22-24 - Echoes

Pema Pera: anything that appears is fuel for appreciation
Pema Pera: your life is nothing but fuel, and appreciation is your engine that runs on it
Pema Pera: you get great mileage that way!
Tarmel Udimo: :)
Pema Pera: every quarter second :)

Pema Pera: so when somebody annoys you at work, you can really really really feel the acute presence of your annoyence, really fully go into it, completely -- and then the next moment you can see how you can also let it drop, watching what takes its place at *that* moment
Pema Pera: half-hearted annoyence tends to linger forever
Pema Pera: fully appreciating the presence of anything can make room for the next thing in the next mom    Pema Pera: burn up each moment
Pema Pera: fully
Pema Pera: like a dragon :-)

Eliza Madrigal: Often we don't know the baggage we carry until it drops and we think "ahhh, that's a relief!" :)

Fefonz Quan: i see. i don't think bad dreams show something bad. infact, waking from a bad dream i sometimes feel much better than waking from a good dream
Eliza Madrigal: Fefonz, you mean if you can resolve it...or just feeling exhilerated?

Fefonz Quan: feeling relieved that the real world is nicer ;)
Eliza Madrigal: :)

genesis Zhangsun: catch the monkey by the tail every fifteen minutes as I think of it

genesis Zhangsun: did you ever have an realization about something in your life Fefonz? ;) and then saw that you had always known it
genesis Zhangsun: but it was obscured from view until a certain moment?
Fefonz Quan: well, that's the thing, mostly when i had realization, i didn't see it before.
genesis Zhangsun: but after you saw it, did it seem completely familiar and clear to you
genesis Zhangsun: like aha the answer was always there but you just didn't see it
Fefonz Quan: sometimes, and sometimes it seemmed new and beautiful

Fefonz Quan: that's why i have difficulties with teh 'we already new it' notion

buddha Nirvana: doing infers 'active'
buddha Nirvana: while change is possibly a passive thing
buddha Nirvana: it happens regardless of any intent
Threedee Shepherd: Pila, the idea is that all doing involves doing something, which always has a component of physical bodily sensation
Threedee Shepherd: what might be a "passive change"? That phrase sounds like an oxymoron
Pila Mulligan: *always* has a component of physical bodily sensation?
Pila Mulligan: sleeping on an airplane ...
buddha Nirvana: i guess im saying that without any effort, things change

buddha Nirvana: i think there are levels of stillness
buddha Nirvana: just like there are components of the body/mind
buddha Nirvana: i think stillness also occurs in layers
buddha Nirvana: i'e - stillness of thought, stillness of sensation
Threedee Shepherd: All thought is about things learned in relationship to the world in the broadest sense. That learning always has a physical bodily component that is imbedded in the thought/memory when it is recalled, that is, implicit motion

Threedee Shepherd: because if there was *someone* non-corporeal in there, how could it communicate eith something corporeal. And also, who then is the someone inside that non-corporeal "little person" who does it's thinking, etc.
buddha Nirvana: is the mind*
Pila Mulligan: well, the non-corporeal someone in there communicates with the corporeal through the brain substrate, same as light communicate with the brain, by stimulating it with an external energy
Threedee Shepherd: In a manner of speaking, buddah, yes. Or from a different perspective, the sensation of brain/body is oneness that we then artificially parcel out
Pila Mulligan: no one else is inside the little fellow
Threedee Shepherd: The non-corporeal must have physical aspects (matter and/or energy) to communicate with the physical brain.
Pila Mulligan: like light , yes
Threedee Shepherd: Light is physical
Pila Mulligan: ok
Pila Mulligan: so is the little fellow then
Threedee Shepherd: and you are lost in infinite regress
Pila Mulligan: see, you are a metaphysical dude then

Pema Pera: the relationship between seeing and letting go is interesting.

Bertrum Quan: Poet Galway Kinnell has a line in a poem that comes to mind: knowing death will come, sensing its onset, may be a fair price for consciousness." But it's a very big price actually--attachment is inherent in some ways and works against seeing.
Pema Pera: unless you are not afraid of death :)

And if that didn't make you curious, i don't know what else will.  I can promise the followed discussion lives to the promise of its beginning. 

Eliza Madrigal: Breakthroughs happen in flashes, often not in "working" at things
Adams Dubrovna: yes
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Eliza Madrigal: Or, the working at things matters because of the understructure
Adams Dubrovna: but often when we are engaged
Adams Dubrovna: there seems to be some need for us to struggle sometimes
Eliza Madrigal: I agree....maybe it is the 'way' we struggle I am thinking about

Adams Dubrovna: you mean we have good struggle and bad struggle?

Eliza Madrigal: yes...more that...struggling with roots not branches as much
Adams Dubrovna: keeps us engaged

Eliza Madrigal: I think that is where we get into Play as Being and sheer appearances...dealing with the illusions as illusions...but not 'not' dealing...dealing consciously, thoughtfully, restfully even
Adams Dubrovna: wu wei :)

Adams Dubrovna: sometimes we gain insights through our work and we forget that often we get them by not working :)
Eliza Madrigal: hehe...yes....that is really what I meant...the ground preparation makes it possible to see

 

Mickorod Renard: its that monopolisation of God that brings about problems

Storm Nordwind is a polytheist. Even as a Buddhist he sees many gods. Whereas Being... how do gods fit into Being? :)
Storm Nordwind: Has anyone ever felt evangelical about Play as Being? Serious playful question! ;)
Wol Euler: I have suggested it to people, yes.

Mickorod Renard: cool,,,my surrounding family and friends just think i am nuts
Storm Nordwind: haha!
Storm Nordwind: An occupational hazard for the sincere seeker!

Sylectra Darwin: I am reading a chapter called The Nature of Reality.
Sylectra Darwin: It made me think of you, Pema.
Sylectra Darwin: He talks of a clay pot, whose existence is dependent on someone having extracted the clay and someone having formed the clay, so it doesn't really have an existence of its own.
Sylectra Darwin: And at the same time the other elements would be pointless without the end product of the clay pot.
Sylectra Darwin: Does that sound familiar?
Pema Pera: yes, codependent arising
Pema Pera: no dance without a dancer, no dancer without a dance

sophia Placebo: quen : knowladge is a placebo to cure arrogance
Constance Fairport: hi genesis
genesis Zhangsun: a wisdom placebo that eventually becomes the real thing :)

 

Adams Rubble: My adventures in PaB have been a thriller for me :)
Adams Rubble: Will I find the answer to Being before becoming a raving lunatic?
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: stay tuned....

Mickorod Renard: but if they wont accept it ,then he will have to do it again
Mickorod Renard: but worse
Wol Euler: absurd
Pila Mulligan: we don't need no thought control ....

Solobill Laville: Right, I was up in the clouds... :)
Pila Mulligan: :)
arabella Ella: nice place to be Solo :)
Solobill Laville: You don't get wet when it rains....
arabella Ella: right and u could float in a state of being comfortably numb

Geo Netizen: Peaceful of body, peaceful of speech and with mind thoroughly stilled, the one who has rid themselves of attachment to the world is called "at peace".
Geo Netizen: To act with a peaceful mind, is to draw happiness after oneself.

Geo Netizen: ’May everyone be drawn to peace, kindness, and harmony through your gentleness.’
Geo Netizen: The second part of the greeting -and good- reminds us of the source of all good.
Geo Netizen: It is a wish for good things:
Geo Netizen: that you experience the joy of a baby’s giggle,
Geo Netizen: the beauty of a vibrant landscape,
Geo Netizen: the warmth of a caring touch,
Geo Netizen: the delights of breaking bread with friends.
Geo Netizen: But more than just good things,
Geo Netizen: good means a state of well-being,
Geo Netizen: circling back to the beginning …
Geo Netizen: a deep, clear, undisturbed lake.
Geo Netizen: Pax et bonum !

Pema Pera: the wish to attain complete enlightenment (that is, Buddhahood) in order to be of benefit to all sentient beings
Pema Pera: or the instructions in airplanes: after dropping away of aircabine pressure, first put the oxygen mask on your own face, before trying to help others

Threedee Shepherd: So, I will not insist on wavelength change ^.^ I must note however, that if Shalom and Salaam meant the same thing the Middle East would be a very different place.

Threedee question about Happines and definitions follows to ideas for another theme session:

Pila Mulligan: humble monk v. cranky old guy -- 10 rounds at PaB -- in search of peace and happiness :) be there

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