2013.10.13 19:00 - Inquiry Without Limits = Play = YES

eliza posted this session, etc...

[18:51] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I'm sure we haven't met, I'm Corvi.
[18:51] Daedalus687 Resident: Here often?
[18:52] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Not recently. How about you?
[18:52] Daedalus687 Resident: Lately
[18:53] Corvuscorva Nightfire smiles warmly.

[18:53] Corvuscorva Nightfire: What have you been thinking about lately?
[18:54] Daedalus687 Resident: Hmm. Maybe trying to juggle thinking with no-thinking
[18:54] Corvuscorva Nightfire nods. How have you been doing that?
[18:55] Daedalus687 Resident: Trying to see that 'I' don't do it possibly
[18:55] Corvuscorva Nightfire nods. Hmmmm.

[18:57] Daedalus687 Resident: How did you originally come across this place?
[18:58] Corvuscorva Nightfire: A friend of mine recommended it to me. I came by and found it interesting, so I stayed.
[18:58] Corvuscorva Nightfire: How about you?
[18:59] Daedalus687 Resident: TSK brought me here, if I might say it brought me

[19:00] Corvuscorva Nightfire looks up from google...I give up...what's TSK?
[19:02] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[19:02] Daedalus687 Resident: Time/Space/Knowledge
[19:02] Daedalus687 Resident: The ideas outlined in there lead a few to create this place.

[19:03] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Ah, I see a little...you read that? Or you worked with some of the people who created this place?
[19:04] Daedalus687 Resident: The former
[19:04] Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
[19:04] Daedalus687 Resident: Hi! :)
[19:05] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hullo, Calvino!
[19:05] Calvino Rabeni: Hello Daedalus ! And Aphrodite and Corvus!
[19:05] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hullo Aph!
[19:05] Aphrodite Macbain: hello all

[19:07] Daedalus687 Resident: Hey, is there any place to create object in this area?
[19:07] Calvino Rabeni: Daedalus, have you been here before (since we haven't met) - do you know about the recorder in the pool here? It puts our conversations onto the group's wiki
[19:07] Aphrodite Macbain: how are thins
[19:07] Daedalus687 Resident: :) I do, thanks for asking
[19:07] Calvino Rabeni: I don't know .. don't think so
[19:07] Calvino Rabeni: ok
[19:08] Daedalus687 Resident: Been comming here recently, its fun
[19:10] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Daedalus was telling me a little about TSK
[19:10] Corvuscorva Nightfire: before ya'll popped in.
[19:10] Calvino Rabeni: Oh, the cleaning product? :)
[19:10] Calvino Rabeni: no .. i think that's .. yes I remember!
[19:10] Calvino Rabeni: I'd like to hear a bit more about it :)
[19:10] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[19:10] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heh...no...it's the stuff that Pema was thinking about when this started, I think, from what DAedalus said
[19:11] Daedalus687 Resident: Yea, I havn't met him yet, id love to
[19:11] Daedalus687 Resident: Pema I mean
[19:12] Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.. I like it when he comes by.
[19:12] Aphrodite Macbain: Tsk Tsk
[19:12] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heehee

[19:12] Daedalus687 Resident: When the original book for TSK was published, I wasnt even born!
[19:13] Aphrodite Macbain: He was here this mornming at the 7AM
[19:13] Daedalus687 Resident: Yea, I missed him...lol
[19:13] Aphrodite Macbain: talking about dropping
[19:13] Calvino Rabeni: that's unusual .. were you there, Aph?
[19:13] Aphrodite Macbain: no- too early for me- but it's in the log
[19:14] Aphrodite Macbain: He came especiall;y as the Guardians were feeling that things were dragging
[19:14] Aphrodite Macbain: so he returned to re-ignite things a bit
[19:14] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[19:14] Aphrodite Macbain: and I was sleeping while he was reigniting
[19:17] Calvino Rabeni: did he bring lighter fluid? A shot in the arm?
[19:17] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[19:17] Corvuscorva Nightfire giggles
[19:17] Daedalus687 Resident: I think just reiterating
[19:17] Aphrodite Macbain: just his red hair!

[19:17] Aphrodite Macbain: Corvi- you have been here from the beginning, haven't you?
[19:18] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Not the beginning, but early on.
[19:18] Aphrodite Macbain: were you part of the early conversations about being and dropping?
[19:19] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I thought those conversations were ongoing? We definitely talked about that alot while I was coming often
[19:19] Aphrodite Macbain wishes she had a hat like Cal's
[19:19] Aphrodite Macbain: I think they are becoming less frequent

[19:19] Daedalus687 Resident: How are ya'll talking in actions?
[19:19] Daedalus687 Resident: What the talks or dropping?

[19:19] Aphrodite Macbain: It's hard to always have the same subject
[19:20] Aphrodite Macbain: dropping is about dropping who we are and what we believe durting the 90 second breaks here or during the day every 15 minutes for 9 seconds
[19:20] Aphrodite Macbain: Perhgaps you can explain it better Cal or Corvi
[19:21] Aphrodite Macbain: I cant even type properly

[19:21] Daedalus687 Resident: A return to space

[19:21] Calvino Rabeni: It seems like once people talk about something for more than a few times it tends to destroy the liveness of it ...
[19:21] Aphrodite Macbain: nods
[19:22] Aphrodite Macbain: and the peop[le who are passionate about it aren't here very often
[19:22] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I think you did a fantastic job of explaining, Aph
[19:22] Aphrodite Macbain: :) thanks Corvi

[19:22] Daedalus687 Resident: What might be interesting to talk about?
[19:23] Aphrodite Macbain: For me it's about stopping and paying attention - to the present, to my body and to my feelings
[19:23] Calvino Rabeni: the think I never got about dropping, is that the conscious beliefs are the tip of the iceberg, and if they are open to dropping, they're already held pretty loosely ..
[19:23] Aphrodite Macbain: nods
[19:23] Daedalus687 Resident: What do you mean beliefs are the tip of the iceberg?
[19:24] Aphrodite Macbain: Sometimes it allows tome to calm down if one is in a passionate argument
[19:24] Aphrodite Macbain: listens to Cal
[19:24] Calvino Rabeni: so it seemed more like .. noticing what is present might have to be the first step to it even being possible
[19:24] Daedalus687 Resident: What might be present in a first step?
[19:24] Corvuscorva Nightfire: to dropping being possible?
[19:24] Calvino Rabeni: the iceberg symbolizes what's unconscious .. most of self / belief / etc.
[19:24] Calvino Rabeni: yes
[19:24] Aphrodite Macbain: yes
[19:25] Calvino Rabeni: the above water part is the aware part

[19:25] Aphrodite Macbain: for example, I am aware that I want to keep explaining rather than listening
[19:25] Calvino Rabeni: the rest is hidden
[19:25] Calvino Rabeni: nods
[19:25] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heh
[19:25] Daedalus687 Resident: k

[19:26] Daedalus687 Resident: What are we listening to?
[19:26] Aphrodite Macbain: we cant do subconscious here ... the fountain is too shallow
[19:26] Aphrodite Macbain: listening to?
[19:27] Calvino Rabeni: what would you say .. is present for you unconsciously ?
[19:27] Daedalus687 Resident: Yea, you said you were aware that you wanted to keep explaining rather than listening
[19:27] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hullo!
[19:27] Calvino Rabeni: like the desires Aph mentions
[19:27] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[19:27] Aphrodite Macbain: exactly
[19:27] Calvino Rabeni: well ... Lucinda
[19:27] Aphrodite Macbain: needing to be clear

[19:27] Lucinda Lavender: Hello all!
[19:27] Daedalus687 Resident: Hi!
[19:27] Aphrodite Macbain: Hiya Luci
[19:28] Aphrodite Macbain: sorry I let you down
[19:28] Aphrodite Macbain: How are the apples?
[19:28] Lucinda Lavender: Apples are great...18 gallons of cider pressed today
[19:28] Daedalus687 Resident: Cool
[19:28] Aphrodite Macbain: wow
[19:28] Calvino Rabeni: I kept having a sense I might encounter you today, Lucinda .. well at least, I was at the Farmer's Market, .. oh it must have been wishful thinking
[19:28] Corvuscorva Nightfire: and you look lovely despite all that work
[19:29] Aphrodite Macbain: when will it be ready to drink?
[19:29] Lucinda Lavender: yes...cool and sweet. Really Cal In my neighborhood?
[19:29] Calvino Rabeni: Yes
[19:29] Lucinda Lavender: I think it is ready now...but fermented cider takes sometime
[19:31] Calvino Rabeni: We have a couple new fermentation projects lately too ..
[19:31] Lucinda Lavender: Luci passes cups of apple juice around to all...
[19:31] Lucinda Lavender: imaginary ones
[19:31] Calvino Rabeni: self-fermented tomato juice
[19:31] Aphrodite Macbain: so you keep some to ferment and drink some now?
[19:32] Aphrodite Macbain: delicious, thanks LUci
[19:32] Calvino Rabeni: if you start in now on the 18 gallons, some large amount is sure to be fermented by the time you get to it
[19:32] Lucinda Lavender: we have some smaller containers that we drink now and a couple 5 gallon carboys
[19:33] Aphrodite Macbain: gets some OJ as a chaser
[19:34] Lucinda Lavender: the large container will have yeast added probably
[19:34] Lucinda Lavender: commercial yeast
[19:34] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Do you add the yeast or...
[19:34] Corvuscorva Nightfire: ah
[19:34] Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods
[19:34] Corvuscorva Nightfire: We used to depend on the wild boogers.
[19:34] Lucinda Lavender: natural yeast dos not have the result we want
[19:34] Calvino Rabeni: what result is different?
[19:35] Lucinda Lavender: commercial is clear and cleaner sweet applely result
[19:35] Aphrodite Macbain: wild boogers?
[19:35] Corvuscorva Nightfire: wild yeast
[19:36] Lucinda Lavender: corvi has tried this? with the natural?
[19:36] Corvuscorva Nightfire: When I was a little kid
[19:36] Aphrodite Macbain: ah giggles
[19:36] Lucinda Lavender: ah! ...
[19:36] Calvino Rabeni: the tomatos ferment naturally here
[19:36] Corvuscorva Nightfire: we did it all the time..put a balloon over an un pastuerized bottle..maybe a little extra sugar
[19:36] Aphrodite Macbain: left to their own devices, they will
[19:36] Lucinda Lavender: did you add anything to the tomatoes?
[19:36] Calvino Rabeni: no
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: why did you want fermented tomatoes?
[19:37] Calvino Rabeni: the old guy next door gets tipsy on them
[19:37] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heehee
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: lol
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: yukk
[19:37] Calvino Rabeni: didn't want them .. they do it naturally
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: yes
[19:37] Lucinda Lavender: I think they can be like little tomatoes full of a champage like bubbly
[19:37] Calvino Rabeni: so the part that is not consumed nor frozen, ... goes that way
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: like most fermenting fruit
[19:37] Calvino Rabeni: yes
[19:37] Aphrodite Macbain: nature's way ...
[19:38] Lucinda Lavender: the season for fruit and it's way
[19:38] Aphrodite Macbain: unless you have a hungry dog

[19:38] Calvino Rabeni: and a new trick, lately, is to refill the kefir bottle whenever it is near empty (with plain milk) then leave it out for a day ... it becomes a magic endless kefir supply
[19:39] Aphrodite Macbain: yogurt sort of does the same thing
[19:39] Calvino Rabeni: brb ... /me must AFK a little while
[19:39] Lucinda Lavender: that is what we do with our yogurt
[19:39] Corvuscorva Nightfire: add milk?
[19:39] Aphrodite Macbain: what? put it in the sun?
[19:39] Lucinda Lavender: save a little in the bottom and use it to make the next batch
[19:39] Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
[19:40] Aphrodite Macbain: do you put it in a low oven overnight?
[19:40] Lucinda Lavender: the next batch gets heated first and then added and set in the oven with the light on
[19:40] Lucinda Lavender: yes:)
[19:40] Lucinda Lavender: I like to add it to oatmeal in the mornings
[19:41] Corvuscorva Nightfire idly picks apart the yogurt wondering what it is...the milk or the little beings and their effluence?
[19:41] Lucinda Lavender: yes...

[19:41] Aphrodite Macbain: Daedelus - why did you call yourself that?
[19:41] Aphrodite Macbain: is there a back story?
[19:42] Lucinda Lavender: that is exactly what is there
[19:42] Lucinda Lavender: in the yogurt
[19:42] Lucinda Lavender: whose name are you asking about Daedelus?
[19:42] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Aph was asking Daedelus about his name
[19:43] Aphrodite Macbain: ? I was asking about his name
[19:43] Lucinda Lavender: sorry missed that

[19:44] Lucinda Lavender: who is Daedalus in myth...?I forget,
[19:44] Daedalus687 Resident: Greek yea, I believe he was the one who told icarus his son not to fly too close to the sun
[19:44] Daedalus687 Resident: then icarus' wings fell off
[19:45] Aphrodite Macbain: Daedalos, meaning "clever worker"; Latin: Daedalus; Etruscan: Taitale) was a skillful craftsman and artisan.[1][2] He is the father of Icarus and Iapyx and the uncle of Perdix.
[19:46] Lucinda Lavender: thanks Aph!...Hi stevanaia
[19:46] stevenaia Michinaga: greetings
[19:46] Daedalus687 Resident: Hi :)
[19:47] stevenaia Michinaga: nice to see new and old friends
[19:47] Aphrodite Macbain: I must make a point of finding out where you both got those kimonos
[19:47] stevenaia Michinaga: Paradise knows
[19:48] Aphrodite Macbain: Thanks for the lm
[19:48] Lucinda Lavender: Luci has just tried to share the lm
[19:48] Aphrodite Macbain: Luci
[19:48] Lucinda Lavender: hopes it worked
[19:48] Aphrodite Macbain: irodori
[19:49] Aphrodite Macbain: I will visit it tomorrow
[19:49] Aphrodite Macbain: I am in the middle of wrting an essay on friendship
[19:49] Lucinda Lavender: in these last 10 minutes...what comes to mind as interesting I wonder....
[19:50] Aphrodite Macbain: Any suggestions about what makes a good one?
[19:50] Lucinda Lavender: friendship...laughing together comes to my mind

[19:50] Lucinda Lavender: hi Santoshima
[19:50] Daedalus687 Resident: Hi! :)
[19:50] Santoshima Resident: hello Lucinda
[19:50] stevenaia Michinaga: time makes a good friendship
[19:50] Santoshima Resident: hi everyone
[19:50] stevenaia Michinaga: hi San
[19:50] Aphrodite Macbain: Hello San. Back from the garden?
[19:50] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi San
[19:51] Santoshima Resident: back, yes ~ hi Corvi!!
[19:51] Santoshima Resident: i
[19:51] Aphrodite Macbain: wb
[19:51] Corvuscorva Nightfire grins
[19:51] Santoshima Resident: like a vision
[19:52] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[19:52] Aphrodite Macbain: Happy Thanksgiving San

[19:52] Corvuscorva Nightfire: We've been talking about TSK (which still needs elucidating) and dropping and fermenting
[19:52] Corvuscorva Nightfire: to catch ya'll up.
[19:53] Santoshima Resident: ok, ty ~ helpful
[19:53] Lucinda Lavender: thanks corvi
[19:53] stevenaia Michinaga: fermenting?
[19:53] stevenaia Michinaga: :)
[19:53] Corvuscorva Nightfire: mmmhmmm
[19:53] Aphrodite Macbain: I have to get going. Something is fermenting on the stove...
[19:53] Lucinda Lavender: my weekend was cider pressing
[19:53] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heehee..bye for now, Aph.
[19:53] Aphrodite Macbain: bye everyone
[19:53] stevenaia Michinaga: nice luci
[19:53] Santoshima Resident: fomenting
[19:53] Daedalus687 Resident: :) bye Aphrodite
[19:53] stevenaia Michinaga: bye Aph
[19:54] Aphrodite Macbain: that too San!
[19:54] Santoshima Resident: byebye Aph
[19:54] Lucinda Lavender: bye bye aph


[19:54] Lucinda Lavender: can you say more about tsk?
[19:54] Santoshima Resident: as in "tsk tsk"?
[19:54] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Actually, I'm hoping Daedalus will
[19:54] Santoshima Resident: or an acronym?
[19:55] Corvuscorva Nightfire: no...as in..umm...I forgot
[19:55] Corvuscorva Nightfire: an acronym

[19:55] Lucinda Lavender: I think as Time space and Knowledge...a book I think
[19:55] Corvuscorva Nightfire: right!
[19:55] Santoshima Resident: oh, ok, book title
[19:55] Corvuscorva Nightfire: one that Pema read
[19:55] Daedalus687 Resident: Play as Being is outlined sorta in it
[19:55] Santoshima Resident: indeed, sorta
[19:55] Daedalus687 Resident: At least the phrase is mentioned
[19:56] Daedalus687 Resident: I can speak of it if you all want
[19:56] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I'd like that
[19:57] Santoshima Resident: okie
[19:57] Lucinda Lavender: please do if you wish...I have only till the hour but would love to hear a little
[19:57] Santoshima Resident: { 3 minutes }
[19:57] stevenaia Michinaga: (three minute summary)
[19:57] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[19:57] Santoshima Resident: egg-timer starting
[19:57] stevenaia Michinaga: GO!
[19:58] Lucinda Lavender: :))

[19:58] Daedalus687 Resident: Space as Being, Time as Being, Knowledge as Being
[19:58] Daedalus687 Resident: Three components,
[19:58] Daedalus687 Resident: its like an epistomology
[19:58] Daedalus687 Resident: a system sorta
[19:58] Daedalus687 Resident: Secular dzogchen
[19:59] Daedalus687 Resident: Space as fundamentally open
[19:59] Daedalus687 Resident: The Body of Knowledge as a birthright of human being
[19:59] Daedalus687 Resident: Time as the activating principal of an open space
[19:59] stevenaia Michinaga: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epistemology
[19:59] Daedalus687 Resident: Knowledge as the intimate synthesis of Time and Space
[20:00] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Heh...I had to look too, Stevie.

[20:01] Daedalus687 Resident: It attempts to establish a vision, without really establishing anything as permanent. Zero-dimentional being

[20:01] Daedalus687 Resident: Sorry theres less time for you lucinda
[20:01] Lucinda Lavender: I like that the body of knowledge is a birthright...that means we do not have to dismiss wisdom which is so interesting....

[20:02] Daedalus687 Resident: The Body of Knowledge is subject and object unified, with no subject nor an object, nor even a unifying process

[20:03] Daedalus687 Resident: Thats word for word pretty much from the book I recall by heart
[20:03] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Thank you.
[20:03] Santoshima Resident: well done
[20:03] Santoshima Resident: thank you
[20:03] Lucinda Lavender: Yes...hear hear!
[20:03] stevenaia Michinaga: :) a good begining

[20:04] Daedalus687 Resident: Inquiry is a 'primary' tool in discovering knowledge
[20:04] Daedalus687 Resident: Or rather, letting knowledge 'be' knowledge
[20:04] Daedalus687 Resident: Without imposing order from the self, or suggesting an order beyond the self
[20:05] Daedalus687 Resident: Inquiry without limits
[20:05] Corvuscorva Nightfire: play
[20:05] Daedalus687 Resident: Yes

[20:05] Lucinda Lavender: Thank you Deadalus...it feels like inquiry can be applied within and without
[20:06] Daedalus687 Resident: play is a wonderful way to characterize it
[20:06] Daedalus687 Resident: also adventure
[20:06] stevenaia Michinaga: a journey
[20:06] Santoshima Resident: wonder
[20:06] Daedalus687 Resident: :)

[20:07] Daedalus687 Resident: As soon as we think we find an answer, knowledge is shut out to a degree...yet ultimately maybe knowledge could never be shut out. that is a position I take as a knower in a known world
[20:07] Daedalus687 Resident: All I say is subject to inquiry, nothing is off limits in the sense of it being real or not real
[20:07] Daedalus687 Resident: Polarization lends to unity without losing the polar nature
[20:08] Daedalus687 Resident: :)

[20:09] Lucinda Lavender: Luci thinks of the yin yang symbol
[20:09] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[20:10] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I keep thinking of fractal patterns
[20:10] Calvino Rabeni: Hi Stevenaia, long time no see .. And Santo too :)
[20:10] stevenaia Michinaga: waves to Cal
[20:11] Santoshima Resident: waves ~ hi Cal
[20:13] Daedalus687 Resident: but theres only so much that could be said
[20:13] stevenaia Michinaga: night all
[20:13] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[20:13] Corvuscorva Nightfire: It's nice to hear it...awww...goodnight, Stevie
[20:13] Santoshima Resident: nitey nite Stevie

[20:15] Corvuscorva Nightfire: Daedalus...It's nice to hear those ideas again and let them wash over me...my understading of them is different now than it was the first time I heard them. in discussion here
[20:15] Lucinda Lavender: I hope we can go into it again...
[20:16] Calvino Rabeni: Can you say how your understanding has changed over time? Corvu?
[20:16] Daedalus687 Resident: I would say that we are already in it, continually
[20:17] Lucinda Lavender: :)
[20:17] Daedalus687 Resident: Yea Corvu, please tell us more
[20:17] Corvuscorva Nightfire thinks on Cal's question...
[20:18] Corvuscorva Nightfire: That's tough, because part if not all is wordless
[20:18] Corvuscorva Nightfire: and I'm sleepy!
[20:18] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[20:18] Calvino Rabeni: Now I am too!
[20:18] Corvuscorva Nightfire: heehee
[20:18] Calvino Rabeni: that effort to speak the wordless always makes me sleepy
[20:19] Lucinda Lavender: in the sleepy soup
[20:19] Santoshima Resident: time for some green tea
[20:19] Calvino Rabeni: yes, .. dark roast
[20:19] Calvino Rabeni: :)
[20:19] Corvuscorva Nightfire: mmmmmm
[20:19] Santoshima Resident: see you all soon ~ thanks for the conversation ~ thanks for the TSK description, Daed, much appreciated!
[20:19] Santoshima Resident: ciao
[20:19] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[20:19] Calvino Rabeni: I think I have some Gunpowder Green in a box somewhere
[20:20] Daedalus687 Resident: bye bye
[20:20] Corvuscorva Nightfire: ciao, San
[20:20] Lucinda Lavender: :)...I will go saying the same thanks regarding such a helpful discussion.
[20:20] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[20:20] Daedalus687 Resident: Cya soon
[20:21] Calvino Rabeni: And I. be well everyone
[20:21] Corvuscorva Nightfire: I think it's time to sleep...Thank you Daedalus
[20:21] Daedalus687 Resident: :)
[20:21] Daedalus687 Resident: Thank u corvi, I appreciate another to articulate
[20:21] Lucinda Lavender: more time and space and knowledge coming
[20:21] Daedalus687 Resident: lol
[20:21] Corvuscorva Nightfire: :)
[20:22] Daedalus687 Resident: ?
[20:22] Corvuscorva Nightfire: goodnight
[20:22] Lucinda Lavender: goodnight all...all much appreciated
[20:22] Daedalus687 Resident: :)