2009.08.17 13:00 - On the sofa with us

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Stim Morane. The comments are by Stim Morane.

    Wol Euler: hello scathach
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Wol:)
    Wol Euler: how does one become Honourable in SL?
    Scathach Rhiadra: ah, join the right resident group!
    Wol Euler: ha, so simple.
    doug Sosa: hi
    Wol Euler: hello doug
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello doug
    Wol Euler: hello bertram too :)
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello bertrum
    doug Sosa: hi bert
    Wol Euler: storm is hiding out to the north of us, perhaps he'll come too :)
    Bertram Jacobus: my radar shows him : 33 meters away ... ;-)
    doug Sosa: how do you tell direction? Sun swt?
    Wol Euler: I have the minimap open always :)
    doug Sosa: set
    doug Sosa: ah.
    Wol Euler: I found it very convenient for giving directions to hapless newbies
    doug Sosa: i had no idea, I am surveilled!
    Bertram Jacobus: minimap is helpful. i agree. also to see others ...
    Wol Euler grins
    Wol Euler: hello hana
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello hana
    doug Sosa: hi han
    Hana Furlough: hi everyone~
    Bertram Jacobus: hello hana ... :-)
    Bertram Jacobus: hey stim :-)
    doug Sosa: stim :)
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello stim, corvi!
    Stim Morane: hi everyone
    Hana Furlough: hi stim~
    Bertram Jacobus: and corvi (i read that name in the - where ? somewhere in the net ... :o)
    Wol Euler: hello fael, stim, corvi
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi, Bertram...I am often in the log and emails.
    Hana Furlough: hi corv
    Fael Illyar: Hi Corvi, Bert, Pila, Stim, ol, Scath, Hana, doug, Storm :)
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello fael
    Hana Furlough: hi there fael~
    Bertram Jacobus: yes. that was it : emails "corvi" ... :-)
    Pila Mulligan: greetings
    Bertram Jacobus: and good evening from here to you too pia :-)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire smiles
    Bertram Jacobus: pila, sorry
    Wol Euler: helo pila
    Scathach Rhiadra: hello Pila
    Hana Furlough: hey pila~
    doug Sosa: hi all of you over there.
    Bertram Jacobus: and fael came also, very quiet (hi *whisper*) ... ;-)
    Hana Furlough: wow i was just thinking about pink blossoms
    Fael Illyar: I got this "test sculptie" done today :)
    Stim Morane: :)
    Fael Illyar: unfortunately, it needs at least 1.22 client to show up properly.
    Wol Euler: doug, come and sit by us. this feels like an interview panel with you alone over there.
    Bertram Jacobus: so hana you felt that already before it was presented now here ? (whaow) :-)
    doug Sosa: right, i am interviewing.. :)
    Stim Morane: we should interview YOU
    Wol Euler: thank you :)
    Hana Furlough: lol yeah i was thinking about pink buds... then i saw yor blossom
    doug Sosa: name no rank no serial number.
    Hana Furlough: it's so beautiful~
    Fael Illyar: it's 3 prims :)
    Hana Furlough: eeek! out of batteries
    Wol Euler wonders if there will be birdsong like this at the retreat.
    Hana Furlough: have wonderful afternoon
    Wol Euler: bye hana, hurry back
    Scathach Rhiadra: bye Hana
    Stim Morane: bye hana
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi Mick
    Wol Euler: hello mick
    Bertram Jacobus: hi mick :-)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye Hana
    Stim Morane: Hi mick
    Mickorod Renard: hiya
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello mick
    Mickorod Renard: hello
    Pila Mulligan: hi Mick
    Mickorod Renard: ;)
    Fael Illyar: Hi Mick :)
    Mickorod Renard: hi wester
    Fael Illyar: Hi Wester :)
    Bertram Jacobus: hello wester ... :-)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: hi wester
    Wol Euler: helo wester
    Scathach Rhiadra: hello Wester
    Stim Morane: hi wester
    doug Sosa: (hi)
    Wester Kiranov: and doug
    Wester Kiranov: and corvu etc
    Wol Euler: hello ara
    Mickorod Renard: hi ara
    Bertram Jacobus: hi ara ... :-)
    Pila Mulligan: hi Wester and Arabella
    Fael Illyar: Hi Ara :)
    Wester Kiranov: hi ara
    arabella Ella: Hiya everyone!
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello ara
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi, Ara.
    Stim Morane: hi arabella
    arabella Ella: oh hi Stim!
    Bertram Jacobus: hello tarmel ... :-)
    Mickorod Renard: hi tarmel
    Wol Euler: hello tarmel
    Fael Illyar: Hi Tarmel :)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi tarmel
    Stim Morane: hey tarmel
    arabella Ella: Hiya Tarmel!
    Wester Kiranov: were you discussing anything before this deluge of greetings?
    Wester Kiranov: hi tarmel
    Wol Euler: nope :)
    arabella Ella: good question :)
    doug Sosa: With lots of practice we are getting good at this. "Deluge". Love it.
    Mickorod Renard: silence is golden
    Tarmel Udimo: Hi Folks, couldn't get into SL, sorry I'm late:)
    Wester Kiranov: how did that happen to the fountain?
    Fael Illyar: I rezzed the flower I made today on it :)
    Wester Kiranov: and put it on low. I se.
    Fael Illyar: ah no, someone else put it on low :)
    Bertram Jacobus: 12 people - more then i ever saw here i guess and so quiet as i never experienced it before i guess ... :-)
    Mickorod Renard: its a challenge to my usual talkative self
    Wol Euler: I'd be very curious to know what people are really doing :)
    Mickorod Renard: i will tell u later wol
    Stim Morane: :)
    Wol Euler: :)
    Bertram Jacobus: i was reading some profiles. and "did nothing", also ... :-)
    doug Sosa: well, i must be in a mood cause i keep thinking of nasty things to say..
    Wol Euler: ok, so I'll start. In RL I am eating raspberries and cream, the enjoyment of which takes some of my attention. I'm listening to birdsong and trying to watch the arising of my thoughts as I do so.
    Wol Euler: and IMing too :)
    Wol Euler looks to bert.
    Bertram Jacobus: what do you see wol ? :-)
    Fael Illyar has been listening to the silence and wondering if he quieted people up by rezzing this lotu flower here.
    Wol Euler: oh, sorry, I was too busy typing to see that you had answered already :)
    Bertram Jacobus: uh. ah. okay ! :-))
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: I am sitting in a dark room decompressing after work, watching the screen and the flower and IMing.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: looks to Stim for the next "whatcha doin"
    Stim Morane: I'm not doing much ... just wondering what topic will emerge for discussion.
    Tarmel Udimo: wandering about whether Stim has any 'old selves' lurking or whether he's past that
    Stim Morane: I think everyone has those ... the issue is not to be someone who lacks them, but there there is "so self" in the first place.
    Stim Morane: *that there is no
    Wester Kiranov: I am quite enjoying having this slow conversation with you all
    Tarmel Udimo: sorry Wester I jumped in there:)
    Bertram Jacobus: i agree : slowlyness is wonderful ! ... :-)
    Pila Mulligan: this is an unusual morning for me, I'm dealing with a spam problem on a friend's server and on phone hold while waiting to get some information from the IRS (US tax agency) and being annoyed by Google mail insisting that I change my password
    Stim Morane: :)
    Wol Euler grins. Secretly busy
    Tarmel Udimo: yikes:)
    Pila Mulligan: too much so
    Stim Morane: Yes, some days are like that
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Tarmel Udimo: yesterday was like that:)
    Stim Morane: :)
    Wol Euler: doug, would you care to tell us about your mean & nasty mood, before you leave?
    doug Sosa: it is getting clearer. I felt like something was WRONG, and it turns out people aren't HERE.
    Wol Euler: ah :)
    Tarmel Udimo: hehehehe
    Wol Euler: you were missing us.
    doug Sosa: I was feeling my way. I've noticed of late my increasing sensitivity to the tone of the group. Almost uncanny. Don't know why it is happening.
    arabella Ella: :)
    Wol Euler smiles. Do you think it*s a good thing?
    doug Sosa: The other day i felt like pushig my hand through sand and coming up against some really sharp object, like a chunk of quartz with metal..
    arabella Ella: in RL u mean?
    doug Sosa: no, sitting here.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: a metaphor for experiencing "here?"
    Tarmel Udimo: the tone of the group that day? and today?
    arabella Ella: perhaps you could try the pond rather than sand?
    doug Sosa: it was how the group felt to me, not how the pond would feel. Different.
    Tarmel Udimo: and today Doug?
    doug Sosa: So today I felt absence but couldn't name it.
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Fael Illyar: Hi Isadora :)
    Wol Euler: hello isadora
    Tarmel Udimo: it does feel a bit like that.....
    Mickorod Renard: hi isi
    Bertram Jacobus: hi isadora :-)
    Stim Morane: hi isadora
    Pila Mulligan: hi Isadora
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Isadora
    Wester Kiranov: hi isa
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi, Isadora
    Tarmel Udimo: Hi Isadora
    Wol Euler: that's good, doug, you are "coming alive" in Second Life :)
    doug Sosa: and before?
    Wol Euler: before you were just here, perhaps :)
    doug Sosa: perhaps.
    Isadora Davidov: Hello, sorry for the interruption
    Wol Euler: I do have the impresssoin that your sensitivity to the group, to presence, to appearance even, is new.
    Bertram Jacobus: no sorry necessairy isa *think* ... :-)
    Isadora Davidov: Were you speaking to me?
    Bertram Jacobus: (yes, only besides isa) ... ;-)
    Tarmel Udimo: still thinking about - if there is no self why can't these old selves just disappear?
    arabella Ella: why should they?
    Isadora Davidov: Hmm, I'm not sure what the question is...?
    arabella Ella: our old selves are part of us
    Isadora Davidov: Oh..."self"
    Tarmel Udimo: yes it was referenced before - sorry Isadora
    Isadora Davidov: Thank you
    Fael Illyar: why would they need to?
    Mickorod Renard: is the self like an old jacket I can hang up in the wardrobe?
    Tarmel Udimo: well carrying them around makes for heavy lifting
    Mickorod Renard: oops
    arabella Ella: depends Tarmel on how you accept your old 'selves' I guess
    Tarmel Udimo: well even if one accepts, them loves them, beats them over the head with a big stick, do we need them?
    arabella Ella: are they not all part of what makes us what we are today?
    Wol Euler: depends how you define "need", perhaps?
    arabella Ella: would we not be very different if they had never 'been'?
    Mickorod Renard: I am taking my old self to a charity shop,,they can have it
    Stim Morane: ;)
    Wester Kiranov: :)
    Tarmel Udimo: well yes it would be good to be no lonfer defined by an old self:)
    Mickorod Renard: Stim promised me his anyway
    Tarmel Udimo: longer
    Tarmel Udimo: :)
    Wol Euler: to me that's part of the "older", Tarmel: tehy are no longer the active "us"
    Stim Morane: That's true, we just have to work out the shipping details, Mick
    arabella Ella: :)
    Tarmel Udimo: yes that's really my question:)
    Wester Kiranov: :D
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Mickorod Renard: hi Yaku
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hey everyone
    Wol Euler: hello yak
    Wester Kiranov: hi yaku
    arabella Ella: Hiya Yakuzza
    Pila Mulligan: hi Yak
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Yakuzza
    Fael Illyar: Hi Yaku :)
    Stim Morane: Hi Yakuzza
    Tarmel Udimo: Hi Yakuzza
    arabella Ella: if I may venture my humble opinion Tarmel
    Bertram Jacobus: for me, "self" and "i" does not make such a great difference. may be intellectual, but not essential ... only confusions wide spread about that in my opinion - is that too arrogant ? i don´t hope so (!) ...
    Bertram Jacobus: hello yaku ... :-)
    Isadora Davidov: Hello Yakuzza
    Tarmel Udimo: sure arabella:)
    arabella Ella: I try not to dwell too much on regret or on what 'could have been'
    arabella Ella: and i try to elimate 'should have done' from my vocabulary whenever possible
    Wol Euler nods
    arabella Ella: as the english expression goes
    arabella Ella: no point crying over spilt milk
    arabella Ella: it is the future that beckons
    Isadora Davidov: Very wise...but those thoughts and expressions do pop up as we tell our "story"
    Mickorod Renard: or the present
    arabella Ella: the present situation is what it is ... we can only act in such a way to attempt to create a better future self
    Isadora Davidov: Maintaing our story...helpful, not so helpful?
    Isadora Davidov: maintaining
    Wester Kiranov: but ... we can only act NOW
    Tarmel Udimo: gd point, except the future is not seperate from the past or the present so they are all coming with you whether you think they are or not
    arabella Ella nods
    arabella Ella: and as humans we tend to often repeat the same ... sometimes misguided ... actions ... but
    Fael Illyar: it's good to pay attention that you're not just changing your vocabulary... stopping using certain sentences only directs the same thoughts to another ways of expression unless the thoughts themselves change.
    Wol Euler: if that is true, then it follows that we cannot possibly lose our previous selves...
    arabella Ella: we can always say to ourselves we did what we thought best under the circumstances
    Isadora Davidov: Laughs..yes, all rolled up together, tangled up it all comes
    Wol Euler: so we'd better just shift over and make room for them on the sofa with us
    Fael Illyar: Hi Ari :)
    Bertram Jacobus: hello ariasia ... :-)
    Wester Kiranov: hi arisia
    Wol Euler: hello ari
    arabella Ella: Hiya Ari!
    Arisia Vita: hello to all my friends
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: hi Ari!!
    Stim Morane: hi arisia
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello ari
    Mickorod Renard: but we can start with the present,in hope that it will not corrupt the future
    Mickorod Renard: hiya ari
    Isadora Davidov: Well, I don't want to whitewash mistakes saying I was doing my best...such a tiny best as I look back
    arabella Ella: the only thing that really scares me to be honest is ...
    Isadora Davidov: Hello Arisia
    Tarmel Udimo: Hi Ari
    arabella Ella: that there are so many external influences that often affect the way we think and act
    arabella Ella: and i find that scarey as it involves a marginal lack or seeming lack of autonomy
    Isadora Davidov: What scares you?
    Isadora Davidov: Oh
    Fael Illyar: umm... why be scared of not having something that does not really exist...
    arabella Ella: external influences ... like our parental upbringing for example and how we tend to resemble our parents and their thoughts and actions more and more the older we grow
    Wester Kiranov: what is an external influence anyway, and what is internal?
    Wester Kiranov: (you answered before i asked)
    arabella Ella: :)
    Isadora Davidov: I do admire and want to develop the positive qualities my parents demonstrated
    arabella Ella: plus there are other constraints or influences that society and the media impose on us at times without our conscious noticing
    Bertram Jacobus: sounds nice isa ... :-)
    arabella Ella: so my question is ... how autonomous are we really?
    doug Sosa: must go. bye.
    Mickorod Renard: bye doug
    arabella Ella: bye doug
    Bertram Jacobus: [bye doug]
    Wol Euler: bye doug
    Pila Mulligan: bye doug
    Tarmel Udimo: bye doug
    Scathach Rhiadra: bye doug
    Mickorod Renard: didnt need a plaster for his hand did he?
    Isadora Davidov: Goodbye Doug
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye Doug
    Wester Kiranov: But in upbringing, for instance, there is always an element of choice as well. you can rebel or not, agree or not, admire or not ... those choices are internal.
    arabella Ella: are you sure about that Wester?
    arabella Ella: could it not perhaps be the case that
    arabella Ella: those who rebel have it in their genes to rebel ... or not to?
    Wester Kiranov: never completely sure, which is my point
    Scathach Rhiadra: good night all!
    Wester Kiranov: bye scath
    Stim Morane: bye Scathach
    Wol Euler: 'night scath, take care
    Tarmel Udimo: night Scath!
    arabella Ella: nite Scath
    Mickorod Renard: bye scath
    Pila Mulligan: bye Scath
    Bertram Jacobus: again and again i think : i don´t know anything. therefore play as being is also a nice idea to me ...
    Fael Illyar: bye Scath :)
    Isadora Davidov: Goodbye! Yes, I think certain traits are activated, either from the inborn or from the enviornment...and then...
    Isadora Davidov: and then...living, behaving, reacting, initiating...etc happens...all while we are so very young and immature
    Wester Kiranov: you can feel something is completely external to you and later find out you did have a choice, or the other way round
    Isadora Davidov: Ah, but you have to be skillful to realize there's a choice and then enact it
    arabella Ella: yes i often think that we feel we have a choice and after reflection over time find we did not have so much of a choice after all
    Mickorod Renard: at some parts of your life I dont think you recognise that anything is wrong
    Wester Kiranov: and what decides if we get skillful? is that just out own choice? practice?
    Wester Kiranov: and how do you decide to see or to ignore?
    Bertram Jacobus: i´ll leave. ty all , have a good time and may all beings be happy
    Isadora Davidov: Well, knowledge developing or coming to consciousness
    Wester Kiranov: bye bert
    Wol Euler: goodnight bertram, schlaf gut
    arabella Ella: perhaps one can learn to be skilful with sensitivity and experience ... perhaps ... i hope
    Mickorod Renard: bye bert
    Tarmel Udimo: bye Bertrum
    arabella Ella: bye Bert
    Stim Morane: bye bert
    Pila Mulligan: bye Bert
    Isadora Davidov: Goodbye Bertram
    Bertram Jacobus: tyty :-))
    Fael Illyar: Good night Bert :)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye Bert
    Pila Mulligan slips aways also -- bye for now
    Bertram Jacobus: ups- syry yaku :o)
    Mickorod Renard: bye pila
    Wester Kiranov: bye pila
    Wol Euler: bye pila
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Bye, Pila
    arabella Ella: bye Pila
    Tarmel Udimo: Bye Pila
    Isadora Davidov: Goodbye Pila
    Mickorod Renard: is the chance to reflect a generous oportunity in life?
    Wol Euler: depends entirely how you use it, Mick.
    Wol Euler: it can be, sure; but if you spend your time telling yourself what a fool you were, you will make your state of mind worse.
    Wol Euler: (previous selves again ;)
    Mickorod Renard: your not reading my mind are you Wol?
    Isadora Davidov: I think time for reflection is a gift...some people have very little..their circumstances desperate
    Tarmel Udimo: yes one is extremely grateful for all that Being has given
    Isadora Davidov: I think regret and remorse, in proper measure are necessary and valuable..unless of course you've been faultless
    Mickorod Renard: I wonder,,if I was positive about everything I wouldnt bother reflecting
    Wester Kiranov: don't the buddhists stress the preciousness of life as a human being because only thus we have a chance to reflect?
    Isadora Davidov: Yes, I've heard something about that from Buddhist teachers
    Mickorod Renard: I think its so quiet here tonite we must all be doing alot of reflecting
    Mickorod Renard: oops
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: reflecting like a madwoman.
    Wol Euler: or a mirror
    Isadora Davidov: I t hink they call that poetry
    Corvuscorva Nightfire smiles.
    Mickorod Renard: I remember another session where it was intimated a good way to look at ourselves is by seeing from a diferent perspective,,like from parent to child,,,i guess we could also do that during reflection
    Mickorod Renard: and see our past events as fond mems of children growing up
    Wol Euler smiles
    Wester Kiranov: This was a very lovely conversation, but I have to leave now. Bye!
    Mickorod Renard: bye wester
    Wol Euler: 'night wester, take care
    Stim Morane: Bye Wester!
    Fael Illyar: Good night Wester :)
    Isadora Davidov: Good bye Wester
    Tarmel Udimo: Bye wester
    Stim Morane: gotta go. Thanks, everyone!
    Wol Euler: goodnight stim, enjoy the day
    Mickorod Renard: nite stim
    Tarmel Udimo: bye stim
    arabella Ella: nite Wester nite Stim
    Stim Morane: bye
    Isadora Davidov: Good bye!
    Isadora Davidov: I need to return to RL...thank you everyone!
    arabella Ella: bye Isa
    Wol Euler: 'night isa, take care
    Fael Illyar: See you later Isadora :)
    Mickorod Renard: bye isadoea
    Mickorod Renard: I have to go now too,,bye and thanks all
    Wol Euler: bye mick, bye ara
    arabella Ella: bye Micko
    arabella Ella: i must go too nite everyone
    Mickorod Renard: x
    Fael Illyar: See you later Ara, Mick :)
    Tarmel Udimo: well only a few days to go and then I'm out of here!
    Wol Euler: :)
    Wol Euler: only in a virtual sense.
    Wol Euler: if anything you will be deeper into here
    Yakuzza Lethecus: but i started listening to knew and old lectures again :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: but i started listening to knew and old lectures again :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: sry
    Tarmel Udimo: true enough - yikes
    Yakuzza Lethecus: that was ment for chat
    Wol Euler: :)
    Tarmel Udimo: Corvi are you on the east or west coast?
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: east coast
    Tarmel Udimo: and you're coming, wow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Wol Euler smiles
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: grins
    Tarmel Udimo: wonderful, another girl:)
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: grins...oh..you, me, Saki..who else?
    Tarmel Udimo: humm I think Maxine
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods.
    Fael Illyar: what would you people think if this flower was the autorecorder in the future?
    Tarmel Udimo: I like it
    Tarmel Udimo: but then i love flowers
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: smiles.
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Tarmel Udimo: uhmmmm I guess you'll need to check with Storm?
    Fael Illyar: I sent him an IM but he hasn't replied yet.
    Arisia Vita: I like it, but then I love you
    Arisia Vita: :)
    Wol Euler: your judgement is clouded? :)
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Tarmel Udimo: fael, you've changed:)
    Fael Illyar: have I? :P
    Wol Euler chuckles
    Tarmel Udimo: well only on the surface:)
    Fael Illyar smiles.
    Wol Euler: :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: good night/morning/day everyone :)
    Tarmel Udimo: well this is it for me folks, off to RL
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Time for me to go, too.
    Yakuzza Lethecus: good day tamel :)
    Wol Euler: bye tarmel, enjoy breakfast and have a good day
    Fael Illyar: Good day Tarmel :)
    Tarmel Udimo: bye all
    Wol Euler: bye corvi, take care.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: thanks Wol, bye all.
    Wol Euler: I'm going ot stop the recorder now, in cse it stops anyway while we fiddle with the scripts

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