28-31 You Are Me

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    These were long sessions within long sessions, and as Corvi might say, also bits within bits. They often had
    an unfolding quality, as friends brought fiery hearts to bear upon each topic which appeared.

    You Are Me

    You are me and I am you.
    It is obvious that we are inter-are.
    You cultivate the flower in
    yourself so that I will be beautiful.
    I transform the garbage in myself so
    that you do not have to suffer.
    I support you you support me.
    I am here to bring you peace
    you are here to bring me joy.

    Thich Nhat Hanh


    Corvuscorva Nightfire: unpack..is so cool an idea...to take an idea apart into it's bits.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: and then..ya get to take the bits apart...
    Bertrum Quan: The image of unpacking is a good one -- to unpack one's mind... to see clearly
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes it an 'avalanche' for me lol

    Corvuscorva Nightfire: In christianity..the phrase is..judge the sin, not the sinner...nods to Bertrum....
    which I suggest means..think about actions...consider them....and be compassionate.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: to the people.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: yes
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: someone once told me that some people are easier to love than others.
    SophiaSharon Larnia: gentler maybe
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: and that those people..the ones easy to love...teach us what love is...so that we can expand the idea.
    Bertrum Quan: And understand suffering.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: compassion is...observing with a clear sight.


    Arms open, fire alit...

    Storm Nordwind: It's spreads its arms out to the LL Welcome Area to the south to invite wanderers over from there
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah.. that's why so many newbies!
    Storm Nordwind: Yes indeed
    Storm Nordwind: And a beacon fire to attract them
    Storm Nordwind: Subtle but effective
    Eliza Madrigal: :) Nice
    Storm Nordwind: But it will not attract everyone
    Storm Nordwind: And that again is intentional
    Storm Nordwind: People more interested in malls and gun battles will doubtless not arrive!

    Eliza Madrigal: I like that it is open, like our conversations!

    Travieso Sella: I think a sense of social conscience and proactivity is neccessary especially
     when to be complacent or passive means being part of the problem
    Travieso Sella: but on a spiritual level I think people have another take on things
    Travieso Sella: THis is something I wish to work on much more. And sometimes I think it is at the root of my spiritual endeavors.
    Travieso Sella: and then there is the creative aspect of it as well
    Eliza Madrigal: in what way?
    Travieso Sella: I try to explore my 'more negative feelings' in hopes of finding useful artistic expressive quailities in work that I do
    Travieso Sella: and with the intention of transformation


    Not scared...

    Storm Nordwind: A year ago, I could not have envisaged where we are now. Now I just expect anything
    at all to happen in the next year!
    Wol Euler smiles
    Adams Rubble: a year ago i was scared silly :)
    Wol Euler: I year ago I was getting bored of SL and considered dropping out.
    Adams Rubble still is silly but not scared :)
    Wol Euler: :)
    Adams Rubble: Hmm. That happened to me a bit earlier Wol. I dropped out for 3 months
    Storm Nordwind: A year ago I was swept up in the enthusiasm for this new project called Play as Being
    Wol Euler: yeah, that is a large part of what kept me here.
    Storm Nordwind: Well my life is richer for your all having stayed here! :)
    Adams Rubble: It was very compelling
    Adams Rubble: yes Storm we all are richer :)
    Wol Euler: likewise!
    Mickorod Renard: I enjoy the feeling that we seem to have formed a family,in our common interests and support
    Qt Core: i'm having some little doubts about my permanence in SL and PaB is one of the few things keeping me


    Qt Core: being an amateur astronomer i've read several books about QM, but only some month ago i had a "revelation" about it
    Qt Core: i started circling and wondering if there is a connection between QM and free will
    Qt Core: if the universe is newtonian, all stated and you can do some math and calculate the state
    of it at any point in time there is no free will
    Qt Core: so all the problems with religion and sin and grace
    Storm Nordwind: I've heard that argument before but have never been convinced

    Wester Kiranov: there are so many things here philosophically problematical - probabilities, free will, determinism, observation - each of those can be interpterted in many ways
    Qt Core: i still like the idea of someone coming out from a place well hidden and bringing us the simple and definitive equation that would explain everything ;-)
    Storm Nordwind: Like God's final message to his creation in H2G2? :)


    Extending our happiness to others...

    Fael Illyar: Funny how I woke up at 5AM last night to a shock at figuring out an answer to a problem
    and then even figuring out how to relate it to others but ... now I find I can't remember what it was :)
    Wol Euler laughs sympathetically.
    Fael Illyar: the problem is gone though :P
    Wol Euler: well, that is good.
    Fael Illyar: ... although I find I forgot what it was.
    Wol Euler: so you solved it without knowing what it was?
    Fael Illyar: hmmh, might be :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: :) I woke up this morning feeling very happy, flushed with warmth
    upon awakening, and once awake it abated a bit....wanted to hold on to it.
    Wol Euler: awww :) do you remember what you were dreaming?
    SophiaSharon Larnia: not one single bit :)) I dont know, I just felt it's loss once real life asserted itself
    Fael Illyar: I managed to keep it while still in bed, even though it almost faltered as I noticed it :)
    SophiaSharon Larnia: i wonder how to hold onto it
    Fael Illyar: you hold to it by not holding :); just thinking it needs to be held pushes it away

    Bertrum Quan: I feel it is important to care about what's happening in the world.l If we are indeed connected to our fellow beings, then their suffering is our suffering. There still can be engagement with the world...
    Wol Euler: there is engagement, but it does not preclude joy or happiness or love
    Tarmel Udimo: and for those people who are engaged with this that life we feel compassion
    Bertrum Quan: There must be. Otherwise, this idea of love, compassion--is mere talk.

    Fael Illyar: joy is an emotion. Happiness is just love.
    Bertrum Quan: Fael, I don't share your definition of happiness, In my view it is a psychological state.
    Wol Euler: I think that happiness is a byproduct, it comes from being immersed in doing good things well
    sophia Placebo: happiness to me is part from being gratfull and thankfull like i fell happy that my brother
    wasnt hurt in car accidant

    Tarmel Udimo: I envy those that can be made happy by a closet full of shoes:)


    Desire for love to burn away suffering...

    quen Oh: but if you really think about next generations or the millions of people in developing world which are now
    in hunger or even die in a world of superfluence.. it is hard to not want some changes
    Gaya Ethaniel: I think a lot of issues recent ones especially grow out of greedy mentality.

    quen Oh: it seems that we live in a world where it almost is acceptable (as it is considered 'understandable') to profit from other human beings against their will (as I don't belief there is a human being that would choose to do without enough food, decent basic housing, good education and healthcare)
    Gaya Ethaniel: mm... we do? live in such a world?
    quen Oh: well, don't we? if we look at the developing world?
    quen Oh: we have enough food on the planet to feed everyone, we even have a surplus of 10% food
    quen Oh: yet millions die of hunger, because we distribute it badly and we even dare to speculate in grain for instance

    Gaya Ethaniel: I cannot imagine a society completely free of corruption etc.
    quen Oh: which it can be, but that requires continuous repression of all oppositional forces
    Gaya Ethaniel: You believe such a society is possible quen?
    quen Oh: yes I do, it will take some time, but I do belief more people are starting to see what the world is like today, and that it is in danger because of the lack of cooperation in environmental issues, world poverty, international politics and so on


    Breath as kindling...

    Solobill Laville: Here we are in beautiful bieup!
    Wol Euler: ah well, 'tis an imperfect world of joy and sorrow commingled, as the poet said.
    Solobill Laville: Yes, it rings sweetly and still stings...daggone poets.. ;)

    Solobill Laville: My son, speak of the lil' devil, said something this morning
    Solobill Laville: "ya know, Dad, I think that in the Earth...
    Solobill Laville: ...is love, and gravity, and air."
    Solobill Laville: I said, 'I agree!"

    Yakuzza Lethecus: Sometimes it gets so silent
    Solobill Laville: Sometimes that silence is powerful too
    Scathach Rhiadra nods
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    Wol Euler: we are officially a meditation group, after all :)



    Keeping the fire burning...

    Dakini Rhode: are you familiar with the 9 sec practice?
    Eos Amaterasu: Yes... I have been wondering what happens if you actually do it every fifteen minutes
    Adams Rubble: sometimes amazing thinngs :)
    Dakini Rhode: you turn into Pema
    Eos Amaterasu: it is hard because I tend to get caught up in things :-)
    Adams Rubble: Hasn't worked for me Dakini. hehe
    Dakini Rhode: that was silly of me
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: You get long hair?
    Dakini Rhode: i think that's from eating carrots
    Karoz Blogger: Are we doing the 9 secs. now?
    Adams Rubble: in a minute times 10
    Dakini Rhode: in 1 minute, we'll take a 90 sec pause

    Travieso Sella: ah that was an exceptioinally enjoyable silence for me
    Dakini Rhode: how so, Trav?
    Travieso Sella: Well, silence may not be the operative word here.
    The music I was listening to seemed to match up quite well with it.

    Dakini Rhode: is humor truly the same as joy?
    Dakini Rhode: joy seems simple, uncomplex
    Karoz Blogger: Joy is all.
    stevenaia Michinaga: joy is acceptance and appreciation
    Karoz Blogger: These are easy questions.
    Karoz Blogger: Joy is being.
    Karoz Blogger: Joy is unconditional.
    stevenaia Michinaga: like love?



    Attending to Aliveness...

    Pila Mulligan: Wol, you meditate?
    Wol Euler: irregularly, I can't seem to keep a practice going
    Pila Mulligan: Sophia? do you meditate?
    sophia Placebo: me ? porposly no, just a moments of mind calmness each day in the garden by sunset ,
    early morning or in the night under stars , revewing the day and thoughts , this have been like a habit to me /Pila Mulligan: sounds lovely, Sophia
    Scathach Rhiadra: yes it does sound like a meditation to me Sophia:)
    Wol Euler: that probably counts as meditation, Sophia :)

    Scathach Rhiadra: it is more like becoming the breathing, and include all that arises, don't have to count for that:)/ just being aware of the moment really, and all that you experience right now
    Pila Mulligan: "One final practice: count the breath as before, being disciplined and focused but also welcoming toward the messy bits of our mind functions and perceptions that would normally distract us... but attend in particular to the aliveness you can find within each part of the breath. Enter that aliveness and allow it to open up to more of itself."
    Pila Mulligan: quoting Stim -- this is an important part
    Pila Mulligan: * attend in particular to the aliveness **
    Scathach Rhiadra: thank you Pila:)
    Pila Mulligan: feeling the air, or chi

    Wol Euler: I have a friend who dances tango with great enthusiasm and skill, for twenty years now.
    Wol Euler: about every three to four years, she goes back and takes a beginners' course again, to see whether she has picked up any bad habits.
    Wol Euler: the same might apply here.

    Fael Illyar: perhaps we mean different things with the word 'mind' then...
    sophia Placebo: i got this idea from a japanese anime - now dont laugh - that the brain generates a waves
    -electromagnatic? - so if you synchronizd btw brain wave and environmet wave , or something like that , then you enter the awarness mode:  it just pop to my mind regarding the benefit of breathing, re adjusting brain waves

    Pila Mulligan: Fael, do the feelings of your heart involve the mind?
    Fael Illyar: I have no idea but the mind is what perceives them.
    Pila Mulligan: have you ever had an inkiling that part of the feeling in the heart is independent of the mind?
    Fael Illyar: I'd first need to able to define mind :)
    Fael Illyar: and I don't know how to define it
    Fael Illyar: I can't say if heart is part of the mind or not.


    Mere philosophy...

    Mickorod Renard: I came to the conclusion that most of it is theoretics, and anyone can do that regardles of the language
    .....i became disenchanted in that some debate became nothing more than a play ground for people s eloquent words
    Mickorod Renard: dont let it put you off
    Mickorod Renard: I am english..but I dont know half the english words that they use in philo
    Yakuzza Lethecus: no i enjoy the philosophical perspectives so far
    Mickorod Renard: good
    Yakuzza Lethecus: i obviously don´t understand everything
    Mickorod Renard: and it grows on you,,without u realising
    Mickorod Renard: like a skill in welding techniques
    Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, that implicit learning is what i head for


    Nothing to hide...

    Mickorod Renard: there is something obvious that I have noticed recently,,that may have something to do with the well being feeling re BEIng etc
    Tarmel Udimo: yes?
    Mickorod Renard: it seems to inolve light
    Mickorod Renard: like for example,,there are references to no head and the relaxing
    Mickorod Renard: when I feel I have obtained a state off well being,,in these sorts of matters
    Mickorod Renard: what is also obvious is that i have allowed more light into my visionary range
    Tarmel Udimo: so things seem lighter or filled with light?
    Mickorod Renard: yes,both..more so that its not so dark
    Tarmel Udimo: nice place to be

    Wester Kiranov: the thing I need on SL is this group of people
    arabella Ella nods to Wester, agree
    Mickorod Renard: interaction with likeminded people is my drug
    Wester Kiranov: but this group is not defined by its people, it's defined by its vision. and that is what attracts me
    Wester Kiranov: if there was just a vision nothing would happen
    Wester Kiranov: if the was just the people nothing unified would happen

    Adelene Dawner: Well, my job is here, my friends are here, most of the things I'm interested in doing are here or on the 'net in general...
    Adelene Dawner: You could say that most people are 'addicted' to living where they currently live
     for much the same reason. And my job is primarily on SL, though we're expanding to Opensim as well.

    arabella Ella: could we each give one or two reasons as to why we find SL most beneficial?
    arabella Ella: me ... mixing with people from all over the world on an equal basis with no baggage...intelligent people too :)
    Fael Illyar: Allows me to have a group of friends I can spend time with, no matter where I am in RL :)
    Mickorod Renard: doesnt cost money (much),,and saves going out in the cold
    Fael Illyar: oh and is much cheaper than spending time with friends in RL :)
    arabella Ella: allows you to discuss any topic under the sun
    Mickorod Renard: and,i look handsome
    arabella Ella: with ppl who have no agendas to hide
    arabella Ella: oh yes we are all barbies and kens here
    Threedee Shepherd: All of the above re friends and dialog plus convenience--availabel 24/7, no need to dress in RL, etc.
    arabella Ella: no feeling cold, no bad weather, no flu, no cleaning or cooking ... etc

    Wester Kiranov: It's abit like the Gods realm in Buddhism, isn't it?


    How long have we really been playing...

    stevenaia Michinaga: it's all about reality, big reality and little reality
    Pila Mulligan: indeed
    Pila Mulligan: Reality and reality?
    stevenaia Michinaga: the difference being?
    Pila Mulligan: Being and being
    stevenaia Michinaga: awww
    Pila Mulligan: :)

    Paradise Tennant: :)) well over dinner tonight we were chatting a bit about how human chemistry works ..
    Fran and I have been friends for a very long ..and I would say almost every day we have spent together has been fun .. funny how it works that some people just connect in laughter :))
    Pila Mulligan: yes, like adjacent puzzle pieces
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, a remarkable thing how it works as well as how it does not for some other people
    Paradise Tennant: yes just like chemical elements :))
    Pila Mulligan: now some would say you may have been freinds for many lifetimes
    Paradise Tennant: Fran is saying she thinks you are right!
    stevenaia Michinaga: if we only knew how we knew
    Pila Mulligan: someone once asked Ravi Shankar how long he had been playing the sitar, and he said "for 24 consecutive lifetimes" :)
    Pila Mulligan: you don't really need the details, just enjoy the situation :)
    Paradise Tennant: yes sometimes you meet some one and you can hear the click/ wow no wonder he is so good :))


    Energizing with tea and snacks...  

    Moon Fargis: the foolish people can live in order, only the master can handle the mess
    Fael Illyar giggles.

    Stargate Tone: know them two expressions which are said to be the most difficult to say ?
    Fael Illyar: do you mean "sorry" and "thank you"?
    Stargate Tone: the first one is right; according what I've let ppl to teach myself
    Fael Illyar: ah, second one would be "I love you"?
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Fael Illyar: yes, those have been very difficult...
    Stargate Tone: and they say that 'I love you' is even more difficult to say the more one means it; but in this I wanna
    highly remind of them exeptions * but do agree with that saying generally speaking *


    Unfolding layers of friendship and compassion
    (a personally significan't session, tough to edit, and I recommend reading the whole thing *highly*) ....

    Fael Illyar: what's the difference between action and inaction?
    Pema Pera: when I say "beyond duality" it sounds abstract, but the felt sense is very concrete
    Adams Rubble: merging?
    Pema Pera: usual there is quite a difference of course, Fael, and that's the point, that somehow
    that distinction is transcended
    Pema Pera: not so much merging
    Pema Pera: as more going to the root of both
    Pema Pera: seeing both e-merging :-)
    Pema Pera: sensing more the openness that allows both

    Pema Pera: withdrawing is perhaps not the right word
    Pema Pera: letting go of the illusion of there being a self, a central switchboard
    Pema Pera: and appreciating how nature/the universe/Being operates
    Adams Rubble: Seeing the nature/the universe/Being with different eyes?
    Pema Pera: let them see :-) / rather than seeing them
    Adams Rubble: ah
    Pema Pera: that "letting" is the shift I was trying to point to

    Eliza Madrigal: Pema, there was also a phrase you used with regard to the appreciation excercize, which I liked, and have thought about but in sort of a distant way.... "raw givenness"
    Eliza Madrigal: Is there anything else you can say about what you mean by that? If you have time?
    Pema Pera:yes, when we deal with anything at all, anything that appears, we normally see only the handle, the judgment, rather than what appears as such
    Pema Pera: a chair is seen as something to sit on, primarily
    Pema Pera:
    a spoon as something to eat with
    Pema Pera:
    a friend often also, in a subtle way, as something to "get" something from -- perhaps not overtly so, but if we really look into our hearts of hearts, that may be the case -- for me at least I keep discovering more and more subtle layers like that, which I didn't see earlier . . . rather sobering
    Pema Pera: a friend as something to learn from, or to feel less lonely through, etc etc
    Eliza Madrigal: Ah, okay.. thank you. And I do see that... we can see someone as what we think they are 'supposed' to be to us.
    Pema Pera: oh yes, we tend to do that all the time / and then we see a few layers of the onion, peel those off, and congratulate ourselves that NOW we can be with someone in an honest way/ until we see ever more subtle layers :-)
    Pema Pera: only by dropping something do we become aware we were carrying that kind of ballast

    Adams Rubble: The Buddhist idea of not making a distinction between one's loved ones and everyone else as far as compassion is concerned seemed to be related to what you are saying about friends Pema
    Pema Pera: ah, that's a sticky wicket, Adams :-)
    Adams Rubble: yes
    Pema Pera: I don't think they really suggest that you should not make a difference
    Pema Pera: at least in daily everyday life
    Adams Rubble sighs with relief  :)
    Pema Pera: yet at the same time, you also extend your love and compassion everywhere
    Pema Pera: like in Christianity!
    Pema Pera: everyone is your neighbor
    Pema Pera: as you will be reminded at during the youngest day :-)
    Pema Pera: "anything you did to xxx you did to me"
    Pema Pera: Really, Christianity is as radical as Buddhism in that sense, don't you think, Adams?
    Pema Pera: Jesus telling his disciples to leave their family, not even to return for a funeral: let the dead bury the dead -- WOW


    What is possible...

    stevenaia Michinaga: there seem to be no "lets all have a 90 second dream" and discuss it, ability built into humans
    Maxine Walden: my personal notion is that there is a process of transformation at the boundary between conscious and unconscious sectors of the mind, and the sophistication of that transformational capacity (which may vary in each of us over time) is a large factor in the wisdom
    Pila Mulligan: there is certainly a transition at the boundary between conscious waking and unconscious dreaming worlds
    stevenaia Michinaga: boundry between control and the randomess of dreaming
    //Pila Mulligan: maybe in dreams our waking assumptions define the boundaries of things -- we see a car in a dream and we assign it car characteristics, but you can pick it up if yuou want to, in a dream
    Maxine Walden: but you make me wonder whether there is a different 'mass' or gravity in the conscious vs unconscious...yes, there are no 'rules' that hold in the unconscious...so that would be closer to your notion of the dreamer lifting the car
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: my wondering also, Maxine / thanks to this Higgs boson
    Maxine Walden: ah... interesting possible intersection of the dream/dreamer and aspects of reality which the physicists show us
    Pila Mulligan: yep ... at least we non-scientists have the liberty of wandering into such zones

    Wol Euler: my gut feeling is that anyhting that can only be sold by "magic" is not worth buying
    Pila Mulligan: and a healthy skepticims it is, too
    Corvuscorva Nightfire sighs..I'm probably too sceptical for my own good, really.
    Pila Mulligan: however, I think it is good to be aware of this and other examples of unexpected things -- some may be true ... I promise you rain is the happy ending to many hawaiian ceremonies, but people inevitably try to rationalize that when I tell them


    Corvuscorva Nightfire: so, has anyone had any experiences with the 9 seconds lately?
    stevenaia Michinaga: not so much recently, I usually stumble upon a meditative moment randomly... smile
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: mm

    stevenaia Michinaga: guests are always welcome, but feel free to come anytime
    stevenaia Michinaga: have you ever tried our 9 second meditation?
    Davmar Hykova: no i haven't
    Davmar Hykova: but I will
    stevenaia Michinaga: early results of the short meditation are always intriguing
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: laughs.
    stevenaia Michinaga: and who really misses 9 seconds for a short distraction

    Pila Mulligan: why rationalize it -- it happens :)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: smiles.
    Pila Mulligan: really it does

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