2016.01.22 13:00 - Kaffir, Koans and Debauched Ariastocrats

The Guardian for this meeting was Aphrodite Macbain. The comments are by Aphrodite Macbain.

Aphrodite Macbain: Hiiiiya
Bruce Mowbray: Hiiiiiiya!
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)

Healthy eating
Bruce Mowbray eyes cookie jar.
Aphrodite Macbain: Time to have lunch?
Bruce Mowbray: I've been munching on nuts ever since the voice session today.
Aphrodite Macbain: have one!
Aphrodite Macbain: sounds healthy
Aphrodite Macbain: better than cookies
Bruce Mowbray: yes... no more crackers or sugary stuff for moi.
Bruce Mowbray: except in SL, of course.
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
Aphrodite Macbain: are you gaining weight?
Bruce Mowbray: Not really.... trying to lose a bit, maybe.
Bruce Mowbray: I can't get as much exercise as I used to, so cutting down on food intake is good.
Aphrodite Macbain: I'm starting to swallow probiotics and fermented foods
Aphrodite Macbain: like Kambucha amd Keffir
Bruce Mowbray: Ahhh!
Aphrodite Macbain: apparently it helps with digestion
Bruce Mowbray: Hmmm.
Aphrodite Macbain: and helps weight loss
Aphrodite Macbain: something I have been trying to accomplish for years now
Bruce Mowbray: What's that yellow stuff . . . ?
Bruce Mowbray: I used to put it on chicken.
Aphrodite Macbain: mustard?
Bruce Mowbray: nope, it's supposed to help with digestion, too....
Aphrodite Macbain: no idea...
Bruce Mowbray: can't think of the word.... from India, I think.
Aphrodite Macbain: apparently we have literally billions of bacteria in our gut...
Bruce Mowbray: yeppers. and I've given all of them names.
Aphrodite Macbain: so this stuff aids and abets them
Aphrodite Macbain: lol
Bruce Mowbray: Yogurt is also good for that...
Bruce Mowbray: and acidophelis
Aphrodite Macbain: yes- has probiotics too
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Aphrodite Macbain: acidophilus and another kind of philus
Bruce Mowbray: Probiotics simply means that it's living, right?
 Aphrodite Macbain: not sure. Sounds very positive though, doesn't it?
Bruce Mowbray: I will look it up.....
Bruce Mowbray: yes, very "PRO"
Aphrodite Macbain: aids biotics
Bruce Mowbray: Probiotics are live bacteria and yeasts that are good for your health, especially your digestive system. We usually think of bacteria as something that causes diseases. But your body is full of bacteria, both good and bad. Probiotics are often called "good" or "helpful" bacteria because they help keep your gut healthy.
Aphrodite Macbain: listens
Aphrodite Macbain: makes sense
Bruce Mowbray: I've heard it said that Oreos are good for guts, too.
Bruce Mowbray: esp. for avatars.
Bruce Mowbray: and chocolate chip cookies.
Aphrodite Macbain: and the fermented food like sauerkraut, and Keffir, help with the yeast bacteria
Bruce Mowbray: THAT is ELEPHANTASTIC!
Bruce Mowbray: _____
Bruce Mowbray: / 0 \____
Bruce Mowbray: / _ \__/ \
Bruce Mowbray: / / \ ____ I \
Bruce Mowbray: /_/ I I I I
Bruce Mowbray: I__I I__I
Bruce Mowbray:
Bruce Mowbray: I love sauerkraut.
Aphrodite Macbain: oreoreorios
Bruce Mowbray: Oreos spelled backward is soerO!
Aphrodite Macbain: I have just eaten an Italian sausage and beetroot sauerkraut
Bruce Mowbray: YUM YUM!
Aphrodite Macbain: yummers
Aphrodite Macbain: and of course mustard
Bruce Mowbray: I have sausage and sauerkraut every New Years Day.
Bruce Mowbray: and mustard, of course.
Aphrodite Macbain: Oh? Is it some kind of tradition?
Bruce Mowbray: Now I'm getting hungry!
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, it is a tradition.
Aphrodite Macbain: have a cookie
Bruce Mowbray: another is lamb... and mint jelly, but I prefer sausage and sauerkraut.
Bruce Mowbray: I had to get the cookie from my inventory.
Bruce Mowbray: Couldn't get the jar to work. Maybe it's empty.
Aphrodite Macbain: oh? not from the jar?
Bruce Mowbray: I tried the jar several times.

Aphrodite Macbain: Would you be interested in performing in the Vaudeville show?
Bruce Mowbray: I have no talent.
Aphrodite Macbain: not true

Bruce Mowbray: Heya, Zen.
Zen Arado: Hi Aph, Bruce
Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Zen-we are in a drop atm...
Zen Arado: kk

Aphrodite Macbain: funny about the cookie jar
Aphrodite Macbain: maybe I need to bake some more
Bruce Mowbray: It changed colors!
Bruce Mowbray: and positions!
Bruce Mowbray: There's another one!
Bruce Mowbray: and another!
Bruce Mowbray: Yikes!
Aphrodite Macbain: lol
Aphrodite Macbain: I'm trying to find a full one....
Bruce Mowbray: When you find a full one, put it beside Zen.
Zen Arado: sounds like Nasrudin
Bruce Mowbray: ha ha!
Bruce Mowbray: Love those stories.
Zen Arado: he kept eating hot peppers
Zen Arado: someone asked him why
Zen Arado: answer: i'm trying to find a sweet one'
Zen Arado: :)
Zen Arado: something like that
Zen Arado: moral?
Zen Zen Arado: we keep doing the same things and expect a different result?
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
Zen Arado: stuck in habits?
Aphrodite Macbain: like trying to lose weight
Zen Arado: precious routines
Aphrodite Macbain: nods
Zen Arado: crazy wisdom
Bruce Mowbray: http://u.cs.biu.ac.il/~schiff/Net/front.html (Nasrudin)

Aphrodite Macbain: I ate a cookie and my jeans fell off!!
Bruce Mowbray: I noticed!
Bruce Mowbray: Disappeared entirely.
Aphrodite Macbain: SL is a dangerous place
Aphrodite Macbain: maybe they went into the cookie jar
Bruce Mowbray: Actually, you became invisible from the waist down... but just for a few seconds.
Bruce Mowbray: like an alpha layer.
Aphrodite Macbain:exactly Bruce yes-I had on an alpha layer...
Bruce Mowbray: :)

Vaudeville
Aphrodite Macbain: are you interested in performing in the Vaudeville routine Zen?
Zen Arado: perform what Aph?
Aphrodite Macbain: in a Vaudeville performance
Aphrodite Macbain: here and in 2 other places
Aphrodite Macbain: rehearsals will be in our theatre
Zen Arado: don't know how to do that
Aphrodite Macbain: It's just a question of wearing a few animations....
Aphrodite Macbain: so you can dance or move around
Zen Arado: maybe
Aphrodite Macbain: we will have lots of rehearsals
Bruce Mowbray: We will NEED them!
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
Zen Arado: I thought vaudeville was comedians
Aphrodite Macbain: Vaudeville had a wide variety of acts, dancing, singing, comedy routines, recitations,
Aphrodite Macbain: that's why I thought it would be fun
Aphrodite Macbain: Nothing needs to be sustained for more than 2-3 minutes
Aphrodite Macbain: I was going to look in SL market place and see if I could find some dancing bears .....
Bruce Mowbray: I could play my recorder while Aph rides her unicycle in circles around me.
Aphrodite Macbain: sounds good :-)
Bruce Mowbray: on second thought, dancing bears might be better.
Aphrodite Macbain: we could have both
Bruce Mowbray: We could indeed.
Aphrodite Macbain: I could juggle as well while I bicycled
Bruce Mowbray: Maybe, if there's time, we could train the bears to ride the unicycle.
Aphrodite Macbain: I have many talents

Aphrodite Macbain: onigokko
Aphrodite Macbain: yayyyyyy
Bruce Mowbray: YAYYYYY!
Aphrodite Macbain: we could do the onigokko!
Aphrodite Macbain: stop
Bruce Mowbray: That we could.
Aphrodite Macbain: terrify the audience

Aphrodite Macbain: Zen- you look like you have joined the clergy or the legal profession
Aphrodite Macbain: let me congratulate you
Aphrodite Macbain: I am referring to your white neck piece
Zen Arado: the old jokes about debauched aristocrats
Zen Arado: they looked like this
Zen Arado: :)
Aphrodite Macbain: lol
Bruce Mowbray: lol
Zen Arado: never see that these days
Aphrodite Macbain: debauched aristocrats and clergy
Zen Arado: always had a monocle too
Aphrodite Macbain: do you still have it?
Zen Arado: no don't have one
Zen Arado: debauched aristocrats had one I mean
Zen Arado: English only maybe
Aphrodite Macbain: ahh- or aristocrats with bad eyesight
Zen Arado: a stereotype
Zen Arado: in old 30's films

Aphrodite Macbain shakes a musical instrument (sound of talking stick)
Aphrodite Macbain: on
Bruce Mowbray: Yikes!
Aphrodite Macbain: off
Aphrodite Macbain: giggles
Bruce Mowbray: THAT is cool!
Bruce Mowbray: ***** APPLAUSE! *****
Bruce Mowbray: [`•.] APPLAUSE!! [.•´]

Aphrodite Macbain: we are becoming very animated today and haven't said one intelligent word yet :-)
Zen Arado: intelligent words are overrated
Aphrodite Macbain: ha ha
Aphrodite Macbain: That's what Donal Trump might say though
Aphrodite Macbain: I think we will be wonderful musicians

Space and emptiness
Aphrodite Macbain: Was there anything in the discussion yesterday Bruce that might be interesting to discuss here Bruce?
Bruce Mowbray: Hmmmm.
Bruce Mowbray: It's rather difficult to discuss TSK out of context,
Bruce Mowbray: and if folks haven't read the book.
Aphrodite Macbain: I thought about the challenge of considering space
Aphrodite Macbain: whether it is empty or not
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, that's an interesting challenge.
Aphrodite Macbain: my definition of space is something that is empty
Bruce Mowbray: In the book's meaning, I felt that space had to be entirely empty.
Aphrodite Macbain: oh?
Bruce Mowbray: Space, in effect, is only a "container" for objects....
Bruce Mowbray: In itself, it is empty.
Bruce Mowbray: although many in the group would disagree with me on that.
Zen Arado: space is for decorating with art, time is for decorating with music
Bruce Mowbray: Ahh!
Aphrodite Macbain: That's how I always thought of it
Aphrodite Macbain: smiles
Aphrodite Macbain: decoration only?
Zen Arado: only a saying
Aphrodite Macbain: I like it
Bruce Mowbray: me too.
Zen Arado: why work on these questions?
Bruce Mowbray: Breaking in new neural pathways?
Aphrodite Macbain: I guess it's a way of challenging our assumptions
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, Aph, good point.
Koans

Koans
Zen Arado: I thought the purpose of Zen koans was to make you realize the pointlessness of intellectualising
Zen Arado: trying to work life out
Zen Arado: philosophy does that Aph
Aphrodite Macbain: nods, and science... what was called "natural philosophy"
Bruce Mowbray: That's what the reward of "working" on a koan is, for sure.....
Zen Arado: Socrates walked around the marketplace challenging peoples' assumptions
Bruce Mowbray: Once one has worked with koans, one begins to see that EVERYTHING is a koan....
Bruce Mowbray: I try to remember that on "bad" days: "It's just another koan."
Zen Arado: people don't like that though
Aphrodite Macbain: nods
Bruce Mowbray: Philosophy or popularity - Take your pick.
Zen Arado: they cling grimly to their beloved assumptions
Aphrodite Macbain: I see nothing wrong with trying to make sense of the world and challenging one's assumptions
Aphrodite Macbain: Socrates was good at that...
Zen Arado: nobody says it is wrong
Zen Arado: but maybe we need some assumptions
Zen Arado: just to function
Aphrodite Macbain: "[13:51] Zen (zen.arado): I thought the purpose of Zen koans was to make you realize the pointlessness of intellectualising"
Aphrodite Macbain: Are we not talking about intellectualizing?
Zen Arado: we assume an elevator is going to work when we step into one
Bruce Mowbray: We assume Aph's cookie jar is not empty when we touch it.
Zen Arado: maybe it should be 'over-intellectualizing'
Bruce Mowbray: Analysis paralysis?
Zen Arado: just questioning everything
Zen Arado: yes
Aphrodite Macbain: questioning everything can be very exhausting!
Zen Arado: yep
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Aphrodite Macbain: Like a child who keeps asking, "why?"
Zen Arado: yes
Aphrodite Macbain: but isn't it better to question than not?
Zen Arado: maybe better to accept the mystery
Zen Arado: why is it better to question?
Aphrodite Macbain: hmm
Zen Arado: maybe better sometimes
Bruce Mowbray: For a koan to "work," don't you need to TRY to figure it out?
Aphrodite Macbain: yes
Zen Arado: yes at the beginning
Aphrodite Macbain: Nothing wrong with questioning assumptions; people once accepted the world was flat and the centre of the universe
Zen Arado: then you see that it doesn't work
Bruce Mowbray nods.
Bruce Mowbray: No true koan is solvable.
Zen Arado: so maybe it has its place
Bruce Mowbray: (although books of answers have been published... ha ha).
Aphrodite Macbain: so the role of the koan is to make you think rather than suggest an answer?
Zen Arado: does it have a role?
Bruce Mowbray: I would say so, Aph.
Zen Arado: maybe you have a teleological best Aph
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
Bruce Mowbray: Existence itself is a koan.
Zen Arado: everything has a purpose if only we could find it
Zen Arado: ?
Aphrodite Macbain: written by whom?
Zen Arado: bent
Aphrodite Macbain: twisted?
Aphrodite Macbain: lol
Bruce Mowbray: off to scrape up a koanic supper.
Aphrodite Macbain: enjoy Bruce
Bruce Mowbray: Be well, good people.
Zen Arado: bye Bruce
Aphrodite Macbain: and I to go for a walk
Aphrodite Macbain: Bye Zen
Aphrodite Macbain: :-)
Zen Arado: bye Aph
Zen Arado: :)
Aphrodite Macbain: see you later!