2008.04.06 19:00 - Secret Agents

Friedrich Ochsenhorn: g’ evening
Caledonia Heron: hi Friedrich :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: nice weekend?
Caledonia Heron: yes, very nice..and you?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: good, but busy. gonna be a hectic month
Caledonia Heron: how so?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: work, school, travel…
Caledonia Heron: ah, a very full plate
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i am a part time grad student, and its the last bit of the semester
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: etc etc
Caledonia Heron: lol, got it…been there
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i don’t think we have ever shown up at the tea house at the same time, but I have encountered your name on the play as being blog
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, nice to finally meet you
Caledonia Heron: it’s nice to meet you now :)
Caledonia Heron: yes, I am the one kind of stumbling around :)
Caledonia Heron: shall we sit down?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sure. is there anyone inside though?
Caledonia Heron: no there is noone inside
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: nice hairdo. i have a similar shade of hair, when its sunny out
Caledonia Heron: thank you - the beauty of sl is perfect hair, all the time…a girl’s dream I suppose :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: snicker. i imagine there is still the analog of a “bad hair day”
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: like when things take a while to render, or whatever
Caledonia Heron: yes! when you can’t find it or it’s stuck to your backside :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i actually had trouble teletransporting the other night
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i wanted to show someone where I had been hanging out this week, but it all broke. silly observers.
Caledonia Heron: yeah, the system has been having some troubles the last week or so…ISP and top routers, etc
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hey - are you capturing the chat, or does that happen automatically?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: if Pema isn’t here, he may want to review the transcript sometime anyway
Caledonia Heron: yes, I will grab it, there is a setting also - yes, he asked me to provide the log
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: cool.
Caledonia Heron: what kind of grad studies do you do?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, what does Caledonia mean?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. jinx.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: Well, I am studying communications at Columbia’s journalism school
Caledonia Heron: Caledonia is a blues song about a strong woman…Caledonia, Caledonia, what makes your big head so hard?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: your head doesn;’t look that big
Caledonia Heron: big enough :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh.
Caledonia Heron: B.B. King - you should check it out
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: k.
Caledonia Heron: are you finding the 9 second practice useful or interesting?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: my feet just disappeared in this view. very disconcerting
Caledonia Heron: deep grass, needs a cut
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: undoubtably. its been a fun week.
Caledonia Heron: how so?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: jolted me into and out of my normal routines
Caledonia Heron: yes, agreed on that
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: my boss/professor has a great piece of advice he used to give his students when they asked him where to go… he used to say, go somewhere you don’t belong
Caledonia Heron: :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: displace yourself, to help you not confuse your horizons for the world
Caledonia Heron: I can see the value of that
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, pausing, or stopping as someone put it the other day, has helped me see over a few of my own self constructed horizons
Caledonia Heron: that’s great !
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: how about you? are you practicing? Noticing differences?
Caledonia Heron: mmm, I am noticing things more frequently although I don’t seem to follow the time increments suggested by Pema….I do pretty well for a while then see to find an alternate schedule
Caledonia Heron: to answer the differences question it seems to be noticing what’s so more often to me
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yeah, i put myself in a lower tax bracket. i only aim for once an hour right now
Caledonia Heron: LOL
Caledonia Heron: good for you
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, i end up often doing it more often
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hm…. just a flyby, huh? speedwalking meditator?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: zen tourist?
Caledonia Heron: :) not sure - kinda of a random passer-by huh?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: I’m /really/ new to SL
Caledonia Heron: yeah I noticed
Caledonia Heron: you’re doing well :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ;-P
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i’m not really here for the identity play right now. just the playing as being
Caledonia Heron: you have one of the brand new avs …not customized yet :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: really, i have my hands full of identities w/out SL
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: what are you talking about! I put my contacts in today ;-)
Caledonia Heron: hmmm interesting idea about the identities
Caledonia Heron: ha ha, yes, very nice contacts :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i wonder if anyone has scripted mirror contacts
Caledonia Heron: contacts but no shoes :) very eastern
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: come to think of it, i haven’t actually seen any mirrors at all in here yet
Caledonia Heron: yes, there are many eye options available
Caledonia Heron: you just use your camera to spin around and look at yourself
Caledonia Heron: don’t need a mirror
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yeah, but that’s not quite the same as a mirror. they aren’t just for seeing yourself
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: they make a room fill bigger, for one thing ;-)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: though, I suppose real estate isn’t a problem in here
Caledonia Heron: yes, expand space, good feng shui
Caledonia Heron: no not so much
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: to break the spell, i also wonder if their rendering/ray tracing software could handle mirrors
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: anyway, its fun to try to figure out what’s missing here.
Caledonia Heron: I’m still exploring what *is* here :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: the omissions are one of the ways ideologies of this platform are expresssed
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: LMAO
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: how did you hear about this project?
Caledonia Heron: I like how some things that are so important in RL are meaningless here like transportation
Caledonia Heron: through another group - MICA
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hmmm… you have to choose your mode of transport, and also know where you are going
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: what’s that stand for?
Caledonia Heron: Meta Institute for Computational Astrophysics
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: are you an astrophysicist?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (and, what’s the difference between that and an astronomer?)
Caledonia Heron: no, I am interested in information management and visualization
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hence, the meta.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i would have to say i am interested in information mgmt and visualization too
Caledonia Heron: !!
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: any particular type of information
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ?
Caledonia Heron: excellent
Caledonia Heron: well, lately I have been studying the conveyance and transfer of information within 3D worlds
Caledonia Heron: but I have worked on the development of systems to provide information to users in various ways
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i’ve been thinking alot about how technology, especially things like the visualization of large volumes of data, is beginning to transform epistemology itself
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: namely, what its possible to know, and how we go about knowing
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and, of course (deep breaths), there are politics all over this too
Caledonia Heron: true enough
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: who has access to these processing capabilities, or even know that they need them
Caledonia Heron: each of these are complex areas
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i hang out w/ alot of social scientists that could surely use these capabilities in their efforts to transform qualitative data into evidence which supports a hypothesis
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: anyhow, not sure if this is interesting to you
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: we have strayed from the experiential ;-)
Caledonia Heron: yes, a different slant within the same realm
Caledonia Heron: that’s ok, what we are doing is experiential :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: err, that’s a bit tautological
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ;-)
Caledonia Heron: lol, gigs up :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, how do you know Pema?
Caledonia Heron: we met by chance and struck a friendship
Caledonia Heron: you?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i had read some of his stuff as an undergrad, by chance, and then saw him talk last monday at a conf.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, i basically know him through playing as being
Caledonia Heron: ah, yes, he said it went well
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i didn’t have the opportunity to really attend that conf - i just crashed his talk, basically - since i recognized his name
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but i think it was a success (whatever that means for a conf about an intractable problem)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i actually work full time at the university - in an org that helps the faculty use new media purposefully in their teaching
Caledonia Heron: interesting, I do something similar
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: we have not yet drank the SL kool-aid, though it certainly keeps being offered.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: whereabouts?
Caledonia Heron: it’s a fever :)
Caledonia Heron: a large govt agency in an education technology incubator
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hmm… so you some kind of secret agent?
Caledonia Heron: building tools for teachers, real time networking tools
Caledonia Heron: absolutely, secret secret double dipped secret clearance :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: nice. i’m an undercover NASA agent (just take off the first A for savings)
Caledonia Heron: ah, hence the interest in information :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: we don’t do much real-time stuff yet. but lots of multimedia, annotations, collaboration, etc
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, as far as that’s concerned, I guess i would call myself a post-modern physicist
Caledonia Heron: what does that mean?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: like, if info is the fundamental constituent of nature, w/ matter and energy supervening on it, and all that jazz, then to understand reality you need to study information in all its forms
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, that includes media and comm. studies, in addition to CS and EE and stuff
Caledonia Heron: well, that sounds like the bookish way to do it :)
Caledonia Heron: lol
Caledonia Heron: good one
Caledonia Heron: you have found the gestures quickly :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: you waiting for the movie?
Caledonia Heron: no, I was thinking more that the fundamental constituent of nature is not CS or EE or something studied but something experienced as true
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sigh. me in a zen garden. i come from a different tradition.
Caledonia Heron: perfect ying yang
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: a bookish one, you could say ;-)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: quality, quantity, and the relationships between them… its been said
Caledonia Heron: yes, :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, here’s the thing, about these words and books…
Caledonia Heron: yes?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: there is the issue of inter-generational communication
Caledonia Heron: ok, and?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: shoulders of giants, picking up where someone else left off.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: eh. either way. i happen to be procrastinating from reading right now anyway, so i must be in agreement.
Caledonia Heron: lol, that is funny - noticing procrastination
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, i try to keep my procrastination productive
Caledonia Heron: which further protracts the …well, you get it…
Caledonia Heron: :), that’s very practical
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, when i get around to it ;-)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, i imagine, w/ that outfit you have been here a while. any places you recomend i visit?
Caledonia Heron: I’ve been inworld a while - you pick stuff up as you see it….you will too after a time
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, did you have a mindful practice before embarking on this experiment?
Caledonia Heron: I don’t understand - try me again
Caledonia Heron: a mindful practice?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i dunno - do you meditate, do yoga, anything like that?
Caledonia Heron: mmm, no, nothing formal
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh - were you at sxsw? I was there last year>
Caledonia Heron: you?
Caledonia Heron: yes, I went - very fun :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: used to. not regularly. I am intrigued by the frequency/duration tradeoff/proposition
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i mean, i used to regularly, not anymore
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: unless you count the story i tell myself about integrating it into my daily life
Caledonia Heron: lol
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: interactive, film, music, or all of the above?
Caledonia Heron: interactive and music - I went to screenburn to check the games and to a lot of music
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: fun. i had a blast last year.
Caledonia Heron: good - Austin is a good town
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: surrounded by TX, they say.
Caledonia Heron: yes, an oasis
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, i’ve been blogging about my reflections on this project too - the main site has been linking to them. i have tied some of these experiences back to ed tech also
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: are you working on anything interesting?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: do you like what you do?
Caledonia Heron: yes, I do enjoy my work
Caledonia Heron: I have enjoyed working in 3d worlds - I have visited a few
Caledonia Heron: I enjoy meeting people like you :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: eh. no ‘blush’ gesture
Friedrich Ochsenhorn blushes
Caledonia Heron: lol, you are pretty sophisticated for such a new av - the gestures, shortcut texting ….well done :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yeah, i hear on good authority that SL is currently working on an OpenSocial like mechanism
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, you could teletransport into other worlds
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: non-SL ones
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: preserving your avatar, but keeping your linden $ secure and stuff
Caledonia Heron: open architecture, universal architecture….indeed
Caledonia Heron: yes, we will be travelling among them soon
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, i have hung out online alot before, just not much in 3D worlds
Caledonia Heron: some businesses are branding themselves across different virtual worlds
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: many post-geographic projects have been making do w/ 2D tools quite effectively
Caledonia Heron: making do, yes…I am over the flat web I’m afraid :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: what attracted me to this project was the way that it leverages what is specifically unique to this immersive stuff
Caledonia Heron: yes :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, i have begun to understand the advantages of the 3D part, in terms of fooling my poor little brain
Caledonia Heron: it’s all very surreal
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: will have to think harder about how to specifically leverage them
Caledonia Heron: it depends what outcome you desire
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, for starters, professionally, there are learning objectives
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i work with folks who have a very healthy skepticism about the use of tech in ed.
Caledonia Heron: luddites eh?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i wouldn’t say that
Caledonia Heron: I’m kidding :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: critical theorists ;-)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh.
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: just so you know, i’ll likely turn into a pumpkin around 11
Caledonia Heron: well, it’s a persuasive speech is all….when they think it’s their idea and are giving you instructions you’ll know you’ve done your job
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: EST
Caledonia Heron: ok, I must leave then also
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hey! have you met my boss
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh.
Caledonia Heron: all bosses are the same
Caledonia Heron: they want to get the job done
Caledonia Heron: maybe they don’t know what the job is
Caledonia Heron: until “they” think of it
Caledonia Heron: that’s where you come in
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hmmm… I’m some people’s bosses now too
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: how do i avoid that disposition
Caledonia Heron: what are they telling you?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i dunno - i haven’t thought of it myself yet
Caledonia Heron: are you open?
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i get bored easy
Caledonia Heron: boredom is a high conscious state - it says you are open to something new :) that’s what a teacher told me - I thought they were playing me but it turns out to be true for me :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i think for me it rings of loneliness and abandonment
Caledonia Heron: hmmm, I never thought of it like that
Caledonia Heron: I see a fresh slate
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: play as being has helped me remember to step back and examine it though
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, i’m just being adversarial. i’m sure its also the source of much creativty
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: a natural tension, if you will
Caledonia Heron: also much laying about :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. i think for me boredom is caused by laying about
Caledonia Heron: yes, a tension and resolution
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: getting up and out is the cure
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: jeez - i had better get going at some point soon
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh
Caledonia Heron: yes :)
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yeah, i’m gonna look in the tea house, just to check it out
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: nice chatting w/ you Caledonia
Caledonia Heron: it was very nice to meet you :) I hope to speak with you again
Friedrich Ochsenhorn: see you around
Caledonia Heron: yes, of course :)