2009.08.27 13:00 - Inner children and voice(s)

Wol Euler was guardian for this session, replacing Storm who was at the Retreat.

Pila and I started slowly, talking about some administrative issues. 

Wol Euler: hello pila
Pila Mulligan: hi Wol
Pila Mulligan: how are you?
Wol Euler: pretty well, all considered. And you?
Pila Mulligan: same :)
Wol Euler: :)
Pila Mulligan: you'll cover tomorrow for Lia?
Wol Euler: sure
Pila Mulligan: how about today's log -- you or me?
Pila Mulligan: either is fine
Wol Euler: already claimed it, and let's wait and see if there is actually a proper session :)
Pila Mulligan: okay
Pila Mulligan: thanks
Wol Euler: my pleasure
Wol Euler: thanks for taking yesterday's
Pila Mulligan: I have a a client in need of hand holding
Wol Euler: :)
Pila Mulligan: real life that is
Wol Euler: knight in shining sandals :)
Pila Mulligan: lol

--BELL--

Pila Mulligan: I'm going to be doing some stuff for the client, so if I seem not to be here at times .... well, then I probably am not :0
Wol Euler nods. No worries.
Wol Euler: if nobody else turns up within the half-hour, I'll call it quits.
Pila Mulligan: ok
Pila Mulligan: yesterday it was a pretty full and interesting session at this time
Wol Euler nods. I caught hte tail end, kept very late at work as I feared
Pila Mulligan: so it is about 10 pm there now?
Wol Euler: right
Pila Mulligan: 10 am here :)
Wol Euler: heh

How we got here.

Pila Mulligan: some day I'd love to hear the story of how you came to Germany
Wol Euler: I was about to say "diamerically opposite", but then you'd hve to be south of the equator.
Wol Euler smiles.
Pila Mulligan: yep
Pila Mulligan: hemispherically opposite maybe
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Wol Euler: chordally
Pila Mulligan: I came to Hawaii in 1985 as an something of an expatriate
Wol Euler: mmm?
Pila Mulligan: with an intent to leave the US mainland at least
Wol Euler: why was that?
Wol Euler: (if you wish to tell the entire world)
Pila Mulligan: I'd been working at legal aid during the first Reagan years
Pila Mulligan: the whole place seemed to be descending into hell
Wol Euler nods
Pila Mulligan: I decided it was not for me, as much a spossible at least
Pila Mulligan: Hawaii is pretty remote in that sense
Pila Mulligan: shifting to the work side of the desk now for a bit ... :)
Wol Euler: :)

Gaya and Yakuzza arrive; Gaya is having trouble with her viewer again.

Wol Euler: hello gaya, yakuzza
Gaya Ethaniel: Hello :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: hola estamos
Wol Euler: oh, how sweet :)
Gaya Ethaniel: Moi?
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Gaya Ethaniel: wow ... laggy tonight.
Wol Euler: nice skin, animal-ish
Wol Euler: suits the antlers
Gaya Ethaniel: ty :)
Gaya Ethaniel: :)
Wol Euler: how is everyone tonight?

--BELL--

Gaya Ethaniel: re-logging ... brb
Wol Euler: kk
Pila Mulligan: hi Gaya and Yak (Pila is shifting back and forth between SL and a little rl work at the moment)
Yakuzza Lethecus: i just came from a spanish class :P
Wol Euler: ah :)
Wol Euler: wb gaya
Pila Mulligan: welcome back Gaya
Gaya Ethaniel: ty :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: wb gaya
Gaya Ethaniel: What is the topic [before I came]?
Gaya Ethaniel: Or while I was here but didn't see because of the lag monster.
Wol Euler: silence, absence :)
Gaya Ethaniel: ah :)
Wol Euler: start us off, gaya :)
Gaya Ethaniel thinks ...

The inner child.

Gaya Ethaniel: I was talking to a friend about a child within us recently [think a lot of us have that]. What do you think?
Wol Euler: sounds like a topic. Tell us more?
Gaya Ethaniel: It manifests in different ways for different people ... sometimes one that feels helpless ... sometimes craving for affection ... many variations.
Wol Euler: the little (heh) voice within us...
Gaya Ethaniel: You hear it also?
Wol Euler: oh yes :)
Pila Mulligan: (my avi seemed to be doing odd things while I was away)
Wol Euler: we hid the bodies.
Pila Mulligan: (came back and it looked like disco-in-place)
Pila Mulligan: :)
Gaya Ethaniel: They revolt while we look away :D
Wol Euler: they do. in RL too...
Pila Mulligan: :)
Pila Mulligan: the inner child maybe
Gaya Ethaniel: Could be :)
Pila Mulligan: do you remembr Eric Berne's Transactional Analysis
Wol Euler: I think it does exist (insofar as thoughts and imaginings and memories and feelings "exist")
Wol Euler: mmhmm, I do :)
Gaya Ethaniel: What is it?
Wol Euler: I think I do. P-A-C?
Pila Mulligan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transactional_analysis
Pila Mulligan: yep
Wol Euler smiles
Gaya Ethaniel looks up ...
Pila Mulligan: he theorized that human interaction involves three levels of relationships
Pila Mulligan: 1. parent 2. adult 3. child
Pila Mulligan: and we act uor those roles according to the situation
Gaya Ethaniel listens.
Wol Euler: the idea that interaction (not jus conversation) can be understood as connecting among three kinds of roles
Wol Euler: right
Gaya Ethaniel: ah sounds interesting.

A pair of visitors land in the pool. It turns out they were looking for the Kira Cafe.

Yakuzza Lethecus: hey noke
Wol Euler: a parent talking down to a child, or two children gleefully conspiring, or a pair of adults solving a technical issue
Wol Euler: etc
Wol Euler: hello Cai, Noke
Noke Yuitza: Aloha!
Gaya Ethaniel: Hello Cai and Noke :)
Wol Euler: have you been here before?
Noke Yuitza: uhm, no, in Kira yes, but here not
Cai Denimore: hello everyone
Wol Euler: ah, ok :)
Pila Mulligan: aloha
Cai Denimore: this is my first time
Wol Euler: we are the contemplative branch of Kira :)
Gaya Ethaniel: It is possible not to take on a role like that though or is it more or less impossible normally?
Pila Mulligan: (noting the aloha greeting in Noke's profile:)
Wol Euler: this is a meeeting of a meditation group called "Play as Being"
Gaya Ethaniel: Welcome to PlyasBeing then both of you :)
Wol Euler: the notecard tells about us, and give the URL of our website
Noke Yuitza: ;(
Noke Yuitza: )*
Pila Mulligan: :)

--BELL--

Wol Euler: we record these conversations, and publish them on our Wiki. May we have your permission to publish your names and comments?
Noke Yuitza: (I'm reading the note)
Cai Denimore: i have the LM for Kira Cage
Cai Denimore: Cafe
Pila Mulligan: :)
Cai Denimore: sorry, but we must go
Cai Denimore: thank you
Yakuzza Lethecus: bye cai, noke
Wol Euler: bye noke, take care
Noke Yuitza: uhm... our idea was going to a science meeting, so maybe next time?
Gaya Ethaniel: Bye :)
Wol Euler: gaya, the theory was that the connections were unconscious.
Pila Mulligan: wrong brain side
Wol Euler: :)
Wol Euler: it doesn't have to happen :)
Gaya Ethaniel: Or could be the recording bit ... I sometimes think some people create alts to participate in PaB.
Wol Euler grins
Wol Euler: TA does explain a lot of miscommunication, actually.

Gaya is having different miscommunication issues.

Gaya Ethaniel: I don't see what I type again ... well SL is not being cooperative today. Hope to catch up another time then. Good night.
Wol Euler: bye gaya, better luck tomorrow
Pila Mulligan: bye Gaya

Language and speech (and voice).

Pila Mulligan: como esta Yak?
Wol Euler: Pila, on your next trip back to this side of the desk, why did yo bring up TA?
Pila Mulligan: the innner child idea
Wol Euler: ah, right.
Wol Euler: I wondered if it had been something specific
Wol Euler: otherly specific :)
Pila Mulligan: Berne seemed to recognize it as a personality element
Yakuzza Lethecus: esta bien :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: lol i was on desktop
Yakuzza Lethecus: nah, i am not great in spanish so far but second life is my only contact to that right now
Yakuzza Lethecus: and that course is even free
Pila Mulligan: Estudiá español en la escuela màs de cuarenta años atràs, y no rememeber mucho de eso ahora
Pila Mulligan: (from Google translator:)
Wol Euler: funny that it didn't understand "rememeber"
Pila Mulligan: what did it say?
Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, i also cheat with the google translator too much :)
Pila Mulligan: oh, English I see
Pila Mulligan: typo
Wol Euler: machine translation has a long way to go before it'll challenge even children's abilities.
Pila Mulligan: the extra 'e'
Wol Euler: any human, of any age, would have understood that.
Pila Mulligan: remember may have worked :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: haha, children's are the god's of language
Pila Mulligan: yes, Yak
Wol Euler: true
Pila Mulligan: Sufi Sam said it this way: 'Children are the voice of God'
Yakuzza Lethecus: obove a certain age it just gets much harder to pick up a language fast
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Yakuzza Lethecus: sufi sam ?
Wol Euler: but it also gets easier to use the ones you do have even a partial grasp of
Pila Mulligan: Sufi Sam was an American -- he became a Sufi
Yakuzza Lethecus: it's sad that nobody uses voice regularly around here
Pila Mulligan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_L._Lewis
Pila Mulligan: my SL voice does not work well
Wol Euler: I don't like it, I very much prefer text. I find it hard to follow multiple speakers, and the sound quality is appallingly poor most of hte time
Pila Mulligan: I've just strated playing with Skype, it seems much better than SL voice
Wol Euler: that's basically a phone call, right?
Pila Mulligan: yes, VOIP
Wol Euler: directly between two people
Pila Mulligan: or a group
Wol Euler: ah
Pila Mulligan: with a text chat also

--BELL--

Wol Euler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sufi_whirling
Wol Euler hums the tune of "God is a DJ"
Pila Mulligan: :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: whats ur skypename pila ?
Pila Mulligan: [censored]
Pila Mulligan: oops -- maybe that should be edited out Wol? does Skype have spam :)
Wol Euler: I'll remove it
Pila Mulligan: thanks
Wol Euler: sure; and yes, there is spam in everything these days. alas.
Pila Mulligan: are you on Skype Yak?
Pila Mulligan: so it seems Wol
Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, just came online and added you
Pila Mulligan: can you send em your info please
Pila Mulligan: or I guess it does that automatically

Pila and Yakuzza descend into a second order of virtuality, and I browse the Wikipedia while waiting.

Wol Euler: well, I never. The order of the Whirling Dervishes was created by Rumi's followers and son.
Wol Euler: (sorry :)
Pila Mulligan: Yak and I are chatting on Skype
Wol Euler: :)
Pila Mulligan: that was fun
Pila Mulligan: Wol, what was the Rumi comment?
Yakuzza Lethecus: yeah, the audio quality in skype is much better but it's also a piece of privacy because you might added more information in a messenger like skype then in ur second life profile
Wol Euler: I was reading wikipedia while you were chatting
Pila Mulligan: about Sufi Sam, Wol?
Wol Euler: I started there :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: so that is why i have pretty much no voicechat or website or facebook profile in my sl profile
Wol Euler: went to the dervishes, and from there to rumi
Pila Mulligan: have you ever seen Dervishes dance?
Wol Euler: nope; or "not yet"
Pila Mulligan: it is a thrill
Pila Mulligan: beautiful to watch
Pila Mulligan: yes, Yak, the personal profiles seem to vary in Skype, some have more content
Pila Mulligan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnunfciSr7k

--BELL--

Yakuzza Lethecus: but ur voice sounded definetly younger then 66 :)
Pila Mulligan: it should, I'm only 63 :)
Wol Euler: heheheheheh
Pila Mulligan: my inner child maybe :0
Pila Mulligan: my hearing is not so good, though, so my challenge with Skype is comprehension
Pila Mulligan: text chat is easier in that regard
Pila Mulligan: Yak's spoken english is excellent by the way
Yakuzza Lethecus: it got 2 sides for me, voice is easier and straight away
Pila Mulligan: yep
Wol Euler nods. We have spoken in SL, at my plot
Pila Mulligan: :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: i have logfiles while chatting but i constantly delete more then half of what i am typing
Wol Euler: what? a log of voice?
Yakuzza Lethecus: you can't do unappropriate jokes because you can't use rethoric very well
Yakuzza Lethecus: no i am on text right now :)
Pila Mulligan: it would be nice to integrate an instant voice recognition to chat text log feature in Skype or SL
Wol Euler nods.
Yakuzza Lethecus: i would be glad to have at least text to speech
Pila Mulligan: make an archive for lectures and an aid to the hard of hearing
Yakuzza Lethecus: i listen very often and liked to hear a chat going on and close my eyes
Pila Mulligan: text to speech exists, but the ones I've seen are kind of mechanical
Pila Mulligan: :)

We think of the Retreaters.

Pila Mulligan: Wol and Yak, have you heard any news from the real life retreat yet?
Wol Euler: not much at all. Corvi said that she was happy.
Wol Euler: I'm not sure if you would call that news :)
Pila Mulligan: it is :)
Pila Mulligan: at least it is something from the retreat
Wol Euler: I'm curious to know how the silent day went, what they did and felt and thought
Pila Mulligan: not that it is new for Corvi to be happy
Pila Mulligan: yes, me too
Pila Mulligan: an especially interesting day
Wol Euler nods
Pila Mulligan: and did the silence go on all day, or just part of it
Yakuzza Lethecus: i don't want to hear something i might get jealous :)
Pila Mulligan: :)

The next retreat.

Pila Mulligan: next year in Germany :)
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Wol Euler: Marienbad perhaps
Pila Mulligan: I'd love to visit Europe, never have - but it reality it is unlikely as I dislike airports
Wol Euler: you could sail.
Wol Euler: just start off a little earler.
Pila Mulligan: that would be fun
Pila Mulligan: I love sailing
Yakuzza Lethecus: how long to sail from hawaii to germany today ? :D
Wol Euler: I think with envy, but with a shudder, of Somerset Maugham setting off to spend three weeks crossing hte Pacific on a steamer
Pila Mulligan: :)
Pila Mulligan: it would depend Yak -- probably there is ont one direct route
Pila Mulligan: so one leg to the US or Asia
Pila Mulligan: then one to Europe
Yakuzza Lethecus: suez isn't for sailingboats ?
Pila Mulligan: or Panama
Yakuzza Lethecus: ah us or asia
Pila Mulligan: boats and trains would be much fun
Yakuzza Lethecus: sry had afrika in mind as well
Pila Mulligan: :)
Pila Mulligan: ohhh, idea: SL retreat cruise
Yakuzza Lethecus: hehe short sailing to kamchatka and then by train
Wol Euler: :)
Pila Mulligan: :)
Pila Mulligan: or PaB retreat cruise, that is
Pila Mulligan: in rl

--BELL--

Yakuzza Lethecus: i can't hold my eyes open for a longer time
Wol Euler smiles. Goodnight, yak. sleep well.
Yakuzza Lethecus: good night and good day pila
Pila Mulligan: have a nice evening's rest

Geometry, timezones and the round world.

Yakuzza Lethecus: it's 11:15am for you isn't it ?
Pila Mulligan: yes :)
Pila Mulligan: chordic opposites
Yakuzza Lethecus: always 12hrs behind us
Yakuzza Lethecus: right
Wol Euler: :)
Wol Euler: a chord rather than a diameter.
Pila Mulligan: Hawaii is one of the last places for the new year to start
Wol Euler: diameters always pass through the centre of a sphere, chords don't have to.
Pila Mulligan: aha
Wol Euler: the circles of latitude are chords
Pila Mulligan: geometry -- longer ago than spansih :)
Wol Euler: as an architect, it#s in my daily toolkit :)
Pila Mulligan: cool
Pila Mulligan: well, Wol, it is also late for you
Pila Mulligan: and my day is making some demands here
Pila Mulligan: so maybe we should end now
Wol Euler nods and smiles
Pila Mulligan: nice to sit with you
Wol Euler: have a nice day, pila.
Pila Mulligan: thanks, aloha
Pila Mulligan: sleep well
Wol Euler: aloha