2017.11.30 13:00 - Milton,life in an interesting epoch

The Guardian for this meeting was Mickorod Renard. The comments are by Mickorod Renard.

Mickorod Renard: Hi Bruce
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Mick.
Mickorod Renard: Hi Tura

Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Tura.
Tura Brezoianu: hi Mick, Bruca
Tura Brezoianu: *Bruce
Mickorod Renard: Big croud at the dreams session
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, a fine session.
Mickorod Renard: I was supprised to see Ri there
Mickorod Renard: Rhi
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, in all her glory, too.
Mickorod Renard: he he
Bruce Mowbray: 
Mickorod Renard: can u excuse me..a sec
Bruce Mowbray: Eliza invited her.
Mickorod Renard: kids upstairs going mad
Bruce Mowbray: np. Take your time.
Tura Brezoianu: I hadn't met her before
Bruce Mowbray: She used to run a philosophy group - don't know if she still does.
Bruce Mowbray: afk for just a sec....
Mickorod Renard: ok back
Mickorod Renard: I still get her reminder to the sessions Bruce
Mickorod Renard: so she is still doing it
Mickorod Renard: I havnt been to one in a while now
Bruce Mowbray: [back]
Mickorod Renard: hiya
Bruce Mowbray: I must have dropped out of that group and forgotten about it.
Mickorod Renard: Hi eliza
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Eliza.
Mickorod Renard: nice outfit
Eliza Madrigal: Howdy, sorry to be late... a little sticky
Eliza Madrigal: Thanks :)
Mickorod Renard: no worries, we havnt started
Mickorod Renard: just commenting on the dreams turnout
Bleu Oleander: 's current display-name is "Bleu".
Mickorod Renard: Hi Bleu
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bleu Oleander: hi all :)
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bleu
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Bleu.
Mickorod Renard: I been running around whipping kids to sleep
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Agatha :)
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, aggers.
Mickorod Renard: Hi Ags
Bleu Oleander: hey Aggers
Agatha Macbeth: Evening all
Eliza Madrigal: I'm a little drained today
Mickorod Renard: me too
Bleu Oleander: me too!
Eliza Madrigal: but happy to be here with you all replenishing company
Agatha Macbeth: Better than being a big drain!
Eliza Madrigal: aw
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: I managed to get to the bottom of ten washing machine loads
Agatha Macbeth: But you're still dreamy...that's what's what counts
Agatha Macbeth: 0.0
Eliza Madrigal: ^^
Agatha Macbeth: That's a big washing machine
Agatha Macbeth: Are you cleaning for an army?
Eliza Madrigal: 10...sort of an army.... children's clothes
Agatha Macbeth: Erk
Mickorod Renard: washing from trip and then I found I had inherited washing from the live in while away freezer emptying family
Eliza Madrigal: oooh
Mickorod Renard: :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)

We start on Paradise lost

Mickorod Renard: anywayzzzz..anyone got a report?
Bruce Mowbray listens
Agatha Macbeth: Brucie probably has
Agatha Macbeth: Aww
Bruce Mowbray: nope, not today. sry.
Mickorod Renard: I made up a quick emergency one
Agatha Macbeth: Curses
Agatha Macbeth: Yay
Eliza Madrigal: great
Mickorod Renard: which we could expand on
Bleu Oleander: listens
Mickorod Renard: ok,,here it comes
Agatha Macbeth ducks
Mickorod Renard: Chapter 10, a wonderful part of the book. Full of rich history and the period that Milton lived in was so vibrant and crazy. I loved the story of his life and the twists and turns that he experienced
Mickorod Renard: i also found the method that he wrote the paradise lost so intriguing as it reminded me of how my period of rich dreaming had permitted me to write up such facinating recals as if it had been done by another hand. i wondered too about how much folk had searched and pondered Genesis even tho its not huge.
Mickorod Renard: done
Eliza Madrigal: nice, ty Mick
Bleu Oleander: I too found his process intriguing
Mickorod Renard: any thoughts on that?

Bleu Oleander: his blindness perhaps like sleep/dreams
Bleu Oleander: his rich inner world
Eliza Madrigal: to me, it is yet another story of amrit vela, although I keep considering how in all the stories of dream insights and dream books, there was already a rich and active mind...
Eliza Madrigal: so the quote "Inspiration exists but must find you working" is what I take from that.
Eliza Madrigal: Picasso?
Mickorod Renard: I guess, as it said he listened to poetry each night,,and his mind must have been full of genesis..it came together..and became overriding in his dream state
Eliza Madrigal: and I guess blindness would cure whatever distractions there were
Bleu Oleander: at least visual ones
Eliza Madrigal: and obligations
Mickorod Renard: no wife..children older
Bleu Oleander: in many ways if I close my eyes, my mind seems more active
Mickorod Renard: I wonder what I would occupy my mind with if I became blind?
Eliza Madrigal: it makes sense really
Bruce Mowbray agrees with Bleu --- There's a whole lot of internal stuff going on.
Eliza Madrigal: like turning into the theater
Mickorod Renard: yes, nice thought
Eliza Madrigal: he chose an interesting muse
Mickorod Renard: gosh, reminded me of that dream where my head became a theatre
Eliza Madrigal: don't remember that one!
Mickorod Renard: I think it was the beginning of the equanamity dream
Bleu Oleander: the theatre of the mind
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Mickorod Renard: i remembered the word
Eliza Madrigal: >woot<
Eliza Madrigal: Ramanujan (sp?) also had a muse...
Eliza Madrigal: or goddess?
Mickorod Renard: I found the deram,,wow its wierd to read it again
Agatha Macbeth listens
Agatha Macbeth: Oops
Agatha Macbeth: Cheers Mick
Mickorod Renard: just funny to read the beginning
Agatha Macbeth: You would be in a pub :p
Mickorod Renard: yeh, but it started in my skull as a hollowed out tavern then turns into a theatre for a play
Mickorod Renard: he he
Mickorod Renard: hope Eliza is ok
Agatha Macbeth: Maybe more bad weather
Agatha Macbeth: That's amazing
Agatha Macbeth: Why don't I have dreams like that
Mickorod Renard: I was facinated that he was around at the same time as Cromwell and Shakespeare
Agatha Macbeth: Yay
Tura Brezoianu: wb Eliza
Bruce Mowbray: wb Eliza.
Agatha Macbeth: WB Liz
Bleu Oleander: wb!
Eliza Madrigal: Hi, sorry about that. Am glitchy today
Mickorod Renard: wb Liz
Bleu Oleander: a lot going on in England then
Mickorod Renard: at the time yes
Mickorod Renard: when I read the stories at that time it always sounds so humourous but it must have been terifying
Bleu Oleander: contrast with what was going on in America then
Mickorod Renard: I was trying to think where Usa was then
Bleu Oleander: Pilgrims, Puritans ... was just read about that time
Agatha Macbeth: Has it moved?
Mickorod Renard: he he
Agatha Macbeth: There goes Liz again
Mickorod Renard: it has in a way,,sort of moved away from the UK..in so many ways
Tura Brezoianu: 1492: Columbus. 1776: Independence. I don't know anything of what happened in between
Bleu Oleander: Puritans 1630
Bleu Oleander: tough times prior to 1776
Mickorod Renard: when was Milton ? in date
Bleu Oleander: Milton 1608-1674
Mickorod Renard: ty
Bleu Oleander: PL 1667 I think
Mickorod Renard: so just before Newton and so forth
Bleu Oleander: Martin Luther 1483-1546 ... big influence
Tura Brezoianu: Difficult for a prominent person to keep his head on his shoulders during all the changes
Mickorod Renard: a crazy time..politically and religiously and in everyway
Bleu Oleander: interesting new book, "fantasyland" ... tells a story of america starting with Luther
Mickorod Renard: Its amazing he managed to escape from being lynched
Bleu Oleander: crazy times indeed
Mickorod Renard: have all here read the whole book yet?
Bleu Oleander: yes
Bruce Mowbray: I've not finished it yet.
Mickorod Renard: I still have a very small bit to finnish
Tura Brezoianu: I've read the next couple of chapters
Mickorod Renard: I wish I had more chance to read
Mickorod Renard: as well as all the other things I want to do
Mickorod Renard: did someone mention Eddison the other day? sleeping only 3 hours a day
Agatha Macbeth: Maybe he left the light bulb on
Bruce Mowbray: :)
Mickorod Renard: when I slept about that long I read tons of books
Mickorod Renard: until i went mad
Bleu Oleander: ha!
Bleu Oleander: brb
Tura Brezoianu: I buy books faster than I read them. I'll have to live forever to read them all.
Mickorod Renard: its a great way to experience the halucinagenic nature of the mind,,sleep deprivation
Mickorod Renard: he he Tura..nice collection u will have tho
Tura Brezoianu: my bookshelves are my to-read pile
Agatha Macbeth: Snap
Mickorod Renard: I had boxes of inheritted books that I munched through,,the only ones I was sad I hadnt inherited were my mums dickens collection
Bleu Oleander: I struggle to read all the books I buy ... but do mostly manage eventually
Mickorod Renard: yayyy,eliza is back
Bruce Mowbray: wb Eliza
Tura Brezoianu: wb2
Mickorod Renard: Hi Liz..again and again
Eliza Madrigal tries tries again
Bleu Oleander: ugh
Agatha Macbeth: WB x 2
Eliza Madrigal: (if I poof again, thanks for a lovely session, lol)
Mickorod Renard: whats happening Eliza? bad weather?
Eliza Madrigal: firestorm I think, but actually the whole computer froze the last time
Eliza Madrigal: thank goodness for the logs :)
Mickorod Renard: ah..I saw some link about if u r running intel graphics the other day
Eliza Madrigal: I did have 20 bazillion tabs open....
Mickorod Renard: wondered whether to follow it
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bleu Oleander: 20 bazillion tabs ... not a quiet mind!
Mickorod Renard: 20 bazillion is lots
Eliza Madrigal: hahah
Mickorod Renard: thats multitasking
Bleu Oleander: how do you square that with meditation? :)
Eliza Madrigal: I keep saving science articles that are over my head... with the determination not to do anything else but spend a day reading and understanding them
Mickorod Renard: anyone any more to say re the Milton?
Mickorod Renard: sorry eliza..listens
Eliza Madrigal: no no, sorry to be a disruption
Mickorod Renard: I used to have the science journal and loved it,,but it started to get sameness
Eliza Madrigal: also with work projects I have have lots of docs open at once all the time
Mickorod Renard: it was new scientist
Eliza Madrigal: so many neat happenings
Eliza Madrigal: can't keep up :)
Bruce Mowbray: (FINE magazine!)
Bleu Oleander: yes coming fast and furious
Eliza Madrigal: but did you know that scallops have eyes? lol https://www.theatlantic.com/science/...mirror/547115/ (for later)
Bleu Oleander: I hang out with lots of scientists who keep me updated ... much easier than reading all those articles
Eliza Madrigal: maybe there is a science dating site where I could meet someone who would just explain them to me as pillow talk every night... lollol
Bleu Oleander: yes!
Mickorod Renard: mmmm not sure I am into scallops
Mickorod Renard: Eliza....you have shocked me
Eliza Madrigal laughs
Mickorod Renard: :)
Bleu Oleander: LOL
Agatha Macbeth: Scallops are cute
Eliza Madrigal: I really am interested in the chapter today though... maybe will try to make some comments when I read the session
Bruce Mowbray: https://phys.org/news/2017-11-scallo...telescope.html
Eliza Madrigal: oh no another tab
Eliza Madrigal: :)))
Bleu Oleander: these guys eyes are fascinating .... http://phenomena.nationalgeographic....a-bit-weirder/
Bruce Mowbray: Thanks, everyone. I will do a better job of reading for Monday.
Bleu Oleander: sorry, another tab ha!
Tura Brezoianu: The eyes have it
Eliza Madrigal: bye Bruce!
Agatha Macbeth: Eye eye
Mickorod Renard: thanks Bruce
Bleu Oleander: bye Bruce
Agatha Macbeth: Scrape well Brucie
Bruce Mowbray: OK.
Eliza Madrigal: I'm going to freeze up again
Mickorod Renard: yes, it was a good chapter,,but i think we are still in vacance mode
Eliza Madrigal: but there has been a lot of dark matter news lately
Eliza Madrigal: vacance?
Agatha Macbeth: Get nearer the fire
Mickorod Renard: ah I love that
Bleu Oleander: next monday, ch 11?
Mickorod Renard: yep
Mickorod Renard: do we need to announce it?
Bleu Oleander: just did?
Mickorod Renard: he he
Mickorod Renard: ty
Mickorod Renard: ok,,dark matter then
Mickorod Renard: as a follow up subject
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Tura Brezoianu: dark materials
Bleu Oleander: think "axions"
Eliza Madrigal: !
Agatha Macbeth: Dark matter
Mickorod Renard: maybe Pema might come and give us an update on it?
Eliza Madrigal: don't think so ... actually he prob won't come back into SL
Mickorod Renard: ok,,we have to solve it ourselves then
Eliza Madrigal: likelier to see him in RL
Eliza Madrigal: it feels like the discoveries are moving fast
Bleu Oleander: yes
Mickorod Renard: do you think its a mathematical problem or a philosophical question?
Eliza Madrigal: I think the knowledge is practical, but has lots of philosophical implications
Bleu Oleander: have to take the math into reality
Eliza Madrigal nods
Mickorod Renard: mmmm..and will it be quantum mechs or string or what?
Eliza Madrigal: actually pema has been writing these blogs for yhouse, about how science is often not taught well in schools because the thinking is that you have to have the math first
Mickorod Renard: good point
Eliza Madrigal: when you can talk about concepts and insights before understanding nuts n bolts
Bleu Oleander: I don't think that's always the case
Bleu Oleander: the math first
Eliza Madrigal: was the case for me, but not always for my daughters
Mickorod Renard: there have been savants,,who can come up with stuff without understanding how
Bleu Oleander: can't go by what school was for us ... changes so fast
Eliza Madrigal nods
Eliza Madrigal: I think that's basically true now
Eliza Madrigal: but a lot of people will be limited in interest by whether teachers have enthusiasm?
Eliza Madrigal: if they have enthusiasm then the insights will be conveyed somewhat naturally
Bleu Oleander: yes
Mickorod Renard: its moving the mass of students along the same path,,like drifting logs down a river
Bleu Oleander: probably should pay teachers more :)
Eliza Madrigal: yes, both
Tura Brezoianu: students as drifting logs :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: teachers still have to address the bulk of the class..only chance is to recognise individuals
Agatha Macbeth: Wonder if anyone will claim them?
Eliza Madrigal: there is often a school cuture
Eliza Madrigal: so different from school to school
Bleu Oleander: school shouldn
Bleu Oleander: shouldn't end with college
Bleu Oleander: too much to learn after that
Eliza Madrigal: some of us start then :)
Bleu Oleander: should be mandatory every 5 years an update LOL
Mickorod Renard: its never ending..I am stuill learning..more so in fact
Bleu Oleander: yes
Mickorod Renard: and yet I am shelved now,,finnished
Eliza Madrigal: the early years are a lot about the ground.... but if that isn't enriched then it is so much harder
Eliza Madrigal: shelved?
Mickorod Renard: yes, just passing time
Eliza Madrigal: no way :) you have little ones now
Bleu Oleander: teach process not so much facts
Eliza Madrigal nods
Mickorod Renard: :)
Mickorod Renard: thats interesting Bleyu
Bleu Oleander: or get a "muse" :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)))
Bleu Oleander: ok ... on that note ... must get going
Eliza Madrigal: I believe in muses :)
Bleu Oleander: take care all
Eliza Madrigal: bye Bleu
Bleu Oleander: bye bye
Agatha Macbeth: TC Bleuji
Mickorod Renard: I am now teaching fractions to 7 year old,,I thought it young
Mickorod Renard: bye Bleu
Tura Brezoianu: bye Bleu
Agatha Macbeth: We still have fractions?
Eliza Madrigal: was probably young before
Eliza Madrigal: lol Agatha
Mickorod Renard: yeh, common denominators etc
Agatha Macbeth: Riiight
Agatha Macbeth: Brings back memories
Mickorod Renard: I just vthink 7 year olds are not up for it yet
Eliza Madrigal: I tried to buy story books about math when the kids were little
Agatha Macbeth: So hard to type them tho
Mickorod Renard: yeh, there are non
Agatha Macbeth: 1/2 3/4 etc
Mickorod Renard: alice in wonderland etc were about maths
Eliza Madrigal: few, but I did find some... pythagoras stories and that kinds of thing
Agatha Macbeth: Not as easy as 0.5 or 0.75
Eliza Madrigal: kind*
Tura Brezoianu: pizza slices might be a teaching opportunity
Eliza Madrigal: and good excuse to eat pizza :)
Agatha Macbeth: No chance...I'd eat them
Agatha Macbeth: Shap
Agatha Macbeth: Snap
Mickorod Renard: yes, thats what I always do..relate to cakes or pizza
Agatha Macbeth: Rather
Eliza Madrigal grins
Agatha Macbeth: 'Eat the evidence'
Eliza Madrigal: hands on learning
Mickorod Renard: I enjoyed pythogoras..but never calculus
Agatha Macbeth: P rocks
Eliza Madrigal: my math is embarrassingly limited... thankfully they surpassed me, but at times it does present challenges
Mickorod Renard: I dont even know if they use log rythms these days
Agatha Macbeth: Big Brother thought 2+2=5
Mickorod Renard: prob does in quantum mechs
Agatha Macbeth: Or string theory
Agatha Macbeth: Or Schrödinger's dog
Tura Brezoianu: no-one uses logs for calculation any more, but they're still important in mathematics
Agatha Macbeth: Napier's bones
Mickorod Renard: he he
Tura Brezoianu remembers making a set of those
Eliza Madrigal: ah, that's right we're talking about your specialty Tura, right?
Tura Brezoianu: yes, I studied maths at university, and it's what I do in my job ever since
Mickorod Renard: I was born in the wrong era..I needed to be in the age of the computer..or calculator
Agatha Macbeth hands you an abacus
Eliza Madrigal: actually I think the point Pema has been making about science could probably be made for math as well... that the insights can be taught before nuts n bolts at times?
Mickorod Renard: it was culculus that made me drop out of school
Eliza Madrigal: the calculus filter... no tutors Mick?
Mickorod Renard: I went inside myself and ran away
Mickorod Renard: literally
Eliza Madrigal relates
Mickorod Renard: police searching for me
Eliza Madrigal: I think that happens a lot
Agatha Macbeth: And started dreaming of French women
Eliza Madrigal: what?
Eliza Madrigal: you ran away over calculus?
Mickorod Renard: yes
Eliza Madrigal: you could write a math story about that :))
Agatha Macbeth: Be on the lookout for a guy on a motorcycle
Eliza Madrigal: for your grandchildren...
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: I was too young foor a mcycle..i was found at my girlfriends tho
Eliza Madrigal: didn't think that one through
Agatha Macbeth: She grassed you up?
Mickorod Renard: she did,,she was put under pressure at school,,
Agatha Macbeth: Women eh
Mickorod Renard: he he
Eliza Madrigal: ah
Mickorod Renard: I was only 15
Eliza Madrigal: funny, Agatha
Mickorod Renard: sweet 15
Mickorod Renard: with spots
Eliza Madrigal: tempted to be free of math
Mickorod Renard: yes
Mickorod Renard: and the cruel world
Mickorod Renard: as a kid we had great fun with apples and gravity
Eliza Madrigal: guess girlfriend wasn't good at calculus... that might have been a solution
Eliza Madrigal: you were actually in a glass house?
Eliza Madrigal shakes head, laughing
Eliza Madrigal: young newton
Eliza Madrigal: Mick's text book for hoodlums
Eliza Madrigal: actually there was this great book I read when the kids were little, called The Teenage Liberation Handbook... had a subversive sort of feeling and pointers to interesting resources
Eliza Madrigal: feeling of taking one's learning in one's own hands
Eliza Madrigal: they were a little young for me to be trying to get them excited by feynman though
Eliza Madrigal: you seem to have Mick
Eliza Madrigal: and kept yourself alive somehow too
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Tura Brezoianu: time to be going
Tura Brezoianu: goodnight everyone
Eliza Madrigal: me too..... computer unstuck but hungry :)
Eliza Madrigal: Night Tura
Eliza Madrigal: thanks for lingering
Eliza Madrigal: feel like I've been to session now
Eliza Madrigal: bye <3 ty
Eliza Madrigal: ♥ ♥ ♥

Eliza Madrigal: ♥ ♥ ♥