2008.04.16 19:00 - Stopping versus Shaking

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    Shortly before our 7pm meeting started, Dakini, Ayden and I were chatting out in the open, near the place of the 6pm evening zazen sessions.

    Ayden Janus: what’s the nature of life? I’m curious because I’m still searching
    Pema Pera: my guess would be
    Pema Pera: that our whole idea of life
    Pema Pera: as unfolding in time
    Pema Pera: is misleading
    Pema Pera: and in fact wrong
    Dakini Rhode: wow i was just thinking that before our session
    Pema Pera: glad to hear that, Dakini!
    Pema Pera: like a dream or movie — convincing and immersive but not real
    Pema Pera: in a movie
    Pema Pera: in a theatre
    Pema Pera: there are FACTS in front of you — you can’t change them (need to buy a film crew) but they are still not real
    Dakini Rhode: i was thinking about people who remember “past lives”
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: but remembering may not be what it seems
    Dakini Rhode: right
    Dakini Rhode: time may not be what it seems
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: in movies too
    Pema Pera: people “remember”
    Dakini Rhode: memories of “me” may not be what they seem
    Ayden Janus: agreed
    Pema Pera: eternity is now
    Pema Pera: right here
    Pema Pera: one deep breath can connect you
    Dakini Rhode: thoughts fly about… we grab them
    Pema Pera: is already connecting us
    Dakini Rhode: and identify them with a self
    Pema Pera: but we disconnect moment by moment
    Pema Pera: yes
    Dakini Rhode: yes
    Dakini Rhode: the 9 sec practice is a great tool, PP
    Pema Pera: we have been trained our whole life to disconnect from eternity
    Pema Pera: that’s why I suggested the 1% time tax, to learn to connect
    Pema Pera: without threatening the time devil called ego
    Pema Pera: ;>)
    Dakini Rhode: o that old devil still shows up haha
    Ayden Janus: going to go play mass effect, see you guys later
    Pema Pera: did you read what Storm wrote today, in his blog, Dakini?
    Pema Pera: http://stormerne.blogspot.com/
    Dakini Rhode: i read storms blog, but i had about a week to catch up on, i don’t recall what he wrote today
    Pema Pera: I notice that self-grasping brings physical tension and stress. A 9 second break and a re-tune to Being, and the subsequent depth of relaxation is greater than a hot bath or a massage could ever give!
    Dakini Rhode: I’ve been noticing that too
    Pema Pera: by Ayden!
    Dakini Rhode: i notice very much how I’m FEELING when i do the 9 sec
    Pema Pera: can you say more?
    Pema Pera: Or better
    Pema Pera: shall we go to the tea house?
    Pema Pera: I think we can use a cup of tea after all that
    Dakini Rhode: not very profound, i’m afraid
    Dakini Rhode: sure!
    Dakini Rhode: definitely teatime

    As soon as we sat down in the tea room, NeitherNorist dropped by.

    Dakini Rhode: hello Neither
    Pema Pera: hi NN
    NeitherNorist Ohl: hey
    Pema Pera: NN, Dakini is the one whom we mentioned this morning
    Pema Pera: who built this tea house
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i see
    Pema Pera: Dakini, NN came it this morning for the first time
    Pema Pera: was born a few days ago in SL.
    Dakini Rhode: and you came back!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: indeed!
    Dakini Rhode: well happy rezzday
    Pema Pera: we met in Manhattan
    Pema Pera: a couple weeks ago
    Pema Pera: after I gave a talk
    Pema Pera: and mentioned “wu-wei”
    Pema Pera: that was the trigger, right?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: yes, indeed
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i was very much inspired by it
    NeitherNorist Ohl: what were you guys talking about just now?
    Pema Pera: we just sat down
    Dakini Rhode: the 9 sec practice
    Pema Pera: yes, Dakini, how did that go recently?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: you mean we do the practice here?
    Dakini Rhode: i mentioned that often when i do the practice, I get in touch with what I’m feeling
    Dakini Rhode: physically, etc.
    Dakini Rhode: I guess it’s noticeable because otherwise I’m paying more attention to what I’m THINKING
    Pema Pera: that’s wonderful, Dakini!
    Dakini Rhode: at least when I’m working
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that’s interesting, because I have exactly the opposite effect
    Dakini Rhode: Isn’t that interesting?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: indeed, quite unexpected
    NeitherNorist Ohl: it is as though when I am in the midst of something, i am most aware of myself
    NeitherNorist Ohl: when i actually take the time to sit back and try to be aware, somehow that awareness eludes me
    Dakini Rhode: what is noticing the lack of awareness?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: what do you think, Pema?
    Pema Pera: there are so many ways of “stopping”
    NeitherNorist Ohl: I don’t think I understood your question, Dakini?
    Pema Pera: and being fully into an action can be a form of stopping
    Pema Pera: that is wu-wei
    Pema Pera: but often we are not fully into it
    Pema Pera: and then taking a break helps
    Pema Pera: the picture that came to mind to me recently was throwing a stone in a pond covered by crud, and suddenly seeing the water underneath.
    Pema Pera: like what Dakini described
    Pema Pera: when our thoughts carry us away
    NeitherNorist Ohl: but why does it have to be stopping then?
    Pema Pera: we need to stop in order to see more of what is
    Pema Pera: stopping, waking up, seeing . . . different terms
    NeitherNorist Ohl: are they all the same though?
    Pema Pera: not the same but similar
    Pema Pera: the point is:
    Pema Pera: we always want to add (knowledge, skills, possessions) but here we really have to subtract
    Pema Pera: that is key
    Pema Pera: letting go
    Pema Pera: renouncing
    Pema Pera: stopping
    Pema Pera: devotion is just that
    Pema Pera: if done in a pure way
    NeitherNorist Ohl: oh, i see what you mean
    Pema Pera: stepping out of the way
    Pema Pera: opening the blinds in front of your windows
    Pema Pera: washing the windows

    After I thus carried on about stopping, my internet took a hint and stopped. First I thought that everybody had fallen into a deep silence, but then I got suspicious, and I realized that I was frozen out. So I logged out and in again, and eventually returned to the tea house.

    NeitherNorist Ohl: it is as though you are talking about stopping while doing, not after doing
    Dakini Rhode: i think Pema just crashed
    NeitherNorist Ohl: oh, i see.
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that was funny :)
    Dakini Rhode: I studied with a group that called it “pausing”
    Dakini Rhode: lol
    Dakini Rhode: Pema is calling it “stopping”
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i see
    NeitherNorist Ohl: but it is interesting how different people might experience stopping differently
    Dakini Rhode: yes!
    Dakini Rhode: We are all playing with trying to understand what Pema is talking about
    Dakini Rhode: and of course Pema doesn’t tell us “how” to stop
    Dakini Rhode: It is for us to experience for ourselves
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i see
    NeitherNorist Ohl: for me, as though doing is stopping, and stopping is not really stopping
    Dakini Rhode: that’s a great observation!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: thanks
    Dakini Rhode: wb PP
    NeitherNorist Ohl: welcome back Pema
    Pema Pera: sorry, frozen computer
    Pema Pera: no idea how long it was frozen
    Pema Pera: I thought everyone had turned thoughtful hahaha
    NeitherNorist Ohl: not that long
    Pema Pera: but then it seemed too long
    Dakini Rhode: we wondered why you weren’t talking to us :-P
    Pema Pera: haha
    Pema Pera: I stopped
    Dakini Rhode: lol
    Pema Pera: or better my computer stopped
    NeitherNorist Ohl: lol
    Pema Pera: my computer is better at such things than I am
    NeitherNorist Ohl: see? that’s my point, though
    Pema Pera: ?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that stopping is not real stopping
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i was just talking to Dakini about different kinds of stoppings
    Dakini Rhode: NN may I repeat what you said?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: for me, doing is stopping and stopping is not really stopping
    Dakini Rhode: :-)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: please go ahead Dakini
    Dakini Rhode: you just did :-)

    We then came back to the notion of wuwei.

    Pema Pera: how do you see wuwei in that context, NN?
    Dakini Rhode: I would love if one of you would translate wuwei for me
    Pema Pera: not-doing
    Pema Pera: literally
    Dakini Rhode: ty
    Pema Pera: but large cultural context
    Pema Pera: no friction
    Pema Pera: not going against the grain but with the grain
    NeitherNorist Ohl: wuwei in that situation means effortless action
    You decline Second Question weekly show! from A group member named Pooky Amsterdam.
    NeitherNorist Ohl: spontaneous and natural
    Dakini Rhode: I get it - I had drawn a blank on the word :)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: so to get back to PP’s question about wuwei
    Dakini Rhode: either senility is setting in or it’s bedtime
    NeitherNorist Ohl: no, the night is still young
    Pema Pera: oh no it is chinese word, needs explaining!
    Pema Pera: of course
    Dakini Rhode: haha depends where you are
    Pema Pera: haha yes
    NeitherNorist Ohl: it is as though intense engagement with something is best for me to be aware of myself, in doing something
    NeitherNorist Ohl: when i sit back, i become numb and dumb, for some reason
    Pema Pera: there are many ways of “sitting back” . . .
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i meant stopping that engagement
    Dakini Rhode: rather than sitting back, maybe we want to move to the center
    NeitherNorist Ohl: can you explain that, Dakini?
    Dakini Rhode: maybe come to a balance
    NeitherNorist Ohl: I see
    Dakini Rhode: just a thought - but between intense engagement and numbness - what is it like there?
    Dakini Rhode: maybe take a rest somewhere in the center
    NeitherNorist Ohl: but I don’t think balance is between intense engagement and numbness
    NeitherNorist Ohl: balance is, for me at least, the effectiveness in engagement
    NeitherNorist Ohl: what do you think, Pema?
    Pema Pera: well, there are so many ways of doing and not-doing . . . . .
    Pema Pera: we have to say more to zoom in and be precise
    Pema Pera: NeitherNorist, have you tried to do the practice for a few hours?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: I did it for an hour
    Pema Pera: and how did that go?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: each time my mind was blank
    Pema Pera: how about doing it for a number of days?
    Pema Pera: say one hour a day
    Pema Pera: just to see
    Pema Pera: as an exploration
    NeitherNorist Ohl: I think I will
    Pema Pera: without particular expectations
    Pema Pera: great!
    Pema Pera: I am looking forward to hearing what will happen
    Pema Pera: no way to know beforehand

    The conversation then moved from stopping to shaking up.

    NeitherNorist Ohl: I did have some experience in regular meditation
    Pema Pera: what kind(s)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: just simple Zazen
    Pema Pera: ha, zazen’s simplicity can be very misleading (^_^)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: of course!
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: zazen can be really beautiful
    Pema Pera: and easy to get into
    Pema Pera: but in zazen too, we can just as easily get stuck
    Pema Pera: like in anything
    NeitherNorist Ohl: absolutely
    Pema Pera: one way to look at the 9-sec practice
    Pema Pera: is that it shakes you up
    NeitherNorist Ohl: my mind easily wandered during zazen
    Pema Pera: not important whether you like it or not, whether it feels good or not
    NeitherNorist Ohl: right
    Pema Pera: to be shaken up many times a day is a good thing
    Pema Pera: and we can take it from there
    Pema Pera: you asked: do we do the practice here?
    Pema Pera: Not specifically no, though of course you can continue
    Pema Pera: and every 15 minutes take your 9-sec break here too
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that’s what I thought
    Pema Pera: but the main reson to come here is to reflect upon what happened the last several hours that you did the practice
    NeitherNorist Ohl: I like “shaking up” better than stopping
    Pema Pera: reflect and share
    Pema Pera: good!
    Pema Pera: For you is will be shaking ;>) accord
    NeitherNorist Ohl: because I experience several shaking ups everyday, at least I try to
    Pema Pera: continuity is the one point I am aiming at here
    Pema Pera: continuity of being shaken up
    NeitherNorist Ohl: right
    Pema Pera: waking up is a big word
    Pema Pera: but shaken up is a good step ;-)
    Pema Pera: so two ways in which I focus on continuity
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i see, so you are making a connection between shaking up and waking up
    Pema Pera: every quarter of an hour you shake yourself ; every quarter of a day you can come here to be shaken up by your peers

    Similarly, we moved from continuity to perseverence.

    NeitherNorist Ohl: i have my misgivings about continuity in general
    NeitherNorist Ohl: although not continuity in shaking up
    NeitherNorist Ohl: or rather perseverence in trying to shaking myself up
    Pema Pera: I’m sure we can find a word that will be more fitting for you
    Pema Pera: perseverence is fine!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: :)
    Pema Pera: Quakers and Shakers!
    Pema Pera: inspiring groups, by the way
    Dakini Rhode: lol shakers and movers!
    Pema Pera: twist and shake?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: :) I was thinking of that as well
    Dakini Rhode: sillies :-)
    Dakini Rhode: I had a teacher… very wise spiritual teacher
    NeitherNorist Ohl: but isn’t it interesting that words can have such drastically different emotive associations?
    Pema Pera: yes indeed!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: we relate to the same words differently
    Dakini Rhode: he would say, “are you comfortable?’
    Dakini Rhode: And if the answer was no, guess what?
    Dakini Rhode: He would say, “Good!”
    Pema Pera: I like your teacher!!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that’s to shake you up!
    Dakini Rhode: So maybe NN should try Stopping!
    Dakini Rhode: Haha yes
    Pema Pera: to shake him up
    Dakini Rhode: yes!
    Pema Pera: stop shaking to let stop shake him
    Dakini Rhode: maybe stopping will shake you up more than shaking!
    NeitherNorist Ohl: it is not that I’m uncomfortable with stopping or continuity, but rather that I relate to those words differently
    Pema Pera: I see
    Dakini Rhode: yes indeed
    NeitherNorist Ohl: continuity carries the sense of being stuck
    NeitherNorist Ohl: for me
    Pema Pera: that’s why it is so important that we share here what actually happens when we do the practice — that will help us rise above words
    Dakini Rhode: as for myself, since i like to be comfortable, i should try shaking for 9 mins
    NeitherNorist Ohl: exactly
    Pema Pera: hahaha
    Pema Pera: disco?
    NeitherNorist Ohl: that’s funny!
    Dakini Rhode: stand in the fridge?

    Our chat circled back to the pretty tea house we were seated in.

    NeitherNorist Ohl: how long did it take you to build this beautiful house, Dakini?
    Dakini Rhode: a LONG TIME haha
    NeitherNorist Ohl: thanks for letting us use it
    Dakini Rhode: np - it’s the reason i built it
    Dakini Rhode: i just didn’t know it at the time :-)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: lol
    Pema Pera: I was very moved when Dakini told me that, a month ago
    Pema Pera: I felt immediately what she meant
    Dakini Rhode: it was a case of “build it and they will come”
    Pema Pera: you read that kind of stuff in books
    Pema Pera: and then it happens in real life
    Pema Pera: well
    Pema Pera: in second life
    Pema Pera: ;>)
    Pema Pera: real second life
    NeitherNorist Ohl: it is not less real though
    Pema Pera: exactly!!
    Pema Pera: we keep coming back to that conclusion
    Pema Pera: about once a day here
    Dakini Rhode: lol yes definitely not less real
    NeitherNorist Ohl: when i first came in this morning, i felt the same as I would when I get into a new place in real life
    Dakini Rhode: more sort of astral plane
    Dakini Rhode: “think and it shall be”
    Pema Pera: i wish I could learn all of second life by “thinking I am skillful” ;>)
    Dakini Rhode: haha me too
    Pema Pera: the design is still as difficult . . .
    Pema Pera: and this place is a mirror of Dakini’s sense of style and space
    NeitherNorist Ohl: which is why SL is no less real
    Dakini Rhode: based on my small ability to execute :-)
    NeitherNorist Ohl: hopefully i’ll learn to do something like sometime in the future

    And from there to dreams, real reality, and virtual reality.

    Dakini Rhode: when I had been in SL for awhile, it occured to me that this virtual reality helps me to visulaize my dreams
    Pema Pera: yes, it affects my dreams too
    NeitherNorist Ohl: what do you mean?
    Dakini Rhode: i think i meant I project my dreams and imaginations into this environment
    Dakini Rhode: I can see what they are more clearly
    Dakini Rhode: How does it affect your dreams, PP?
    Pema Pera: all kind of actions from SL carry over in the dream sometimes
    Pema Pera: clicking on people and things, for example
    Pema Pera: but more generally
    Dakini Rhode: haha are you doing thisjust before sleeping?
    Pema Pera: a sense of the dreaming, waking and SLing mixing
    Pema Pera: actually now just after waking up ;>)
    Pema Pera: here in California
    Pema Pera: so memories of dreams and waking life and SL keep mingling in such a way
    Dakini Rhode: I was here TOO MUCH at first
    Pema Pera: that I often have to really think for a given memory from which of the three it came
    Dakini Rhode: Walking down the street or driving, I would think, “this is like SL!!”
    Pema Pera: yes, that tendency I know!
    Pema Pera: haha, yes
    Pema Pera: Storm told me
    Pema Pera: that when he looks at a web site
    Pema Pera: he wants to alt/option click and zoom in ;>)
    Dakini Rhode: oh, ALWAYS!
    Pema Pera: hahaha
    Pema Pera: yeah, recognizable
    Dakini Rhode: i do it all the time
    Pema Pera: like smokers with brown fingers
    Pema Pera: well Dakini
    Dakini Rhode: I want that laugh!
    Pema Pera: time for a shake?
    Dakini Rhode: well
    Dakini Rhode: 9 secs?
    Pema Pera: sure, for NN!
    Pema Pera: チョコレイト・ディスコ ♪
    Dakini Rhode:
    Pema Pera: do you have sound on, NN?
    Pema Pera: this is the PaB corporate song
    Pema Pera: every quarter of an hour a piece of chocolate
    NeitherNorist Ohl: i could hear it, but i didn’t know how to dance along
    Pema Pera: it’s like a secret handshake
    Dakini Rhode: Chokoreito Disco ♪
    Dakini Rhode: チョコレイト・ディスコ ♪
    Pema Pera: チョコレイト・ディスコ ♪
    Dakini Rhode: this is very silly

    At this point Dakini donned her giant icecream cone hat.

    Dakini Rhode: i forgot my hat
    Pema Pera: this is the PaB corporate headdress
    Dakini Rhode: i wish i could transfer this
    Pema Pera: remember where you got it?
    Dakini Rhode: one of the monks gave it to me
    Dakini Rhode: we will need to ask Moon Fargis - he made it
    Pema Pera: please do!
    Pema Pera: I’m happy to buy a dozen, right away!

    After Dakini and NeitherNorist had left, Pema spent a bit more time relaxing in the tea hut. At that point a passer-by stopped, opened the door, and stepped in.

    Tahuti Thor: hello
    Tahuti Thor: good evening
    Tahuti Thor: may i ask what r u doin
    Pema Pera: wanna sit down?
    Pema Pera: sure
    Pema Pera: we just had a meeting here
    Pema Pera: with a few friends
    Pema Pera: chatting
    Pema Pera: have you been here before?
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Tahuti Thor: no
    Tahuti Thor: never cound find any buddhists on here
    Pema Pera: here there are lots of them lol
    Pema Pera: two sims full!
    Tahuti Thor: oh ok
    Tahuti Thor: that is good to know
    Pema Pera: next door, there is a very nice small gathering every day at 6 pm SLT
    Pema Pera: doing 20 minutes meditation, zen style but really open for any version of Buddhism and beyond
    Pema Pera: very good atmosphere
    Pema Pera: The woman leading it is both gentle and firm, good combination
    Pema Pera: Dakini Rhode
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Tahuti Thor: ill take note of that
    Pema Pera: feel free to just drop by, any day at 6 pm
    Pema Pera: you’ll find at least half a dozen green dots just to the west of here
    Pema Pera: on the tatami mats in the grassy space
    Tahuti Thor: what does a green dot imply
    Pema Pera: oh, people on the map
    Tahuti Thor: oh ok
    Tahuti Thor: is that a green dot the butu-rei
    Pema Pera: different green dot ;>)
    Pema Pera: if you look at a map
    Pema Pera: either “map” or “mini-map”
    Pema Pera: you find green dots indicating where the avatars are
    Tahuti Thor: oic
    Tahuti Thor: haha
    Tahuti Thor: and i was so use to flying all around til i found someone
    Pema Pera: good way to find out where something is going on
    Pema Pera: haha yes
    Tahuti Thor: so now i can just look at the map
    Pema Pera: good to know!
    Tahuti Thor: maybe thats why i never seen any buddhists
    Pema Pera: hehe
    Pema Pera: also, I’m doing something here with these gatherings, every day
    Tahuti Thor: is there any special meditations ?
    Tahuti Thor: i reached a state of feeling that everything was apart of me
    Tahuti Thor: but i had to meditate soooo much to get there
    Tahuti Thor: is there any method that reaches that state quicker
    Pema Pera: http://playasbeing.wordpress.com/ is a web site that I recently put upt
    Pema Pera: it may be just what you were looking for ;>)
    Pema Pera: I come here every day at 7 am , 1 pm , 7 pm
    Pema Pera: feel free to drop by, at any of those times
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Tahuti Thor: hmm
    Tahuti Thor: i dont see any special meditation techniques
    Tahuti Thor: maybe there are none ?

    At that point Dakini returned, seeing that her hut hadn’t yet closed down for the night.

    Dakini Rhode: poking my head in the door :-)
    Dakini Rhode: hi :-)
    Tahuti Thor: hello
    Pema Pera: hi Dakini!
    Dakini Rhode: boy do i know how to stop a conversation
    Pema Pera: oh no Dakini
    Pema Pera: I had just given Tahuit the web site
    Dakini Rhode: the playasbeing website?
    Pema Pera: Dakini built all this, Tahuti
    Tahuti Thor: the sim ?
    Dakini Rhode: just this teahouse
    Dakini Rhode: what happens here is more special than what I built
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Dakini Rhode: we have sitting practice here every night
    Dakini Rhode: and Pema has his playasbeing meetings here in the teahouse
    Tahuti Thor: have u ever had that feeling that everything was a part of you ?
    Pema Pera: can you say a bit more?
    Tahuti Thor: there was no seperation between yourself and not-yourself
    Tahuti Thor: there was no you really
    Pema Pera: yes, that I am familiar with in some different ways
    Dakini Rhode: what does it feel like?
    Dakini Rhode: or that you were pure empty space and encompassed everything?
    Tahuti Thor: like your living in the present….your whole being is
    Tahuti Thor: yes maybe u can put it that way too
    Tahuti Thor: i only reached that state for 20 seconds
    Tahuti Thor: took me soo long….so many meditations
    Tahuti Thor: is there any meditation that can get there any faster ?
    Dakini Rhode: it sounds like this experience affected you
    Tahuti Thor: yes it was the strangest feeling in the world
    Dakini Rhode: I practice meditation, in fact, i’ve practiced a lot
    Dakini Rhode: different every time
    Dakini Rhode: the practice i do… we don’t aim for a particular state of mind
    Dakini Rhode: what i find is that the practice has the ability to transform one’s mind
    Tahuti Thor: yes, an aim might lessen the effect
    Dakini Rhode: the transformation - in terms of wisdom - I find most exciting
    Dakini Rhode: sometimes if I have an insight - or suddenly see things (or myself) differently
    Dakini Rhode: I can trace that to my practice
    Tahuti Thor: true
    Tahuti Thor: i like to combine meditation with a little learning
    Dakini Rhode: good idea!
    Dakini Rhode: what is your practice?
    Tahuti Thor: sometimes i focus in on a single point (end of nose sensation or naval mostly)
    Tahuti Thor: or i dont focus on anything and witness thoughts and feelings pass by
    Dakini Rhode: Oh dear, I must excuse myself (really this time) I’m about to turn into a pumpkin
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Pema Pera: bye Dakini!
    Tahuti Thor: nice chatting
    Pema Pera: Thanks for stopping by!
    Dakini Rhode: Nite PP and TT
    Pema Pera: happy dreams

    After Dakini had left, I took up Tahuti’s wish for speed.

    Pema Pera: Tahuti,
    Pema Pera: you mentioned that you would like to have “fast” results
    Pema Pera: and I’m all for that
    Tahuti Thor: yes
    Tahuti Thor: if its possible
    Pema Pera: but there are two different aspects
    Pema Pera: one question is: “how quick can I get a really deep experience”
    Pema Pera: and another question is “how quick can I can integrate such an experience into my life”
    Pema Pera: The two often are in contradictino
    Pema Pera: *tion
    Pema Pera: some methods lead to quick sensations, experiences, etc
    Pema Pera: but then take a very long time to really transform your daily life and awareness
    Pema Pera: other methods don’t seem to “do” much for quite a while, but when they “do” they may already have soaked into your whole life, so to speak
    Pema Pera: What I have been trying to do here
    Pema Pera: and I explain a little on that web site I pointed to
    Tahuti Thor: so to go slowly and persistenly is the best way ?
    Pema Pera: is to go for the integration before the deep experience
    Pema Pera: no best way
    Pema Pera: depends on the individual
    Pema Pera: and his/her surroundings — teacher and/or peers, sangha, friends
    Pema Pera: my method is like fog
    Pema Pera: walk in the fog for a while and you get really really wet
    Pema Pera: not like taking a quick shower and then let yourself dry up ;>)
    Pema Pera: so I ask people to spend 9 seconds to do practice every 15 minutes
    Pema Pera: for at least an hour a day
    Pema Pera: ideally several hours
    Pema Pera: as long as is comfortable

    At this point my internet connection froze once more, but after a few minutes I was back in again.

    Pema Pera: so I am trading duration (half an hour daily sitting, say) for frequency
    Pema Pera: a few minutes a day in total, but very very frequent
    Pema Pera: to let it really soak into your life
    Pema Pera: change your life
    Pema Pera: If you’d like to try it for a few days — will only take a few minutes ;>)
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Pema Pera: I could say a lot about what we can do in those 9 seconds
    Pema Pera: but it may be better to spend a few days getting into the routine.
    Pema Pera: For now, just taking a good breath, and stopping what you were in the middle of — creating a brief breathing space, literally — is enough for a start
    Pema Pera: I also suggest people jot down a few words during those 9 seconds
    Pema Pera: in a journal
    Pema Pera: seeing your own life like a laboratory
    Tahuti Thor: yes i saw that on the website
    Tahuti Thor: y jot down words?
    Pema Pera: you can keep a lab journal
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: whatever pops in your mind during those 9 seconds
    Pema Pera: simple or profound
    Pema Pera: silly or not
    Pema Pera: I’m afraid I have to go now
    Pema Pera: getting a bit late here
    Tahuti Thor: k
    Pema Pera: Thanks for stopping by!
    Tahuti Thor: i shall go too
    Pema Pera: take care!
    Tahuti Thor: u too

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