2009.08.09 01:00 - Right and wrong?

Moon Fargis: morning star:))
Stargate Tone: Good Morning
--BELL--
Stargate Tone: hearts
Stargate Tone: hearts
Moon Fargis: 10
Moon Fargis: 15
Moon Fargis: moring fael!
Stargate Tone: morning Fael :)***
Fael Illyar: Morning Moon, Star :)
Fael Illyar: ah, slideshow :)
Moon Fargis: yes from yesterday
Fael Illyar: I took a couple snapshots too :)
Moon Fargis: ahhh you uploaded them ?
--BELL--
Fael Illyar: not yet at least.
Fael Illyar: 8 of them :)
Moon Fargis: ^^
Fael Illyar: there, uploading them to picasa now
Fael Illyar: http://picasaweb.google.com/fael.ill...eat=directlink
Fael Illyar: I took them quite late, though so none from the beginning :)
Fael Illyar: the last one I took and realized 'Oh, it's over.'
Moon Fargis: :))
Moon Fargis: yes idnt assume time goes by so fast
Fael Illyar smiles.
Moon Fargis: morning bert
Fael Illyar: Hi Bert :)
Bertram Jacobus: hello all and where is morning : morning :-D
Stargate Tone: good morning Bert :)
Bertram Jacobus: ty for all you geve me star ... :-)
Bertram Jacobus: gave
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Stargate Tone: your very welcome :)*
Bertram Jacobus: so highs and lows come and go ... yesterday i had a very sad happening here : i choosed a kind of heavy example for the question wheather there is "right" and "wrog" (i guess yes (!)) ... ;-) - and one of the participants found that too harsh - that was not clever from me : i did not know him before, should have been more aware ... :-/
Fael Illyar: That's how you learn to know people...
Stargate Tone: or there sensitiveness on the moment
Moon Fargis: yep especially with such a tpic that highly depends on beliefe
Moon Fargis: believe
Stargate Tone: hoping U Bert dont think much bad that You took such topic...think that it's possible for the person to ask to close the topic too...
Stargate Tone: thinking that nowbody can be the guardian of one's words all the time...or what rises to speak about
Fael Illyar: yes, mistakes happen, you forgive and go on.
Bertram Jacobus: yes : that will be a great reminder for me ... but the price was / is high ...
Moon Fargis: man kann es nicht jeden recht machen :)
Bertram Jacobus: i hurt a person ... :-/
Stargate Tone: well; I once...as my mom was dying...couldn't take the topic of death...
Bertram Jacobus: i was unaware
Stargate Tone: so I said that in chat
Bertram Jacobus: i could have done it really better
Bertram Jacobus: so it was not right ;-)
--BELL--
Fael Illyar: no, it went the way it did. You couldn't choose better.
Stargate Tone: well; as my request not to talk about was not heared; I went off
Stargate Tone: as that also is always the option to all of the people here
Stargate Tone: so; in case you take that you had hurted somebody; it's been also his/her choice to hear what you said...
Stargate Tone: did he/she ask you to stop the topic ?
Bertram Jacobus: but fael - i see that in two relations : first : yes : i could not do better : otherwise i would have done. but second : i choosed a bad example for the topic and only then i took a good one. "could have done that at once, before" - without having chosen the bad one
Bertram Jacobus: no, it was not the topic, it was the example
Fael Illyar: It takes time to come up with good examples...
Bertram Jacobus: sure, but ... "okay" - ty all for your friendly reactions ...
Bertram Jacobus: i wished he was here
Stargate Tone: well...was U here those times when there was this Samuel hurting ppl 'around' ?
Bertram Jacobus: i ´ll try to apologize ...
Bertram Jacobus: no
Stargate Tone: well; thinking that all of the people here tried to help him to see how he hurted....
Bertram Jacobus: i see
Stargate Tone: he never truly listened to what othere people said
Stargate Tone: well...finally he 'disappeared'
Bertram Jacobus: yes. that the other person said to me : at least i would listen ... it was a really unhappy coming together of circumstances yesterday ...
Stargate Tone: to apologize is sure good thing; you can also leave the note card or IM message
Stargate Tone: so; pls hear his/her own words; he/she chooced
Stargate Tone: well; this man who didn't listen to anybody's true words, but added his own to them and left others off ; how was his mood each time
Stargate Tone: but...the last time I 'saw' him, I felt that 'something' happened in him....
Stargate Tone: like he'd openend to 'something'
Stargate Tone: and I think there happened some wound't opening to heal better
Bertram Jacobus: nice. all action is followed by reaction ...
Stargate Tone: and I later on heared a little better of him to be...
Stargate Tone: so,,,cuz this person last evening felt him/herself to be hurted for the example...
Stargate Tone: I cannot avoid to think that there was some wound....not healed completely
Stargate Tone: as that happenes so much...wounds can be healed not to hurt...yet...not to heal well
Bertram Jacobus: i see what you mean, but the same applies for me ...
Stargate Tone: so...something to open them...usually is also to heal them...
Stargate Tone: thinking that to all feeling and thinking beings...just the saem
Stargate Tone: same
Stargate Tone: as liḱe Moon so often compares human being to the tree
Stargate Tone: ...I use to do that thinking how human being and tree do grow up
Stargate Tone: from inside
Stargate Tone: so...as well the true healing happenes from inside...
Stargate Tone: not setting the bandage onto the wound...it only hides the pain
Bertram Jacobus: but i think, in the end there is no difference even between inside and outside (?) ...
Stargate Tone: well; meaning this
Stargate Tone: in case one only forget and go on; there can the wound stay....
Stargate Tone: but if one 'meets' the matter; heals it not to hurt anymore
--BELL--
Fael Illyar: a wound that is only hidden, is not truly gone.
Bertram Jacobus: so ... you all think, that there is no right or wrong i fear ? ... ;-)
Moon Fargis: you fear to make the mistake agan
Fael Illyar: yet, it's up to you to decide what the mistake was and whether it was a mistake.
Bertram Jacobus: no. i was kidding a bit :
Bertram Jacobus: ;-)
Fael Illyar: but to answer your question, yes, there is right and wrong but it's not so simple that just simply hurting someone would decide it.
Stargate Tone: well; is it Fael so simple ?
Bertram Jacobus: wonderful fael - at least somebody who doesn´t deny that question ... :-)
Fael Illyar: Star, why not?
Stargate Tone: trying to find words with my laggy english
Bertram Jacobus: ah ! i mentioned the same problem yesterday and sometimes : laggy english is a nice description :-)
Fael Illyar smiles.
Stargate Tone: as the base truth surely is, that each one always makes the choice by oneself, if to judge something to be mistake or not
Stargate Tone: that's the fact...even many people try to accuse other people for there choices...
Stargate Tone: that it is no question if to do that or not; one does it always and anyway
Stargate Tone: but...maybe to think that the mistake (cuz somebody was hurted) comes to be that only if the mistake is tried to heal with the new mistake; doing more wrong...
--BELL--
Stargate Tone: I'm understood now ?
Fael Illyar: I'm confused... I can't see any conflict with what I meant.
Fael Illyar: are you talking of how to decide if something is a mistake or not?
Stargate Tone: well,,,take that it's not a question if one decides one's doing to been mistake or not, that it's obvious that one does the decicion always
Stargate Tone: but that the question is if to punish oneself for that and/or how or not...
Stargate Tone: and imo, nobody needs to punish oneself if honours other's pain and brings that out and that one didn't mean that
Fael Illyar: I find that I often can't tell if something was a mistake until days, weeks or even years later.
Stargate Tone: well; do you take that you dont do a mistake if you hurt somebody ?
Fael Illyar: too little information in that question to answer. It's not that simple.
Stargate Tone: sry; to me that is
Moon Fargis: well sometimes truth also hurts
Moon Fargis: but can truth be a mistake ?
Stargate Tone: sometimes even that can be the mistake to tell
Bertram Jacobus: i think talking can be a mistake and not to spaek can be better sometimes
Stargate Tone: ah yes; agree
Fael Illyar: even if, to not hurt now will mean much more hurt tomorrow?
Stargate Tone: can be so
Bertram Jacobus: that is what i do still very often in a wrong way for my opinion : i don´t be silent enough ...
Fael Illyar: would that still be a mistake to hurt the little now, instead of a lot tomorrow?
Stargate Tone: could be so too Fael
Stargate Tone: ah Bert; I've never met person who's perfectly known always if to keep silence or not
Bertram Jacobus: i don´t think so fael, but one has to be very wide seeing to do such things in a good manner - iw ould doubt often if i could do so
Stargate Tone: but...like you thought that U want to apologize; that's the best way to live to my opinion
Fael Illyar: it's often not possible consciously, yes.
Stargate Tone: well; to my opinion it's not good to 'stick' people with sayings, specially if one donno the effect of them
Stargate Tone: but it's so huge much differncies of timing and how private the moment is and so
Fael Illyar: that's why I say it's not so simple that you could simple say "to hurt someone is a mistake"
Stargate Tone: and like you know that I've said that even the truth should not be said to the person who's not got possibility to understand that in proper time
Stargate Tone: well...if your not ment to hurt; wouldn't that them be the mistake...to me that is...
Stargate Tone: completely other question is then what to do and what one can do....
Stargate Tone: so; the silence is very golden thing
Stargate Tone: but ; thinking whats to been said in the meeting like PaB is
Fael Illyar: doesn't look to me that you take "to hurt someone is a mistake" to be strictly true either though...
Stargate Tone: I think that nobody can know advantage if somebody get's hurted or not, before one has spoken
--BELL--
Fael Illyar: by the way, there was a butterfly that flew in to greet me yesterday :)
Fael Illyar: http://www.flickr.com/photos/fael-illyar/3800332343/
Stargate Tone: well; as I've said; the hurting can lead to healing; that's to make the bad thing to serve the good thing
Stargate Tone: **
Moon Fargis: ^^
Moon Fargis: nice!
Fael Illyar smiles 'So we agree.'
Stargate Tone: but...in case one dont take that hurting to been mistake, one cannot either even try to fix it..
Stargate Tone: and that's the thing to turn to be the wrong doind; imo
Stargate Tone: and yes; also to punish oneself for the mistake is -imo-bad thing
Fael Illyar: how do you fix hurting?
Stargate Tone: in case one has option to give any help to the hurted one
Stargate Tone: love is the first healer
Stargate Tone: you know that
Fael Illyar: Of course :) Just, the hurting happened, that can't be changed.
Stargate Tone: nope
Stargate Tone: only 'by time' if that time is healing time
Stargate Tone: if not...to wound continues to exist
Fael Illyar: does it require deciding causing the wound was a mistake to then heal it?
Moon Fargis: uh
Stargate Tone: well...think that everybody needs the reason to do or not to do; what ever that to do or not is...
Fael Illyar: Moon?
Moon Fargis: lets relax a bit :)
Fael Illyar smiles.
Stargate Tone: (Moon setting a bandage on the wound :) (?))
Moon Fargis: ^^
Fael Illyar laughs.
Moon Fargis: well had also the luck that a butterfly poses for me
Moon Fargis: http://picasaweb.google.com/Sylvio.K...09498135433682
Stargate Tone: ***
Fael Illyar: Ooh, nice picture :)
Bertram Jacobus: both very nice pictures ...
Stargate Tone: (so sencitive atm that would cry if I'de look them and see more than I see 'through you' )
Moon Fargis: ^^ you know it already star ^^
Stargate Tone: ah *
Stargate Tone: and yes; them butterflies are to me also the special messagers from my called upstairs office
Stargate Tone: messangers of love
Fael Illyar smiles.
Fael Illyar was very happy to find the butterfly in the kitchen window.
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Fael Illyar: I took a few photos, then helped it find the open window :)
Fael Illyar: was difficult as it was so scared of my finger that it didn't want to sit on it for long enough that I could get it out :)
Stargate Tone: *
Moon Fargis: ^^
Moon Fargis: ah satr, did you already saw those? http://picasaweb.google.com/Sylvio.K...27072009Zorge#
Moon Fargis: star
Moon Fargis: there was a butterfly lovefest :)
--BELL--
Moon Fargis: ah i mean loveparade
Moon Fargis: haha
Stargate Tone: hm
Stargate Tone: feels that I can look at them :)***
Stargate Tone: *grins*
Stargate Tone: ah yes; but was good to see again :)*
Fael Illyar smiles.
Bertram Jacobus: wonderful pictures moon ! :-))
Moon Fargis: ^^
Moon Fargis: feel free to look around, here i store those i like most: http://picasaweb.google.com/Sylvio.Kurze/Impressions#
Moon Fargis: what comes to sky impressions
Bertram Jacobus: so many impressions everywhere ! i´m not so fast ...
Stargate Tone: ah; you can save them addresses :)*
Moon Fargis: ^^ noone said you should be fast :)
Bertram Jacobus: i did it already :o) (saved it)
Stargate Tone: :)*
Moon Fargis: *streches*
Moon Fargis: well i should take care now for something to eat, and to pack my stuff, and clea up hikari :)
Stargate Tone: *
Moon Fargis: but this requires to stand up.. and.. ehh im too lazy :)
Fael Illyar smiles.
Bertram Jacobus: "okay" : i´ll take a pause from here now - was VERY nice this morning - ty all !
Stargate Tone: thank you Bert for sharing *
Moon Fargis: ^^
Moon Fargis: ok see you soon bert
Fael Illyar: See you later Bert :)
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Bertram Jacobus: yes. have a nice day ("and please : may be all beings happy") ...
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Fael Illyar: may all beings be happy :)
Bertram Jacobus: :-))
Moon Fargis: ^^ ok ill should retreat too , lots of stuff to take care of
Fael Illyar: I'll take a break as well :)
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Fael Illyar: See you two later :)
Stargate Tone: *
Moon Fargis: see you later ^^/
Fael Illyar: what time do you poof from SL Moon?
Moon Fargis: tomorrow
Moon Fargis: evening
Fael Illyar: Ok :)
--BELL--
Fael Illyar: have fun :)