2009.02.13 13:00 - Sound

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Solobill Laville. The comments are by Solobill Laville.

    I arrived at the Playgoda to find Susi and Wol already there, with a new addition, Susi's trained falcon. Pila arrived just as I did.

        Wol Euler: hello susi
        Susi Alcott: hi wol
        Wol Euler: and hello falcon
        Susi Alcott: Storm wanted to see this how it was; was too quick to take it away
        Wol Euler: evening Mr. Laville
        Susi Alcott: hi Pila
        Wol Euler: hello pila
        Solobill Laville bows low to Ms. Euler
        Pila Mulligan: greetings everyone
        Solobill Laville: Hello, Susi, Pila :)
        Susi Alcott: hi Solo
        Wol Euler: watch your fingers, pila
        Susi Alcott: somebody here good to set items nicely ?
        Pila Mulligan: what is this critter?
        Susi Alcott: she's got the hood
        Susi Alcott: dont need to be afraid of
        Susi Alcott: she's well trained
        Wol Euler: a hunting falcon :)
        Wol Euler: by the look of her
        Pila Mulligan: aha
        Susi Alcott: but she'd like to fly up to the fench up there
        Pila Mulligan: sqwwack
        Susi Alcott: Adams set her for me at first
        Solobill Laville: We have many peregrines near my home now
        Susi Alcott: but I took it away
        Solobill Laville: When I grew up we had none...silent spring...
        Susi Alcott: but now storm told she might be nice to be there
        Wol Euler: that's a good sign, I think.
        Wol Euler: they are returning to cities in Germany too, nesting on ledges and in towers
        Wol Euler: keeping the rats and mice down :)
        Solobill Laville: :) and rabbits, and squirrels...
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Wol Euler: now rotate her forward a little, head towards the ground
        Susi Alcott: then she wouldn't stand on the bench; now she's looking at the fire...

    Setting the Falcon...


        Wol Euler: yes, but birds don't stand bolt upright like that, she should be leaning forward a little I think
        Susi Alcott: but pls set it better; I'm not so good with these things
        Pila Mulligan: maybe she was raised by a penguin
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Susi Alcott: or to stand on my arm only
        Wol Euler: :)
        Susi Alcott: needed some retraining for that
        Wol Euler: what do you think?
        Susi Alcott: very good for me
        Wol Euler: good!
        Solobill Laville: Is it editable?
        Susi Alcott: she's a little shy still, so she needs the hood on
        Susi Alcott: but I believe she'll get rid ot it quite soon
        Solobill Laville: ah, ok, yes, that was going to be my suggestion :)
        Susi Alcott: (in case anybody knows how to do that; feel free)
        Susi Alcott: (she's quick to learn)
        Wol Euler: better have a backup copy before trying!
        Solobill Laville: wise advice....
        Wol Euler: learned the hard way, several times
        Solobill Laville: hehe

    I had read recently in a chat log about Pila's new home and its location, so I thought I'd ask Pila a contemplation-related question about it.

        Solobill Laville: Pila, can I ask you a question?
        Susi Alcott: no copy
        Pila Mulligan: another one -- you just did :)
        Wol Euler: ka-ching!
        Solobill Laville: ok, here cames #2
        Pila Mulligan: ok
        Solobill Laville: Do you find that living "in the boonies" in conducive to...mmm...general contemplation (e.g. not just "meditationally" speaking)
        Pila Mulligan: definitely yes, Solo

    Sam joins us.

        Pila Mulligan: hi Sam
        Wol Euler: hello samuel
        Susi Alcott: hi Sam
        Solobill Laville: Easier to appreciate due to lack of "human" stimuli, or something like that?
        Samuel Okelly:
        Samuel Okelly: ( @ @ )
        Samuel Okelly: ...o00o.(_).o00o...
        Samuel Okelly: (( HELLO EVERY1! ! ! ! ))
        Samuel Okelly:
        Solobill Laville smiles
        Pila Mulligan: :0 Sam -- nice greeting
        Solobill Laville: Hi, Sam :)
        Pila Mulligan: yes, Solo, there are quite a few places in Hawai`i I've been to where just being there is like a meditation
        Solobill Laville nods
        Samuel Okelly: thanks pila :) can you guess ive been playing with gestures? ;-)
        Solobill Laville: Been to places like that too
        Pila Mulligan: in fact, some charlatans have taken over such places and brought paid groups there for so called healing events
        Solobill Laville: ahhh
        Pila Mulligan: what cyncicsm
        Pila Mulligan: the places are naturally healing for anyone, for free :)
        Solobill Laville: are they publicly owned?
        Pila Mulligan: some, some not
        Pila Mulligan: some are pulblicly owned but diffiuclt to get to
        Pila Mulligan: the Island of Kaho`olawe is a remarkable place
        Solobill Laville recalls a black sand beach and waterful in Kauii that his freind showed him pics of once

    Doug joins us.

        Wol Euler: hello doug
        Pila Mulligan: the Hawaiians consider the enitre island to be a whi pana (a sacred plcae)
        Susi Alcott: hi doug
        Solobill Laville: Hi, Doug :)
        Pila Mulligan: wahi pana*
        Pila Mulligan: hi Doug
        doug Sosa: not very gracful
        Solobill Laville: I bet it is beautiful
        Pila Mulligan: but you cannot just go there as it was used as a military target range during and after WW II and still has unexploded ordinance

    Fefonz joins us.

        Solobill Laville: Hi, Fefonz
        Pila Mulligan: hi Fefonz
        Samuel Okelly: hi fef
        Wol Euler: hello fefonz
        Susi Alcott: hi Fef
        Fefonz Quan: hi All :)
        Pila Mulligan: you've opened the door on one of my pet subjects, Solo -- places have an intrinsic beauty or spirit of their own
        Wol Euler smiles.
        Solobill Laville: ;)
        Solobill Laville: I'd like to of then, and others that other folks have experienced as well
        Susi Alcott: and/or the stargate
        Fefonz Quan: (a word of which place are we talking about?)
        Pila Mulligan: to native people there are places in nature just as meaningful as the Cistine Chapel or any similar holy place in Western culture
        Samuel Okelly: spirit pila? (apologies if i have come to the discussion late)
        Pila Mulligan: a spritual significance yes Sam
        Pila Mulligan: like the Cistine Chapel, for exmpale
        Samuel Okelly: ahh see a subjective association rather than objectively recoginsed?
        Pila Mulligan: Fefonz: [13:11] Solobill Laville: Do you find that living "in the boonies" in conducive to...mmm...general contemplation (e.g. not just meditation speaking) [13:11] Pila Mulligan: definitely yes,
        Pila Mulligan: both
        Pila Mulligan: maybe not scientifically recongized :)
        Pila Mulligan: but if a social or cultural recognition counts as objective, then certianly the latter also
        Susi Alcott: in case it can be taken scientifically recognized when it's measured of the area's vibration
        Solobill Laville: it does
        Samuel Okelly: i understand... the catholic view of the divine prescence actually present in the chapel is something akin to this idea i guess?
        Pila Mulligan: probably -- it sure feels divine :)
        Wol Euler: yes, very much so.
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Solobill Laville: The Duomo in Milan has that as well, imo :)
        Pila Mulligan: there were literally epiphanies among the military people involved in cleaning up Kaho`olawe, oyu can see them ont heinterent
        Solobill Laville: I'd like to see the Sistine someday though
        Solobill Laville: Wow!
        Pila Mulligan: (ahh, my bad -- spelling error, thanks Solo)
        Samuel Okelly: i visited the sistine chpel here on SL recently
        Pila Mulligan: try a google search on Kahoolawe -- it is one of the best examples
        Pila Mulligan: for here, anyway
        Pila Mulligan: oh, is there one in SL -- I did not know
        Pila Mulligan: is it accurate?
        Wol Euler: what did you think of it, Sam?
        Solobill Laville: hey, guys, my viewer is flipping out; I'm gonna pop out and back, brb
        Fefonz Quan: searched it just now - it looks like the island of "lost" :)
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Pila Mulligan: it is a trippy place
        Pila Mulligan: wb Solo
        Wol Euler: wb solo
        Susi Alcott: wb

    Riddle joins us.

        Riddle Sideways: Hi All
        Fefonz Quan: Hi Riddle
        Wol Euler: hello riddle
        Solobill Laville: Heya, Riddle :)
        Samuel Okelly: it appeared to be very authentic
        Pila Mulligan: now Solo, can I take it the next step in regard to my pet subject?
        Susi Alcott: hi Riddle
        Samuel Okelly: hi rid, sol
        Pila Mulligan: hi Riddle
        Solobill Laville: hehe, of course!!
        Wol Euler: please do, pila :)
        Samuel Okelly: please do pila
        Pila Mulligan: so you start with a place that is naturally conducive to contemplation and spiritually uplifting
        Pila Mulligan: because it is so quiet and peaceful
        Pila Mulligan: and you visit it regularly and then one day you start to notice
        Pila Mulligan: something is deteriorating, going awry
        Pila Mulligan: I bet you cannot guess what the first symptom of that is :0
        Solobill Laville: You?
        Pila Mulligan: no :0
        Solobill Laville: Hmmm...
        Pila Mulligan: it is a sound
        Pila Mulligan: can you guess what it is?
        Pila Mulligan: ok, not to play too much ..
        Wol Euler: hello scath
        Samuel Okelly: the stability of the place you are in?
        Pila Mulligan: it is the whining sound of tires on a highway
        Wol Euler: heh
        doug Sosa: song birds gone

    Scathach joins in.

        Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Wol:)
        Solobill Laville: ahh
        Pila Mulligan: that is usually the first sound that intrudes into naturally quiet places
        Solobill Laville: Hiya, Scath :)
        Pila Mulligan: hi Scath
        Scathach Rhiadra: Hello all:)
        Susi Alcott: hi Scat
        Fefonz Quan: Hey Scath :)
        Pila Mulligan: the noise of the tires displaces things like the silence that surrounds bids, doug
        Wol Euler nods
        Pila Mulligan: singing birds do not disturb silence, in my experience :)
        Wol Euler: the dull roar of the highway 2 miles away is the fisrt thing I notice when I go to my parents' house
        doug Sosa: in the old village it was the rumbling of the carts, the drivers beating the donkies
        Pila Mulligan: :0 yep
        Pila Mulligan: one tire sounds first, then dozens then rorars :)
        doug Sosa: the *absence* of the song birds is noticeable, like their afternoon nap.
        Wol Euler: difference is, those sounds are intermittent. There aren't that many donkeys, and they stop rolling overnight
        Pila Mulligan: yep :)
        Wol Euler: the highway never pauses
        doug Sosa: i agree about tires.
        Samuel Okelly: i know a number of ppl who live by the coast who do not "enjoy" the domineering sound of gulls
        Pila Mulligan: have you heard peacocks :)
        doug Sosa: argh.
        Wol Euler chuckles
        Riddle Sideways: :)
        Pila Mulligan: talk about a roar
        Samuel Okelly: it seems that it is the incessant nature of the sound rather than the sound itself
        Fefonz Quan: yet some places remain inpiring and peaceful although there are some cars around
        Pila Mulligan: yes, but less so then if they were quiet, I'd guess Fefonz
        Riddle Sideways: probably depends on the define of quiet place

    Adams joins us.

        Pila Mulligan: hi Adams
        Riddle Sideways: if silence HAS to be the main part
        Pila Mulligan: yes, quiet is a relative term
        Susi Alcott: hi Adams
        Solobill Laville: Hello, Adams :)
        Wol Euler: hello adams
        Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Adams:)
        Riddle Sideways: you can be quiet in a subway
        Fefonz Quan: Hey adams, long time :0
        Fefonz Quan: ;)
        Samuel Okelly: hi ad :)
        Adams Rubble: Hello all. You are rezzing slowly :)
        Riddle Sideways: hi everybody that just came in
        Pila Mulligan: the places I've seen that are sponaneously the most uplifting have mostly been pretty quiet places
        Wol Euler: there are a lot of us today, adams, that will slow it down
        Pila Mulligan: an exception: waterfalls
        Solobill Laville nods
        Fefonz Quan: if you talk about 'holy" places, have you been to jerusalem?
        Pila Mulligan: not me Fefonz
        Wol Euler: not yet :)
        Samuel Okelly: me neither
        Solobill Laville: nope
        Riddle Sideways: very noisey city
        Fefonz Quan: as noisy as you can get
        Pila Mulligan: I'd love to see it though
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Pila Mulligan: wailing
        Samuel Okelly: i did live for a time in the marian shrine of lourdes in southern france
        Wol Euler: wow
        Wol Euler: do tell, please.
        Fefonz Quan: I have some dificulty with the notion that peace of mind should be conditioned by quite, "natural" places/surroundings
        Riddle Sideways: I do too
        Riddle Sideways: peace of mind comes from within
        doug Sosa: the old life was not quiet.
        Fefonz Quan: along with the new-age "getting back to the good old nature" stuff
        Pila Mulligan: ahh, it would be agreeable to me to have that qualification attached to my comment about quiet places, Fefonz
        Pila Mulligan: [13:11] Solobill Laville: Do you find that living "in the boonies" in conducive to...mmm...general contemplation (e.g. not just meditation speaking) [13:11] Pila Mulligan: definitely yes, Solo
        Pila Mulligan: where we began
        Pila Mulligan: there are places that are naturally meditative
        Fefonz Quan: yes, Sosa, i also think it is more fantasy than truth
        Pila Mulligan: there I will dispute your idea :)
        Pila Mulligan: it is not fanatsy
        Pila Mulligan: "getting back to the good old nature" stuff can be quite real
        Fefonz Quan: (i was talking about the "old life owas quite/better"
        Pila Mulligan: ah, excuse me -- I prefer indoor plumbing :)
        Wol Euler: the old life was hard as hell: short dirty and painful
        Fefonz Quan: :)
        Fefonz Quan: yes, Wol
        Solobill Laville: And no internets :)
        Scathach Rhiadra nods
        Wol Euler gasps
        Riddle Sideways: gasps
        Samuel Okelly: i can understand how noisy places would only contribute to cluttered thought
        doug Sosa: not so short. many lived long. take a list of philosophers over the centuries, plato and socrates to start..
        Pila Mulligan: this is what occurred to me at Stim's talk yesterday, in just a few generations science and technology have redefined the world radically
        Fefonz Quan: i do agreee that the connection with nature is winded into our being,
        Solobill Laville: There is a reason that monks go away to caves or quiet monasteries
        Pila Mulligan: so the old world is not so far off in time
        Adams Rubble likes to get into the woods at least once a week
        Fefonz Quan: and we can use it on some level
        doug Sosa: meditation for me is not shurring out but letting in, and noises esp mechancical, get in the way.

    Tarmel joins us.

        Pila Mulligan: hi Tarmel
        Wol Euler: morning tarmel!
        Adams Rubble: Hello tarmel :)
        Samuel Okelly: i had a similar thought too pila
        Susi Alcott: hi Tarmel
        Solobill Laville: Heya, Tarmel :)
        Samuel Okelly: hi tam
        Wol Euler: wow, one more and we have a full circle.
        Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Tarmel:)
        Fefonz Quan: well, if i cando meditation in a cave, but not in my hoje in the city - i think i've missed something by large
        Solobill Laville: I like to hear your experiences, doug, it is so complimentary to mine :)
        Tarmel Udimo: hi everyone
        Riddle Sideways: due to this couple of days rain, we have frogs in the meadow
        Riddle Sideways: millions of them
        Riddle Sideways: they are all croaking at once
        Wol Euler: :)
        Riddle Sideways: then they stop
        Riddle Sideways: soon they startup again
        Fefonz Quan: i've experienced in some "urban retreats", with highways around
        Riddle Sideways: on all levelsI like that
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Adams Rubble: for 9 seconds?
        Riddle Sideways: there was a sound workshop I was at years ago
        Riddle Sideways: somebody has us all chanting Ohm
        Adams Rubble: (that was said a few lines ago :( )
        Riddle Sideways: or however it is speeled
        Pila Mulligan: ohm has more resistance :)
        Riddle Sideways: then he made us all be quiet
        Fefonz Quan: lol
        Pila Mulligan: om is more recptive :)
        Riddle Sideways: and we listened
        Solobill Laville: ha, Pila ;)
        Riddle Sideways: the breathing sounded part of the same sound
        Riddle Sideways: the cars on the highway sounded same
        Riddle Sideways: the dogs, ppl,everything makingnoise
        Fefonz Quan: yes
        Pila Mulligan: hi Anonymous1

    A newbie joins us and we make a complete circle around the fountain, for the first time in any of my sessions!

        Anonymous1: figli di puttana
        Anonymous1: hi
        Riddle Sideways: we part of that sound
        Anonymous1: can i ask u something ?????
        Riddle Sideways: when annoyed at the roar of life
        Solobill Laville: Hello, Anonymous1
        Riddle Sideways: I try to remember that lesson
        Wol Euler: sure
        Anonymous1: u know were is the number one
        Pila Mulligan: I appreciate your comment Riddle, and agree
        Pila Mulligan: between 0 and 2
        Fefonz Quan: here - 1
        Solobill Laville: Suzuki Roshi talked about sound and noise, and objective vs. subjective

    (This short talk is available at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHNyCAJXUXE)

        Solobill Laville notes the full circle!
        Anonymous1: so noone knows were is the nuber one ???
        Wol Euler cheers. we all get bonus karma points.
        Riddle Sideways: ah a full circle
        Fefonz Quan: ;-)
        Anonymous1: -.-
        Wol Euler: depends what you think it is, Anonymous1
        Pila Mulligan: where is the number one, Anonymous1?
        doug Sosa: number one?
        Solobill Laville: My Mom sometimes tells my Dad he's number by showing him her middle finger, true story
        Anonymous1: ita a hard core disco pub
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Anonymous1: gabber bich
        Solobill Laville: Ah, Sorry, I don't know it Anonymous1
        Wol Euler: ah, click on the "search" button at the bottom of your screen
        Pila Mulligan: oh, The Number One Hard Core Disco Pub, of course :)
        Wol Euler: go to the tab marked "places"
        Wol Euler: type there "number one" and hit Return
        Wol Euler: that will show you where it is
        Anonymous1: were is the mark place ???
        Anonymous1: yea
        Anonymous1: then what ?
        Pila Mulligan: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Flathead/106/174/24
        Wol Euler: ah well done, pila
        Pila Mulligan: click that ling Anonymous1
        Solobill Laville: Well, Suzuki's point, I believe, was that "sound" as an objective experience helps us to nurture that mindful contemplative place
        Pila Mulligan: link*
        Riddle Sideways: Flat head ? :)
        Solobill Laville: Sounds can help
        Adams Rubble: hard core Riddle :)
        Solobill Laville: "Noise" is another thing... :)
        Adams Rubble: yes Bill
        Fefonz Quan: when practicing vipashyana, all those sounds are a part of the meditation
        Fefonz Quan: all rise as appearances, stays and go away
        Riddle Sideways: yes
        Fefonz Quan: and part of the practice is not hanging onto them
        Anonymous1: yo i found on group number one but how do i tele there ???
        Riddle Sideways: therein lays the very hard part
        Fefonz Quan: both in the negative (may it go away) way, or the positive (ah, the beautiful sounds of birds)
        Solobill Laville nods
        Fefonz Quan: i find it a very good practice
        Solobill Laville: Appreciation is very possible, however...just appreciation, without any "positive" baggage
        Fefonz Quan: yes, solo
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Fefonz Quan: and it's surprising how you can appereciate noises
        Fefonz Quan: that are naturally annoying
        Anonymous1: tell me what do i need to do 1 on 1 plz
        Adams Rubble: yes
        Scathach Rhiadra: :)
        Anonymous1: im new here
        Pila Mulligan: Anonymous1, try clicking on this-- http://slurl.com/secondlife/Flathead/106/174/24
        Anonymous1: i started this now
        Solobill Laville: Welcome to SL, Anonymous1 :)
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Riddle Sideways: welcome, not even born yesterday
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Anonymous1: i dont understand what u sad man im italian srry
        Adams Rubble: born of Friday the Thirteenth
        Solobill Laville: Pila, is that link the club Anonymous1 is looking for?
        Adams Rubble: yes
        Pila Mulligan: I believe so
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Pila Mulligan: Number One Hard Core Disco Club
        Fefonz Quan: Anonymous, after clicking the link, there is a new window with "teleport" on it - click it then
        Solobill Laville: Anonymous1, if you'e like to go to that club, you can click on this link: http://slurl.com/secondlife/Flathead/106/174/24
        Pila Mulligan: maybe we should all go there :)
        Solobill Laville: And if so, have fun! :)
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Riddle Sideways: :D
        Susi Alcott: (wanted to open the circle for the energy to get free)
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Riddle Sideways: I have yet to go to those places
        Wol Euler: thats odd, Susi, I thought of energy flowing when we were all together completing the circle :)
        Riddle Sideways: TY susi
        Solobill Laville: Well, we have 5 minutes left!
        Wol Euler: Anonymous1 seems to have worked it out
        Pila Mulligan: only 5 minutes?
        Fefonz Quan: well, i got that energy now :)
        Solobill Laville: I've never been to a Hard Core Disco Club
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Solobill Laville: is 5 minutes enough time?
        Solobill Laville: ;)
        Pila Mulligan: probably not
        Wol Euler: for quickie
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Solobill Laville: Alas... ;)
        Riddle Sideways: :O
        Fefonz Quan: as the buddha is pointing to the moon, we the humble ones point to namber one HC disco :)
        Pila Mulligan: it takes longer than that to bribe the door security
        Adams Rubble: hehe
        Solobill Laville: lol

    Just then Doug vanished.

        Solobill Laville: Ooh, doug went there
        Adams Rubble giggles
        Pila Mulligan: maybe he will bring a scouting report
        Solobill Laville: :))
        Fefonz Quan: or a companion :)
        Riddle Sideways: Doug thought his duty to guide him
        Solobill Laville: or two...
        Wol Euler: that didn't take him long
        Solobill Laville: lol
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Wol Euler: wb doug
        Solobill Laville: wb doug
        Adams Rubble: wb Doug
        Pila Mulligan: hi doug, how was #1 HCDC
        Susi Alcott: wb doug
        Solobill Laville: LOL
        Wol Euler: I am always amazed by the things that newbies know about SL.
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Pila Mulligan: that may be the only reason Anonymous1 came to SL Wol :)
        Riddle Sideways: they all read that same article
        doug Sosa: boring? no, well.
        Adams Rubble: same sentence with Wow instead of SWol
        Wol Euler: possibly. Many people come here for virtual sex and are surprised to find that it is a world.
        Susi Alcott: on of my friend told that he read all the possible befor his rezzing day of SL
        Riddle Sideways: few do
        Tarmel Udimo: hows that susi did the energy change :-)
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Wol Euler: you seem to have caught some of it, tarmel.
        Fefonz Quan: well, yuo do float Tarm :)
        Susi Alcott: it got free :)
        Tarmel Udimo: yes if only in rl
        Wol Euler: :)
        Tarmel Udimo: yeah but now iots stuck on me :-)
        Samuel Okelly: given the largely single-viewed bias that SL has across the UK media it is hardly
    surprising that ppl come here with the expectation of "sexual" reward
        Susi Alcott: to open the circle is like to do this _/!\_
        Pila Mulligan: true Sam, it has earned a reputation in that arena
        Susi Alcott: not without the reasons
        Fefonz Quan: well, the web as a whole in average is doing the same
        Wol Euler: yep, all these years on it is still the only thing many journalists can think of to say about it.
        Tarmel Udimo: well sorry folks I have to go to pheono hopefully see you all again :-)
        Adams Rubble: bye tarmel
        Pila Mulligan: bye Tarmel
        Solobill Laville: :) Bye, Tarmel
        Wol Euler: bye tarmel, enjoy your saturday.
        Scathach Rhiadra: see you there
        Susi Alcott: know people who's found true marriage in SL
        Wol Euler: mmhmm
        Solobill Laville: me too
        Pila Mulligan: bye Scath
        Pila Mulligan: and Solo
        Riddle Sideways: oooo, I could make2 meetings here while home sickly
        Samuel Okelly: I feel as though I have to use a newspaper shop analogy for SL to thse who are unfamiliar with it
        Wol Euler: oh, pheno, right.
        Scathach Rhiadra: bye all:)
        Adams Rubble: bye Scath :)
        Wol Euler: bye scath
        Fefonz Quan: i know people who found true love in the web :)
        Wol Euler: right, sam.
        Solobill Laville: See you Scath :)
        Susi Alcott: bye all who's leaving _/!\_
        Fefonz Quan: and you know too :)
        Pila Mulligan: bye Riddle, hope sickly becomes well soon
        Riddle Sideways: thanks all, c'ya
        Adams Rubble: bye Riddle
        Solobill Laville: Bye, Riddle
        Riddle Sideways: I hope so too
        Adams Rubble knows people who fell in love walking in nature
        doug Sosa: :)
        Fefonz Quan: going to pheno too, bye everybody :)
        Wol Euler: bye riddle, fef, take care
        Adams Rubble: bye Fefonz :)
        Pila Mulligan: bye Fefonz
        Samuel Okelly: tc fef
        Solobill Laville fell in love in Kalamazoo...
        Adams Rubble: :)
        Solobill Laville: Bye, Fefonz
        Wol Euler: awww, solo.
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Solobill Laville: There is something potent about nature and contemplation
        Adams Rubble: yes
        Solobill Laville: and especially sounds..
        Solobill Laville: Perhaps because, if nothing else, it is not visual
        Adams Rubble: as long as we are not being followed by a tiger
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Wol Euler: :)
        Solobill Laville: Which can overstimulate, perhaps
        Solobill Laville: hehe
        Susi Alcott: it is possibe to build the shealds agains sounds...smells...
        Susi Alcott: the lady living next to the railwaystation didn't here even that for the while the shields was on
        Solobill Laville: Is it good to do you think, Susi?
        Pila Mulligan: isn't that similar toone of the earlier meanings of the term sutra?
        Susi Alcott: for a while, but nowbody sure is not ment to live inside shealds; they work against the needed info too
        Adams Rubble must go now. bye all :)
        Pila Mulligan: bye Adams
        Wol Euler: bye adams, take care.
        Solobill Laville: Bye, Adams
        Samuel Okelly: tc ad :)
        Solobill Laville: Wasn't Sutta Pali for teaching?
        Susi Alcott: toone may change against for the sheal is builded, but I think you know what you are talking about
        Solobill Laville: I see your meaning, I think Susi. Perhaps in a "clarity" vs. "integration" way?
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Susi Alcott: the base is that the sheald is like 'golden mirror' as I call it
        Solobill Laville: Shields in a clarity perspective, the other as in integration
        Samuel Okelly: please excuse me every1. thanks for the discussion :)
        Susi Alcott: it can be builded three ways like walls in SL
        Pila Mulligan: bye Sam
        Susi Alcott: bye Sam
        Wol Euler: bye sam, take care
        Samuel Okelly: tc every1 :)
        Solobill Laville: Appearance as a reflection of reality (the golden mirror)?
        Solobill Laville: Bye, Sam
        Susi Alcott: either to see out or it or not
        Susi Alcott: well; the mirror is also reality
        Solobill Laville nods
        Solobill Laville: :) Show me what is not real
        Susi Alcott: smiles :)
        Wol Euler: heheheh
        Wol Euler: a koan.
        Susi Alcott: how to show such ?
        Solobill Laville: And, show me what IS real
        Solobill Laville: Right
        Susi Alcott: look at anything :)
        Solobill Laville: Better to just eat crackers with tea
        Susi Alcott: if you can see it, it's real
        Susi Alcott: maybe only to you, who knows, but it's real
        Solobill Laville: thx, Wol, I was getting all out of whack
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Wol Euler: if I cannot see it, is it still real?
        Susi Alcott: can be
        Susi Alcott: there's much such
        Pila Mulligan: to some degree yes, Wol
        Wol Euler: right :)
        Pila Mulligan: can you see Friday the 13th?
        Wol Euler: my not-seeing can as easily be mistaken as your sight.
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Susi Alcott: can see the letters and numbers because you wrote them
        Solobill Laville: But if by see we mean perceive - then what I am doing now, as the interaction btw
        Susi Alcott: can feel phenomenas around which created this day
        Solobill Laville: me and the engagement is really real
        Susi Alcott: so you can feel the truth so it's real
        Susi Alcott: to feel is also to 'see'
        Solobill Laville: ..."just"...
        Solobill Laville: nothing more :)
        Susi Alcott: _/!\_
        Wol Euler: thinking on that, perhaps intuition is not an extra sense that overlays our others,
        Wol Euler: but rather something deeper that happens when they all shut up for a moment
        Pila Mulligan: yep
        Pila Mulligan: when you can hear it, intuiution is valuable
        Susi Alcott: agree 130 %
        Susi Alcott: that is only one 'name' to sencies
        Solobill Laville: Put your mind in your belly, really try it if you haven't, and see what you see :)
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Susi Alcott: :)
        Wol Euler chuckles at the concept.
        Pila Mulligan: particularly the solar plexus :)
        Wol Euler is channeling James Brown :)
        Solobill Laville: the point is you take your "mind" out of your "brain"
        Solobill Laville: and intuition can breath a bit easier :)
        Pila Mulligan: http://www.alchemylab.com/c1alch-s1.jpg
        Susi Alcott: my mind sometimes in brain (?)
        Pila Mulligan: from a Chinese text, the image came to mind with Solo's suggestion
        Susi Alcott: well; hopefully
        Susi Alcott: hm
        Solobill Laville: Ancient Chinese pizza :)
        Pila Mulligan: :)
        Susi Alcott: might somebody like to build such golden mirror around my brain if I could then see either them or my mind :)
        Pila Mulligan: the next one in the sequence is even cooler ... just a sec
        Pila Mulligan: http://www.alchemylab.com/b1alch-s1.jpg
        Solobill Laville: Jewel in the Lotus?
        Wol Euler: baby in the lotus.
        Wol Euler thinks of the last scene of "2001"
        Solobill Laville: ah, yes, lil legs in there
        Solobill Laville: Thus spake Zarathustra
        Wol Euler: mmhmm
        Pila Mulligan: there is a third phase, but I cannot find it
        Pila Mulligan: these are illustrations from the Secret of the Golden Flower
        Wol Euler: http://www.alchemylab.com/a1alch-s1.jpg
        Wol Euler: perhaps?
        Solobill Laville: Yes, that looks the first one (a1)
        Susi Alcott: I cannot see them atm
        Pila Mulligan: nope, that is the starting one Wol
        Solobill Laville: Folks, I must now play Spiderman and order Chinese food
        Wol Euler cheers
        Pila Mulligan: bye Solo, chop chop
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Wol Euler: take care solo, order well and don't spare the fried rice.

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