2009.08.22 07:00 - Beer Day and the Un-Retreat

The Guardian for this meeting was Eliza Madrigal. The comments are by Eliza Madrigal.

Great title, eh? Yes, and a fun session.

Wol and I arrived simultaneously, to Yakuzza present already. Wol was dressed to kill, had to ask...

Eliza Madrigal: Hi Yakuzza :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: hey you both :)
Eliza Madrigal: What a great outfit, Wol :)
Wol Euler: hello eliza, yakuzza
Wol Euler smiles. Thank you! I can give you a LM to the store, if you like :)
Eliza Madrigal: Sure, would be great
Eliza Madrigal: Thanks
Wol Euler: my pleasure. It's one of my favorite stores, you'll recognize a lot of the outfits that I have worn here :)
Eliza Madrigal: :) Then I'll try to mix and match...so as not to mirror you too much :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: i always thought that ur also designing some stuff by urself wol
Wol Euler: oh no, my talents are nowhere near good enough to make clothing.
Eliza Madrigal: Is it the hardest SL skill, you think?
Wol Euler: I'm keenly aware of my limitations :)
Wol Euler: yes, because it combines all others (even scripting in some cases)
Eliza Madrigal: yes, It seems it would be...fitting to av bodies, movement, etc
Wol Euler: you need to know how to torture prims, how to make and use good textures, how to cause things to move ...
Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, i think ur steampunk outfit might be one of the hardest
Eliza Madrigal: Shall I claim the session? This is Sophia's slot?
Yakuzza Lethecus: how costly was that ?
Wol Euler: yes, but I thought her absence started next week. Let's claim it, if she shows up she can trump us :)
Eliza Madrigal: heh
Yakuzza Lethecus: hey bert
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bertram :)
Wol Euler: hello bertram
Bertram Jacobus: hy yaku, eliza and wol :-)

Bertram arrives.

We had fallen into quiet for a few minutes, and Wol's noticing this sparks conversation about language ...

Wol Euler: this seems to be another quiet session :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: i am good with that :)
Eliza Madrigal: haha, yes you are
Eliza Madrigal likes to tease Ya about being quiet
Wol Euler: :)
Wol Euler: an experienced quieter.
Eliza Madrigal: my wheels are turning this morning, but not in a particular direction....
Yakuzza Lethecus: it's often not even that i wouldn't have to say anything it's just that i have a lack of words for what i think
--BELL--
Eliza Madrigal nods... certainly understands that feeling
Bertram Jacobus: oh yaku - i already sometimes made that as a topic, because i feel the same problem ! but i think, with practise, it grwos and we can learn a lot
Wol Euler nods. The thing is to try, and to learn from trying.
Wol Euler: as in much of life.
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Yakuzza Lethecus: but the funny thing it's not only about the foreign language it's about words in general because i don't know such a group even in my real life
Bertram Jacobus: for example, i just did not get elizas sentence with the wheels - i guess, that may has been a joke (?) which i nevertheless don't understand yet :o)
Yakuzza Lethecus: so i've never been exposed to thoughts about spirtuality and even emotions are not kind of a big topic to talk about
Eliza Madrigal: I agree Yakuzza, the 'way' we discuss things is often quite different... a good model most of the time
Eliza Madrigal: Hah Bertram, a kind of joke I guess... a picture of my brain this morning
Eliza Madrigal: (for me morning)
Wol Euler nods. These kind of discussions are pretty rare in my RL too.
Bertram Jacobus: ah. the brain ! yes, ty eliza ! wol also explained me im in german - so ty both !
Wol Euler: :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bertram Jacobus: yaku - i forgot : what is your original language, please ?
Eliza Madrigal: I have noticed at times, RL conversations taking on distinctly more PaB feels to them... sometimes with people one wouldn't expect
Yakuzza Lethecus: du bist aus köln und ich aus dem sauerland
Yakuzza Lethecus: :)
Bertram Jacobus: ah doch. danke :o)

The SL profile 'note' feature, and Corvi arrives!

Bertram Jacobus: now i make a notice ! :-)
Wol Euler: actually, the best place for that notice is on the other person's profile.
Wol Euler: there is a fifth (sixth?) page called something like "my notes"
Wol Euler: which only you can see.
Eliza Madrigal: I wondered if anyone else used that feature!
Wol Euler grins
Bertram Jacobus: lia (from aachen - all very close) didn't want to believe it. that made me doubt again ...
Yakuzza Lethecus: europe is small :)
Bertram Jacobus: yes wol. ty. i like to use this "space" very much. it's real useful
Eliza Madrigal: It still feels funny to me, that feature, because though I know the other person can't see it, I feel I'm writing on the person's shirt... or adding a sticky note :)
Wol Euler: but very dense in a way that the US isn't
Wol Euler nods to eliza.
Wol Euler: corvi!
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Corvi!!!!
Wol Euler pats the cushion next to herself
Yakuzza Lethecus: hello corvuscorva
Eliza Madrigal: What a nice surprise :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Wol, Eliza! Yakuzza, Bertram!!! how nice to see you all.
Wol Euler: the Germans are in the majority at this session :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: heh...Betram..you are also German?
Yakuzza Lethecus: corvi: ur german ?
Corvuscorva Nightfire: no..I'm from the USA, but I know you and Wol are in Germany.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: and Eliza is not.
Yakuzza Lethecus: but wol isn't german aren't you ?
Bertram Jacobus: hello corvi :-)
Wol Euler: no, but I live in Germany
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Heya.
Wol Euler: OTOH neither am I american :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: lol, that would even be a topic :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: grins.
Yakuzza Lethecus: what makes us german, american or british :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: or what ever :)

Ideas for the next retreat, and we get seriously silly...

Eliza Madrigal: So you all have quite a lobbying group here for the next retreat site...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods..that is a good topic
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods..yes!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Germany!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nodsnods.
Wol Euler: indeed. I suggested Fargo ND, but that was *mostly* in jest.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I'm sure you and I need to visit Germany, right?
Eliza Madrigal: I really need a good reason to go to Europe by myself... heheh
Corvuscorva Nightfire: looks to Eliza.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: grins
Bertram Jacobus: yes i am corvi (sorry, still exploitating some remarks from the session here ... scrolling and searching for translations ... ;-)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods.
Eliza Madrigal: Yes, I read that Wol. Hah... Hmmm
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I vote for Germany not ND
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods firmly.
Wol Euler grins
Corvuscorva Nightfire: swats Wol.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: with the everhandy pillow.
Wol Euler laughs
Wol Euler: we could certainly do it in germany, we could easily find retreat-type places with accomodation and catering
Wol Euler: and there is no shortage of major airports to choose from
Wol Euler whispers: and the beer is very good
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods and starts digging coins out of the couch.
Eliza Madrigal: Is there a beer day in retreat?
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
Corvuscorva Nightfire: laughs
Corvuscorva Nightfire: maybe the trip would be a leeetle longer?
Wol Euler: there would be if I were planning one.
Eliza Madrigal laughs
Eliza Madrigal: silent beer drinking day
Wol Euler: Appreciate the Presence of Intoxication as a Present from Being
Corvuscorva Nightfire dies laughing
Bertram Jacobus: lol eliza :o)
Eliza Madrigal: so funny... yes seems a plan
--BELL--
Corvuscorva Nightfire: okay dokey..we've got a plan.
Wol Euler: indeed we do
Bertram Jacobus: i thought about that already, too ... retreat and meeting in europe ... but without any hurry i think ... more slowly i could imagine ... (?) :-)
Wol Euler: well, probably not before next Spring or early summer. May 2010?
Bertram Jacobus: yes. may be :-)
Eliza Madrigal: Yes, I have to be very methodical to pull anything off... daughter is a senior and there are bills bills bills involved :)
Wol Euler: hmmmmmmmm
Eliza Madrigal: So the earlier trying to plan the better :) I didn't do that this time
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nodsnods.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I feel the same..I need time to make it work early summer, Wol?
Corvuscorva Nightfire digs one more penny from the couch, and plops it in the jar.
Wol Euler: sure :)
Eliza Madrigal: hehe
Wol Euler: well, with compound interest ....
Eliza Madrigal is imagining the alternate retreat shedule with beer drinking day, and onigokko day...
Wol Euler: :)
Wol Euler: RL onigokko would be a challenge, but we could rise to it.
Eliza Madrigal: haha...talk like a pirate day...
Bertram Jacobus: brb :-)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: heheh
Corvuscorva Nightfire: thinks..and..we must have a large supply of pillows..I simply can't do a retreat without my own pile.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: crosses her arms and looks stern.
Wol Euler: yes absolutely.
Eliza Madrigal nods... this is true!
Wol Euler: I know a lovely place, actually, where I went on a weekend workshop, but it's up in the hills near Stuttgart. We'd probably need an extra day for people to gather in S, and then take a bus up there.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods
Bertram Jacobus: sounds good :-)
Eliza Madrigal: Sounds so nice... to be up in the hills
Bertram Jacobus: yes. also the churches and temples were often built on the hills, on top if possible ...
Wol Euler: it is a great place. Not exactly palatial, but hte accomodation is clean and the catering was great.
Wol Euler: plenty of fields and woods for walking in
Wol Euler: and a sweat lodge!
Eliza Madrigal: well there's another day to the schedule right there...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: smiles.
Eliza Madrigal: Seriously, it does sound lovely
Wol Euler: all right, I'll write it up and if others are interested I'll see about prices.
Eliza Madrigal: yes, would probably be great to see the options and really compare early on

Bertram asks a good question regarding the roles of 'teachers' and Play as Being...

Bertram Jacobus: what comes into my mind here, is : is pab a method without any teachers ?
Wol Euler: maybe :)
--BELL--
Eliza Madrigal: Ah, good question Bert.. that's the idea... though the ideas come out of teachings?
Wol Euler: it certainly had an originator.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: the method is the thing, though..it holds it's own without teachers.
Wol Euler: but I'm not sure that he is a "teacher" as such.
Wol Euler nods to corvi
Eliza Madrigal: Ah, yes Corvi
Eliza Madrigal: It is interesting though, Pema wouldn't call himself a teacher in this context... would a 'pointer to' be accurate? Though, we all point to :)
Bertram Jacobus: "originator" seems to me a nice word for this ...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nosa
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods
Corvuscorva Nightfire: the spot of origin
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: from which we all get to create the next bit.
Wol Euler: x marks the spot.
Eliza Madrigal: yes, nice
Wol Euler: the digging is up to us
Corvuscorva Nightfire: giggles.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods
Wol Euler: I'm really curious about the Retreat though, in this context. It sounds much more organized and sructured than these sessions, or even the website
Eliza Madrigal: yes, it sounds more of a traditional outline...
Wol Euler: perhaps retreats have leaders?
Eliza Madrigal: but any person can kind of set their own pace as long as respectful of others it seems
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods.
Eliza Madrigal: Hm.. organizers... someone to hold the time and space :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: ah!
Eliza Madrigal: or mark it out
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nice.
Bertram Jacobus: i think, structure is a question of the topics, too. such a retreat - is nice when it is organized for example and the planned books are so too for my impression. here at the meetings, is more kinda "free space" to develop what ever ...
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods.
Eliza Madrigal nods
Wol Euler: pehaps we could not-organize a non-Retreat? :)
Wol Euler: like the current fashion for Unconferences
Eliza Madrigal: a dig in?
Bertram Jacobus: i felt overstrained with that i fear wol :o)
Bertram Jacobus: with the non organisation of a no retraet i meant :-)
Wol Euler: heheheheh
Wol Euler: well, avoiding planning and filling-up-timetables, and leaving freedom for participants to invent stuff to do
Wol Euler: coming out of your suggestion for free space
Wol Euler: Wikipedia: An unconference is a facilitated, participant-driven conference centered around a theme or purpose. The term "unconference" has been applied, or self-applied, to a wide range of gatherings that try to avoid one or more aspects of a conventional conference, such as high fees and sponsored presentations.
Bertram Jacobus: "but" ... as i wrote - i think, it's a matter of topic, too. and my impression is, that the organisation for the coming retreat sounds very good. here the point of "the leaders" also already come out (?) ... ;-)
--BELL--
Eliza Madrigal: I'm open to all kinds of ideas, but putting the two things together, I realize that Bertram's question speaks to something I find myself balancing... formal 'practice' model (ie teacher structure) and pab model...those exist together in my picture... am figuring it out :)
Bertram Jacobus: so many possible and thinkable forms !
Eliza Madrigal: A retreat can be a real opportunity to taste a kind of freeing structure
Corvuscorva Nightfire: wow.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: taste a freeing structure.
Corvuscorva Nightfire rolls this around in her mind, loving it.
Eliza Madrigal: Oh!
Bertram Jacobus: :-)
Eliza Madrigal now goes back to see what she missed...hehe
Corvuscorva Nightfire: what a wonderful image.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: not image...flavour.
Eliza Madrigal nods
Corvuscorva Nightfire grins..salt..it's salt!!
Wol Euler laughs
Eliza Madrigal giggles
Bertram Jacobus: the salt in the soup ?
Corvuscorva Nightfire: really I mean it..a freeing structure is a neat idea..and when you said that, I did roll it around on my tongue...*nods to Bertam*
Corvuscorva Nightfire: exactly!
Bertram Jacobus: fine :-)
Bertram Jacobus: i mean : nice :-9
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods, smiles.
Bertram Jacobus: uh, the ugly 9 again ! ;-)
Bertram Jacobus: only in this context for sure (ugly : ;-9
Bertram Jacobus: in "9 seconds" it is wonderful, for example (!) ...
Eliza Madrigal smiles, yes :)) Or 90
Bertram Jacobus: yes. agree. :-)
Eliza Madrigal: I need to get going... school prep to be done today :)

I sign off and do a whirlwind house tour through clothes and backpacks and pencils and... Well, why can't the kids just have the little laptops now? Huh? :) Anyway, I accomplished phase one here, while the discussion turned to celebrating Summer and vegetarianism... desire...

Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods..see you soon, Eliza.
Wol Euler: ah :)
Bertram Jacobus: okay. have a good time eliza !
Wol Euler: bye eliza, take care
Eliza Madrigal: So nice to see everyone and Corvi it was really nice to see you..was too long!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: nods..it was indeed.
Eliza Madrigal: Bye for now and perhaps see you all later too
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bertram Jacobus: i'll go to a buddhistic summer party at a center until tomorrow morning later this day ... :-)
Wol Euler: nice.
Wol Euler: how do buddhists celebrate summer?
Wol Euler: barbecued vegetables?
Bertram Jacobus: tomorrow evening - what did i write !?
Bertram Jacobus: strange ... :o)
Wol Euler: thinking in SL time!
Bertram Jacobus: lol. ty for this solution :o)
Bertram Jacobus: and no : that is also a strange point : the tibetan buddhists often "still" eat meat. and so do i, always very regretting ... :-/
Bertram Jacobus: one of my teachers explained to me, that was simply greed. and i agree. and i experienced, if long enogh a sort of bad conscience can work, bad habits can drop ...
Wol Euler nods
Bertram Jacobus: i hope, that that can happen in this case, too. and i try - but not very successful for sake until now - not to eat so much meat or to eat so few as possible - what ever that means
Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I am a vegetarian but I have leather things.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I have bought fewer and fewer over the years.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: letting go little by little.
--BELL--
Corvuscorva Nightfire: but not entirely.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: http://workingwithinsight.wordpress....a-woman-story/ this story is my favorite buddhist story
Corvuscorva Nightfire: it helps me.
Bertram Jacobus: i often experience in discussions that all people seem to be strongly touched by this topic, wheather they admit or not, because : very often these discussions go totally out of control, on "both sides" ...
Bertram Jacobus: *klick* :-)
Wol Euler reads and nods.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: smiles.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Desire is a tricky thing, always.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: any kind of wanting.
Bertram Jacobus: yes. i know the story. very nice one :-)
Wol Euler nods again.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: I like that this is like some kinds of meditation.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: where the thought is acknowledged, accepted and then....one moves on.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: instead of vigorously denying the idea.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: whatever it is.
Bertram Jacobus: yeah :-)
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Bertram Jacobus: i'll leave for now. thank you all for the wonderful meetings ...
Wol Euler: bye bertram, see you later
Corvuscorva Nightfire: thank you all, as well.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye, Bertram.
Yakuzza Lethecus: bye you both
Wol Euler: bye yak, sorry for the silence :)
Wol Euler: enjoy the evening
Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye Yakuzza.