The Guardian for this meeting was Mickorod Renard. Eliza, who thankfully does not have zika virus, posted this session and appreciates the well wishes. <3 LOVEly session!

Reference page for this Time Space Knowledge session: 2016.09.01 - Wonderment is the Presence

Wonderment is the presence, the presenting, the appreciation of reality as
Being. All appearance is sheer art, beautiful beyond enduring, appealing
beyond all possiblity of possession. It cannot be posessed but it is entirely
accessible. The treasure which our being preserves for us is like an ever-
present nectar; it is like an inexaustible kingdom which is always open to
us. [Kindle 2554]

Bleu Oleander: hi Mick :)
Mickorod Renard: Hi Bleu
Mickorod Renard: :)
Mickorod Renard: how are you?
Bleu Oleander: pretty good, you?
Mickorod Renard: great, I am good too thanlks
Bleu Oleander: hi Eliza!
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Mick, Bleu
Mickorod Renard: Hi Eliza
Mickorod Renard: howz ur flu?
Eliza Madrigal: I am not able to stay today.... woozy headed
Bleu Oleander: awww, sorry to hear
Mickorod Renard: owwww :(
Eliza Madrigal: just saw a message from Tura also, that she will be away until the 10th...
Bleu Oleander: chicken soup!
Eliza Madrigal: I made this great ginger soup for my grandfather a few weeks ago, and thankfully had some frozen still
Bleu Oleander: is next week our last one?
Mickorod Renard: I see there is a huricane your way Eliza?
Eliza Madrigal: yes, unless you count the retreat session
Eliza Madrigal: hurricane is on FL west coast and I'm on east
Mickorod Renard: ah great

Bleu Oleander: how will the retreat session differ from the reg sessions?
Eliza Madrigal: so have friends getting ready for that
Eliza Madrigal: just that we'll try to do an exploration on the spot
Eliza Madrigal: or maybe two if it feels natural to
Bleu Oleander: ah ok I see
Eliza Madrigal: would love suggestions for which or how
Bleu Oleander: will think about that :)
Eliza Madrigal: and everyone can say anything they'd like to about the whole adventure
Bleu Oleander: hi Kori :)
Eliza Madrigal: sorry to dwindle right before ending... and I really like this exercise this week, so bummed not to spend more time with it in session....
Mickorod Renard: Hi Kori
Korel Laloix: Osiyo
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Kori
Eliza Madrigal: but I'll try to write something on my own when head clears
Mickorod Renard: well, we will cope somehow :)..he he
Eliza Madrigal: has been a crazy few days
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Bleu Oleander: well, hope you feel better and take care of yourself!
Mickorod Renard: I wrote something up earlier
Eliza Madrigal: it is quite a tangible one.... have had the experience of, well... will write
Mickorod Renard: yes, thats the main thing,,get yourself well again
Mickorod Renard: Hi Brucie
Bleu Oleander: hi Bruce
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bruce, and bye everyone <3 thanks so much and see you soon
Mickorod Renard: see you
Bleu Oleander: take care!
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Eliza and everyone.
Korel Laloix: Heya
Eliza Madrigal: thankx
Mickorod Renard: Eliza is poorly
Mickorod Renard: so she has nipped off
Bleu Oleander: the flu is a yucky thing to deal with!
Bruce Mowbray: Oh dear. I hope she doesn't have that horrible Zika thing.
Mickorod Renard: yes for sure..I have been lucky these last few years to escape it
Bruce Mowbray knocks on wood.
Mickorod Renard: same here
Bruce Mowbray: :)
Mickorod Renard: yes, that zika is a bit scary
Bleu Oleander: hi San, Riddle :)
Bruce Mowbray: Well, they keep finding more cases of it around Miami.
Mickorod Renard: Hi riddle
Riddle Sideways: hi All
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Riddle.
Bleu Oleander: Eliza has the flu and won't be here today
Mickorod Renard: Hi San
Bruce Mowbray: Hi, San-ji.
Riddle Sideways: hope it is not zeka(sp?)
Riddle Sideways: hope she is not preggers
Mickorod Renard: yes, we will have to sort ourselves out today
Korel Laloix: The big issues with Zika is that most people that have it dont show much if any symptoms.
Bruce Mowbray: ahhh.
Bleu Oleander: that's a nice seat for you San with your wings :)
Bruce Mowbray: So they could pass it along without knowing.
Mickorod Renard: oh..thats a bit ghastly
Korel Laloix: Exactly... or at least be a feeding ground for a vctor.
Mickorod Renard: I was in Brazil earlier this year too
Bruce Mowbray: Oh dear. Don't bite me, Mick.
Mickorod Renard: he he

Mickorod Renard: well..how did everyone get on with the tsk this week?
Bleu Oleander: brb, call I need to take, so sorry
Korel Laloix: And we have plenty of people coming across the border into the US that carry it as well..
Mickorod Renard: anyone any reportage?
Mickorod Renard: np Bleu
Mickorod Renard: from mexicao Korel?
Mickorod Renard: I did do a prepared write up on what i read of tsk this week
Korel Laloix: Yes.
Bruce Mowbray: I don't have a report, but I do have a thought.
Bruce Mowbray listens for more from Mick.
Mickorod Renard: yay, I am sure we would love to hear your thoughts bruce
Mickorod Renard: ok,,lets toss a coin..he he
Bruce Mowbray: Well, my thought is very brief.
Mickorod Renard: sh''ok Bruce,,go for it
Bruce Mowbray: OK.
Mickorod Renard: :)

Bruce

Bruce Mowbray: As I finised reading the book,
Bruce Mowbray: I kept feeling some resonance with Western traditions,
Bruce Mowbray: but I couldn't place it exactly.
Bruce Mowbray: This may be way off-base,
Bruce Mowbray: and I'm sure there would be many differences,
Bruce Mowbray: but (and I say this as one who values the teachings of Jesus far too highly to call myself Christian)...
Bruce Mowbray: the resonance that i finally came up with was 1 Corinthians Chap 13:
Bruce Mowbray: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage...Corinthians+13
Mickorod Renard: shall we have a mo to look?
Bruce Mowbray: For sure there are differences, but that's what was resonating in my head all week as I finished the book.
Bruce Mowbray: [done]

--BELL--

Riddle Sideways: reads and then sings "All you need is Love ..."
Bruce Mowbray: La ta ta ta tahhhh Hums along.
Mickorod Renard: thats a nice link Bruce

Mickorod Renard: funnily enough, I too wrote some about love
Bruce Mowbray: Does Great Knowledge = Love?
Bruce Mowbray listens for more from Mick. Go for it, Mick.
Mickorod Renard: I think there is something about love that we often lose sight of,,prefering possession instead
Mickorod Renard: I will do mine then
Bleu Oleander: (sorry, must slip out, this will take longer than I realized)
Mickorod Renard: its a few mins long,,please be patient
Santoshima Resident: bye bleu
Mickorod Renard: ok Bleu..no worries
Bruce Mowbray is in no hurry.

Mick

Mickorod Renard: I was part way through chapter 14 and drawn to the 'culprit in our studies'..its the 'motion' of 'time'. I wanted to comprehend this..so I read on.
Mickorod Renard: I still couldn't grasp it but the chapter went on talking about our tendency to label everything. I recall some of this during other ,past, studies of tsk. Pema was often talking of our tendency to label things. I understood some of this, at least in my thinking, which may be wrong.
Mickorod Renard: I was drawn to a dream I had once presented to the dream sessions some time ago. It tied into what was being spoken of in this chapter further along, in relation to love and its positive and negative side.
Mickorod Renard: The dream I had had, allowed me to experience love 'with a woman ' without all the clutter and baggage (maybe labels too) that we often experience in relationships. The experience in the dream was revelationary to me...no contesting,no jealousy, no fears of deceptions etc...just complete trust and honesty. The freedom from the baggage allowed a sort of quality that rather than risked loss provided so much more.I am sure I can find an old copy of the dream should anyone want to read it.

Bruce Mowbray: In your understanding, Mick, would labels be comparable to TSK's "focal settings" -- and freezing?
Mickorod Renard: I was also drawn to a sort of short sightedness. Of forgetting how we do have ups and downs which are natural cycles and yet rather than see the overwhelming positiveness of life we focus more on the downs and allow them to dictate how we feel and see.
Mickorod Renard: not sure Bruce
Mickorod Renard: I fell into a day dream...I was in a zoo...I was outside the lions cage and there sat a lovely friendly lion...i entered the caged area and the lion decided he liked me so much he wouldn't let me go...I thought about how trapped I felt and how I now couldn't experience seeing the other animals and gardens. Maybe I shouldn't have wanted the lion so much.
Bruce Mowbray: !!
Mickorod Renard: 'The self seeks to love and this shows it is not in love'...mmmm thoughtful 'We are then truly in love, and this love is itself not a possession but a gift, enjoyed and shared within 'knowingness'........reminded me of what a vicar once said about ones children..ie your children are gifts lent for a period to be looked after.
Santoshima Resident: Gibran

Mickorod Renard: should I stop here..I did some of chapter 15 too..but maybe later?
Bruce Mowbray: Wonderful report, Mick.
Mickorod Renard: thankyou..just ramblings but as they are felt at the time
Santoshima Resident: thank you
Santoshima Resident: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ti0rzHq_0xU
Santoshima Resident: for later
Mickorod Renard: I struggled with chapter 15
Mickorod Renard: but i dont know if what I said about love resonated with anyone
Riddle Sideways: :) thank you, San. so love Sweet Honey In The Rock
Santoshima Resident: me too

Mickorod Renard: I felt like I had missed the point of love after I had had the dream
Mickorod Renard: meaning,,we often get caught up in lifes complexities too much..and miss the beauty

Mickorod Renard: hello

Bruce Mowbray: Simplify simplify simplify? -- Thoreau

--BELL--

Riddle Sideways: sorry, was caught up in no complexities of what you said
Mickorod Renard: I have bad lag and thought I had crashed
Mickorod Renard: :)
Mickorod Renard: I felt as though Bruce has something re love
Mickorod Renard: I haven't got to the end yet
Mickorod Renard: of the tsk book
Mickorod Renard: But love has these values in them,,as tsk has brought up..like trust etc
Mickorod Renard: when one is emersed in love then other trivialities fall away

Mickorod Renard: does anyone else have any offerings?
Bruce Mowbray: But every "triviality" is also a potential gate for entering Great Knowledge... if I'm understanding TSK rightly.
Bruce Mowbray: Every point is all points, as TSK says.
Bruce Mowbray listens.
Mickorod Renard: well, its odd in a way..maybe triviality is the wrong word..as in an other way it almost suggests that all should be looked at in a light fashion i think
Bruce Mowbray: a playful lightness. Yes.
Mickorod Renard: perhaps we put too much emphasis in individual things and miss the whole

Bruce Mowbray: Did your lion want to play, Mick?
Mickorod Renard: well, the lion was more like a possessive trap
Bruce Mowbray: Ahhh.
Mickorod Renard: so I was greedy at wanting to get to the lion and at my end expense
Bruce Mowbray: I "hear" a lot of resonances with Suzuki's "Beginner's Mind" and Zen's "no mind" also.
Santoshima Resident: yes
Bruce Mowbray: "Relax, everything's out of control!"
Mickorod Renard: I also noticed that the writer refers to the dificulties of the practice or even non practice as' we' which made me think it isnt a practice we can be 'in' all the time
Bruce Mowbray: would you agree that TSK's vision is enormously (infinitely?) positive and optimistic?
Mickorod Renard: this modern world is quite distracting
Mickorod Renard: I personnaly am torn..between a temptation of utopic positivness on offer...he he ..and the ensuing drama of everyday life

Bruce Mowbray: --- Do you feel that the TSK vision is not suited to the "modern world," then?
Mickorod Renard: :)

--BELL--

Bruce Mowbray: perhaps I should not say "the" vision, but "a TSK vision..."
Mickorod Renard: I am trying to find a means to holding onto those sweet moments among the crazy everyday antics
Bruce Mowbray: I don't find TSK to be utopian as much as ecstatic.
Mickorod Renard: I feel someone must manage it
Bruce Mowbray: "control it"?
Mickorod Renard: well,,thats such an interesting question Bruce
Bruce Mowbray: Hmmm. Listens.....
Mickorod Renard: maybe its the letting go that delvers the tsk to ones self
Bruce Mowbray: I think so, Mick.
Bruce Mowbray: but it is a gift, not a purchase.
Mickorod Renard: but modern life has ...me for eg..in a state of controlling all the time
Bruce Mowbray nods, empathizes.
Mickorod Renard: yes, a gift,,but to pick it up seems to be at a cost of letting everything else go
Bruce Mowbray ponders the "joys" of a solitary, hermitish, rural life....
Mickorod Renard: if only I could manage both..he he
Bruce Mowbray nods.

Bruce Mowbray: Can you build yourself a private bubble, Mick? One that honors your own needs, and one that would be respected by those around you?
Bruce Mowbray: A safe bubble, perhaps.
Mickorod Renard: its hard..for me..but I look for that bubble
Bruce Mowbray: A "container" --- in which you could attend to your own needs and desires for a while, unencumbered by the needs of those around you....
Mickorod Renard: it must be similar for others too
Mickorod Renard: when in france I started to build my own little chapel ..for a place of sanctury
Bruce Mowbray: My whole "context" seems to be such a container ---- but it's not always pleasant. Solitude can bring out one's demons, of course.
Bruce Mowbray: Wonderful, Mick.
Mickorod Renard: but now I find moments when I go riding motorbikes or similar
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Bruce Mowbray: Long solitary walks do it for me.
Mickorod Renard: yes, there is a need to feel loved too
Mickorod Renard: but that was refered to in the tsk book
Bruce Mowbray: Yes. I feel we all need that feeling.

Riddle Sideways: hmmm, back .. was off in everyday task of listening to Old Cat (20) who insisted on having Love right now! So, get on the floor and rub the soft fur and tune in the purrs. was that part of TSK?
Mickorod Renard: The self seeks to love and this shows it is not in love'...mmmm thoughtful
Riddle Sideways: is there a place for cat purring in your world
Mickorod Renard: yes, for sure
Bruce Mowbray: I get the notion that the TSK vision is saying that reality is big enough and strong enough to "hold" whatever we need to let go of, and also providential enough to supply whatever we need.
Bruce Mowbray: Nothing is lacking, and nothing is in excess.
Mickorod Renard: I think it is true Bruce...but changing a habit of a lifetime,,and with associated attached responsibilities...makes it hard,,without hurting people

Bruce Mowbray: Alas. A quiet session today. I do hope Eliza is healing well and soon. Happiness to you all. I am off to scrape up supper.
Bruce Mowbray: I understand, Mick.
Bruce Mowbray: (me too on that one.)
Mickorod Renard: wow,,hour up
Santoshima Resident: nicely said, bruce ~ enjoy your supper ~ good to see you
Mickorod Renard: bye Bruce,,and thankyou
Bruce Mowbray: Bye for now, good people.
Santoshima Resident: ty ~ bye eveyone
Santoshima Resident: r
Riddle Sideways: ok, back to sweet honey
Mickorod Renard: Thankyou to everyone for being here
Riddle Sideways: thanks All
Mickorod Renard: see you all next week
Mickorod Renard: :)