak, but not of the evil. For what is evil but good tortured by its own hunger and thirst? Verily when good is hungry it seeks food even in dark caves, and when it thirsts it drinks even of dead waters. "

Snaps, snaps!:

Fael Illyar: Everyone has something of value to say, no matter who they are. :) … even utter ... forgive me ... bullshit can give us that. Or more accurately, trigger us to realize.
Scathach Rhiadra: True Fael, and we can pick up wisdom in some unusual places :) or unexpected places maybe
Arisia Vita: No knowledge is so right as to be beyond question, and no belief is so wrong as to be beyond usefulness.
Wol Euler: heh, coincidence. I just read that somewhere ...
Fael Illyar smiles 'I've certainly heard that somewhere.'

Smile (reaction to a video Wol shares):

Fael Illyar: In a nut shell "Just smile." :)
Wol Euler nods and smiles.
Moon Fargis: A bright smile is a half enlightenment :)

2009.05.15 19:00 - Support-Power-Subject-Object

RL group based on PaB model:

Pila Mulligan: … the potential for PaB styled social interaction to deal with community difficulties … a recent catastrophic fire in Eos's neighborhood … I wonder if having sessions like this in real life would be of help, in such difficulties or just in general.
Eliza Madrigal: It seems that someone could make a space... but often in neighborhoods people don't like to meet regularly... and people can lean on others if they are already comfortable with them... when there is a group at least in place.
Adams Rubble: Local groups are an interesting idea
Adams Rubble: tough for some people though
Eliza Madrigal: I've been considering putting up a notice in my neighborhood for people to come and meditate... not sure yet
Eos Amaterasu: Kind of like a small open park
Pila Mulligan: … establishing several times a day when people can visit a place and see if others also arrivee there may solve part of the scheduling difficulty, kind of a support-as-available thing.
Eliza Madrigal nods...yes just leaving the space open :)
Eliza Madrigal: Of course there will always need to be a 'main person' who does that I think... the ::drumroll:: community organizer! :)
Pila Mulligan: If such an activity had been established already, before a catastrophe, then it would seem to naturally slip into a support-recovery function
Geo Netizen: Probably would need the equivalent of the GoC - the one committed to each time slot
Pila Mulligan: Conversely, if the activity was established after a catastrophe as a support-recovery function, then it may naturally continue to function and evolve afterwards
Geo Netizen nods. An official purpose but much room for exploring. PaB for us here but we roam extensively.
Eliza Madrigal: Yes we do:) Wander off... but know where to wander back...
Adams Rubble wanders off in search of sleep. Good night all :)