2019.01.24 13:00 - Harari IV - Mozart in the Machine

The Guardian for this meeting was Bruce. The comments are by Agatha. We arrived to find a griefer object on the sim next door rezzing particles.

Bruce Mowbray's current display-name is "Bruce".
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Riddle.
Eliza Madrigal: yikes, they are still coming after me
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Eliza.
Riddle Sideways: hi Bruce, Eliza and All
Bruce Mowbray: The dreaded posters?
Eliza Madrigal: yes
Eliza Madrigal: flooding the pavilion
Bruce Mowbray: oh dear.
Eliza Madrigal: now I get what the visitor was seeing
Eliza Madrigal: it is overwhelming
Riddle Sideways: ?
Eliza Madrigal: will take a photo one sec
Bruce Mowbray: Fortunately, I did not look at the whater-it-was that invokes the poster curse.
Riddle Sideways: oh the poster outside
Bruce Mowbray: No, it is an attack.
Eliza Madrigal: not sure if it is letting me share photos
Bruce Mowbray: I saw the photo you sent in email, Eliza.
Bruce Mowbray: Got it!
Eliza Madrigal: I can't stay like this :(
--BELL--1.00
Bruce Mowbray: Mercy.
Eliza Madrigal: bleu and agatha were just here
Eliza Madrigal: bleu suggested I teleport somewhere and come back to see if it would stop
Eliza Madrigal: but not sure where they are now
Bruce Mowbray: I've never been attacked by them, fortunately.
Eliza Madrigal: the other day I couldn't see them either
Eliza Madrigal: agatha says she/they maybe, found the object
Eliza Madrigal: which will help when filing a complaint
Bruce Mowbray: I surey hope so.
Bleu Oleander's current display-name is "Bleu".
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Bleu.
Bleu Oleander: hi all
Bleu Oleander: I've filed another abuse report on the poster spamming thingy
Bleu Oleander: for now just turn particles off
Bruce Mowbray: Good. Thanks, Bleu.
Eliza Madrigal: Aggers says she is at the object
Bleu Oleander: and you won't see them
Eliza Madrigal: how? let me see....
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, aggers.
Bleu Oleander: in prefs
Riddle Sideways: once again, see nothing
Bleu Oleander: under graphics
Eliza Madrigal: aha
Bleu Oleander: turn down particles
Eliza Madrigal: ok done
Bruce Mowbray: I don't see them either, Riddle.
Agatha Macbeth: I didn't see anything at first either
Eliza Madrigal: I didn't see anything when the visitor mentioned before
Bleu Oleander: if you see nothing you're not zooming out beyond the pavilion or you have particles turned off
Bleu Oleander: the particles don't come here unless you zoom over to where they are then they follow your camera
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, that's why I'm keeping my camera within the pavilion.
Agatha Macbeth: The object is in Shiot
Eliza Madrigal: actually when I turn my view facing toward me I don't see them but they were here before without my zooming, and I can still see them emanating from over there if I look that way
Eliza Madrigal: with particles down
Bleu Oleander: ok so turn particles off
Agatha Macbeth: That sim used to be owned by a guy who was permabanned
Agatha Macbeth: So maybe one of his old acquaintances
Bleu Oleander: or turn down your draw distance
Eliza Madrigal: will keep a narrow view now , zoomed on just us
Riddle Sideways: years ago there were rolling tumble weed from that sim
Agatha Macbeth: It's stopped for me now
Bleu Oleander: draw distance around 128 is really all you need
Agatha Macbeth: Yeh
Agatha Macbeth: Mine is only 64 anyway
Eliza Madrigal: thanks for finding the source ... will include that in complaint 
Bleu Oleander: you can turn particles up again when you need to
Bleu Oleander: 64 works too :)
Agatha Macbeth: Haven't seen a griefer round here for years
Bleu Oleander: every once and a while
Eliza Madrigal: a few situations that felt like they could become griefer situations... like testing waters
Agatha Macbeth: Well Hanja's always deserted now
Bleu Oleander: they're a little slow in getting to it this time
Eliza Madrigal nods

                       
Eliza Madrigal rubs temples and looks around :)
Agatha Macbeth: So....
Agatha Macbeth: Shall we begin? :p
Bruce Mowbray: Sort of like virtually induced paranoid schizophrenia, I guess.
Bleu Oleander: sure
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bruce Mowbray: THEY'RE COMING AFTER ME!
Bruce Mowbray: Yikes!
Bleu Oleander: lol
Eliza Madrigal: and no one else sees them :)
Agatha Macbeth: omg
Eliza Madrigal: at least here I can show photos :P
Riddle Sideways: twoght zone
Bruce Mowbray: Right. . . you're all alone in your hallucination.
Bruce Mowbray: Well, then. . .
Bruce Mowbray: Aph cannot be here today.
Eliza Madrigal: Oh, bummer... she sounded excited
Bruce Mowbray: Are we ready to discuss Harari's Chapter 2? Yes, she said she had a doc appt....
Eliza Madrigal: sure
Bleu Oleander: yes ch 2
Riddle Sideways: sure
Bruce Mowbray: Artificial Intelligence and work, creativity
Bruce Mowbray: Does anyone have a report?
Eliza Madrigal: I'm really interested in what he said about art, cause I felt he stayed a little shallow.
Eliza Madrigal: Is art judged on the basis of emotion?
Bruce Mowbray: Hmmmm Interesting, Eliza.
Eliza Madrigal: I was waiting for him to make a more full argument so I was curious to hear others' thoughts
Bruce Mowbray: “The Mozart in the Machine” - creativity. . . even artists could be replaced /
Riddle Sideways: said art could be produced, but who would judge it
Bleu Oleander: art can be judged objectively if the parameters are given to AI
Bruce Mowbray: emotional impact could be measured by biometric data, analysed and tailor music to individual personality and mood types
Bleu Oleander: yes
--BELL--1.15
Johny Malheur's current display-name is "Johny Merveilleux".
Bruce Mowbray: To some degree, this is already happening with Netflix, Amazon, etc.....
Bleu Oleander: hi Johny
Johny Malheur: hi all
Eliza Madrigal: hm, is fascination/curiosity an emotion? I guess it
Bruce Mowbray: they cater their ads to your tastes.
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Johny
Agatha Macbeth: Hello again Johnny
Riddle Sideways: glad Fitbit reports heartbeat to Amazon
Eliza Madrigal: guess it is*, but I don't usually think of it that way
Riddle Sideways: hi Johnny
Bruce Mowbray: Welcome, Johny.
Bleu Oleander: we use emotions in all our decision processes
Eliza Madrigal: they can sell you the right vitamins Riddle :)
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, Bleu, but we don't normally have biometric devices attached to us....
Bleu Oleander: well certainly AI can predict what you will like
Bleu Oleander: but we don't have to like it
Bleu Oleander: Amazon tries to tell me what books i'll like but I never like their choices
Bruce Mowbray: Johny - Our chat logs are posted online after the session. Is that all right with you.
Riddle Sideways: each time you state not liking it, it is trained to do better next guess
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eliza Madrigal: I do follow sometimes the "others who bought this also looked at..."
Johny Malheur: i can live with it
Bruce Mowbray: Artificial Intelligence is always a gentle approximation. . . . a prediction of most likely outcomes.
Bleu Oleander: that's why its good to throw them off by not choosing their choices
Bruce Mowbray: OK. Johny. I understand hat to be "Yes."
Eliza Madrigal: maybe it will encourage us to be more diverse in choices... since we want to see more options
Bruce Mowbray: I appreciate their saving me time having to sort through a lot of stuff they know I wouldn't like anyway.
Bleu Oleander: we may end up liking AI produced art better than human produced art ... could happen
Bruce Mowbray: Perhaps. I wrote a Java program that painted Jackson Pollock-like works.
Eliza Madrigal: I'm not sure we'll leave the arena of collaboration in my lifetime, or at least not for a while
Bruce Mowbray: So, did you want to say more about AI and art -- or what Harari said about that, Eliza?
Eliza Madrigal: Oh, yes that was neat Bruce
Bruce Mowbray: ty ha ha.
Riddle Sideways: then there is the music it thinks we could use to get out of the funk it proceives
Bleu Oleander: with Pollock, its not just that it looks like a Pollock, its that it is a Pollock :)
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, Riddle.
Bruce Mowbray: Music selected by mood. . .
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, I never got THAT good with my programming.
Eliza Madrigal nods, interesting too
Johny Malheur: ops must go. laters
Riddle Sideways: how long to stay mad at so and so
Eliza Madrigal waves
Riddle Sideways: bye
Bruce Mowbray: Bye for now, Johny.
Bleu Oleander: bye
Eliza Madrigal: the fun of so many things is that they are counterintuitive
Riddle Sideways: yes
Eliza Madrigal: but I guess that's where he talked about turning up or down this or that, things like spontaneity
Agatha Macbeth: Bye
Agatha Macbeth: Short visit
Eliza Madrigal: I like to be caught off guard
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eliza Madrigal: or listen to things someone might not think I'd listen to, etc
Bleu Oleander: exactly
Bruce Mowbray: well, Harari did say that the programs could build in random things that were outside the person's usual preferences.
Bleu Oleander: yes
Bruce Mowbray: So it learns your expectations and preferences - and then finds something outside of those.
Eliza Madrigal: I guess that's the best scenario? I'm still freaked out by some of the youtube experiments and odd things that have happened with autoplay, etc.
Bleu Oleander: interesting he says the quest for meaning and community might eclipse the quest for a job
Bruce Mowbray: Quest for community and meaning ---- Losing our jobs to algorithms might be a blessing.
Riddle Sideways: that was probably most interesting, Bleu
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eliza Madrigal: then can really spend all my time in PaB :)
Eliza Madrigal laughs
Riddle Sideways: the last 5-6 paragraphs
Bleu Oleander: right!!!
Riddle Sideways: the Ultra-orthodocts PaBers
Bleu Oleander: :)
Eliza Madrigal: pretty interesting flip he described
Bruce Mowbray: Need to focus on meeting human needs, including self-worth
Riddle Sideways: well, he writes from Israel that has those conditions
Eliza Madrigal: harkens back to a time when village life was maybe more than who could hunt the most
Bleu Oleander: its really all about creating meaning in a way
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Patrick.
Eliza Madrigal: Hi patrick
Riddle Sideways: hi Patrick
Agatha Macbeth: G'day
Bleu Oleander: hi Patrick
Bruce Mowbray: We're discussing Chapter 2 of Yuval Harari's 21 Lessons for the 21st Century.
Bruce Mowbray: regarding AI and work, and creativity and artificial intelligence.
Eliza Madrigal: Like what you've written in your profile Patrick
Riddle Sideways: remembering a taxi driver going on and on about the non-working population
Riddle Sideways: that were happy
Eliza Madrigal: recently, Riddle?
Riddle Sideways: years ago in Israel
Riddle Sideways: maybe 5
Bruce Mowbray: Hello, Sabeen.
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Sabeen
Riddle Sideways: hi Sabeen
Eliza Madrigal: happy because of what he describes? meaning and community?
Bleu Oleander: hi Sabeen
Sabeen Schmidt: hi wht is this place
Bruce Mowbray: Sabeen, our chat logs are posted online after the session. Is that all right with you?
Riddle Sideways: yes, happy in the Meaning of their Life
Bruce Mowbray: This is the Play as Being pavilion.
Bleu Oleander: so we need to get good at creating meaning in our lives
Bruce Mowbray: We're discussing Chapter 2 of Yuval Harari's 21 Lessons for the 21stregarding AI and work, and creativity and artificial intelligence.
--BELL--1.30
Bruce Mowbray: Have a seat if you like.
Bruce Mowbray: I am concerned about people feeling irrelevant
Eliza Madrigal: hard to work as 'we' on the whole sometimes perhaps
Eliza Madrigal listens
Bruce Mowbray: and over-stressed by change.
Bleu Oleander: for sure many won't be able to handle the changes
Bruce Mowbray: A cascade of ever-bigger disruptions – therefore, a life of endless upheavals in work, therefore stress.
Bleu Oleander: as he mentions
Eliza Madrigal: more meditation, he seems to suggest. It is probably why 'self-care' is such a big focus of our time
Bruce Mowbray: Well, that's already happening, isn't it?
Eliza Madrigal: absolutely
Bruce Mowbray: Need stress reduction techniques: new drugs, meditation, etc. to avoid mental/emotional collapse.
Bleu Oleander: I'm not sure meditation is the answer for everyone tho
Bruce Mowbray: well, neither is Harari. . .
Bleu Oleander: exactly
Eliza Madrigal: ways to create spaciousness to handle contrasting views etc., ways to mitigate the input
Bruce Mowbray: neither medication nor meditation. . . .
Riddle Sideways: some, are able to set their Attitudes to not stress in their own ways
Bleu Oleander: yes
Eliza Madrigal: autism studies may have a lot to say about this too
Riddle Sideways: however, it is the Some that can't that need those basics
Eliza Madrigal nods
Riddle Sideways: or separation e.g. Amish or Ultra-Orthedox
Bruce Mowbray: Social and political disruptions – similar to disruptions brought by industrial revolution.
Bruce Mowbray: What to do to prevent job loss; what to do to create enough new jobs; and what to do if job losses are greater than job creation.
Bruce Mowbray: Should government try to slow down the pace of change?
Bleu Oleander: have to start training people to prepare for other types of jobs
Riddle Sideways: and even if enough jobs created, what of those that can't move on/up/over
Bruce Mowbray: Governments will have to step in to provide retraining and financial support while retraining is taking place.
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, good point Riddle.
Eliza Madrigal: what to take on as one's self, and what to realize one can't affect so they don't go crazy trying
Bleu Oleander: coal miner can't become programmer over night
Bruce Mowbray: Post-work social models
Bleu Oleander: suicide is already very high
Eliza Madrigal nods
Bruce Mowbray: Catering to the algorithms rather than toward humans?
Riddle Sideways: Harari covers that pretty thorough
Bruce Mowbray: Expand view of what is considered “jobs” – child care etc.
Patrick Edwyn: used to be employers cared about the future of there employeed, but not anymore since the workplace has been destroyed by vulture capitalism
Riddle Sideways: gov. supporting the mother of 3 while she goes back to school to retrain
Bleu Oleander: so what are the best things we can do now?
Riddle Sideways: adapt
Bruce Mowbray: universal basic services: free education, free transportation, free child care (the utopian vision of Communism)
Eliza Madrigal: This week Ocasio-Cortez got a lot of press, for talking about algorithms .. it was so odd that most in govt misunderstood her because they haven't thought deeply about these things at all
Bleu Oleander: yes
Bruce Mowbray: Right, govt is wayyyyy out of step.
Riddle Sideways: Love the paragraph on how Homop Sapiens never will find that 'enough'
Eliza Madrigal: and about work culture... thinking, yes that goes back to meaning making
Eliza Madrigal: people used to have life long careers with many of the same people in and out of their lives
Eliza Madrigal: we have soooo many connections now, but few deep ones
Riddle Sideways: yes
Agatha Macbeth: More is less
Bruce Mowbray: What are “basic” human needs?
Bleu Oleander: so community will be important
Eliza Madrigal nods... some seem to thrive that way but I'll admit sputtering
Riddle Sideways: use to be able to 'see' 30+ years into your future
Bruce Mowbray: Is there such a thing as "universal" human need?
Eliza Madrigal: snuggling? :)
Bruce Mowbray: :)
Bruce Mowbray: Hugs.
Agatha Macbeth: Mm
Bleu Oleander: health, safety, opportunity to live meaningful life?
Eliza Madrigal: nods, 'sense' of possibility
Bruce Mowbray: Access to internet? Skills education? Health care?
Eliza Madrigal: even if things are hard, one wants to feel they can affect their future
Riddle Sideways: he sputtered over just Education; how years, how wide
Bruce Mowbray: Having a sense of control over one's life is central to meaning, I feel.
Eliza Madrigal: dignity
Eliza Madrigal: easy to understand how the idea of education is disheartening, so many reforms, so little progress, things changing so fast
--BELL--1.45
Bruce Mowbray: New Jobs: instead of competing with AI, humans could focus on servicing and leveraging AI operations, maintenance, cyber security (aiming at cooperation rather than competition)
Riddle Sideways: that section was soooo bleak
Eliza Madrigal: it was
Riddle Sideways: good, back to Hybrid jobs
Bruce Mowbray: Yes it was: The rise of a new useless-irrelevant class produced by automation.
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Riddle Sideways: partnerships
Eliza Madrigal: I think we're sort of losing freedom to be off the internet
Riddle Sideways: oh, and the widening have-havenot gap
Bleu Oleander: but maybe a nudge toward nurturing our communities?
Eliza Madrigal: that's what makes the rest a problem imo
Bruce Mowbray: Are we at the point where we suspect AI's have been at work whenever we see creativity?
Eliza Madrigal: I went to schools with very wide ranges of haves and have nots and I think that was important
Bleu Oleander: agree
Eliza Madrigal: had friends who lived in tiny apartments with grandma and friends who had arcades in their homes
Riddle Sideways: was thinking about long long ago the grocery checker manually typing in the price of each item. Now automatic scanning... until it doesn't work xmooth
Riddle Sideways: smooth and human take over
Bruce Mowbray: Universal Basic Income? Cushion poor against crushing poverty while protecting rich from public rage.
Eliza Madrigal: although... self check outs are not that popular, seems we like having something 'there'
Eliza Madrigal: someone
Eliza Madrigal: (maybe typo, would robot be ok? ;-)
Riddle Sideways: yes, won't try them unless someone is there
Bleu Oleander: :)
Bruce Mowbray: I like to have someone "there" to chat with in the checkout line. . .
Eliza Madrigal nods
Bleu Oleander: chatty robots
Eliza Madrigal giggles
Bruce Mowbray: whether it is self-checkout or one with a cashier.
Bleu Oleander: at least robots don't pass on viruses :)
Bruce Mowbray: :)
Riddle Sideways: really?
Eliza Madrigal: well this is true :)
Bruce Mowbray: just computer viruses.
Eliza Madrigal: hehe
Bleu Oleander: right
Riddle Sideways: robots wash their hands less
Agatha Macbeth: Send for the robodoc
Bleu Oleander: but fewer colds perhaps?
Bruce Mowbray: Individual humans are likely to be replaced by integrated networks of inter-connected AI's. . . .
Bruce Mowbray: doctor, banker, lawyer networks.
Bruce Mowbray: Such networks are part of the same algorithm – that can be upgraded and shared instantly, with nearly universal access – so persons with no access to doctors can still have access to expert medical information.
Riddle Sideways: But, not nurses
Agatha Macbeth: Wonder if the robots will get paid as much
Bruce Mowbray: Right!
Bruce Mowbray: Not nurses. . . care givers.
Eliza Madrigal: they'll have to get really close to feeling 'comfortable' because people seem to crave that, the more modern we get... taking up knitting and all kinds of retro arts, etc.
Agatha Macbeth: Let's get one for Zen
Eliza Madrigal: comfort animals abounding
Eliza Madrigal: :) Agatha
Bleu Oleander: love my Zoe
Riddle Sideways: yes, epidemic of service and comfort animals about
Agatha Macbeth: Wot?
Bruce Mowbray: I was thinking about needing a comfort animal. . .
Bleu Oleander: speaking of her ... must go take her for a walk
Bruce Mowbray: kk, bye for now Bleu.
Agatha Macbeth: Woof
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Bleu, hugs to Zoey :)
Riddle Sideways: see, Bleu is trained
Bleu Oleander: take care ... what's up for next week?
Eliza Madrigal smilse
Eliza Madrigal: smiles*
Bleu Oleander: ha ha Riddle
Bruce Mowbray: I'm not sure.
Bruce Mowbray: about next week.
Bleu Oleander: ok will watch emails
Bruce Mowbray: I'll ask Aph later.
Bleu Oleander: bye for now
Bruce Mowbray: bye, Bleu.
Eliza Madrigal: I have it on the wiki but don't seem to be able to open the page atm
Riddle Sideways: by Bleu
Agatha Macbeth: Where is Aph?
Bleu Oleander: art workshop next wed
Agatha Macbeth: Yay
Bruce Mowbray: She had a doc appt. (not robotic kind).
Agatha Macbeth: Oh
Agatha Macbeth: Hope she's OK
Bruce Mowbray: Google's Alpha Zero learned chess from scratch and became a chess master in four hours.
Riddle Sideways: it was Go
Agatha Macbeth: I prefer Bobby Fischer
Eliza Madrigal: he didn't get to GO, I wonder why
Eliza Madrigal: maybe later in the book?
Bruce Mowbray: No, Alpha Go is passe. Alpha Zero learns with NO supervision.
Riddle Sideways: oh, right
Agatha Macbeth: Maybe he STOPped
Patrick Edwyn: thanks for the discussion Bruce !!!
Bruce Mowbray: YW!
Bruce Mowbray: Come back when you can, Patrick.
Riddle Sideways: thanks Bruce and All
Eliza Madrigal: next week is happiness
Bruce Mowbray: Self-driving cars would reduce traffic deaths by 90% – one million lives every year.
Eliza Madrigal: https://wiki.playasbeing.org/Theme_Sessions
Riddle Sideways: oh good, Happiness
Riddle Sideways: have already started that
Bruce Mowbray: Don't worry. Be happy.
Eliza Madrigal: we were dong uber eats and had self driving option come up
Agatha Macbeth: I'll look forward to some of that
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Bruce Mowbray: I have another session starting in three minutes that i need to go to now.
Bruce Mowbray: May all be well and happy.
Agatha Macbeth: Busy guy
Eliza Madrigal: THANKS Bruce
Eliza Madrigal: and thanks everybody :)
Bruce Mowbray: Bye for now, good people.
Agatha Macbeth: Did our visitors give permission to be included?
Eliza Madrigal: yes
Agatha Macbeth: Ta
Eliza Madrigal: Still with us Sabeen?
Agatha Macbeth: Saves me editing
Eliza Madrigal: You will see when posting, too
Agatha Macbeth: Well hopefully :p
Eliza Madrigal: :) you're good about that... making little sections and such
--BELL--2.00
Agatha Macbeth: Mm, I try to keep it relevant
Eliza Madrigal: and you make sure people don't miss the humor
Agatha Macbeth: And keep it clear
Agatha Macbeth: Just in case anyone reads it ha
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Agatha Macbeth: Lady in red

Eliza Madrigal: I've been thinking about the question of what it is like to be an outsider happening upon a pab chat log

Eliza Madrigal: feel like doing a focus group, hah

Agatha Macbeth: Bewilderment most likely
Eliza Madrigal: likely so
Eliza Madrigal: sometimes I go back to a session I remember enjoying years ago and my head gets boggled
Agatha Macbeth: As Pamala Clift would say 'What's with these crazy people'
Eliza Madrigal: yeah, what is UP with us
Agatha Macbeth: We're a coterie
Agatha Macbeth: Or something
Eliza Madrigal: something beyond coffee clasche (SP?)
Eliza Madrigal: yikes I've lost all my spelling abilities
Agatha Macbeth: Yeh could be
Eliza Madrigal: klatch
Eliza Madrigal: !
Agatha Macbeth: Wonder how latte man is these days
Eliza Madrigal: latte man?
Agatha Macbeth: What was his name?
Agatha Macbeth: Enzo?
Eliza Madrigal: Isen?
Agatha Macbeth: Maybe
Eliza Madrigal: yes Enso
Eliza Madrigal: or zo
Agatha Macbeth: Ach zo
Eliza Madrigal: :) What a great character
Agatha Macbeth: And Quilty
Eliza Madrigal: I really thought he was a full time monk when I was first in SL
Eliza Madrigal: I thought anyone wearing the robes was, haha
Eliza Madrigal: for about a week
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Agatha Macbeth: I thought he was too
Eliza Madrigal: he was indeed very disciplined
Agatha Macbeth: And Adelene and Threedee
Eliza Madrigal: who I wonder about a lot
Agatha Macbeth: They couldn't sit down on the cushions :p
Agatha Macbeth: The winged lions
Eliza Madrigal: I read that in lion form, I think it was 3D who said, he was less identified with labels n such
Eliza Madrigal: he felt more free
Agatha Macbeth nods
Eliza Madrigal: avatar comfort animal :)
Agatha Macbeth: Disassociation
Eliza Madrigal: relaxing boundaries... sigh, so many rich discussions
Agatha Macbeth: Maybe that's why so many furries
Eliza Madrigal: must be
Eliza Madrigal: I liked being an animal sometimes but never quite could settle as one
Eliza Madrigal: feel a sense of 'me'
Agatha Macbeth: I'll have to come as a panda again sometime
Eliza Madrigal smiles yes!
Eliza Madrigal: one thing about the animal avies, others really want to be close and seems to make them happy
Eliza Madrigal: so that could become addictive :)
Agatha Macbeth: If it makes you happy...
Agatha Macbeth: It can't be that bad
Eliza Madrigal: can't be that bad...
Agatha Macbeth: Snap
Eliza Madrigal: aroo
Agatha Macbeth: Aroo to you too
Eliza Madrigal: hahah
Eliza Madrigal: bye Sabeen, if you return to read this (I think she's been away for some time)
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Agatha! Have a beautiful night
Agatha Macbeth: TTFN
Agatha Macbeth: Love to George
Agatha Macbeth: _/!\_
Eliza Madrigal: k