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[01:17] Alfred Kelberry: berty :)
[01:18] Alfred Kelberry: didn't expect to see you
[01:18] Bertram Jacobus: boxy ... :-))
[01:18] Alfred Kelberry: how's your meditation vow? keep doing it every day?
[01:18] Bertram Jacobus: hehe - "right" - it´s more seldom that i can be here at "such times" of the day / week ... :-)
[01:18] Bertram Jacobus: oh my - no ! ... :-(
[01:18] Alfred Kelberry: aww
[01:19] Alfred Kelberry: busy schedule?
[01:20] Bertram Jacobus: i´m really a jerk with these things - continuity is so hard for me to practise !
[01:20] Alfred Kelberry: *pats your back* it's ok, berty :)
[01:20] Bertram Jacobus: and the effects of such meditations - i experience them so intense - too intense ...
[01:20] Alfred Kelberry: oh, can you tell more?
[01:21] Alfred Kelberry: what are the effects?
[01:21] Bertram Jacobus: so i "have to" / like to find methods which i can practise beside the usual / normal / traditional ones ...
[01:22] Alfred Kelberry: yes, trying things. sounds like a good approach :)
[01:23] Alfred Kelberry: seeing what works for you
[01:23] Bertram Jacobus: sure : so much inner aspects, problems and so called "dark shadows" come up, are developed ... that it is not bareble to me , not too much in too short time at least ...
[01:23] Alfred Kelberry: *nods*
[01:23] Alfred Kelberry: how long were your daily meditations? 1 hour?
[01:24] Bertram Jacobus: i often feel then not only psychological, but even physical effects - which are really not very funny ...
[01:24] Alfred Kelberry: interesting
[01:25] Bertram Jacobus: hmmm - no. not at all. the tradition which i am close to, meditates often only for some minutes ... but chanting and such can be for one or more hours
[01:25] Alfred Kelberry: are there happy thoughts during your meditations?
[01:25] Bertram Jacobus: may be, we first should define, what we understand from the word "meditation" (?)
[01:26] Bertram Jacobus: hmmm - yes : thoughs of all kinds ...
[01:26] Alfred Kelberry: but the dark ones dominate?
[01:27] Bertram Jacobus: not so much thoughts - more feelings
[01:27] Alfred Kelberry: i take "meditation" in broad terms - reflection, awareness of self and others in the present. how you do it can vary.
[01:28] Alfred Kelberry: why do you think the dark feelings appear so strongly? i have a notion of meditation as relaxing and healing. a bit surprising to see such a negative effect.
[01:29] Bertram Jacobus: i think, because there are so many bad things inside me, and because i want to develop all so fast
[01:31] Bertram Jacobus: the real work may be to clarify all that, to go through those heavy areas of the self, to clean and dissolve all that - to reach finally the before hidden most inner essence - which is not devided from anything else , then
[01:32] Bertram Jacobus: there are many remarks, that the true paths would be heavy ...
[01:32] Bertram Jacobus: in many traditions we can find such statements
[01:33] Bertram Jacobus: but the healing and relaxing effects can be there as well, for sure
[01:33] Bertram Jacobus: as i said before : there is everything
[01:33] Alfred Kelberry: your answer made me smile actually, cause whatever bad things are inside of you, nothing is shown on the outside - quite otherwise - you radiate happiness and joy :)
[01:33] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. ty. i´m very happy to read that ! :-)
[01:34] Alfred Kelberry: and in fact, very calm too. in tune with the present. that's how it appeared to me :)
[01:35] Alfred Kelberry: "the true paths would be heavy" - kind of profound
[01:35] Bertram Jacobus: that may be some effects of my practises and searchings, works on all that - hopefully - but the work is not yet finished as i feel that ...
[01:35] Bertram Jacobus: ok : sometimes i can "just be" - that is REALLY nice ...
[01:35] Alfred Kelberry: oh, i hope it's never finished :)
[01:36] Alfred Kelberry: life goes on :)
[01:36] Alfred Kelberry: yes, i've seen that in berlin. it was calming and... uplifting :)
[01:37] Bertram Jacobus: and i even fall often in such a state - where others then become a bit squirrely - as i feel then ... and so i try to help then and start acting again, often ...
[01:37] Alfred Kelberry: squirrely :)
[01:37] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. yes. i found it in the dictionary :-)
[01:38] Bertram Jacobus: many people don´t feel comfortable with silence and pauses ...
[01:38] Alfred Kelberry: i think being "just me" you're already helping
[01:38] Alfred Kelberry: yes
[01:39] Bertram Jacobus: oops - the telephone rang - i have to work - sry ! ...
[01:39] Alfred Kelberry: but surprisingly i was very comfortable in berlin during meditation and other pauses
[01:39] Bertram Jacobus: wonderful !
[01:39] Alfred Kelberry: of course. no worries :)
[01:40] Alfred Kelberry: it's the group effort, i believe
[01:40] Bertram Jacobus: okay dear boxy - have a very nice day pls, was so nice to meet you (again) -
[01:40] Alfred Kelberry: you're on receiving end
[01:40] Alfred Kelberry: it was very ncie to see you here, berty!
[01:40] Alfred Kelberry: thank you for sharing
[01:40] Bertram Jacobus: byeee - rush off :o)
[01:40] Alfred Kelberry: bye :)
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