2009.08.13 01:00 - Buddha's Final Moments

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Fael Illyar. The comments are by Fael Illyar.

    Fael Illyar: Hi Arch :)
    Fael Illyar: Hi Qt :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Greetings Qt
    Fael Illyar: Hi Star :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Howdy sis
    Stargate Tone: Hello Fael; Qt and my bro :)***
    Stargate Tone: sry Fael I again slept....
    Fael Illyar: No problem :)
    Qt Core: hi Stargate
    Stargate Tone: ah; the transltor seems to be very 'intelligent' today :)
    Fael Illyar: Yes, amusing translation :)
    Stargate Tone: it seems to know that one needs to lay down if sleeps :)*
    Stargate Tone: well; joke that might not been able to translate 'back' in english...donno
    Archmage Atlantis: I wish my body would listen to the translator, this office chair is mighty uncomforable after 2 hours of sleep
    Stargate Tone: ah yes; words can be soooo cute thing too when used 'wrong' :)*
    Stargate Tone: ah yes *
    Fael Illyar: Yes, very cute sometimes :)
    Stargate Tone: hm
    Fael Illyar: Unable to sleep, Arch?
    Stargate Tone: btw; some people has a 'habbit' to fell asleep in the chair...
    Stargate Tone: just noticed to think....
    Stargate Tone: as I've take that always to be awful...to sleep on the chair
    Stargate Tone: no matter if armchair
    Archmage Atlantis: Well, i got in bed and went sound asleep at a normal hour......but 2 hours later the doorbell rang and someone was pounding on the door
    Fael Illyar: The rest is different when it's in a chair.
    Stargate Tone: do you Fael know something good of it ?
    Archmage Atlantis: Apparently the repo man didn't get the bank's instruction to come at 9AM my time tomorrow......since then, not so much rest
    Stargate Tone: that's bad Arch
    Archmage Atlantis: Maybe, maybe not
    Fael Illyar: good of sleeping in a chair? Only that it does save you from sleep deprivation.
    Stargate Tone: think I know what you mean; when is awake, on collects much information at least, maybe much experiencies too...
    Stargate Tone: deprivation
    Archmage Atlantis: Riisto? isn't that a rice dish, like "riisto y bise"
    Stargate Tone: ah no
    Stargate Tone: that's the main prob o human kind
    Stargate Tone: yet; my mind cannot understand how to sleep can be such...
    Archmage Atlantis: Or maybe"y bisi"
    Fael Illyar: sleep deprivation, means getting too little sleep
    Stargate Tone: as I've learned that one shouldn't ever needed to 'push' to awake, that it is always deprivation
    Stargate Tone: ahhh
    Stargate Tone: ok
    Stargate Tone: (tried hard to understand your sentence after knowing that word in finnish
    Archmage Atlantis: Just trying to polk QT (gently)
    Fael Illyar: try what you translator says for "sleep deprivation" :)
    Stargate Tone: polk
    Stargate Tone: sleep deprivation
    Stargate Tone: lol
    Qt Core: i wonder how RL know when i'm here to start calling me here and there all around home
    Fael Illyar: well, not quite what I meant either :)
    Stargate Tone: lol
    Stargate Tone: so
    Qt Core: i just got to grab a couple sentence about sleep (or lack of it)
    Stargate Tone: deprivation
    Stargate Tone: tried that word again
    Stargate Tone: so; is that word as single translated the right way in finnish ?
    Fael Illyar: yes, quite closely.
    Stargate Tone: ok
    Stargate Tone: then I dont need to correct my opinion that deprivation is the most bad prob of man kind
    Fael Illyar: but it's not an exact match for all cases, of course :)
    Stargate Tone: so very true
    Stargate Tone: has life done that deprivation to you Qt that you have not had possibility to sleep ?
    Archmage Atlantis: The definition from the English/American Dictionary on line is
    Fael Illyar: deprivation is usually used when there is no-one in specific who can be said to be doing it.
    Qt Core: yes, i have lost a lot of sleep hours in last couple years
    Stargate Tone: that's always tough thing
    Archmage Atlantis: "the condition if being robbed of sleep, in real life or in experiment, aa opposed to being unable to sleep
    Fael Illyar: and to exploit would be word that is used when there is a clear doer.
    Qt Core: and not for lack of trying ;-)
    Stargate Tone: ahh
    Fael Illyar: but for exploit, it has two possible translations to Finnish. "hödyntää" and "riistää"
    Stargate Tone: well; so has it been so that there is not must for you to be awake, but not been able to sleep even tried ?
    Stargate Tone: so....there's not so huge much difference between finnish words...
    Archmage Atlantis: Tonight is the first time in 2 weeks I was able to just fall asleeep
    Archmage Atlantis: And the repo man robbed me of it
    Stargate Tone: so; might this exploit be the better word to descirbe the most bad thing among human kind; what people so much do to each other
    Stargate Tone: oh
    Qt Core: for me things to be done and nervousness that made it useless even to try to go to bed untill it leave me
    Stargate Tone: -> Arch; then that is even worse
    Stargate Tone: ah well...Qt...some people has turned to me also for them sleep probs
    Stargate Tone: ...got also help to that; more or less
    Stargate Tone: but most of them have got rid of them probs...
    Archmage Atlantis: Nerves, worries, problems can, in English, rob you of sleep as well as people
    Stargate Tone: yes
    Stargate Tone: they can be also been won...
    Qt Core: most of it comes from the declining health and rising needs of a family member
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Archmage Atlantis: Hey,, even if one has no family members....unless one includes oneself as a/the family member
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Stargate Tone: each 'case' is one's own
    Qt Core: sure, that was/is my sleep deprivation source
    Qt Core: some night o got it good and i can... lose sleep on my own problems ;-)
    Archmage Atlantis: I think nuance word is "sleepless" as it comes without a judgement of causation
    Archmage Atlantis: But English is probably the least precise language
    Archmage Atlantis: It absorbs everything
    Stargate Tone: would there be wrong to say 'restless' ?
    Fael Illyar: it would have a different meaning... it's translated as "rauhaton"
    Qt Core: english has a lot of words, but many are in technical areas/jargon, the core is quite small
    Stargate Tone: but I mean that if we think the cause why one is sleepless...
    Fael Illyar: but often does mean sleepless as a result.
    Archmage Atlantis: That would be close, of course, the next question another would ask is "What was causing you to be restless"
    Stargate Tone: yes
    Stargate Tone: ....or...
    Stargate Tone: could there be possibility to find peace...
    Stargate Tone: peace of mind...
    Archmage Atlantis: I suppose that is one way to look at it QT......Vocabulary depending on who you are talking to, can use the same word for a different idea
    Stargate Tone: as all those questions have been 'the answer' to people turned to me and started to sleep better
    Stargate Tone: and yes; that can be based also onto the 'angle' how one observes the phase
    Archmage Atlantis: Frankly, the legend of Bable rings more likely a future than the notion of Singularity
    Stargate Tone: or...is attitude better word to that ...
    Archmage Atlantis: Either or both I think Star
    Stargate Tone: as so many people has the 'attitude' that one must....this and that...even one cannot...
    Archmage Atlantis: Most crave certainty, and respond to diversity with fear
    Stargate Tone: that is very common problem with people having such fear that is not so much understood as the fear; to feel responsibility
    Stargate Tone: but that also is the fear when it's too much...
    Archmage Atlantis: I think I need to poke QT again, either he is asleep in his chair, or RL has intruded
    Archmage Atlantis: *chuckles*
    Qt Core: no, i'm here, never been able to sleep on a chair (if it is not a car/bus/train/plane seat)
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Archmage Atlantis: Ah, the comparison to the rocking motion of a small child by the young one's mothere
    Archmage Atlantis: *mother
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Qt Core: i have a friends that even if he sleeps has problems starting to sleep and when we went on a cruise (twice) he always said the rolling ship made him start to sleep in seconds
    Stargate Tone: smiles *
    Stargate Tone: ---cannot but take that to be sweet
    Archmage Atlantis: *smile*
    Stargate Tone: thinking that this your friend has that fear....
    Stargate Tone: 'responsibility'
    Stargate Tone: and the 'mom's rocking lap' 'gives' him/her the permission to sleep
    Qt Core: ha has many activities and interest, yes, i can see him unable to stop his mind
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Archmage Atlantis: Sounds like a good idea for an invention
    Qt Core: maybe an hammoc is enough ;-)
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Stargate Tone: well...one person having that same and for the same reason learned with the thought that 'what I have not time to do in my this life I can do in the next..or the next...or..
    Stargate Tone: there can be this thought as the medicine too; 'to take a sleep now, I can do things better tomorrow'
    Archmage Atlantis: That is why I am glad that the creator is trimming dowm my life for me
    Archmage Atlantis: What is left, will be the essentials for this time in reality
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Qt Core: that is if you believeyou'll have multiple shot at life
    Archmage Atlantis: The other decades were just preparation
    Stargate Tone: or enough experiences that has prooven that so that one cay say 'I know'
    Archmage Atlantis: Well, I see not proof for or against, so I figure I get to choose which I prefer
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Stargate Tone: and that 'second' thought I brought up needs not to have the knowledge of eternall life
    Archmage Atlantis: Not all are given "sight" Star, so of us have only logic and reason to trust
    Stargate Tone: as that's been even scientificly prooven, that if one is fresh/slept well, one does things better
    Archmage Atlantis: Until we find, they too are limited and of this world
    Qt Core: it does not even need science, just common sense ;-)
    Stargate Tone: smiles *
    Stargate Tone: ah yes; the common sence is the most good medicine *
    Fael Illyar: yes, why require scientific proof for something that's obvious to anyone with their eyes open? :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Qt, would you define the words "common sense"
    Qt Core: i used to be almosw always well rested and only now that i'm often not well rested really notice the difference the rare day i can sleep well and enough
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Stargate Tone: well...
    Stargate Tone: ...for a while there's been on 'story' rising very strongly from my chest
    Qt Core: ;-) fael, hard task ;-)
    Fael Illyar: Qt, unfortunately, yes.
    Fael Illyar: sure, do tell :)
    Stargate Tone: even my (a lttle tired mind has not yet cleared up the connection to the topic)
    Stargate Tone: as that is told different ways; the longer way, that what Buddha experienced when he sat under the bodhi tree...
    Stargate Tone: as the 'short' way is to tell that he found reality
    Archmage Atlantis: The short way is a conclusion and reveals nothing
    Stargate Tone: so; depends on what one takes to be reality...one understand Buddhas excperience or not...
    Stargate Tone: as the longer 'version' is to tell the grace and happyness what Buddha experienced
    Stargate Tone: cuz he saw the whole world to be so beautiful just as it is
    Stargate Tone: such grace he felt, that is not easy to describe with words...but if one can 'see' the light which rose from his existence...
    Stargate Tone: the happyness and glory of human world...as it is...of it's reality
    Stargate Tone: ...'end'...of the 'story'...
    Archmage Atlantis: That is enlightenment.....that all things are as they should be in this moment
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Stargate Tone: ...could be...maybe not...
    Archmage Atlantis: Pray tell, if not, then what?
    Stargate Tone: maybe it's also to see what's illusion...and leave that part of the world not to look at,,,
    Stargate Tone: to let it go...
    Archmage Atlantis: On this we disagree, and if that is what Siddhartha felt, that some part should not be looked at, then more enlightenment is to come
    Fael Illyar agrees with Arch.
    Stargate Tone: when one creates the illusion to his mind, that one is for example all mighty god ; wouldn't that illusion be good to let go ?
    Archmage Atlantis: That is a different thing altogether
    Stargate Tone: disagree
    Archmage Atlantis: Then we agree to disagree
    Stargate Tone: cuz there's huge much such people whos' got that attitude
    Archmage Atlantis: And they have not yet experienced enlightenment
    Qt Core: i have to go
    Fael Illyar: See you later Qt :)
    Stargate Tone: and yes; that was what Siddharta did....let all those illusions and the world created based on them to vanish from his mind; he let himself to have peace, that he cannot save the whole world....so; why to worry such that one cannot change
    Qt Core: Ciao!
    Archmage Atlantis: Blessings to you Qt
    Stargate Tone: restfull time to you Qt *
    Archmage Atlantis: In what you just said Star, lies 1 word that is our difference
    Fael Illyar: an illusion in one's mind is a part of the world.
    Stargate Tone: as long one keeps that illusion
    Stargate Tone: so; as well Buddha could see only his world...
    Archmage Atlantis: Well, that was the 1st time the 90 seconds of silence got observed
    Stargate Tone: ...or was the natural need to be in silence (to me)
    Archmage Atlantis: We did not see you in SL yesterday, Star.....your not here-ness was noted.
    Stargate Tone: ah...you mean my 'normal' time...as I dorpped by on Finnish daytime
    Stargate Tone: ...was not able to log in more...
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes, I suppose so as it was Ari and I who had the thought, and his time is the same as mine.
    Archmage Atlantis: I'm assuming, changing the subject, that this isn't the usual flavor of the PaB sessions
    Fael Illyar: I'm not sure if there is an usual flavor.
    Stargate Tone: flavor
    Stargate Tone: well; so many honest and open persons I know to gather here
    Archmage Atlantis: Well with 4 chances a day, I should get the routine down fast enough
    Stargate Tone: that I'de say the 'flavor' to be 'sangha'....
    Stargate Tone: as yes Arch; there is no other 'routine' but that people gather here
    Stargate Tone: sometimes there can be even three people having silence ; saying only 'hi' and 'bye'
    Archmage Atlantis: Well, having read the founder's profile and web info, he is a unique individual who would attract uniqueness
    Stargate Tone: then can also be that only two persons and chat is full of text :)*
    Fael Illyar: and the bells... although that's a voluntary one.
    Stargate Tone: and yes; thankfully only few persons likes to remind of that...when somebody 'brakes the rule'
    Fael Illyar: not everyone has realized it's voluntary :)
    Stargate Tone: and yes; I've heared much people to experienced bad things for that ment brake....but not heared anybody to thank it so
    Archmage Atlantis: The 90 second rule, or the th 15 minutes
    Archmage Atlantis: *the
    Stargate Tone: no matter; the whole thing that one must cut one's speech
    Fael Illyar: either/both
    Fael Illyar: no must there. It's voluntary
    Stargate Tone: ah; that I didn't know
    Archmage Atlantis: Cause big brother is still recording.....
    Archmage Atlantis: I was thinking of bios about how enlightened we all are
    Archmage Atlantis: "snickers"
    Stargate Tone: bios
    Stargate Tone: bios
    Stargate Tone: bio
    Star is using an English to Finnish translator that the autorecorder unfortunately does not record. But this time it stayed silent.
    Archmage Atlantis: biography
    Stargate Tone: hm...translator slept :)*
    Stargate Tone: ah...think I 'got it'
    Archmage Atlantis: The way the economy has been, the poor translater is probably trying to keep it's circuit boards from being repossessed
    Fael Illyar: heh :)
    Archmage Atlantis: I don't care, as Popeye says, I yam what I yam
    Stargate Tone: smiles *
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Archmage Atlantis: Poor Adam, he didn't know what he was getting us all into when God took that rib
    Stargate Tone: I truly do not envi you *
    Stargate Tone: rib
    Stargate Tone: hm
    Stargate Tone: hoping that 'Adam' never blaimes 'himself' from that doings...
    Archmage Atlantis: Yep the translator is definitely having circuit board repo problems
    Archmage Atlantis: I don't think he did, probably too much like most men, easily distracted by many things
    Stargate Tone: smiles *
    Stargate Tone: but you know what...your that sentence kind of 'hit' me...just that I replaced the name 'Adam' to be 'Ekhnaton/Akhunaton/Akhunaten'
    Archmage Atlantis: Funny that
    Stargate Tone: ah...well...U know what 'base faults' he made ?
    Archmage Atlantis: Ok, its time for me to get up out of the bed I'm not in and start a day I haven't rested for........
    Stargate Tone: well; just this more
    Stargate Tone: as he created them laws that also women are free; not under men to rule over
    Stargate Tone: so; wishing you to get good rest; verry good rest
    Archmage Atlantis: Now that really sounds like a woman, being gay, I'm not claiming any part of that folly
    Stargate Tone: knowing for sure that sometimes 'too little sleep' is not only bad thing
    Archmage Atlantis: Nite and blessings to you both, mi familia
    Fael Illyar: Have a good rest, Arch :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Adios
    Fael Illyar: Well, I only slept for 6 hours before getting up for this meeting so I'll head to bed to rest a bit before doing anything else.
    Stargate Tone: _/!\_
    Fael Illyar: See you later :)
    Stargate Tone: sleep well *
    Stargate Tone: C U later
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