2008.08.15 07:00 - Anxiety is Another Passing Cloud

Adams Rubble feels fortunate to have been the guardian for this session and the comments belong to Adams

I arrived first and was soon joined by Doug and then Sky

Adams Rubble: Hello Doug :)
doug Sosa: hi adams
Adams Rubble: How are you this morning?
Adams Rubble: Hello Sky :)
doug Sosa: was fine till microsot did an update and reset much of my 'puter. hm.
Sky Szimmer: h'yall
Adams Rubble: Yes, I was having my own thoughts about Microsoft this morning
doug Sosa: i like that, "microsot".
Adams Rubble: hehe
Adams Rubble: Microsop

Sky begins the discussion focusing on PaB and how it may be a distraction to her

Sky Szimmer: how is everyone? Been thinking I should stop PaB for a while
Adams Rubble: Does anyone have anything they would like to talk about?
Adams Rubble: Oh my, Sky
Sky Szimmer: I find that I am thinking too much about the different characters.
Adams Rubble: Anything you can talk about?
Adams Rubble: I am a step behind you
Sky Szimmer: you know, like watching a good movie, then just can't stop thinking about it
Sky Szimmer: this is why I don't like to watch movies, cause it clogs up my mind
Sky Szimmer: you guys don't have the same issue?
Adams Rubble: I have attended fewer sessions in the last few weeks
Sky Szimmer: yes I noticed.
Adams Rubble: Mostly that is a time issue
Sky Szimmer: me too

Wol arrives and we move on to discuss role playing

Adams Rubble: Hello Wol :)
Wol Euler: good morning all!
Sky Szimmer: hey there.
Adams Rubble: It has been helpful to pick and choose and not feel obligated to come
Adams Rubble: Of course, the obligation all came from within
doug Sosa: or to stay more than half an hour.
Adams Rubble: Yes, I've noticed that Doug
doug Sosa: i find everything i do is before something else, so i need to end on the half hour becuase that next...
Sky Szimmer: BTW Adams, I was really intrigued with role playing when I first entered SL, I was a fox, then a man for a short while. But I always thought I'd give myself away as a female with the way I thought
Adams Rubble: That is very interesting
Wol Euler smiles. I think few people listen that closely, Sky.
Sky Szimmer: I guess you are right Wol.
Adams Rubble: I would love to talk to you about what you learned
Sky Szimmer: I think more of us should role play and try to play someone totally different than our RL because SL gives an opportunity never existsed in RL
Wol Euler: true!
Sky Szimmer: just to invent a completely new person, with no history, no opinions
Adams Rubble: Yes, it gives new perspectives
Sky Szimmer: i tried to do that while I traveled solo to different worlds, but couldn't shake my own self critique of what others thought of me so I censored myself
Wol Euler: actually I was surprised to find that my alt had very strong opinions of its own, that clearly came from my head but were not _my_ opínions or desires at all.
Adams Rubble: I get caught up in things and I guess I get oblivious to external forces to a degree
Sky Szimmer: really. how can you tell the difference
Sky Szimmer: Wol,
Adams Rubble: I can tell often
Wol Euler: oh, it's clear. I am surprised by things that the alt wants to do. Like camping, for insatnce: I spent months camping. My alt did it for 5 minutes, then said "hell with this" and got a paypal account and _bought_ some L$
Adams Rubble: :)
Wol Euler: heheheh

Thorberg pops in. I hadn't seen Thor since my first few weeks when I had been attending as many sessions as I could; while Thor and I exchange greetings, there are briefly two threads going on at once

Wol Euler: hello thorberg
Sky Szimmer: hey thor
Adams Rubble: Hello Thorberg, I haven't seen you in ages :)
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello everyone
Thorberg Nordlicht: likewise, Adams

Doug talks about simplification

doug Sosa: hm, i find it hard enough just be be myself and try to let it go. if i had a second identity i'd be really confused.
doug Sosa: hi.
Thorberg Nordlicht: I'm guardian for Monday night at 7 PM, but don't make it to many other meetings due to RL time constraints
Adams Rubble: I know the other identity is me but with a different perspective on things
Sky Szimmer: that is interesting. doug, why do you say that?
Adams Rubble: I haven't gotten to many 7 PM, Thor
Sky Szimmer: do you have some notion of what yourself should be doug?
doug Sosa: i think i find that simplification leads to better perception, awareness and depth.
Sky Szimmer: yes. stripping down to that is best, doug.
Wol Euler: I don't disagree, however my alt has shown me that there are other depths that the ones I knew about.
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, we get to know the regulars for a particular recurring time slot, and it's easy to forget there're whole other groups of regulars in other time slots we rarely see
Sky Szimmer: but I guess, it seems to be some of the avatars are really attached to their professional experiences.

hmmm. I forgot to ask what you meant by that, Sky, but the statement moves the discussion on to attachments

Thorberg Nordlicht: don't let me interrupt the discussion
doug Sosa: SL is hard because it puts in the front property, $, and personal presentation - a caricature of RL.
Adams Rubble: yes Doug
Sky Szimmer: I don't mean my comment as a critique, but I think that any type of attachment should be looked at as PaB
Adams Rubble: yes Sky
Adams Rubble: I wonder if sometimes I am a bit atached to my avatar. I will find out soon :)
Sky Szimmer: I can see that Adams. You have created a new being
Sky Szimmer: i am attached to her too.
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: But maybe it is time to move more to Doug's view for me
Adams Rubble: simplify
Adams Rubble: I don't know yet
Sky Szimmer: I guess I was thinking of using alt to drop some of our RL attachments
Sky Szimmer: rather than putting on more layers
Wol Euler nods
doug Sosa: i don't mean simplify the surrounding environment, simplify ones self. Fewer things, fener necessary actions. .
Sky Szimmer: we have so many baggage and roles in RL
Adams Rubble: yes Sky. I have dropped RL attachments and I wonder if I am picking up others
Sky Szimmer: sometimes, some are harder to see and detach
Adams Rubble: Of course, they will be easier to drop

Doug offers some good advice about being busy...

doug Sosa: For example, instead of saying I am too busy, say I have time. Really, don't change anything but what you say and you will have more time. amazing.
Adams Rubble: Yes Doug
Sky Szimmer: words are magic
Sky Szimmer: I keep forgetting that as it can be white magic or black
Adams Rubble: I have been doing that with gratitude/complaining
Adams Rubble: I like the idea of doing it with time
doug Sosa: People are actually afraid to say "I am not busy."
Adams Rubble: :)
Sky Szimmer: I have been having a hard time with PaB.
Sky Szimmer: Can't get in the right frame of mind
Sky Szimmer: alot of contractions and can't relax and expand
Sky Szimmer: I like Cal's use of contraction and expansion rather than thinking of life in terms of a time line
doug Sosa: maybe there is no right frame of mind. I have learned here that when i am tired, have a hadache, preoccupied, these are the most intresting times.
Sky Szimmer: oh?
doug Sosa: The mind is more revealled at these times.
Sky Szimmer: hmm.
Sky Szimmer: when I am preoccupied, then everything contracts
doug Sosa: if you get "pure and cleaned out" before starting meditation, there is nothing left to learn.
doug Sosa: Those contrations are wonderful. observe them.
Sky Szimmer: getting exhausted leaves me pure and cleaned out
doug Sosa: no. you said "contracted". much more interesting.
Sky Szimmer: why is that

...and watching the thought process when our minds are agitated

doug Sosa: because then there is something to learn from, something to watch, the mind making mistakes.
Sky Szimmer: ah, but sometimes one is so distracted, that the mind just goes amuck
doug Sosa: fine. watch it.
Sky Szimmer: good advice! thanks doug
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, "observe without judging"; as doug say, just watch it
doug Sosa: remember, play as being. take the muck and engage with it openly, playfully.
Sky Szimmer: yes. I am trying to remind myself of that one.
Sky Szimmer: re mind that one
Adams Rubble: The playfulness helps us relax a little
Sky Szimmer: Avastu would say there is no self to remind
Thorberg Nordlicht: the one thing we are closest to is our own mind, and yet our attention is always elsewhere -- in the future, in the past, somewhere else right now; take time out, whether 9-seconds or 40 minutes to just set all that aside and simply watch our own minds, to become aware of it, familiar with it, and begin to understand how it behaves, and how it reacts to things

Steve appears and Doug slips away (just as I was formulating a question to him)

Adams Rubble: Hello Steve :)
Wol Euler: hi steve
doug Sosa: the tension is not in the way of meditation, it is the object of meditation, to disaggregate it let it turn from tight to lose to free.
stevenaia Michinaga: hello
doug Sosa: hi steve.
Sky Szimmer: yes thor and doug.
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello
Sky Szimmer: I have been watching that tension and other emotions as they arise,

Wol Euler: lol
Sky Szimmer: sit with them, feel them, and then feel them dissipating
Wol Euler leans back against steve
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, , to impatient to rezz, one moment
Wol Euler: np
stevenaia Michinaga: anyone on this pillow?
Sky Szimmer: there goes Doug. it is somewhat disconcerting the way he vanishes
Adams Rubble: Oh yes Sky. This time prematurely
Sky Szimmer: nope. exactly 7:30 on the dot.
Adams Rubble: Adams checking to see where Steve is sitting
Adams Rubble: No, I meant he was offering so much
Sky Szimmer: ah. that. indeed. but he is like the fairy god mother. when the time clock chimes, he's got to go....
Adams Rubble: :)
Wol Euler: we could make him a pumpkin and white mice avatar ...

There is a pause here before Sky picks up the thread again and begins to formualte answers to her own question

Sky Szimmer: I did noticed with exercising with the emotions, sometimes the emotion arises, then secondary comments immediately ensue about the emotion
Sky Szimmer: then it adds another layer to the emotion
Sky Szimmer: so if I felt tired, there is the feeling, but then my mind adds "i am tired"
Sky Szimmer: if i felt anxious, then there is the physical sensation, the emotional sensation, but then my mind adds " oh that so and so is making me so anxious"
Thorberg Nordlicht: but then the mind reacts to the comment itself, which leads to new comments about the new reaction, and on and on -- the endless internal monolog
Sky Szimmer: I like to strike my mind and say thought
Sky Szimmer: exactly Thos.
Sky Szimmer: but the thought also creates new emotions
Adams Rubble: With anxiety, I find myself asking "Who is anxious?"
Sky Szimmer: yes. that too. Adams
Thorberg Nordlicht: and then we as "what can we *do* to stop the endless cycle of reactions stirring up comments and comments stirring up reactions; it's like stirring up mud in water; it makes the water all cloudy
Thorberg Nordlicht: *ask
Adams Rubble: yes Thor
Sky Szimmer: but i am playing with the three sensations, the emotional sensation, the physical sensation, the thought commentary
Sky Szimmer: to notice the arising of the emotion and sit there with it, watch it dissipate without comment, stops the need to ask "waht can we do" "who is anxious"
Adams Rubble: Yes, if it goes away on its own, no need Sky
Sky Szimmer: to watch the emotion without commentary without assigning it to the self, then there is no who
Sky Szimmer: it is just an emotional sensation, reaction
Sky Szimmer: it just is
Adams Rubble: yes Sky. In my case I think there is usually a "Who" :)
Sky Szimmer: why?
Adams Rubble: That is great Sky
Gambhira Skytower is Online
Adams Rubble: Why, in my case?

Avastu arrives and sits with us as Steve Departs

Sky Szimmer: yes. why do you assign a who
Adams Rubble: I am still learning :)

Well not a good answer. I should have said something like asking "who" focuses on the self and the attachment

Thorberg Nordlicht: hello Avastu
stevenaia Michinaga: rl calls see you all soon
Adams Rubble: Hello Avastu
Sky Szimmer: Hi Avastu!
Avastu Maruti: hello my friend
Wol Euler: hello avastu, bye steve
Adams Rubble: bye Steve
Avastu Maruti: friend(s)
Sky Szimmer: ah. I didn't mean to put you on the spot Adams.
Sky Szimmer: I guess I had to see this lesson with my RL struggles
Sky Szimmer: to see that emotions are only linked to a who with secondary comments
Adams Rubble: Don't worry about that Sky. I am comfortable with myself on this and willing to learn from others
Sky Szimmer: my emotion, my anxiety.. etc.

When Steve left, Wol moved closer to the group and Thorberg soon filled in so we all could see each other better

Wol Euler nudges Thor. Come sit by Sky :-)
Sky Szimmer: the anxiety, fear, happiness, whatever the emotion, is just a feeling.
Wol Euler: :-)
Thorberg Nordlicht: :-)
Adams Rubble is feeling the pavilion listing

Sky continues to work out her thoughts with us

Sky Szimmer: but the thought that comes after, saying my this and my that, causes the mind to claim the emotion as a part of self
Sky Szimmer: sorry, I am writing so much because verbalizing all this somehow clarifies things for me more
Adams Rubble: That is great Sky, then please keep doing it :)
Wol Euler: agreed
Sky Szimmer: so i don't know if this is right, so correct me if i am wrong everybody.
Wol Euler: (as an aside, I'm interested that you said "writing". I experience this as speaking and listening.)
Sky Szimmer: but i see there is three parts that a self comes into being, IDing with the emotional sensation, IDing with physical sensations and the thoughts that claims them as my this and my that. I see or I hear, My fears, My worries rather than just seeing, hearing, worries and fears
Sky Szimmer: OK. I am done. Thanks for being here to listen to my monologue.
Wol Euler chuckles.
Adams Rubble: no it hasn't been a monologue :)
Adams Rubble: I am thinking about what you wrote
Sky Szimmer: You all are so sweet! Hugs. Everyone.
Thorberg Nordlicht: :-)
Wol Euler: It's an intereseting idea, Sky, I#ve never thoght of the mind in that set of divisions (as it were). What brought you to that idea?
Sky Szimmer: I had a hell of a time with RL recently
Wol Euler: ah.
Sky Szimmer: many fears, many anxieties, many worries
Sky Szimmer: but then RL is the real teacher
Sky Szimmer: just when one gets smug, then WAM
Wol Euler nods.
Wol Euler: I'm sorry to hear it.
Adams Rubble: Yes. It is hard to keep ones perspective when things get very rough
Sky Szimmer: I guess I better clariy. just when I got smugged about Being, then WAM comes RL to teach me that things aren't too clear yet
Sky Szimmer: so lesson of the day. never get smug about Being. : )
Wol Euler: lol
Adams Rubble: Not to in any way make light of your real issues, soemtimes when things are roughest is when we can see most clearly what is important
Sky Szimmer: I don't know. Rough times suck, clarity lessens, self wanting it all to go away
Adams Rubble: Yes they do suck
Sky Szimmer: but then, I learned what I told y'all above.
Sky Szimmer: Funny thing is that none of it was that clear, until I told you guys about it
Adams Rubble: :)
Sky Szimmer: now i see it pretty clearly.
Wol Euler nods. Very true. The way to learn something is by teaching it to somebody else.

And yes, writing it down....

Sky Szimmer: I guess this is why Pema is always telling me to write. to get the ideas down on paper. but it is more fun to get your feedback.
Thorberg Nordlicht: both
Adams Rubble: Writing has kept me going and yes peoeple read it and comment
Thorberg Nordlicht: writ it don *and* get feedback
Thorberg Nordlicht: ((trying to type one handed while petting a very demanding siamese cat on my lap))
Adams Rubble: :)
Wol Euler: :-)

Avastu had been sitting quietly as usual and I wantl to ask him what he has been thinking but I ask a simple quextion and Avastu returns with the title for the session

Adams Rubble: Avastu, what do you think about anxiety?
Avastu Maruti: Anxiety is another passing cloud
Thorberg Nordlicht: Playing devil's advocate: yes, but isn't anxiety "telling you something"; isn't it like emotional radar?
Avastu Maruti: if we play in concepts, this could be said
Thorberg Nordlicht: :-) hmm, I was baiting you, but i can see you're too wise to take the bait
Adams Rubble: :)
Wol Euler: I thnk of anxiety as being like an overdue notice from the library, it's telling me that there is something I really ought to examine.
Sky Szimmer: OK Folks. Thanks a bunch for listening! I totally appreciate it. I feel much lighter and clearer now.
Sky Szimmer: Got to go back to RL
Sky Szimmer: Ciao!
Avastu Maruti: good bye my friend
Wol Euler: bye sky, thanks for the discussion.
Wol Euler: have a good weekend.
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, good discussion
Adams Rubble: bye Sky
Sky Szimmer: hugs everyone
Adams Rubble: :)
Thorberg Nordlicht: happy Friday, everyone; it's 8 o'clock; i'll have to be returning to RL now also
Wol Euler: goodbye all, take care.
Avastu Maruti: good bye my friend
Adams Rubble: Good to see you again Thor :)
Adams Rubble: bye Wol :)
Thorberg Nordlicht: good to see you also, Adams
Adams Rubble: Well I better be getting back to my work too. Good to see you again Avastu :)
Avastu Maruti: good bye my friend
Adams Rubble: bye :)