That evening, Thorberg was the guardian. He later sent me the following log. The comments are mine, and the photographs are provided by Sylectra.
Sylectra Darwin: Hello Adams
Adams Rubble: hello
Gambhira Skytower: hi Adams
Gambhira Skytower: Hi pema
Adams Rubble: whoa
Pema Pera: Hi Adams, hi Thorberg!
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello Pema
Pema Pera: Hi Gambhira!
Sylectra Darwin: evening
Adams Rubble: hello everybody
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello Adams
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello everybody
Pema Pera: Hi Syl!
Sylectra Darwin: how are you?
A tumble of greetings, and there we were: Adams, Gambhira, Sylectra, Thorberg and me, five in total.
Pema Pera: Thor, I won’t be able to stay long
Thorberg Nordlicht: ok Pema
Pema Pera: so I’m glad you are the guardian for this session!
Pema Pera: I have an early lunch meeting here in Tokyo
Pema Pera: but glad I can at least stop by and say hi!
Thorberg Nordlicht: glad you could stop by
Sylectra Darwin: me too
Thorberg Nordlicht: Gambhira and I were just sittin’ here talking about the 9-second micro-meditation technique, when everyone else suddenly showed up all at once
Thorberg Nordlicht: so, just jump right in with a new topic, anyone
Pema Pera: hi Steve!
stevenaia Michinaga: powerful thing
stevenaia Michinaga: you think, we appear
Sylectra Darwin: Hi Steven
Pema Pera: :)
stevenaia Michinaga: hello
stevenaia Michinaga: waiting for pillows and people to rezz
Pema Pera: Hi Pia!
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello Pia; join us
Pia Iger: Hi, all.
Adams Rubble: Hello Pia
And with Steve and Pia, there were seven of us, filling up the tea
house. It is becoming more and more clear that we will have to move to
a larger location soon.
Thorberg Nordlicht: you haven’t missed anything; no established topic; just lot’s of folks showing up
Pia Iger: you look like a serious prof
Thorberg Nordlicht: ha ha
Adams Rubble: Is there an easy way to tell whose blog is whose on the webpage?
Pema Pera: Adams, it is up to the writers of blogs to say who they are
Pema Pera: I have just provided links
Pema Pera: I don’t want to provide more information than the writers themselves do
Pema Pera: but in most cases I think we can guess
Pema Pera: is there a blog that you are puzzled about?
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, rather impressive to read Adams blog
Adams Rubble: It just makes it hard when someone says something is on somebody’s blog
Adams Rubble: Oh Pia mentioned something on Stim’s blog
stevenaia Michinaga: I see some of her 9 second thought take 14 minules to put down, jsut in time fir the next 9 secs
Pia Iger: no, stim has no blog
Pia was right at the time. A couple days later, Steven would start his own blog. See http://flipp6er.wordpress.com/
Pia Iger: as far as I know. I meant a PaB blog entry, which includes Stim.
Adams Rubble: Oh in the daily log?
Pema Pera: http://playasbeing.wordpress.com/2008/06/07/respecting-anger/
Pia Iger: yes.
Pema Pera: was what Pia refered to
stevenaia Michinaga: Oh Adams I didn;t see you
Pia Iger: Yes. as Pema said.
Adams Rubble: Thanks
Adams Rubble: Yes I am here Steve
Adams Rubble: Thanks for the kind words
Pema Pera: When Stim says something, it is very much worth listening :)
Pema Pera: he talks a lot less than I
Pema Pera: but I suggest you prod him to say more :-)
Pema Pera: the blog entry above is an example
Pema Pera: of some really good insights
Pia Iger: this pm, Stim said a lot
Pema Pera: ah! Look forward to reading it
Pema Pera: ah yes, it was his guardian slot, one of his two slots
Pia Iger: basically we talked further about anger, continued from this 7am session.
Pia Iger: maybe now we can talk about something happier??
stevenaia Michinaga: I am very interested in anger as it has escaped me for a very long time, due to inherent happyness
Pema Pera: :)
Sylectra Darwin: smiles
Pia Iger: wow, inherent happyness!
This triggered various animal related reactions :-)
Thorberg Nordlicht: “inherent happyness”; i live with a cat like that
Sylectra Darwin: a case of the relentless happies
Sylectra Darwin: My dogs are like that.
stevenaia Michinaga: no, cats suck happyness from the world
stevenaia Michinaga: it serves them so
Pema Pera: but give it back too :-)
Thorberg Nordlicht: “relentlessly happy dogs”
stevenaia Michinaga: I jsut finished petting my cat for 1/2 an hour… I got the fuzz and the runny nose, cat purrs
stevenaia Michinaga: but I too purr
Sylectra Darwin: nice
Sylectra Darwin: brings you to a simpler mind state
Pia Iger: Animals do live in the moment, first of all, right?
Sylectra Darwin: oh yes
stevenaia Michinaga: only after you feed them, befoe that they live to get you to feed them
stevenaia Michinaga: do i sound like my cat runs my house?
Sylectra Darwin: they run all houses
Sylectra Darwin: or the house runs the cat
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, and it didn’t occur to some of us that it was at all unusual
stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps this is a good example of giving to receive happyness,e ven if it is provided by a cat
stevenaia Michinaga: or anything for that matter
Sylectra Darwin: a cat is a living creature fully in its own right; it is no less capable of giving or receiving love than a human
Sylectra Darwin: brb
Time for me to leave.
Pema Pera: Steve and Pia, I mentioned just before you got in that I have to leave for an earlier lunch here. See you all soon again! And Thor, I look forward to see the log later and to read up on the rest of the conversation! — cats are my favorate animals =^+^=
Thorberg Nordlicht: ok, Pema
Thorberg Nordlicht: see you later
Pia Iger: bye, Pema
Adams Rubble: bye Pema
stevenaia Michinaga: enjoy your lunch
Pema Pera: thank you all for joining — wish I could take you all out to lunch in Tokyo!!
Adams Rubble: :)
Pema Pera: Alas, teleporting in RL is still not yet realized . . . . .
Pema Pera: RL is soooooo 21st century
stevenaia Michinaga: shouldn;t you be working on that?
Pema Pera: shhht
Gambhira Skytower: Jerry Seinfeld said once that if Aliens were observing us they would think dogs were the leaders because we clean up their poop
Pema Pera: hahaha, Gamb
Pema Pera: how about cats?
stevenaia Michinaga: there is a book about that, that dogs and cats are invaders from another planet and are sworn enemies, alsa we are jsut pawns
Gambhira Skytower: lol
stevenaia Michinaga: who would have thought?
Pia Iger: so the point of view is really powerful. All depends on how we see it.
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, I don;t know if the dogs or cats wrote that book
stevenaia Michinaga: or Stephan King
Sylectra Darwin: wow, not him
Gambhira Skytower: percieving something in a new way can be helpful or funny I think in some cases
stevenaia Michinaga: no, it was an illustrated children’s book
Sylectra Darwin: OK, definitely not SK then
stevenaia Michinaga: wb Sylectra
Sylectra Darwin: ty
Back to happiness.
stevenaia Michinaga: is everyone happy here tonight?, jsut to try for a differing perspective
Thorberg Nordlicht: i’m happy
Pia Iger: not really…
Sylectra Darwin: no, but at peace
Thorberg Nordlicht: my avatar is happy — not a care in the world
stevenaia Michinaga: do you know why?
Pia Iger: why?
stevenaia Michinaga: why you aren;t happy?
Adams Rubble is feeling content
Pia Iger: feeling can just be, like wake up there is
Pia Iger: hard to be happy or content all the time.
Thorberg Nordlicht: come in, nicau
Thorberg Nordlicht: hello nicau; join us
Thorberg Nordlicht: join us; have a seat
Thorberg Nordlicht: ((right-click a cushion and select “sit here”))
nicau Laville: konbanwa
stevenaia Michinaga: wonders if not being happy means it is displaced or it can co-exist with contentment or other things?
Thorberg Nordlicht: sorry, Pia, i think you were interrupted
Pia Iger: no problem, prof:)
Thorberg Nordlicht: :)
Pia Iger: I am afraid, unhappyness is important part of life, too.
Thorberg Nordlicht: brings to mind the first Noble Truth
Pia Iger: in what sense?
Sylectra Darwin: true, and I honor my unhappiness just as I do my happiness
stevenaia Michinaga: Noble truth?
Pia Iger: of buddism, right?
Thorberg talked more about the four noble truths.
Thorberg Nordlicht: some basic principles of Buddhism as summarized as “the four Noble Truths”
Thorberg Nordlicht: the traditional interpretation of the first truth is that “suffering” is an inherent part of life
Gambhira Skytower: not sure about the word “inherent” there
Thorberg Nordlicht: Pia’s comment that “unhappyness is important part of life” brought this to mind
Pia Iger: Why, Gam, not sure about inherent?
Gambhira Skytower: because the third noble truth is that there is an end to suffering that is possible. In other words, our mental suffering is unnecessary
Adams Rubble: Yes, but most of us do not get to that point
Pia Iger: at least me now…
Adams Rubble: but we can keep trying
Gambhira Skytower: but Buddha says it is possible
stevenaia Michinaga: or be patient
Adams Rubble: Yes, but few do
Adams Rubble: It gives us some hope
Sylectra Darwin: Unhappiness tells us what we care about, or what we might be grieving the loss of.
stevenaia Michinaga: not sure you can rush to anything
Adams Rubble: although hope is kind of a Christian tghing :)
Adams Rubble: thing
Adams Rubble: term
Thorberg Nordlicht: perhaps the point is that there’s a difference between pain and suffering; pain is unavoiable (sickness, old age, death), but suffering *is* avoidable because it’s self created
Gambhira Skytower: i agree
Adams Rubble: Yes me too
Gambhira brought up a fascinating pointer.
Gambhira Skytower: I heard a teacher say once that unhappiness is like a teacher that we seldom listen to
Adams Rubble: :)
Pia Iger: ah.
Pia Iger: maybe it is painful to listen to…
Pia Iger: we ran away.
Thorberg Nordlicht: an alternate view is that since even pain can be extinguished, then the first Truth must only be referring to the fact the life is unprdictable and that we create both our own suffering *and* pain
Sylectra Darwin: that’s good.
Sylectra Darwin: I like the idea of unhappiness being a teacher.
Adams Rubble: Don;t some people translate the term as misery and not suffering?
Gambhira Skytower: i think so Adams
Pia Iger: Misery does sound more self created.
Gambhira Skytower: the Pali term is dukkha
Pia Iger: ?
Sylectra Darwin: dukkha
Sylectra Darwin: hmmm
Adams Rubble: If so, Buddha may have differentiated between suffering from pain and misery
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, i believe that’s the traditional interpretation
Adams Rubble: although he was moved by people in pain
Thorberg Nordlicht: but recently isen told me the literal menaing of the word is just “wobbly” like a wheel that wobbles
Adams Rubble: and dhying
Adams Rubble: dying
Adams Rubble: hmmmm
Thorberg Nordlicht: so the first Truth is just acknowledging that the world is unpredictable
Thorberg Nordlicht: the question is whether “dukkha” is inherently “unsatisfactory”
Adams Rubble: I don;t think I understand
Adams Rubble: Do you mean the use of the word, Thor?
Pia Iger: I think the answer would be “it is not inherently unsatisfactory”. But in my own life, I have not really felt that yet.
Thorberg Nordlicht: no, not the use of the word, but the notion the word refers to
Adams Rubble: an unsatisfactory state?
Gambhira introduced another Pali word: sukha.
Gambhira Skytower: in Pali there is also the word “sukha” which refers to any type of pleasure or happyness
Thorberg Nordlicht: that’s interesting; can you say more about the distinction between dukkha and sukha
Adams Rubble: yes, that would be helpful
Gambhira Skytower: Hmmm… I’m not sure what else to say about it at the moment. The Buddha said there is sukha, dukkha, and neither sukha-nor dukkha. three types of feelings
Sylectra Darwin: the neutral state - neither sukha nor dukkha.
Gambhira Skytower: and there are three underlying tendencies with regard to the three feelings, aversion towards dukkha, delight in sukha, and ignorance of neutral feelings
Sylectra Darwin: what do you mean by ignorance of neutral feelings?
Sylectra Darwin: what is a neutral feeling?
Gambhira Skytower: I’m not sure I understand the meaning of it. My interpretation is that we tend to overlook things are aren’t pleasant or painful
Sylectra Darwin: ah, yes
Sylectra Darwin: okay
Gambhira Skytower: does that seem to be the case to anyone?
Pia Iger: make sense.
Sylectra Darwin: i would definitely agree
Sylectra Darwin: It’s like our reaction to foods
Sylectra Darwin: Some are delicious and some are awful
Adams Rubble: yes or opening mail
Sylectra Darwin: We tend not to notice the ones that are from the middle spectrum, as in just so-so
Gambhira Skytower: and the scripture says further that knowledge of the neutral feelings is pleasant. This seems difficult to understand to me
Sylectra Darwin: Is it possible that spending too much time in sukha or dukkha brings one out of balance?
Gambhira Skytower: i would like to spend all my time in sukha!
Adams Rubble: Wouldn’t enlightenment by all sukha?
Adams Rubble: or also neutral mixed in?
Sylectra Darwin: did the text mean sukha as in material delight or as in spiritual delight?
Gambhira Skytower: it makes a distinction between the two Sylectra, it is a very important distinction
From sukha in general to bliss and to Nirvana.
Adams Rubble: wouldn;t it equate with “bliss”?
Thorberg Nordlicht: or does “enlightement” transcend the entire realm of dukkha, sukha, and neutral?
Gambhira Skytower: Nirvana is described at the highest or best sukha possilbe
Adams Rubble: Then that is bliss, Thor?
Adams Rubble: and Gambhira
Gambhira Skytower: because it is lasting sukha, not impermanent
Gambhira Skytower: sukha can also mean bliss
Pia Iger: I feel a bit hopless now, cause it’s unusal for people to get Nirvana.
Adams Rubble: I don;t think it is hopeless
Adams Rubble: we can lessen our misery
Gambhira Skytower: people have done it and so could you
Thorberg Nordlicht: yes, “lessen our misery” by recognizing the extent to which it is self-created by our attachment and desire
Pia Iger: That is constant inner work.
Adams Rubble: that can pay big dividends
stevenaia Michinaga: my happyness evolved from my own misery and the recognition that I am done the that, time to move on
Adams Rubble: nice thought
Pia Iger: great, Steve
Sylectra Darwin: A personal choice about how one reacts to a situation can be very powerful stuff.
stevenaia Michinaga: life changing
Pia Iger: I was gonna ask Syl, if you can give an example of how you honor your unhappyness
stevenaia Michinaga: or transforming
Sylectra gave a great and succinct summary.
Sylectra Darwin: I will try.
Sylectra Darwin: I honor my unhappiness because it is my truth at the moment, and a sign that I care about something.
Sylectra Darwin: It may be caused by desire or lack of letting go, but there is caring wrapped up in it.
Sylectra Darwin: Then I am not in a position of controversy but more a compassionate observer of my feelings.
Sylectra Darwin: The unhappiness can be my little sister who does as she wishes and is not necessarily my essence.
Sylectra Darwin: There are great lessons in one’s feelings, especially the unhappy ones.
Pia Iger: thanks, Syl.
Sylectra Darwin: smiles
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, and in love
Pia Iger: it is inspiring.
Sylectra Darwin: ty
Pia Iger: I feel we have such good talk tonight.
Sylectra Darwin: yes
Thorberg Nordlicht: :)
Adams Rubble: I agree :)
Gambhira Skytower: thanks for listening and sharing everybody
Sylectra Darwin: thank you as well
Thorberg Nordlicht: it’s getting late; i’m going to have to leave soon
Sylectra Darwin: Me too.
Sylectra Darwin: Namaste, all.
stevenaia Michinaga: will you pass the log on?
stevenaia Michinaga: to Pema?
Thorberg Nordlicht: I’ll send the log to Pema, but doesn’t hurt if anyone else also sends one
Thorberg Nordlicht: just lable it clearly
Adams Rubble: Thank you everyone and bye :)
Adams Rubble: namaste
Pia Iger: so long, everyone.
stevenaia Michinaga: bye all
Gambhira Skytower: goodbye
Sylectra Darwin: goodbye
Thorberg Nordlicht: good night, everyone
