2010.01.06 13:00 - Heppiness is a Warm Gun

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Fefonz Quan. The comments are by Fefonz Quan.

    Wol Euler: hello calvino
    Calvino Rabeni: Hello, ambiguously present one - becoming more so, Wol
    Wol Euler: :)
    Wol Euler: hello fefonz, wester, happy new year
    Wester Kiranov: hi cal, wol, fef
    Fefonz Quan: hi Wol, Cal, Wester
    Fefonz Quan: brb
    Fefonz Quan: back
    Wol Euler: wb
    Wol Euler: haven't seen you in ages, fef. How's life?
    Fefonz Quan: Life's great Wol!
    Wester Kiranov: hi eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Wester, Fef, Wol, Cal :)
    Fefonz Quan: Hello Eliza
    Wol Euler: hello eliza
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bert
    Wol Euler: hello bert
    Bertram Jacobus: hello everybody ! ... :-)
    Fefonz Quan: Hey Bert
    Wester Kiranov: hi bertram. nice hat
    Bertram Jacobus: hehe ty :o)
    Fefonz Quan: and nice shirt too, overall a very nice outfit Bert
    Bertram Jacobus: uh - so many compliments ! ... :o)
    Eliza Madrigal: well, very interesting attire :)
    Bertram Jacobus: how to deal with that ? ... :-)
    Fefonz Quan: Hey Storm!
    Wol Euler: hello storm
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Storm :)
    Wester Kiranov: hi storm
    Storm Nordwind: Hi everyone!
    Wol Euler: nice jacket
    Storm Nordwind chuckles
    Wester Kiranov: no shortage of nice outfits tonight
    Bertram Jacobus: hi storm - and wol ... you always look SO phantastic ! again and again new creations and combinations ... ... ... ;-)
    Wol Euler: awwwww, thank you :)
    Fefonz Quan: it is very quiet here today
    Eliza Madrigal: yes, funny.
    Calvino Rabeni:

    Choose life with its conspiratorial sheets
    Its scars from escapes
    Chose life choose that rose window on my tomb
    The life of being here nothing but being here
    Where one voice says Are you there
    where another answers Are you there I'm hardly here at all alas

    Wester Kiranov: i think this is a good silence
    Wol Euler nods silently.
    Eliza Madrigal smiles
    Yakuzza Lethecus: good day
    Fefonz Quan: Heyaku!
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Ya :)
    Wol Euler: bonsoir
    Wester Kiranov: hi yak
    Bertram Jacobus: lol. mr. tea arrived ! ;-)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: slt :)
    Fefonz Quan: Mr. T? :)
    Storm Nordwind chuckles
    Wol Euler: :)
    Bertram Jacobus: jes :o)
    Wol Euler: hello arch
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Arch
    Bertram Jacobus: hi arch
    Wester Kiranov: hi arch
    Fefonz Quan: hi arch
    Eliza Madrigal: Interesting rainbow dancing :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Hellon Wol, Eliza, Bertram, Wesor, Fefonz
    Bertram Jacobus: rainbow dancing ? where ?
    Wol Euler: ah, you missed it :)
    Bertram Jacobus: oh. yes.
    Bertram Jacobus: distracted again ...
    Eliza Madrigal: Arch arrived, dancing in a ball of rainbows
    Bertram Jacobus: so many often to do in sl (!)
    Archmage Atlantis: Was dancing in Zeus club, sorry
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Mick
    Bertram Jacobus: zeus club ... (make a notice) ... :-)
    Wol Euler: hello mick
    Wester Kiranov: hey mickey
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Mickorod Renard: Hiya everyone
    Fefonz Quan: In Hebrew Arch and Rainbow have the same word :)
    Bertram Jacobus: heyy mick ! ... :-)
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Fefonz Quan: Hey Mick
    Mickorod Renard: yeaa:)
    Eliza Madrigal smiles, makes sense :)
    Wol Euler: "arc en ciel" in French, an arch in heaven
    Mickorod Renard: are you on a subject?
    Wester Kiranov: enjoying the silence
    Bertram Jacobus: "rain arch" in german ...
    Fefonz Quan: "arc on a cloud" here
    Eliza Madrigal: Something on your mind, Mick?
    Archmage Atlantis: running toilet here, brb
    Mickorod Renard: lots,,but nothing of interest
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Wol Euler: hello zen
    Wester Kiranov: hi zen
    Zen Arado: Helo All
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen
    Mickorod Renard: I was thinking of those crazy notions of pots of gold at the end of the rainbow
    Mickorod Renard: Hi zen
    Bertram Jacobus: crazy ? could be seen as lyric, poetic too ... ;-)
    Archmage Atlantis: bk, gold has no value unless we give it to it
    Mickorod Renard: it crossed my mind that its another illusion that happiness is something you chase and often in the wrong direction
    Storm Nordwind: There are zombies at the end of the rainbow. Who do you think started all those rumours about pots of gold? ;)
    Wol Euler: heheheh
    Wol Euler: a trap!
    Calvino Rabeni: Leprechauns of course - it is a diversion as always
    Wol Euler: I think happiness isn't something you can "obtain"
    Wol Euler: I think it's a byproduct of being very busy doing Right Things.
    Mickorod Renard: be careful cal, zen will have a word to say about remarks about the Irish
    Zen Arado: :)
    Storm Nordwind: However I think unhappiness is something you can get rid of!
    Wester Kiranov: by stopping trying to obtain it, mostly
    Wol Euler: yes, that's true. An interesting asymmetry.
    Calvino Rabeni: Happiness - a way you *are*
    Zen Arado: stop listening to your little mind stories
    Mickorod Renard: or you could drown your unhappiness with a few pints of guiness
    Fefonz Quan: /nods to Storm, though usually there's more to it there's more coming from there
    Wester Kiranov: or a cigar? ;)
    Zen Arado: or a Black Bush whiskey
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Zen Arado: stories of the way things 'should' be
    Fefonz Quan: a cigar can make you unhappy too, depends of which side you put in your mouth
    Archmage Atlantis: As I often ask, does suffering have meaning?.....Is there purpose in unhappyness?
    Wol Euler: heheheh
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Wol Euler nods to Zen.
    Bertram Jacobus: nice question arch
    Calvino Rabeni: A happy story about unhappiness - gives it meaning
    Mickorod Renard: you need a bit of contrast
    Storm Nordwind: You don't need to be unhappy to have contrast. You can still be happy all the time. :)
    Eliza Madrigal: Hi Ara
    Wol Euler: hello ara
    arabella Ella: Hiya everyone!
    Zen Arado: Hi Ara
    Mickorod Renard: happy all the time sounds good
    Fefonz Quan: hi Ara
    Wol Euler: yes, different happinesses have different flavours.
    Wester Kiranov: hi ara
    Bertram Jacobus: hey ara ! ... :-)
    Mickorod Renard: Hi ara
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Yakuzza Lethecus: hi ara
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Zen Arado: if you were happy all the time you wouldn't realize you were happy
    Storm Nordwind: Not true Zen
    Eliza Madrigal: So not being unhappy in the midst of difficult events is along the same lines as not worrying in the midst of things you still must address...
    Fefonz Quan: when the shoe fits etc...
    Wester Kiranov: people who are unhappy all the time realize they are as well
    Wol Euler: but if so: would it matter?
    Zen Arado: why not Storm?
    Storm Nordwind: I am. And I know it. It must be possible for others too.
    Wol Euler smiles.
    Calvino Rabeni: I think happiness requires engagement - not just in the mind to be manipulated like a thought or mood
    Fefonz Quan agrees with Storm
    Wester Kiranov: some people have more talent for happiness than others i think
    Zen Arado: but the term happiness wouldn't have meaning without something to contrast against is what I mean
    Eliza Madrigal: Interesting idea! A talent for happiness :)
    Storm Nordwind: You're thinking in terms of black and white Zen
    Wester Kiranov: i don't think the meaning is in the contrast
    Fefonz Quan: i disagree Zen
    Wester Kiranov: the pair is what has the meaning
    Zen Arado: think equanimity is better
    Fefonz Quan: its a whole range, it's not two opposites
    Zen Arado: ups and downs are normal in life
    Mickorod Renard: I think happiness comes from a comfortable platform..and that must be relative
    arabella Ella: do you mean a positive outlook on life Storm?
    Storm Nordwind: Imagine a sine wave of happiness (theoretically of course). You don't have to go below the axis into negative (unhappiness) You just move the whole curve upwards!
    Wol Euler: heheh
    Zen Arado: being able to view bad things happening without getting upset
    Mickorod Renard: gosh Storm..I must do that immeadiatly
    Zen Arado: not being disturbed
    Wester Kiranov: isn't that the same as moving the axis downwards?
    Storm Nordwind: Yup
    Storm Nordwind: The effect is the same. You still have the contrast but you remain happy.
    Mickorod Renard: the problem for many i guess is making the adjustment
    Wester Kiranov: don't you get manic at the tops of the wave?
    Storm Nordwind: I don't seem to ;) Not yet at least!
    Eliza Madrigal: Less so than if you were trying to control the flow of the ocean I'd guess :)
    Storm Nordwind: But Zen is right in awy. It is equanimity that gets you to that point
    Mickorod Renard: I would be happily manic at the top..its the lows that seem to be the problem
    Zen Arado: well - if someone close dies I think I wouldn't be happy
    Archmage Atlantis: Being old, that gives some advantage
    Fefonz Quan: In a way i think we are missing a point here - what causes the ripple?
    Zen Arado: but being able to cope with serenity is good
    arabella Ella: yes what causes the ripple Storm?
    Fefonz Quan: is it only outside event that control this wave?
    Storm Nordwind: That has happened many times to me Zen. Attachment is a hard lesson. But it can be learned in time.
    Calvino Rabeni: the ripple is life
    Fefonz Quan: if so - it's not exactly happiness, more event-related joy
    Storm Nordwind: The ripples are the countless things we encounter in our everyday life. And to that extent, yes it includes Fef's event-related joy - with no attachment.
    Wol Euler: leaving aside tragedies, the commonest cause of unhappiness is our own expectations (I think).
    arabella Ella: another cause is dissonance ... the big gap between what we wish (expectations) and the reality we experience, plus (and related) planning too far ahead
    Storm Nordwind: And if one can love without attachment, then that seems to be a worthy height of a relationship
    Zen Arado: agree Wol
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    Mickorod Renard: yes, and our attachment to thingsthat need upkeep and maintainance
    Archmage Atlantis: Agree.Wol, but not all is from that source
    Wol Euler: or seeing the upkeep and maintenance as a problem
    Wester Kiranov: without expectations there would be no dissonance with the world
    Archmage Atlantis: Some is real
    Zen Arado: there will always be pain in life
    Storm Nordwind: I disagree Wol. The commonest cause of unhappiness is not our own expectations. The commonest cause of unhappiness is our attachment to our own expectations.
    Archmage Atlantis: That is the failure of the Buddha's thought
    Wol Euler: true, zen, and/but *suffering* is optional
    arabella Ella: that is a lovely way of putting it Storm ... attachment ...
    Calvino Rabeni: agree arch
    Wol Euler: yes, ok, I see the difference.
    Archmage Atlantis: That all sorrow is from expectations
    Bertram Jacobus: Up, up...and....
    Bertram Jacobus: ? didn´t he say "greed" ? and doesn´t greed imply clinging ?
    Bertram Jacobus: ...away?
    Zen Arado: yes Wol - it is what we do about the pain
    Calvino Rabeni: you cannot trick yourself out of unhappiness by manipulating expectations
    Bertram Jacobus: oh. lol. a gesture ! :o)
    Fefonz Quan: the buddha didn't say that all sorrow is from expectation
    Zen Arado: when we resist pain and the way things are we suffer IMO
    Calvino Rabeni: agree zen
    Wol Euler: um, I did use the word "commonest" in that sentence ...
    Fefonz Quan nods to Zen
    Storm Nordwind chuckles
    Zen Arado: suffering = pain x resistance
    Mickorod Renard: I think greed must be an extention to our general meaning of attachments
    Calvino Rabeni: some truth to that equation zen
    arabella Ella: I think Storm seems to be implying our attitude to pain and not resisting pain ... not sure if that is correct
    Fefonz Quan: even joyxresistence will bring suffering, as surprising as it may seem
    Archmage Atlantis: Sometimes, we are meant to resist
    Calvino Rabeni: greed is an exaggeration or attachment with joy
    Archmage Atlantis: And to suffer
    Calvino Rabeni: that's a balanced attitude Arch
    Fefonz Quan: 'meant' by whom?
    Zen Arado: yes Arch
    Wester Kiranov: second fef
    Mickorod Renard: resist temptation to greed
    Calvino Rabeni: with temtation, don't resist, just make better choices
    Zen Arado: I think some suffering is still inevitable - if yoiu get cancer for instance - but you can lessen it
    arabella Ella: or if one's child is seriously ill
    arabella Ella: one's offspring
    arabella Ella: that would be tough
    Mickorod Renard: I guess our idea's to what is greedy has become mal adjusted due to the high expectations in the western world
    Fefonz Quan: yet there are peopel in the world that had big tragedies, that are happier than ones that were born with a silver spoon in their mouth
    Mickorod Renard: that is so true Fef
    Wol Euler: true
    Wester Kiranov: have to go now - RL interfering
    Wester Kiranov: bye
    Fefonz Quan: By Wester
    Wol Euler: bye wester, take care
    Mickorod Renard: by wester
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Zen Arado: actually suffering can bring us to awakening quicker I think
    Calvino Rabeni: Wow - it is an especially rich discussion today O.O
    Zen Arado: bye Wester
    Calvino Rabeni: @zen, conscious suffering, true
    arabella Ella: perhaps not just suffering but some sacrifice too
    Zen Arado: maybe we need suffering
    Zen Arado: that idea is in Christianity too I think
    Fefonz Quan: yes, cause just when we feel we can't have something no more, we get up and try to change it.
    Calvino Rabeni: :) on sacrifice
    Mickorod Renard: maybe the comfort of a safe existance makes us bored, and this leads to something that goes wrong
    Zen Arado: something about the smelter's fir purifying us
    Zen Arado: fire
    Zen Arado: like gold
    arabella Ella: what is the smelter's fur?
    Archmage Atlantis: Prometheus brought fire to humanity
    Zen Arado: fire sorry :)
    arabella Ella: ah
    arabella Ella: sorry!
    Bertram Jacobus: i´ll leave - have a nice time and thanks all ... :-)
    Zen Arado: np
    Mickorod Renard: I find having too much time(about 5 seconds) is unhealthy for me
    arabella Ella: nite Bert
    Zen Arado: bye Bert
    Fefonz Quan: by bert
    Wol Euler: bye bert, take care
    Archmage Atlantis: For this he was punished by the gods
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes Mick on that too
    Mickorod Renard: bye Bert
    Storm Nordwind: Melting fur is not so hot (or perhaps too much)!
    Bertram Jacobus: ty again :-)
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Zen Arado: hmmm analogy lost it's impact somewhat :)
    Eliza Madrigal was looking for Rumi's "Love With No Object" poem...
    Zen Arado: I wonder if I was perfectly happy and contented would I bother doing anything?
    Zen Arado: but just sit and be happy
    Fefonz Quan: yes you would
    Calvino Rabeni: dont worry zen
    Wol Euler: I think you would not be perfectly happy and contented if all you did was sat :)
    Fefonz Quan: sit and be happy, eat and be happy, go to work and be happy
    Wol Euler: but perhaps that's just my take on it.
    Calvino Rabeni: :)
    Eliza Madrigal: More more energy to do things if not tangled up in unhappinesses and, like you said, 'stories of what isn't/might be/etc'
    Zen Arado: but mught lose motivation
    Storm Nordwind: Until there needed some wood chopping or some water carrying. And then you would be perfectly happy doing that!
    Zen Arado: like when the Buddha was enlightened
    Eliza Madrigal: energy without the 'lag' maybe :)
    Fefonz Quan: i believe we misspresume, that happines is a static state of mind, hence it would 'freeze' us
    Zen Arado: yes simple actions required
    Mickorod Renard: buddha must have been very worried about his wieght problem I think
    Eliza Madrigal: :)))
    Wol Euler: :)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Zen Arado: nearly died of starvation one time though
    Zen Arado: asceticism
    Storm Nordwind: Some buddhas are thin, some are fat.
    Archmage Atlantis: Agree, Fefonz
    Fefonz Quan: guess he was much more thinner than most of his statues...
    Wol Euler: I was thinking during hte pause about times that I have known that I was happy. There were very few, actually, when I felt happiness arising.
    Zen Arado: yes fat = happy stereotype
    Wol Euler: It's mostly something that I recognize afterwards, "Ah, that was nice"
    Eliza Madrigal: :)
    Fefonz Quan: I recognize it during sometimes, than i try not to think about it too much, cause than it pushes it away...
    Mickorod Renard: I remember times i am happy,,and am frequently happy,,I am very lucky,,maybe I am greedy wanting to be very happy all of the time
    Wol Euler: right!
    Zen Arado: we look for it in the future
    Eliza Madrigal: yes like self-consciousness
    Zen Arado: and miss it when ity is here
    Storm Nordwind: Realizing I am happy does not make me any less happy.
    Fefonz Quan: staying with it without pushing it aside is much harder than one might expect
    arabella Ella: i think one important concept is Carpe Diem ... seize the day
    Eliza Madrigal: sometimes you can compliment a reserved child on something they are doing... and then they look at themselves and stop
    Storm Nordwind: I guess it comes with practice then :)
    Fefonz Quan nods to Storm
    Archmage Atlantis: nothing is wrong in seeking the future, only in forgetting the past
    Zen Arado: have a suspicion if you were happy all the time you wouldn't be happy
    arabella Ella: happiness also involves having no regrets about the past
    Zen Arado: ever hear of Nozick's'experience machine' ?
    Storm Nordwind: When you can speak from experience and not suspicion, Zen, you'll know one way or the other!
    Archmage Atlantis: Agree, Ara
    Fefonz Quan have a suspicion Zen is not correct
    Zen Arado: Ara?
    arabella Ella: and not planning too far in the future
    Mickorod Renard: watz that zen??
    Zen Arado: well - it is a device you hook up to and it fulfill all your wildest desires
    Wol Euler: ah, a suicide machine :)
    Zen Arado: what was that swartznegger film total recall?
    Zen Arado: like that
    Storm Nordwind: 'Better than Life" in Red Dwarf
    Eliza Madrigal has to go. Thanks everyone, great discussion :)
    Wol Euler smiles and nods
    Wol Euler: bye eliza, take care
    Fefonz Quan: By Eliza
    Mickorod Renard: bye eliza
    arabella Ella: bye Eliza
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Zen Arado: well most ppl wouldn't want to be hooked up to it it turns out
    Zen Arado: why?
    Zen Arado: bye Eliza
    Archmage Atlantis: That took a moment
    Archmage Atlantis: [14:09] arabella Ella: happiness also involves having no regrets
    Storm Nordwind: We are already hooked up to it Zen!
    Wol Euler laughs.
    Mickorod Renard: was it the same machine they used in Barbarella?
    Zen Arado: :)
    Fefonz Quan: yes, but this is pleasure, joy, not happines Zen. it is like drug-induced pleasure
    Zen Arado: yes yes but you could say it was happiness ?
    arabella Ella: i also think it is a relatively stable state
    Yakuzza Lethecus: night
    Fefonz Quan: i could, but i'd be wrong
    Fefonz Quan: night Yaku
    Storm Nordwind: "More joy"... reminds me of one of my favourite videos: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDSAAlrqAHM
    arabella Ella: nite Yaku
    Zen Arado: would any of you like to try this?
    Zen Arado: and if not whay not?
    Fefonz Quan: sure, for a while ;-)
    Fefonz Quan: ("i can stop any time i like "
    Wol Euler: I would probably not, because I would fear that it would totally, fatally, addictive.
    Fefonz Quan: )
    Zen Arado: it may come to pass
    Zen Arado: yes real life might seem flat after that
    Zen Arado: this scenario was in the 'Matrix ' too I think?
    Zen Arado: a sedated population
    Mickorod Renard: I think if we are actually wired up in a matrix type scenario,,they must be doin a poor job in the happy stimulus drug inducement
    Mickorod Renard: oops
    Archmage Atlantis: We are only about ourselves, no matter how much we love others'
    Archmage Atlantis: It is how we were guilt
    Archmage Atlantis: sorry, bui=uilt
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Zon
    arabella Ella: thanks for sharing video Storm
    Calvino Rabeni: sorry arch, your freudian slip is more accurate
    Zen Arado: HI Zon
    Storm Nordwind: yw ara!
    Wol Euler: _)
    Calvino Rabeni: the guilt shows we are wired with others
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,that was quite well done Arch
    Zon Quar: hey..sry im in my htoughts...
    Mickorod Renard: I was reading a book earlier,,it almost promoted a drug,,I was almost tempted to try it
    Wol Euler: mm?
    Mickorod Renard: but I am pretty good at resisting temptation
    Calvino Rabeni: ayahusca?
    Fefonz Quan: nice link Storm
    Calvino Rabeni: Or prozac
    Mickorod Renard: but was supprised how liberal they were about it
    Storm Nordwind smiles at Fef
    Zen Arado: yes nice inl
    Mickorod Renard: it was extacy
    Storm Nordwind: Please excuse me. RL calls :)
    Calvino Rabeni: OK
    Mickorod Renard: well,,u spell it for me
    Zen Arado: bye Storm
    Wol Euler: bye storm, take care
    Mickorod Renard: bye storm
    Storm Nordwind: Namaste
    Fefonz Quan: Namaste
    Calvino Rabeni: _/!\_
    arabella Ella: bye Storm
    Storm Nordwind waves
    Fefonz Quan: I'll go too, it's been a wonderful conversation! good night all
    Wol Euler: bye fef, give my regards to the beach.
    arabella Ella: nite Fefonz
    Mickorod Renard: nite Fef
    Fefonz Quan: thank Wol, i will :)
    Zen Arado: nite Fefonz
    Wol Euler: :)
    Fefonz Quan: _/!\_
    Calvino Rabeni: A rich and fertile discussion today
    Wol Euler: indeed :)
    arabella Ella: :)
    Wol Euler: we did very well. Congratulations and thanks to us all.
    Zen Arado: pat ourselves on back and be happy
    Mickorod Renard: thankyou to everyone
    Zen Arado: :)
    Mickorod Renard: it was good yesterday at the same time too
    arabella Ella: happiness is i guess a learnt attitude to life
    Archmage Atlantis: This dicussion goes on to the end of time
    Wol Euler: yes, ara, very true
    arabella Ella: taking disappointments or pain in our stride
    arabella Ella: so be it
    Archmage Atlantis: And it's new beginning
    Zen Arado: and always learning
    arabella Ella: yes
    Zen Arado: and helping others
    arabella Ella: yes
    Zen Arado: and allowing ourselves to be helped
    Calvino Rabeni: Doing good works
    arabella Ella: and if you watched the video ... love for others ... and for oneself
    Wol Euler: ze3n, those two are about 51% of happiness already, to me.
    Zen Arado: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: reaching out beyond one's "small" self
    Zen Arado: freedom of being
    Calvino Rabeni: Letting life live you
    Zen Arado: yes
    arabella Ella: adjusting to circumstances you know you have no power to change
    Zen Arado: letting it move freely through us
    Archmage Atlantis: My cat, Nimbus, need to be held, gotta go
    arabella Ella: :)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Wol Euler: bye arch, be happy
    arabella Ella: say hi to Nimbus Arch I love cats :)
    Zen Arado: mine too
    Mickorod Renard: what I like is how we discuss things that we always may have wanted to discuss had we had opportunities in rl but perhaps felt to reserved to do
    Wol Euler smiles
    Mickorod Renard: bye arch
    Zen Arado: bye Arch
    Wol Euler: cats are people too, holding them counts as "doing good works"
    arabella Ella: oh yes :)
    Calvino Rabeni: May different, true perspectives on happiness showed up here today
    Zen Arado: I only have one in SL now
    Zen Arado: many viewpoints
    Calvino Rabeni: Animals are known to aid happiness for people
    Zen Arado: like facets of a diamond
    Wol Euler: or the bits of an elephant :)
    Zen Arado: yes they are Cal
    Zen Arado: :)
    arabella Ella: well on campus here the belief is that the strays whiich are fed and taken care of are theraupetic for students especially at exam time
    Zen Arado: back to earth
    Zen Arado: stroking a pet is good for us
    Wol Euler: mmhmm
    arabella Ella: :)
    Mickorod Renard: he he he
    Mickorod Renard: lets not get too into animals
    Zen Arado: doctors recommend getting a dog
    arabella Ella: i much prefer cats
    Zen Arado: it really improve health in mmanyways
    Zen Arado: I like both equally
    Mickorod Renard: I have one,,my dog has nearly made me insane,,he's a pain in the rear
    arabella Ella: cats are much more independent and therapeutic i find
    Zen Arado: think dogs give more unconditional love though
    Mickorod Renard: i have had 3 cats,,and the joy of them is that you dont have to look after them
    arabella Ella: so do cats :)
    Zen Arado: ah was TV prog tonight and I missed it!
    Wol Euler: yes buty ou have to earn it with a cat, ara :)
    arabella Ella: ;0
    arabella Ella: ;0
    arabella Ella: sorry meant this :)
    Mickorod Renard: my pet is the dish washer..i love my dish washer..
    Wol Euler: heheheh
    Zen Arado: dogs are more loyal too
    Mickorod Renard: my dishwasher has never let me down
    Zen Arado: but cats can sit on your knee
    arabella Ella: ah Zen wasnt it you who said you like both cats and dogs ... now you sound biased :)
    Zen Arado: yes has to even it out there :)
    arabella Ella: :)
    Zen Arado: you don't have to walk cats and pick up their poo either :)
    Mickorod Renard: if it wasnt for my partners jelousy i would get a bionic dishwasher
    Calvino Rabeni: Good thing pets can't talk, though :)
    arabella Ella: yes one nice thing about pets is that they cant argue
    Zen Arado: had a budgie who could :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Talking birds are OK
    arabella Ella: i was gonna mention birds ... cockatees for example ... lovely as company but can be somewhat too talkative at times
    Mickorod Renard: i had a series of budgies as a child,,funnily enough they all had the same name
    arabella Ella: there was a time when i had to bird-sit ... had them at my place ... and when i needed peace and quiet had to put a cloth over their cage they could be very talkative
    Zen Arado: Joey?
    Mickorod Renard: i think my mum thought I hadnt noticed them dying
    Wol Euler: heheh
    arabella Ella: owwww Mick
    Zen Arado: :)
    Mickorod Renard: :)
    Zen Arado: who's a pretty boy then ?
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Zen Arado: I better go - lapsing into nonsense :)
    arabella Ella: nite Zen
    Mickorod Renard: yes, I must go
    Mickorod Renard: nite zen
    arabella Ella: nite Mick
    Zen Arado: bye all
    arabella Ella: me too nite all
    Wol Euler: bye mick, zen, thanks for the great convo
    Wol Euler: bye ara
    Zen Arado: tahnks to all
    Mickorod Renard: byeeeee
    Calvino Rabeni: bye
    Wol Euler: have you indeed :)
    Calvino Rabeni: synaesthesia
    Wol Euler: ah
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